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Lord Seriphim
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2017.01.05 14:03:16 -
[1] - Quote
Gallente have the Miasmos Amarr, Caldari and Minmitar dont get one , with Alpha play can you please either add one to each race or create a Ore faction one that alphas can fly thats the same as the miasmos
thankyou
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blargderp
United Earth Space Council
15
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Posted - 2017.01.05 15:23:50 -
[2] - Quote
last I checked alpha clones only got their faction's indy up to level one, so the gap between the miasmos and any other alpha accessible indy with cargo expanders isn't all that huge. I agree that it does provide another advantage to gallente alphas though. none of this would be a problem if the racial restrictions were lifted however. |
Do Little
Virgin Plc Evictus.
710
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Posted - 2017.01.05 16:27:59 -
[3] - Quote
The specialized haulers do give Gallente an advantage and I expect CCP to adjust the balance over the winter. The easiest solution would be to move Miasmos, Kyros, Epithal and Hoarder to Ore and give Alphas the ability to train Ore industrial level 1 - would also unlock Noctis and the salvaging profession. I don't think that would be a problem. |
Shu t'Me
19
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Posted - 2017.01.05 17:55:17 -
[4] - Quote
So make a Gallente alpha character.
Or, pay the subscription. |
Amarisen Gream
Divine Demise Sherwood Hisec Industrial Technologies
308
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Posted - 2017.01.05 18:40:55 -
[5] - Quote
Hopeful CCP will do something about this soon(tm)
"The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger
All of his fury and rage.
He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels"
- The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1
DIDE- is open to new members
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Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
32
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Posted - 2017.01.05 19:36:33 -
[6] - Quote
Do Little wrote:The specialized haulers do give Gallente an advantage and I expect CCP to adjust the balance over the winter. The easiest solution would be to move Miasmos, Kyros, Epithal and Hoarder to Ore and give Alphas the ability to train Ore industrial level 1 - would also unlock Noctis and the salvaging profession. I don't think that would be a problem. The Hoarder doesn't really seem to be the style of ORE, but I agree with the rest. Alpha clones could clean the space after l4 security missions, I don't think too many omegas would mind this.
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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blargderp
United Earth Space Council
15
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Posted - 2017.01.05 19:43:08 -
[7] - Quote
Dior Ambraelle wrote:Do Little wrote:The specialized haulers do give Gallente an advantage and I expect CCP to adjust the balance over the winter. The easiest solution would be to move Miasmos, Kyros, Epithal and Hoarder to Ore and give Alphas the ability to train Ore industrial level 1 - would also unlock Noctis and the salvaging profession. I don't think that would be a problem. The Hoarder doesn't really seem to be the style of ORE, but I agree with the rest. Alpha clones could clean the space after l4 security missions, I don't think too many omegas would mind this.
I personally would not want alphas scanning me down and stealing my salvage before I can get to it, then again they would get CONCORDed if they tried to tractor any of my wrecks and salvaging in a noctis without tractor beams is a pretty silly thing to do. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5142
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Posted - 2017.01.05 19:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
Back in my day, you'd bolt a bunch of salvagers onto a destroyer to clean up a mission. Why can an alpha not do this? Why do you need a noctis to salvage anything? |
Lugh Crow-Slave
3489
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Posted - 2017.01.05 20:15:38 -
[9] - Quote
Then make a gal alpha then problem solved. Compressing it off a citadel also works fine
BLOPS Hauler
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Matthias Ancaladron
Wrath of Angels
61
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Posted - 2017.01.05 20:48:32 -
[10] - Quote
blargderp wrote:last I checked alpha clones only got their faction's indy up to level one, so the gap between the miasmos and any other alpha accessible indy with cargo expanders isn't all that huge. I agree that it does provide another advantage to gallente alphas though. none of this would be a problem if the racial restrictions were lifted however. That's a 20-30k different though. A bestower only gets up to like 15k-20k if you fill all the low slots with expanders. Gallente gets double the ore hold without sacrificing any speed. As far as ore hauling goes that's a massive difference. 100% more ore per trip.
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Matthias Ancaladron
Wrath of Angels
61
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Posted - 2017.01.05 20:52:49 -
[11] - Quote
That said i don't want all the races to be identical. I hate the state of cruisers and frigates. They're all exactly the same across the races. I liked it better the way it used to be pre tiericide, when each ship just sort of did it's own thing. And it wasn't just a copy pasted logi ship, or ewarfare ship, or drone ship. The races have lost a little bit of individuality cause. |
blargderp
United Earth Space Council
15
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Posted - 2017.01.05 21:12:15 -
[12] - Quote
Matthias Ancaladron wrote:blargderp wrote:last I checked alpha clones only got their faction's indy up to level one, so the gap between the miasmos and any other alpha accessible indy with cargo expanders isn't all that huge. I agree that it does provide another advantage to gallente alphas though. none of this would be a problem if the racial restrictions were lifted however. That's a 20-30k different though. A bestower only gets up to like 15k-20k if you fill all the low slots with expanders. Gallente gets double the ore hold without sacrificing any speed. As far as ore hauling goes that's a massive difference. 100% more ore per trip.
with expanders and rigs a bestower can hold over 32km3. the miasmos at lvl1 holds 46.2km3. that's an approximate 44% (let's say 50% if you count the cargo hold with expanders and rigs as well) difference, which, while still significant, is a far cry from double capacity. if you're using an indy to scoop jet cans full of ore then you only need 27.5km3, as that is the maximum capacity of a jet can. if you're planning on hauling the ore itself you're better off reprocessing it and moving the processed materials (which are much smaller) in a standard indy with expander mods and rigs or simply selling the ore locally in system. |
Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
32
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Posted - 2017.01.05 22:44:33 -
[13] - Quote
What if we would simply remove 2 of gallente's 3 special industrials and give them to amarr and caldari? Each race will have 3, and each is specialized differently. Or even put in the ammo hauler too, and redistribute them all.
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
3546
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Posted - 2017.01.05 22:56:33 -
[14] - Quote
Dior Ambraelle wrote:What if we would simply remove 2 of gallente's 3 special industrials and give them to amarr and caldari? Each race will have 3, and each is specialized differently. Or even put in the ammo hauler too, and redistribute them all. Why? Gallente used to have 5 industrial ships, the other races didn't. Lore wise it makes no sense to, and from a business prospective it makes no sense.
If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
27296
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Posted - 2017.01.05 23:33:05 -
[15] - Quote
blargderp wrote:I personally would not want alphas scanning me down and stealing my salvage before I can get to it, then again they would get CONCORDed if they tried to tractor any of my wrecks and salvaging in a noctis without tractor beams is a pretty silly thing to do. You can only tractor wrecks that have been abandoned and wrecks that belong to you; IIRC the module won't even activate on somebody else's wreck.
Danika Princip wrote:Back in my day, you'd bolt a bunch of salvagers onto a destroyer to clean up a mission. Why can an alpha not do this? Why do you need a noctis to salvage anything? I still do, a MWD destroyer does the job admirable; my Noctis hasn't undocked in years
In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.
New Player FAQ
Feyd's Survival Pack
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3675
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Posted - 2017.01.06 00:00:38 -
[16] - Quote
blargderp wrote:Matthias Ancaladron wrote:blargderp wrote:last I checked alpha clones only got their faction's indy up to level one, so the gap between the miasmos and any other alpha accessible indy with cargo expanders isn't all that huge. I agree that it does provide another advantage to gallente alphas though. none of this would be a problem if the racial restrictions were lifted however. That's a 20-30k different though. A bestower only gets up to like 15k-20k if you fill all the low slots with expanders. Gallente gets double the ore hold without sacrificing any speed. As far as ore hauling goes that's a massive difference. 100% more ore per trip. with expanders and rigs a bestower can hold over 32km3. the miasmos at lvl1 holds 46.2km3. that's an approximate 44% (let's say 50% if you count the cargo hold with expanders and rigs as well) difference, which, while still significant, is a far cry from double capacity. if you're using an indy to scoop jet cans full of ore then you only need 27.5km3, as that is the maximum capacity of a jet can. if you're planning on hauling the ore itself you're better off reprocessing it and moving the processed materials (which are much smaller) in a standard indy with expander mods and rigs or simply selling the ore locally in system.
The trouble is a miasmos can haul the most ore in a fast AND tanky fit. No other hauler can get even close to the power of a miasmos.
Alphas are just another reason specialised haulers are ******.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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Tordar Ohmiras
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2017.01.06 13:09:23 -
[17] - Quote
Lord Seriphim wrote:Gallente have the Miasmos Amarr, Caldari and Minmitar dont get one , with Alpha play can you please either add one to each race or create a Ore faction one that alphas can fly thats the same as the miasmos
thankyou
No. Alphas cost no money make a second char. Of a silly idea go omega.
-1 |
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop Eve Radio Alliance
615
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Posted - 2017.01.06 18:42:04 -
[18] - Quote
Matthias Ancaladron wrote:blargderp wrote:last I checked alpha clones only got their faction's indy up to level one, so the gap between the miasmos and any other alpha accessible indy with cargo expanders isn't all that huge. I agree that it does provide another advantage to gallente alphas though. none of this would be a problem if the racial restrictions were lifted however. That's a 20-30k different though. A bestower only gets up to like 15k-20k if you fill all the low slots with expanders. Gallente gets double the ore hold without sacrificing any speed. As far as ore hauling goes that's a massive difference. 100% more ore per trip.
Yes... but you lose lasers. /shrug.
--Gadget
Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist
Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."
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Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3011
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Posted - 2017.01.07 02:51:33 -
[19] - Quote
I have a better idea: don't let alphas fly the Miasmos, Kryos, or Epithal. What do they need the Epithal for, anyway?
Edit: that would also mean don't let the Minmatar alphas fly the Hoarder.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
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Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
34
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Posted - 2017.01.07 21:01:49 -
[20] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I have a better idea: don't let alphas fly the Miasmos, Kryos, or Epithal. What do they need the Epithal for, anyway?
Edit: that would also mean don't let the Minmatar alphas fly the Hoarder. Make them all ORE industrials then and leave the alphas with the basic haulers? I wouldn't mind this change, and it would make sense lore-wise too - I think.
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
34
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Posted - 2017.01.07 21:04:50 -
[21] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Dior Ambraelle wrote:What if we would simply remove 2 of gallente's 3 special industrials and give them to amarr and caldari? Each race will have 3, and each is specialized differently. Or even put in the ammo hauler too, and redistribute them all. Why? Gallente used to have 5 industrial ships, the other races didn't. Lore wise it makes no sense to, and from a business prospective it makes no sense. So Gallente have 5, Minmatar have 3 and sucks to be Caldari or Amarr... why is this good exactly?
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
3549
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Posted - 2017.01.07 21:25:31 -
[22] - Quote
Dior Ambraelle wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:I have a better idea: don't let alphas fly the Miasmos, Kryos, or Epithal. What do they need the Epithal for, anyway?
Edit: that would also mean don't let the Minmatar alphas fly the Hoarder. Make them all ORE industrials then and leave the alphas with the basic haulers? I wouldn't mind this change, and it would make sense lore-wise too - I think.
CCP Rise wrote: Some of us like this option a lot - unfortunately it would mean doing the same for all t2 haulers and all t1/t2 freighters, which would be A: A giant commitment in terms of art asset creation, B: A waste of assets that already exist and C: would probably be hated by a lot of players because of how much flavor and history it would remove from the game.
If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
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Dornier Pfeil
Citadel Defenders
26
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Posted - 2017.01.07 22:00:03 -
[23] - Quote
Do Little wrote:The specialized haulers do give Gallente an advantage and I expect CCP to adjust the balance over the winter. The easiest solution would be to move Miasmos, Kyros, Epithal and Hoarder to Ore and give Alphas the ability to train Ore industrial level 1 - would also unlock Noctis and the salvaging profession. I don't think that would be a problem.
If they did this it would be nice if they gave players the option of moving the SP for Gallente Industrial over to ORE Industrial. Until such a change I would have no reason to train ORE Ind. since I have no desire to fly any of those ships but I do have Gallente Ind. trained specifically so I can fly the Miasmos. Note: I didn't say turn the SP into general points that could end up anywhere. Just some one time use item that moves them from the Gallente skill to the ORE skill on pressing of an accept button. The item could also have a decline button. After that it vanishes. No ISK value. No transferability to another player. Just a nice way for CCP to say they understand this change screws over a subset of the players and they don't want to do that. |
Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
34
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Posted - 2017.01.07 23:11:13 -
[24] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:CCP Rise wrote:Some of us like this option a lot - unfortunately it would mean doing the same for all t2 haulers and all t1/t2 freighters, which would be A: A giant commitment in terms of art asset creation, B: A waste of assets that already exist and C: would probably be hated by a lot of players because of how much flavor and history it would remove from the game. Why/how does moving the 4 special haulers to ORE affect basically every other hauler exactly? T2 ships are the same for every faction, and I don't think freighters have anything to do with these 4. Also, - A: we only need 4, quite similar ships of their own class. It's a "big" work, not a "giant". I'm sure they have more important things to work on though. - B: the Hoarder is kind of unique, but the Gallente industrials are made like lego, we could even customize their look, we wouldn't really lose anything. - C: flavor and history, not to mention the industrialists who learned Gallente or Minmatar industrials to level 5 just to use these the most efficiently. Which they probably have done anyways to use the t2 transport ships. The only real difference is their ORE industrial skill, which is probably on level 3 only.
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3013
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Posted - 2017.01.08 00:26:10 -
[25] - Quote
Dior Ambraelle wrote:Make them all ORE industrials then and leave the alphas with the basic haulers? I wouldn't mind this change, and it would make sense lore-wise too - I think. I'd like to see more actual racial industrials as well, such as: 1.) frigate-sized industrial 2.) battleship-sized industrial 3.) heavily armored industrial with combat capability
I'd remove the specialized industrials entirely and add more actual industrial options.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5157
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Posted - 2017.01.08 12:34:28 -
[26] - Quote
So, if you bump the Epithal over to ore, how the hell do I get my hands on another occator?
And Reaver, those are called t2 haulers. or frigates with cargo expanders. You're asking for things that already exist again. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3013
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Posted - 2017.01.08 19:37:09 -
[27] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:So, if you bump the Epithal over to ore, how the hell do I get my hands on another occator?
And Reaver, those are called t2 haulers. or frigates with cargo expanders. You're asking for things that already exist again. Obviously if Epithal became an ORE ship, it would have its hull completely redesigned. Occator need not change.
Blockade Runners are NOT frigates. They have cruiser align time, cruiser sig radius, cruiser hit points, cruiser max velocity, cruiser mass, industrial volume, enough powergrid for cruiser defenses, and their cargohold is a bit large for a frigate. They have tech 2 cruiser price. The only thing frigate-like about them is their slot layout. Orcas have a cruiser slot layout, but you wouldn't call them a cruiser, would you?
I want an industrial that aligns twice as fast as a BR, has half the sig radius, a third of the hit points, twice the max velocity, a tenth the mass, half the packaged volume, a tenth of the powergrid, and a quarter of the cargohold, all for a fifth of the price. Or make it tech 1, take off the covert ops bonus, and put it under a mil. What's so unreasonable about that?
Danika Princip wrote:You're asking for things that already exist again. I have been accused of this many times, but it has NEVER happened.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5158
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Posted - 2017.01.08 19:48:29 -
[28] - Quote
If the occator need not change, how do I actually get another one, given that it is a gallente T2 variant of a ship that you don't want to be gallente anymore?
You want an industrial that aligns in under two seconds, outruns literally everything that isn't an interceptor, carries over 1km3 and is, essentially, untouchable in a way that even a well flown blockade runner can't match. For under 25 mil. And is still cloaky. Or for under 1 mil without the cloak. What is NOT unreasonable about that? That makes travelceptors look balanced.
And your BS industrial is an orca, and your tanky industrial is a DST. Please feel free to completely redefine the concept of tanky and battleship sized, they way you usually do. |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
3013
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Posted - 2017.01.08 20:32:26 -
[29] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:You want an industrial that aligns in under two seconds, outruns literally everything that isn't an interceptor, carries over 1km3 and is, essentially, untouchable in a way that even a well flown blockade runner can't match. For under 25 mil. And is still cloaky. Or for under 1 mil without the cloak. What is NOT unreasonable about that? That makes travelceptors look balanced. Sure, let's just spew out a bunch of subjective descriptions about the ship's absolute stats and completely ignore how it performs relative to existing ships.
Frigates align in under 3 seconds when fit for agility, but they can carry over 1000m3 when fit for cargo. What I'm suggesting is merely specialized toward hauling, and thus would have a larger carrying capacity than a probe frigate. How does it have anything to do with travelceptors?
Also, I gave approximate attributes. Who says it'll align in under 2 seconds? It depends on its exact attributes. But more importantly, why is that such a bad thing? It's not bubble immune, it's not cloaky, and it doesn't have a lot of hit points. Or are you trying to suggest that T1 frigates are overpowered?
Danika Princip wrote:And your BS industrial is an orca, and your tanky industrial is a DST. Please feel free to completely redefine the concept of tanky and battleship sized, they way you usually do. Orca is a miniature capital ship, DST is a tech II battleship industrial. I want a tech 1 battleship industrial, a combat-oriented industrial, a frigate-sized industrial (both tech 1 and tech 2), and a light freighter that hauls significantly more than a DST and isn't specialized as a command ship. None of these exist and they would fill huge gaps in the ship lineup.
FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."
Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
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Dior Ambraelle
University of Caille Gallente Federation
39
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Posted - 2017.01.08 21:40:07 -
[30] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:So, if you bump the Epithal over to ore, how the hell do I get my hands on another occator? Sorry, but I can't follow your logic here. The suggestion is to move the Miasmos, Epithal, Kryos and Hoarder (do we even need this ship?) to the ORE industrials group. Every other industrial - the rest of the t1 haulers, the t2 haulers, the freighters and jump freighters - would remain as they are right now. This would also prevent alpha clones from using these ships.
If you want an intelligent argument, please do, I'm up for it!
But if you want a trolling contest, I will win it by simply not participating.
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