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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
VossKarr
Caldari The 6th Directorate
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:01:00 -
[211]
Originally by: Creepin
Originally by: VossKarr Tell me, what good would such an account be to CCP from their POV? If such player is not even paying for server time and bandwidth he/she is not only not making CCP any money, he/she actually costs CCP money to keep.
Are you serious? Each and every GTC's are bought from CCP originally. So, from CCP's point of view, there's absolutely no difference if you pay 20 bucks for your GTC directly to CCP, or if someone else pays that same 20 bucks to that same CCP and later gives GTC for you in exchange of some of your isks.
I was talking about ISK for GTC directly from CCP. In the old system someone had to buy GTC from CCP for RL money before reselling it for ISK. In the proposed system CCP eliminates the middleman and sells GTC directly for ISK. The question is how will they support their company without RL cash being in the equation?
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Zorda
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:09:00 -
[212]
Every day I see less reasons to log into EVE lately.
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Sarafi
The 2nd Coming
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:12:00 -
[213]
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Creepin
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:13:00 -
[214]
Originally by: VossKarr I was talking about ISK for GTC directly from CCP. In the old system someone had to buy GTC from CCP for RL money before reselling it for ISK. In the proposed system CCP eliminates the middleman and sells GTC directly for ISK. The question is how will they support their company without RL cash being in the equation?
Oops, sorry. I've read what your quoted and your answer, but still made a mistake on a matter of discussion :)
I agree with you on this one - it's so losing to CCP to sell GTCs for iskies on their own, that even if they decide to actually do it, they had to be sure that this service will be used by as little people as possible, and easiest way to ensure it is to set GTC price up to like few billy's per month. :( I guess in this case many of us will be forced to turn to a black market for GTCs, so eventually CCP will get results opposite to ones they were hoping for, as prices on black-market GTCs will also rocket high, even if less then official prices, making this business even more profitable than ATM.
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Cryten Jones
Gallente Eldritch Storm
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:17:00 -
[215]
Slightly off topic but I just be happy to see the direct debit option available in the UK. I mean we use DD for all bills why do we not get this option !!
-CJ
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Contrary Mary
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:42:00 -
[216]
Only speculation here, but I suspect that CCP might just be only giving us part of the info here.
If they implement a program of
a) Selling players Game Time for ISK, and at the same time b) Removing the option of ISK transfer between characters, and c) Introduce the selling (from CCP direct only) of ISK for RL Cash
They will have the ability to monitor large fluctuations in character wallets.
Any large jump in a wallet that isn't directly linkable to an in-game market transaction, contract, or character sale (if that is still permitted), can then be flagged as a EULA violator.
It would give them an audit trail, and the ability to control the people making RL cash out of the current rules, while still allowing for both cash-rich/time-poor and cash-poor/time-rich players.
It makes more sense as a business-model I reckon.
No flames please - only speculation
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VossKarr
Caldari The 6th Directorate
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Posted - 2007.05.05 07:57:00 -
[217]
Originally by: Contrary Mary
b) Removing the option of ISK transfer between characters
How? You can always sell 1 trit for 1 bil to transfer cash so.. really, impossible, unless you scrap the market along with contracts.
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Creepin
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Posted - 2007.05.05 08:15:00 -
[218]
I suspect half-community will leave EVE without second thought should they: Originally by: Contrary Mary
c) Introduce the selling (from CCP direct only) of ISK for RL Cash
EVE will be no better than Lineage freeshards then. But somehow I doubt that such a thing will be implemented - not only because of gameplay and community dissatisfaction issues, but because of RL legal and taxation issues as well.
Originally by: Contrary Mary b) Removing the option of ISK transfer between characters
What? So I'll be unable to give to my girlfriend's char birthday present of few billions? To help my RL friend in his need? To throw some cash on my Jita-resident alt to buy me a stuff while my main is 30 jumps away from Jita? What a... bad idea
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 08:42:00 -
[219]
Edited by: Goumindong on 05/05/2007 08:40:28
Originally by: Deus Ex'Machina
Originally by: Mox Trident
Quote: In the future, CCP will introduce a billing solution replacing the current system that allows the purchase of game time from third parties for in-game ISK
This is the part that some people have missed.
The way I read it is that you will no longer be able to buy GTC's from third parties like shatteredcrystal.com or ebay.
From now on you'll buy your GTC directly from CCP through account management.
This is how I think it will work:
Player A will purchase a GTC for RL cash from CCP.
Player A will be given an option to either use the GTC himself or sell it to player B for ISK.
When player B buys a GTC from a seller, the GTC is automatically added to his subscription time. This prevents player B from re-selling the GTC out of game for RL cash.
This way CCP get the RL cash, all transactions are through account management, and third party middlemen are removed from the equation altogether.
Well, if this is true then it's perfect.
Note, seller = player A ;-) Note, buying from player A = trough account management
/signed this particular version of Engrish
Uhh. This is how it works right now.
Just because player A isnt named "www.shatteredcrystal.com" does not mean that player A isnt www.shatteredcrystal.com.
If its supposedly going to work like that then it doesnt change anything except make the middlemans accounting a little bit more difficult. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew" |
ParMizaN
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.05.05 08:43:00 -
[220]
YES! Thank you! [IMG]http://tinyurl.com/yuphfgIMG] BDCI sig ftp screwed.
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Awox
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.05.05 08:56:00 -
[221]
Originally by: PDoggy
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: PDoggy I VERY MUCH protest this. This was a great way for casual players to enjoy EVE without the money grind and PvP to their hearts' content and I predict you will lose a SIGNIFICANT number of accounts over this.
This is why it is good. A major nerf to UT2K4 in space.
Why oh WHY would you say this?
I quit WoW because it became a horrible, ****ty grindfest past level 45. I play EVE for the PvP - I enjoy it and it's a great, unique experience. I don't like having to mine for six hours to fit out a HAC. EVE has always been very attractive to casual players with the GTCs and the offline skill training, and removing this is a slap in A) The face of casual MMO-players everywhere and B) CCP's accounting deparment.
I don't have six hours to mine to fit out a HAC and yet I can still do it. Is it GTC sales? Or is it just because I might understand the game better than you.
Adapt or die, I can't wait to see the day when all these morons who are broke in-game (it's too easy to make ISK these days) leave EVE because they can no longer use their RL wallet to keep them in premium PvP vessels. - BOOST OUTLAWS (-10.0 and proud of it) |
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Betrayal Under Mayhem
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Posted - 2007.05.05 09:14:00 -
[222]
This is the best thing CCP have ever done in EVE. There's been a LOT of cool stuff, but this, tops it.
ISK <-> cash trades are unhealthy for a game, in every single incidence. I can see the argument that you buy your friend game time, and he gives you isk, thus everyone's happy. I feel for your friend who is too poor.
But at the same time, the ability to gain in game advantage, for RL cash. Or worse, to actually turn 'playing EVE' into a way to make money (Buy GTC, Resell on Ebay style) is SERIOUSLY bad for the game.
I can see CCP considering that particular tradeoff pretty hard. I'm sure they'll have looked at revenue impact, and can see how much of it's happening. It may well be worth it, given that there's a lot of people who find the whole practice rather revolting.
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Craam Hustler
Gallente ReTech
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Posted - 2007.05.05 09:29:00 -
[223]
Originally by: James Lyrus This is the best thing CCP have ever done in EVE. There's been a LOT of cool stuff, but this, tops it.
But but, god forbid people learn how to earn ISK!!!!! WE CANT HAVE THAT! Cause once players learn to make ISK I might have to find new ways to make ISK!
Noes!
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Briana Flametop
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Posted - 2007.05.05 09:54:00 -
[224]
Originally by: Awox Adapt or die, I can't wait to see the day when all these morons who are broke in-game (it's too easy to make ISK these days) start buying ISK from ebay, with none of the RL money going to CCP (unlike how it works at the moment)
Fixed it for you.
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R3dSh1ft
FIRMA
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Posted - 2007.05.05 09:59:00 -
[225]
GTC sellers will just go back underground again. The only people this hurts is the short-cashed ______________________________________
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voogru
Gallente Massive Damage
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:00:00 -
[226]
Edited by: voogru on 05/05/2007 09:56:33
Originally by: Briana Flametop
Originally by: Awox Adapt or die, I can't wait to see the day when all these morons who are broke in-game (it's too easy to make ISK these days) start buying ISK from ebay, with none of the RL money going to CCP (unlike how it works at the moment)
Fixed it for you.
Originally by: R3dSh1ft GTC sellers will just go back underground again. The only people this hurts is the short-cashed
And they risk getting banned.
Way to go! Time to clean up the gene pool!
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Avon
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:00:00 -
[227]
Edited by: Avon on 05/05/2007 09:58:10 I have no problem with people selling some gametime to a friend for some ISK, and I doubt CCP has much of a problem with it either.
The problem is when it becomes either people selling gamtetime with intention of buying ISK (rather than helping someone out), or worse, selling ISK to buy $$ especially if that involves GTCs to "legitimise" the trade.
I welcome any change that reduces RMT, even if that may unfortunately mean a reduced ability to bail your mates out when they are short of cash to play.
CCP have seen their tolerance of "friendly" sales being abused on a large scale, and whilst it is sad for those who did it for the "right reasons", I can't see that CCP has been left with any choice other than to clamp down.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Dranadar
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:05:00 -
[228]
I get to play for about 3 hours a week due to a VERY busy RL. I only PVP, the rest of the game doesnt interest me as much - if I had more game time maybe it would, but with such limited playtime I want to do the bit I most enjoy. I loose ships and refit when needed with an ETC trade.
I wont be spending my spare 3 hours/week 3 weeks/month grinding ISK so that at the end of the month I can PVP, and probably get a cap ship Zerg, or 50 man bubble camp pwn my ass within 15 mins of undocking, or having an FC send us on a suicide run.(its just my luck)
I dont spend RL to get "ahead" as such, just to dodge the grind - I fly BS/Recons and occiasionly need a new one. Altough I see the point if there was no ISK farming to sell for Cash/GameTime that inflation wouldnt be as bad.
But I just dont think that making time in my life for EVE is going to happen if I need to spend 75% of my time ingame doing something I dont enjoy.
Once my ship pops it looks like the account is going inactive until my RL is not so busy (but as its been like this for 4 Years I need to find some uber long skills to train)
damn shame
Dranadar - Space Monkey
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Avon
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:13:00 -
[229]
Originally by: Dranadar I get to play for about 3 hours a week due to a VERY busy RL. I only PVP, the rest of the game doesnt interest me as much - if I had more game time maybe it would, but with such limited playtime I want to do the bit I most enjoy. I loose ships and refit when needed with an ETC trade.
I didn't have time to train like the other competitors, so I just had to take those performance enhancing drugs...
I don't get to play very much either, so when I have to grind for ISK I'm not doing what I want .. but I am doing what I must, as should you.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Xriss Ravana
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:23:00 -
[230]
Originally by: Avon I didn't have time to train like the other competitors, so I just had to take those performance enhancing drugs...
I don't get to play very much either, so when I have to grind for ISK I'm not doing what I want .. but I am doing what I must, as should you.
Its less using performance enhancing drugs and more skipping the qualifying stages. Him buying ISK doesnt make him better than you, like drugs would, just means he gets to compete at the same level.
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Sorted
Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:26:00 -
[231]
Edited by: Sorted on 05/05/2007 10:22:53 Nice clear post there mister DEV
Learn More: Privateers Recruitment |
voogru
Gallente Massive Damage
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:34:00 -
[232]
Edited by: voogru on 05/05/2007 10:30:58
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Dranadar I get to play for about 3 hours a week due to a VERY busy RL. I only PVP, the rest of the game doesnt interest me as much - if I had more game time maybe it would, but with such limited playtime I want to do the bit I most enjoy. I loose ships and refit when needed with an ETC trade.
I didn't have time to train like the other competitors, so I just had to take those performance enhancing drugs...
Originally by: Kerfira people would buy from illegal vendors anyway.
And risk getting banned. So not only will they spend RL money to advance themselves in a video game, they risk getting banned and losing what they paid for.
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Dranadar
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:38:00 -
[233]
Originally by: Kerfira I think a lot of people mis-understand due to some ambiguities in the OP. CCP would NEVER directly sell GTC's for ISK. It'd completely ruin their income if they did it at reasonable prices, and if their prices weren't reasonable, people would buy from illegal vendors anyway.
The scenario I think they plan is: 1. Player A buys a GTC from CCP, and instead of using it, marks it for sale (probably even setting his own price in ISK) 2. Player B wants to buy a GTC, so he looks at the list of GTC's for sale through CCP and buy one there.
This system is transparent for everyone, and 100% controllable. CCP don't need to spend ANY resources on petitions about GTC sales, and the sales forum gets cleaned up. Win-win.
The scenario they probably also want to get rid of is this: 1. All players in an alliance buys their GTC's through a 3rd party reseller. 2. The alliance gets a kick-back in RL money (maybe $1 per 90d GTC or whatever). 3. The alliance use that money to buy GTC's, which they then sell for ISK. 4. In effect, this alliance now has gotten ISK for free, in a manner approved by CCP since the current rules don't prevent it.....
Personally, I like EVERYTHING about this!!!! No free ISK for any alliances, and a secure way of buying/selling GTC's if you're poor/rich IRL.
What's not to like?????
Assumption? a Clear what is going to be and what isnt going to be, in nice bullet points from a DEV would be great.
If what you say does transpire - great. If not
Dranadar - Space Monkey
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Dranadar
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:42:00 -
[234]
Edited by: Dranadar on 05/05/2007 10:39:26
Originally by: Xriss Ravana
Originally by: BubbaZanetti
Excellent news.
At the same time this goin in, you're going to be limiting all other players to only be allowed to play as long as I can, right? Or, really, whatever the least amount of logged in time per month is, really, that's how long we'll need to all be allowed to play now, yes?
After all, we can't have real world circumstances influencing people's ability to get ahead in the game. It's not fair that I, who make a good living can just buy isk by selling game time cards, so it's equally not fair that some one else, who works less than I do, should be able to play the game longer and just grind isk, right?
Ok, cool. Let me know how much time we're allowed to log in an play per month as soon as you geniuses of what's fair and equitable get it sorted out.
This mans point is full of win and made of awesome, listen to him.
By grinding while on benifits the other player is getting ahead due to RL. I get it, and he gets a bigger and better ship than me. then I REALY GET IT>, hes pwning me in game by surviving on my tax money in RL.. ARGH!
narr.. seriously If he can play alot thats cool, I cant though and just want to play with the bits I enjoy. Not be forced to Mine,Mission,Scam or Trade ingame to get the ISK to do it.
Dranadar - Space Monkey
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:43:00 -
[235]
Originally by: voogru
Originally by: Kerfira people would buy from illegal vendors anyway.
And risk getting banned. So not only will they spend RL money to advance themselves in a video game, they risk getting banned and losing what they paid for.
A lot of ppl WILL risk that as long as they think they can get away with it.
What a system like this will also give to CCP, is a lot more transparency in how GTC money flows.
They can set up monitoring systems which can flag large ISK movements for investigation, and ppl will not longer have the excuse that they were doing GTC-ISK sales/buys. This'll make it easier for CCP to catch ISK-sellers/buyers and macro-farmers, while making the effort involved in illegal ISK trade go up.
If they're serious about this and implements it properly, it could make a decent dent in the ISK-trade for RL money.
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:45:00 -
[236]
Originally by: Dranadar
Originally by: Kerfira My stuff...
Assumption? a Clear what is going to be and what isnt going to be, in nice bullet points from a DEV would be great.
If what you say does transpire - great. If not
I agree, and it IS an assumption/interpretation on my part. However, this is how I read the OP, and applying a large amount of common sense
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ToxicFire
Phoenix Knights Dark Nebula Galactic Empire
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:50:00 -
[237]
Originally by: Kerfira
Originally by: Dranadar
Originally by: Kerfira My stuff...
Assumption? a Clear what is going to be and what isnt going to be, in nice bullet points from a DEV would be great.
If what you say does transpire - great. If not
I agree, and it IS an assumption/interpretation on my part. However, this is how I read the OP, and applying a large amount of common sense
Your assumption forgot the fact ccp already has a secure gtc for isk trading system in place as part of the accounts section. The op clearly states that there getting rid of the current system that allows gtc and isk sales via third parties and that isk rich players will be able to buy gtc from ccp directly. Sig removed as it lacks EVE-related content. Mail [email protected] if you have questions. -Hango
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Pan Crastus
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:53:00 -
[238]
Originally by: CCP kieron In essence, it will be possible for a time and ISK-rich, but financially challenged player to purchase game time directly from CCP.
Well, that's a good way to keep your older players who are discontent with the current flaws in EVE (since they will no longer have to pay).
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Rikako
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Posted - 2007.05.05 10:54:00 -
[239]
Nine pages, most of it not even related to the original post: 0.0 alliances, pvp, pirating? Off topic.
Short and sweet folks, and honest to the core: If the wave of change washes over you and you don't like it, there are other places to go.
Everyone has missed the very fundamental of Kieron's post quote:
Originally by: "CCP kieron" We still have a number of details to work out
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In essence, nothing is concrete yet. It is an idea in progress, and like it was mentioned by dear Big K himself, a number of details to work out.
A number of details to work out. Remember that, take a deep breath, hold for three seconds, let go. Now you may make your next post fellow capsuleers.
Warmly,
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ToxicFire
Phoenix Knights Dark Nebula Galactic Empire
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Posted - 2007.05.05 11:01:00 -
[240]
Originally by: Rikako Nine pages, most of it not even related to the original post: 0.0 alliances, pvp, pirating? Off topic.
Short and sweet folks, and honest to the core: If the wave of change washes over you and you don't like it, there are other places to go.
Everyone has missed the very fundamental of Kieron's post quote:
Originally by: "CCP kieron" We still have a number of details to work out
.
In essence, nothing is concrete yet. It is an idea in progress, and like it was mentioned by dear Big K himself, a number of details to work out.
A number of details to work out. Remember that, take a deep breath, hold for three seconds, let go. Now you may make your next post fellow capsuleers.
Warmly,
Even with a number of details to work out there is only a limited number of avenues CCP could go down and implement the basis kieron has confirmed for us, those been tiered account classes, those that buy with isk don't have access to all the content using a limitation system such as used on trial accounts currently. Charging for content expsansion packs like AO or GW. Sig removed as it lacks EVE-related content. Mail [email protected] if you have questions. -Hango
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