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Sephiroth Angell
Sinthoras Industries Imperium Divine.
0
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Posted - 2017.06.19 23:41:44 -
[1] - Quote
Can somebody please explain to me solid econimical reason why the PLEX is growing so much in price?? That becomed really Broken.
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Rain6637
NulzSec
35105
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:03:01 -
[2] - Quote
back in my day plex was 350 million ISK
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Vortexo VonBrenner
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
2951
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:03:37 -
[3] - Quote
Prices in general tend to rise long-term?
In the Domain region the average PLEX price 6 days ago was 2.71 million. Today it is 2.8 million. May 23 it was 2.73 million. Really I'm not seeing much of a problem.
I should check the Serenity server, see how things are there just to be curious...
EvE security zones in pictures
EvE quick reference pdf
EvE links
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Gastuse r
Utility Ltd. Synergy of Steel
0
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:04:45 -
[4] - Quote
ghost Training is now a exploid and all the farms must now to be paid for (with the trillion of isk they made :))
yes yes ccp will handle this :D :D :D
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ScanAlt
Imperian Sciences
11
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:07:01 -
[5] - Quote
My best guess is that there were a lot of folks in the same boat as me. In my case, when the PLEX conversion happened, it also converted all the Aurum I had into the new PLEX. I had never bought any Aurum, but over the years I'd managed to accumulate ~850 new PLEX worth. As I plex my account, this meant I didn't have to buy a plex last month, and I'll only need to buy a third of one this month. Less demand (me and others like me) means lower prices, but those plex earned during the conversion likely dried up already or will shortly and so demand will be back at normal levels soon.
I wouldn't be surprised if there were more market factors tying into it, but I don't keep up with that sort of thing. |
Teckos Pech
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
6692
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:07:14 -
[6] - Quote
Gee, it might not have anything to do with 60+ trillion ISK entering the economy...an absolutely huge amount of ISK.
Nope, nothing to do with it at all.
More people need to go whine about the nerf to fighters so CCP can let this much ISK continue to flood into the game economy.
Edit: To be clear, I consider PLEX like a luxury good. A luxury good has a high income elasticity, that is as income goes up people tend to buy more of the good, so much more the that a larger portion of their income will go to that good. So, people who are now ISK rich thanks to carrier and super ratting may very well be putting that ISK into PLEX. Either to PLEX their accounts, for use in other services, or just as a long term store of value. After all, the long term trend for the price of PLEX is upwards.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
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Sonya Corvinus
Grant Village
1255
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:13:30 -
[7] - Quote
Why would you buy plex in game anyway? Subbing is significantly cheaper. You can earn enough to sub for a month in 30 minutes IRL. It's hard to say that about the ISK it takes to get a plex. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
11432
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:29:19 -
[8] - Quote
Sephiroth Angell wrote:Can somebody please explain to me solid econimical reason why the PLEX is growing so much in price?? I can't tell you. But if you figure it out, I believe there will be a job waiting for you at CCP.
Mr Epeen
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Rain6637
NulzSec
35106
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:38:22 -
[9] - Quote
It's because supers weren't nerfed hard enough
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
4053
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Posted - 2017.06.20 00:59:05 -
[10] - Quote
It's actually because the plex market is driven (& has been for years now) by investors & speculators. Not by consumers. Which means that most of the people involved in the plex market want the price to keep going up in order to get a reward on their investment. It's basically a share market in that regards, growing like a bubble, and if it ever bursts a lot of peoples investments crash hard. And some of those people are rich enough to influence the markets of EVE and make sure it never does. |
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Pleasure Hub Node-514
Pleasure Hub Hotline
246
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Posted - 2017.06.20 01:28:38 -
[11] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:It's because supers weren't nerfed hard enough "The beatings must continue until moral improves." -collected saying of Mistress Nerf (from page 69 of Longing for Your Buff)
'One night hauler' The tell all story of a pleasure bot in Jita 4-4
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Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
1700
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Posted - 2017.06.20 01:31:28 -
[12] - Quote
ISK inflation, potentially less people buying PLEX with RL cash and too many with ISK; so I guess a natural supply:demand.
@lunettelulu7
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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
3455
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Posted - 2017.06.20 01:42:54 -
[13] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:It's actually because the plex market is driven (& has been for years now) by investors & speculators. Not by consumers. Which means that most of the people involved in the plex market want the price to keep going up in order to get a reward on their investment. It's basically a share market in that regards, growing like a bubble, and if it ever bursts a lot of peoples investments crash hard. And some of those people are rich enough to influence the markets of EVE and make sure it never does.
Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel.
This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right? |
Algarion Getz
Aideron Corp
443
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Posted - 2017.06.20 01:48:21 -
[14] - Quote
Sephiroth Angell wrote:Can somebody please explain to me solid econimical reason why the PLEX is growing so much in price?? That becomed really Broken. There is huge demand for PLEX:
- SP farms (the legal version)
- investments (players hoard PLEX as gold item)
- game time
- vanity items like SKINs and apparel
Supply is limited.
Since the ISK faucets are wide open, prices can only go up and they will continue to go up because there are no major ISK sinks on the horizon. There are also no big wars. For more than half a year, the big alliances are carebearing and hoarding and buy PLEX with the extra ISK as investment. |
Algarion Getz
Aideron Corp
443
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Posted - 2017.06.20 01:58:09 -
[15] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:It's actually because the plex market is driven (& has been for years now) by investors & speculators. Not by consumers. Which means that most of the people involved in the plex market want the price to keep going up in order to get a reward on their investment. It's basically a share market in that regards, growing like a bubble, and if it ever bursts a lot of peoples investments crash hard. And some of those people are rich enough to influence the markets of EVE and make sure it never does. Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel. This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right? Of course we can share links, for example the "surge in ISK created out of thin air" in graph: http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/May_2017/9a_sinksfaucets.png +60 trillion ISK in May.
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Algarion Getz
Aideron Corp
443
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Posted - 2017.06.20 02:07:25 -
[16] - Quote
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:Prices in general tend to rise long-term?
In the Domain region the average PLEX price 6 days ago was 2.71 million. Today it is 2.8 million. May 23 it was 2.73 million. Really I'm not seeing much of a problem.
I should check the Serenity server, see how things are there just to be curious...
Well, it depends on your point of view and the timeframe you are looking at. If you are someone who needs to buy PLEX for Omega time, then you will see that the price for 30 days of game time has increased by 50% in just 1 year. (from ~1bill to ~1.5bill). That is a very fast increase. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
4053
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Posted - 2017.06.20 02:14:47 -
[17] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel.
This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right?
Of course it has had an impact, but the Plex market has not suddenly bubbled in the last 2 months because of Isk. It's been growing like this for far far longer, so you can't point at the supercarrier ratting as the cause of the plex price movement. It's simply made the problem a bit worse. |
Voddick
AFK
96
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Posted - 2017.06.20 02:48:42 -
[18] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:back in my day plex was 350 million ISK
I was running incursions during this time at 100 mil/hr. I regret not storing my ISK in PLEX every single day. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Primus Inc. LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
1619
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Posted - 2017.06.20 03:03:58 -
[19] - Quote
90 day GTCs for 450mil. Thats 150mil per 30 days and at 1.5bil it means a 10 fold increase in about as many years Id say. So ironically not to bad that it doubles every year.
Funny part was it was 2.784mil or so yesterday. So this is a fast increase.
Neyvn has it right. Its a speculator and investors market that they want to keep going up and CCP has a vested interest in it doing so as well from a business standpoint.
Have you heard anything I've said?
You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?
That's right.
Had to end sometime.
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Teckos Pech
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
6693
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Posted - 2017.06.20 04:47:37 -
[20] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel.
This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right?
Of course it has had an impact, but the Plex market has not suddenly bubbled in the last 2 months because of Isk. It's been growing like this for far far longer, so you can't point at the supercarrier ratting as the cause of the plex price movement. It's simply made the problem a bit worse.
The thing is only until recently has the growth rate of the ISK supply gone...well nearly vertical. Up until May it was growing at a much more sedate pace. In May the amount of ISK entering the economy was about the same as the ISK that entered the economy in the last six fecking months of 2016.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
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Lamajagarn McMyra
No Vacancies No Vacancies.
23
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Posted - 2017.06.20 06:41:43 -
[21] - Quote
Plex price has always been rising, hell even when they anounced the fighter changes prices did not move. The increase will continue untill something really drastic happens.
consider this: http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/May_2017/9aaa_top.sinks.faucets.over.time.png
Since prices were increasing slowly already in 2015 when average income was not even half of today. With current income i belive we will see a monthly increase around 5%. Invest all isk in plex the moment it's earned as it's loosing value rapidly. :) |
Mr Mieyli
Hedion University Amarr Empire
668
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Posted - 2017.06.20 06:45:19 -
[22] - Quote
Plex is now an easier market to get into, and it has a self fulfilling prophecy of only going up in value. More transactions would speed up the rate plex prices rise.
This post brought to you by CCP's alpha forum alt initiative. Playing the eve forums has never come cheaper.
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Piugattuk
Lima beans Corp
651
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Posted - 2017.06.20 06:47:27 -
[23] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:back in my day plex was 350 million ISK
Back when I started plex was about 125 million, inflation. |
April rabbit
Mosquito Squadron The-Culture
31
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Posted - 2017.06.20 07:05:19 -
[24] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:It's actually because the plex market is driven (& has been for years now) by investors & speculators. Not by consumers. Which means that most of the people involved in the plex market want the price to keep going up in order to get a reward on their investment. It's basically a share market in that regards, growing like a bubble, and if it ever bursts a lot of peoples investments crash hard. And some of those people are rich enough to influence the markets of EVE and make sure it never does. Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel. This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right? 2 days ago PLEX was 2.8, today it is 3 mil pu. Before it PLEX was semi-stable for long time.
I guess supers are the main reason for its grow.... |
Do Little
Virgin Plc Evictus.
1323
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Posted - 2017.06.20 07:54:36 -
[25] - Quote
PLEX is worth whatever the player buying it is willing to pay. No more, no less. It's value in real world money is controlled by CCP and has been stable as long as I can remember.
The in-game exchange rate with ISK is player controlled and has been going up as people accumulate more ISK and have nothing to spend it on. PLEX is a reasonable place to store in-game wealth since it can always be exchanged for game time.
If CCP dials back the ISK faucets, as they are trying to do, the price should stabilize and a lot of ISK will be turned into refineries this winter which will soak up a bit of the oversupply.
Don't expect the price to drop unless a lot of new players sell PLEX purchased from CCP with real world cash to finance in-game projects. |
Uthgaard
Because Wardec
44
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Posted - 2017.06.20 07:58:55 -
[26] - Quote
Ghost training and afk ratting. But mostly ghost training. Due to incursion farming and the rise in afk carrier ratting & VNI orbiting, ISK faucets exceed ISK sinks, leading to inflation.
But ghost training was a PLEX based exploit. One PLEX = 19 months of sp gain, which converted the cost of 1 plex into 74.5b profit. (12 month queue ending with a 6 month skill, at the end of the plexed month: 12+6+1 = 19) This led to a boom in PLEX consumption, raising its price steadily as it was diverted from the economy into this EVE version of The Matrix.
While ghost training was active, the more PLEX ghost trainer purchased, the more they could profit, creating an infinite loop that removed any upper limit on PLEX prices. Without a self-perpetuating price spiral, PLEX prices will equal the average monthly disposable income for normal players, varying +/- 1 standard deviation.
It didn't take long until ghost farms were consuming PLEX faster than it was being introduced into the game, driving demand above supply, and prices along with that. The skyrocketing prices drove off most of the players who had to afford PLEX to play. If you compare the two graphs you will see that player population follows the inverse of PLEX price. Left unchecked, they would have eventually smothered the game into extinction.
CCP introduced some PLEX drops with this event. Seeding some back into the economy is a great way to normalize the prices, but too few are dropping for this event to really impact the prices, so it will be a very long time before we see the decline. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Primus Inc. LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
1619
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Posted - 2017.06.20 08:06:40 -
[27] - Quote
Do Little wrote:PLEX is worth whatever the player buying it is willing to pay. No more, no less. It's value in real world money is controlled by CCP and has been stable as long as I can remember.
The in-game exchange rate with ISK is player controlled and has been going up as people accumulate more ISK and have nothing to spend it on. PLEX is a reasonable place to store in-game wealth since it can always be exchanged for game time.
If CCP dials back the ISK faucets, as they are trying to do, the price should stabilize and a lot of ISK will be turned into refineries this winter which will soak up a bit of the oversupply.
Don't expect the price to drop unless a lot of new players sell PLEX purchased from CCP with real world cash to finance in-game projects. Some will finance refineries and other ventures come winter with PLEX as well as the large isk influx lately. So it might have a small downward pressure on the prices then. But historically winter/spring has been the rise and peak of the yearly cycles for prices.
Have you heard anything I've said?
You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?
That's right.
Had to end sometime.
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Rain6637
NulzSec
35110
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Posted - 2017.06.20 08:09:32 -
[28] - Quote
Uthgaard wrote:Ghost training and afk ratting. But mostly ghost training. Due to incursion farming and the rise in afk carrier ratting & VNI orbiting, ISK faucets exceed ISK sinks, leading to inflation. But ghost training was a PLEX based exploit. One PLEX = 19 months of sp gain, which converted the cost of 1 plex into 74.5b profit. (12 month queue ending with a 6 month skill, at the end of the plexed month: 12+6+1 = 19) This led to a boom in PLEX consumption, raising its price steadily as it was diverted from the economy into this EVE version of The Matrix. While ghost training was active, the more PLEX ghost trainer purchased, the more they could profit, creating an infinite loop that removed any upper limit on PLEX prices. Without a self-perpetuating price spiral, PLEX prices will equal the average monthly disposable income for normal players, varying +/- 1 standard deviation. It didn't take long until ghost farms were consuming PLEX faster than it was being introduced into the game, driving demand above supply, and prices along with that. The skyrocketing prices drove off most of the players who had to afford PLEX to play. If you compare the two graphs you will see that player population follows the inverse of PLEX price. Left unchecked, they would have eventually smothered the game into extinction. CCP introduced some PLEX drops with this event. Seeding some back into the economy is a great way to normalize the prices, but too few are dropping for this event to really impact the prices, so it will be a very long time before we see the decline. They're dropping PLEX in game now too? That's a new one. Interesting to see the NES item devaluation doesn't miss the gold standard of the game economy. Now I feel less resentful of the SKINs and clothing that see similar devaluation through in-game drops.
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
559
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Posted - 2017.06.20 08:13:21 -
[29] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Dinsdale Pirannha wrote: Right, and the surge in ISK created out of thin air by the null sec cartels in supercarriers has had no impact. We can't share links on this forum, but some null sec guy on Crossing Zebras today flatly states he was making 260M / tick, or 780M/ hour, in a Hel.
This unprecedented surge of ISK into the economy had no impact, right?
Of course it has had an impact, but the Plex market has not suddenly bubbled in the last 2 months because of Isk. It's been growing like this for far far longer, so you can't point at the supercarrier ratting as the cause of the plex price movement. It's simply made the problem a bit worse. You can point to power creep in general and the players learning how to farm ever faster.
And features which have made this possible, like the supercarriers.
A signature :o
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Uthgaard
Because Wardec
44
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Posted - 2017.06.20 08:46:19 -
[30] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:They're dropping PLEX in game now too? That's a new one. Interesting to see the NES item devaluation doesn't miss the gold standard of the game economy. Now I feel less resentful of the SKINs and clothing that see similar devaluation through in-game drops.
They're not very common, they're dropping 1-2 at a time when they do drop. And since you need 500 to redeem, I wouldn't be surprised if the entire event contributes less than 50 total months of game time by its end. |
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