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Psorion
Absolute Wrath Inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.18 12:29:00 -
[1]
I fly Caldari / Manticore. I dont need a new bomb. I need other things for my investment in training time and isk.
1: Warp cloaked. This ship is designed as a stealth bomber, make it able to warp cloaked (like covert ops) , maybe using a covert-ops cloaker.
2: Target/lock cloaked- Why not? passive targeting of some sort, Maybe you still cannot fire weapons cloaked but targeting should not be disabled. If this is not possible, reduce the time to lock.
3: Improve cruisemissles. A bonus to flight time and explosion velocity as part of 'stealth bomber' skill. This ship should be dangerous, to offset its 'fragility'. It should bring the pain to frigates, destroyers, and should be a threat to cruisers.
4: Keep the third launcher in the Manticore. Maybe give the other races a bonus to their racial weapons, Ie-Range bonus for laser/etc..
Stealth bombers are paper, and if they are going to be used should be rewarded for the risk of being damped/locked/destroyed in one salvo
Cloaked and AFK at a system near you... |
Quilan Masaq
Caldari Combat Systems
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Posted - 2007.05.18 12:39:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Quilan Masaq on 18/05/2007 12:41:16
Originally by: Psorion I fly Caldari / Manticore. I dont need a new bomb. I need other things for my investment in training time and isk.
1: Warp cloaked. This ship is designed as a stealth bomber, make it able to warp cloaked (like covert ops) , maybe using a covert-ops cloaker.
2: Target/lock cloaked- Why not? passive targeting of some sort, Maybe you still cannot fire weapons cloaked but targeting should not be disabled. If this is not possible, reduce the time to lock.
4: Keep the third launcher in the Manticore.
Stealth bombers are paper, and if they are going to be used should be rewarded for the risk of being damped/locked/destroyed in one salvo
Agree with those three points. Both the first two are kind of vital to its role.
Cruise missiles are fine as they are however, you already have a BS sized weapon system on a Frigate thats powerful enough.
Mant should deffinatly keep the 3rd slot, and the other SB's should be changed to 3 Hi's as well imho.
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Waxau
Liberty Rogues Insomnia.
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Posted - 2007.05.18 12:40:00 -
[3]
..........lol
So you want your bomber to warp cloaked? Fair does - been suggested often.
You want to lock cloaked? Rofl - Why? What bonus is it, and why?
Improve missiles - no. Theyre fine.
and as for the others....you want them to get bonuses to what......lasers?????? rofl - How would that make them a BOMBER
Dear me, some people
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Psorion
Absolute Wrath Inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.18 13:47:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Waxau ..........lol
So you want your bomber to warp cloaked? Fair does - been suggested often.
You want to lock cloaked? Rofl - Why? What bonus is it, and why?
Improve missiles - no. Theyre fine.
and as for the others....you want them to get bonuses to what......lasers?????? rofl - How would that make them a BOMBER
Dear me, some people
Thanks for not flaming and keeping it constructive.
Yes.
1: I think a stealth bomber should be able to employ its stealthy ness and lock targets. For more intelligence (cargo/ship scanning for example) and to be able to uncloak and fire. U can be locked as soon as u uncloak, and ships with fast scan res can lock you quicker than you can recloak. So in the interest of improving the viability of the SB, sure allow it to passively lock cloaked . (maybe increasing the time required to get a lock).
2: Racial bonusus, For example. Amarr Stealth bomber has 2 lauchers and 2 high slots (gunslots). Improve the bonus to range or damage, and allow the mounting of a battleship class equivalant of the cruise missle. Amarr may not train any missle skills, so why should their stealth bombers be forced to train cruise missles. Caldari dont train lasers.etc Just ideas, since I dont fly Amarr. But this would help balance the Stealth Bomber of all races not just caldari (IMHO).
Technically, since the inception the Stealth bomber is neither stealthy or a bomber. Maybe reducing its sig radius lower than it is would increase its 'stealthy' ness.
It should be
1: Very hard to lock 2: Very hard to detect 3: Hit hard 4: Easy to kill
Cloaked and AFK at a system near you... |
Liam Fremen
Gallente Global Isk Network NBSI Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.18 13:50:00 -
[5]
On SISI there are already "bombs" that are deployed by SB with 15km explosion radius with various kind of effect.
Unitevi alla crociata contro gli sfigati di EvE, gli AESC! |
Psorion
Absolute Wrath Inc.
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Posted - 2007.05.18 13:53:00 -
[6]
I have been reading the SB threads about SISI, and intend to do some testing, but from what I have read its not worth it. I range as my tank on my SB, and with the flight time of Cruises, I find I have to work a 50-100km buffer to keep out of lock range of most of my targets (frigates etc) and use multiple sensor dampers and boosters to keep my range advantage. if I have to move within 15km of a target Im likely in a pod with the way the ship is setup (paper and cardboard shields and armor).
Cloaked and AFK at a system near you... |
Leikung
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Posted - 2007.05.18 15:43:00 -
[7]
1) would be nice, more in line with "stealth"
2)Leave it the way it is. Its in line with how cloak should work.
3) CM are just fine, I can target and launch at 200km, you dont need any more cushion than that.
4) concur, leave all the SBers just the way they are. We dont need cookie cutter ships. If you want the best, then learn Caldari, and fly the manti, I did.
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Swirled
Amarr The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.18 15:44:00 -
[8]
Having not tried out the new bombs on SiSi yet, im not 100% sure on the effect they will have on the game.
I agree with the idea that stealth bombers should be able to fit the cov-ops cloak. The roles between the cov-ops ship and the stealth bomber are still clearly defined due to A) The scanning bonus on cov-ops and B) The warp range, and speed of stealth bombers (Im sure SB pilots will agree that warp range on most can be... well, not brilliant)
Not too sure id agree with the cloaked targetting, or the boost to cruise missiles... Think cruise are fine, and that cloaked targetting wouldnt offer a huge difference in gameplay to make it worthy of implementing.
I like the idea of a racial bonus of some kind however, making it for the small weapons of each race may make them an underused bonus, as most SB pilots wont like to get within that kind of range.
--- Just My Opinion Of Course...
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Rasputtin
Pastafarians Novus Ordos Seclorum
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Posted - 2007.05.18 16:14:00 -
[9]
I havent been in my Nemesis since I found out that once the Cruise missles are launched, recloaking makes them hit for 0 Pts of Damage... Has this been fixed or is it a still a Developer "Bonus" to the SB class?
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Christopher Dalran
Gallente Deadly Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.18 16:45:00 -
[10]
The worst part about a SB is that after you fire off your missiles you have to fly around uncloaked untill they reach their target or you do no damage at all.
Another bad part is the rediculos bonuses on the ships, the Galente SB has bonuses to hybrid weapons of all things. Find me a small turrent that can even come close to the range of Cruise missiles.
Also with the main weapon system being Cruise missiles all of them need the same # of missile launcher spots or the ones with 3 will end up being 50% better than those with 2 (much too large a difference).
IMHO the extreme limitations on cloaks are seriously hurting SB's. Perhaps Cov ops should be the warp while cloaked ability while SB's get can cloak while being locked (but not after a lock is established) ability. Cov ops dont want to be seen, SB's want to disappear after being seen.
Missiles absolutly MUST damage their target after the firing ship cloaks. SB's should be able to move into a favorable position, lock their target while still cloaked, decloak, fire weapons (still no module activation while cloaked), recloak and relocate to a new position WHILE the missiles are in flight. Extremely fast locking ships should be required to catch them as they cant employ the afformentioned technique and scramble a target at the same time. ------------------------------- C.D's Formula for success ------------------------------- Credit Card = Game Time Card Gametime Card = ISK Therefore Credit Card = ISK.
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Talos Darkhart
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Posted - 2007.05.18 17:15:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Rasputtin I havent been in my Nemesis since I found out that once the Cruise missles are launched, recloaking makes them hit for 0 Pts of Damage... Has this been fixed or is it a still a Developer "Bonus" to the SB class?
Not totally sure if it's still the same but a couple of months back once a missle had been in flight for a certain amount of time you could cloak and it still hurt
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neamiah
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Posted - 2007.09.08 17:11:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Psorion I fly Caldari / Manticore. I dont need a new bomb. I need other things for my investment in training time and isk.
1: Warp cloaked. This ship is designed as a stealth bomber, make it able to warp cloaked (like covert ops) , maybe using a covert-ops cloaker.
2: Target/lock cloaked- Why not? passive targeting of some sort, Maybe you still cannot fire weapons cloaked but targeting should not be disabled. If this is not possible, reduce the time to lock.
3: Improve cruisemissles. A bonus to flight time and explosion velocity as part of 'stealth bomber' skill. This ship should be dangerous, to offset its 'fragility'. It should bring the pain to frigates, destroyers, and should be a threat to cruisers.
4: Keep the third launcher in the Manticore. Maybe give the other races a bonus to their racial weapons, Ie-Range bonus for laser/etc..
Stealth bombers are paper, and if they are going to be used should be rewarded for the risk of being damped/locked/destroyed in one salvo
I wanted to reinstate this thread instead of making a new one. I think it's important enough of a subject considering the possibilities of the SB ships. Please read the posts and comment (no flaming children). I'd like to see what a developer might say about it. I want to hear a VALID agrument as to why a SB shouldn't fit the T2 Cov Ops Cloak.
Thanks!
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Lisento Slaven
Amarr Vendetta Underground Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.09.08 18:08:00 -
[13]
The stealth bomber does not need to be able to fit the cov ops cloak in my opinion. It would make it a LOT more deadly if it could, but it isn't necessary. As a Bomber in 0.0 if it could warp cloaked the enemy would not see it coming that's for sure.
As far as the original post:
1. Already commented, that's an entirely opinionated thing. 2. The Stealth Bomber is not really effected in any way by the decloak delay. I can lock things as soon as I decloak which defeats the purpose of locking before decloaking. I lock things pretty fricken fast too. 3. The missiles themselves are fine in their current stage considering the stealth bomber has the general boost to all damage. 4. Well...we saw what happened. All got 3rd launcher.
Whatev ---
Put in space whales!
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Jan Ars
The Thrill Kill Clique
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Posted - 2007.09.08 18:17:00 -
[14]
I'd like to see some kind of small (SMALL!) bonus to Cruise Missile Launch speed.
Hear me out.
Granted, we don't want them lobbing out massive DPS, they're already fairly deadly.
Perhaps something like: +5% ROF for each fitted Ballistic Control System. That'd only be a 10% ROF bonus, but it would increase DPS slightly enough to add to their deadliness.
I know most of you will probably hate the idea. With my skills, I'd be launching 3 missiles every 11.21 seconds. (using EFT)
Without this proposed bonus, I get 152.7 DPS. With the change, I'd get 175.55 DPS. Not a huge increase, but something you'd notice.
Honestly, the alpha strike is the most important strike. The secondary volley has to come quickly or else the target will be gone. This will enhance (ever so slightly) the damage the ship deals. Not a lot, but just a delightful little bonus.
/flames incoming ECM Specialist
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Reem Fairchild
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Posted - 2007.09.08 18:46:00 -
[15]
I (well my main character, not on on this one) fly a Nemesis, and it is a great ship as it is. Stealth Bombers do not need a boost. In fact, if anything, I predict within 4-6 months or so we are going to start seeing massive forum whining about how overpowered they are and that they need to be "nerfed".
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Rude Bwoy
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Posted - 2007.09.08 19:30:00 -
[16]
I fly Nemesis. It fits 3 x Arby Launchers.
I agree with point 1: I think it should be able to fit covert ops cloak.
I disagree with point 2. No other ship can do that - plus besides, my guess is the fundamental game code won't allow it.
I actually think its cruise missiles powerful enough. There are plenty of Missile skills to help ensure more damage is dealt. The nemesis for instance already gets a bonus for thermal cruise dmg (plus the usual covert-ops skills) Who's the rudest of them all! |
Slipofthetongue
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Posted - 2007.09.09 04:08:00 -
[17]
If using the correct setup and with the right skills a stealth bomber is already an awesome ship. I mean with the 200 dps (before resists) I can put out using a manticore, along with an alpha of 2300+ (which is only slightly smaller on frigate sized ships), I don't know what else you are asking for from a frigate costing between 10 and 15 mil...
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Arana Tellen
Gallente The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.09.09 05:04:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Arana Tellen on 09/09/2007 05:04:43 I love roaming gangs of ewar stealth bombers, they are deadly.
For ****s and giggles I put a rate of fire and damage rig on my nemesis to make up for the loss in DPS a bit but with 4 or 5 you are putting out a nice amount of damage with a decent amount of damage.
Immune to a lone interceptor by virtue of damp + web ---------------------------------
Core 2 Duo E4300 1.8ghz @ 3ghz, 2GB Gskill DDR2 5400 @ 800mhh 4-4-4-12, Abit fatality mATX F-I90HD @ 334mhz, 8800GTS 320mb 2x250GB 7200.10s Raid 0, Vista 64 Home. |
Dalanoria
Northern Intelligence Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.09.09 05:46:00 -
[19]
lol, BUFF a ship that can peal the shield and 1/2 the armor off a cruiser in 1 volley ?
SB's are the best cheap pos ship out there for the dmg they deal..20 mill isk to deal 3k alphas, doesnt sound like it needs buffing...
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2007.09.09 08:33:00 -
[20]
They need to fix the stealth part of the stealth bomber. Right now itÆs got a bigger sig, easier to lock, see and shoot over the T1 frigate its built around. It should have a smaller sig then the T1 frig.
Passive shield tanking guide click here |
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Julius Romanus
Bloodmoney Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.09.09 09:44:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Pottsey They need to fix the stealth part of the stealth bomber. Right now itÆs got a bigger sig, easier to lock, see and shoot over the T1 frigate its built around. It should have a smaller sig then the T1 frig.
I too would enjoy a ceptor with cruise missles.
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Night Tripper
Es and Whizz
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Posted - 2007.09.09 09:58:00 -
[22]
i think these ships are really supposed to be flown in gangs, where they are much more effective. not really a solo frig popper.
the only thing, as potsey suggests, is a small sig radius would i think help them a lot. give them a little more speed and maneuverability.
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2007.09.09 10:35:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Pottsey on 09/09/2007 10:39:23 ôI too would enjoy a ceptor with cruise missles.ö I captor isnÆt a stealth ship, it shouldnÆt be more stealthy then a stealth ship that require covert ops skills.
Look at it logically. CCP have taken a T1 frigate increased its sig, made it less stealthy and then gone and called it a stealth ship. At the very least a SB should be more stealthy then the T1 ship hull itÆs based on.
CCP should either rename Stealth bombers to just bombers and remove the stealth skills or they should make the ship a real stealth ship.
Stealth ships should be harder to lock, see and shoot. Not easier. Surly I am not the only one that thinks stealth ships should hav a low signature Radius? Passive shield tanking guide click here |
Ararius
EP0CH Black Sun Cartel
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Posted - 2007.09.09 10:41:00 -
[24]
Change the bonus so it does ALOT of damage per shot, but fires ALOT slower
So like ZOMG A SB BRACE FOR IMPACT -Boom- -You take much Damage- It decloaks
Your all 'wtf'
\o/
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Cali Dare
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Posted - 2007.09.09 10:42:00 -
[25]
Stealth Bombers were boosted, twice.
If by now you still don't know how to use them I suggest you go back to whatever you flew before you tried bombers, they're fine.
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Mudkest
MetaForge Ekliptika
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Posted - 2007.09.09 11:06:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Julius Romanus
Originally by: Pottsey They need to fix the stealth part of the stealth bomber. Right now itÆs got a bigger sig, easier to lock, see and shoot over the T1 frigate its built around. It should have a smaller sig then the T1 frig.
I too would enjoy a ceptor with cruise missles.
it will still be slow and heavy, hardly an interceptor ;)
----- GIEV custom ship paint jobs!
I want my hello-kitty-kessie! |
Multras
Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.09.09 11:20:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Multras on 09/09/2007 11:21:55 No.
Yes I fly stealth bombers. Making the SB a weak ship is fine with me, it makes it fun and challenging to fly. Giving the SB covert ops cloak would make it way too easy to fly about and pop things. And lets apply some logic to why the ship has a higher sig radius and is slow/bulky: It uses BS sized weapons.
Thanks to EVE Art Store for the sig. |
Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2007.09.09 18:52:00 -
[28]
ôAnd lets apply some logic to why the ship has a higher sig radius and is slow/bulky: It uses BS sized weapons.ö But if itÆs got a higher sig itÆs not a stealth ship so shouldnÆt be called a stealth ship. Slow/bulky is fine. Right now itÆs a bomber not a Stealth bomber.
Passive shield tanking guide click here |
Reem Fairchild
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Posted - 2007.09.09 20:52:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Multras Giving the SB covert ops cloak would make it way too easy to fly about and pop things.
Not to mention that it would make the regular covert ops frigate completely useless.
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Multras
Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.09.09 23:11:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Pottsey ôAnd lets apply some logic to why the ship has a higher sig radius and is slow/bulky: It uses BS sized weapons.ö But if itÆs got a higher sig itÆs not a stealth ship so shouldnÆt be called a stealth ship. Slow/bulky is fine. Right now itÆs a bomber not a Stealth bomber.
-100% targeting delay after decloaking. A stealth role bonus. It also has a larger CPU amount so it can fit a cloaking device along with its other thingies.
Thanks to EVE Art Store for the sig. |
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