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The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.06.27 10:18:00 -
[1]
Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 10:21:11 Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 10:18:44 Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 10:17:30 Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 10:16:50 Hi, I am hoping to get potential investors for the buying and selling of minerals over long periods of time.
Basically you invest a certain amount of money (say 50mil) and that 50mil goes into buying an amount of minerals. I then wait a number of weeks, or possibly months (depending on the inflation rate) before deciding what would be the most profitable time to sell up.
This process will then be repeated until the investor has 200% of what was originally invested
This may take a while you think, but you can always opt out of the investment and I will transfer the current amount of isk you have made to you by selling the minerals bought from your isk immediatly (presuming they will be making a profit)
Here is how the profit will be split: 50% of the sale profit will be returned to the investor 40% will be re-invested 10% Will go to me
How can I be sure this isn't a scam? Erm, I don't think there is a possible way of telling, like everyone else I am not a alt, I have been playing for 2 years now, you have my word. If there is any way i can prove it to you then let me know
If your thinking that I would pretend to make a loss on your minerals purposefully in order to cover up the fact i have stolen your isk, I will be mailing every investor almost every week to notify them exactly what there isk is being used/invested into. So they are able to check for themselves that there money isnt being lost.
What happens if I make a loss? Well that can't really happen because mineral prices will always inflate and deflate so chances are there will be a time where a profit can be made no matter at what point you buy the minerals, its more of a question of just how long you have to wait for prices to inflate to a point beyond what I originally payed :)
Please send any isk you wish to invest to me (no amount under 10 million isk please)
If there is anything i missed out let me know or if you have any questions please say so
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Mr DanielXY
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Posted - 2007.06.27 14:25:00 -
[2]
Two Questions:
1) Do you have any experience in Mineral Trading or is this your first venture? (What makes you the right person to do this?)
2) Whats your estimate on monthly profit (I know its hard to predict and will fluctuate but what do you expect on average)
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The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.06.27 15:05:00 -
[3]
Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 15:05:13 Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 27/06/2007 15:03:58 1) Is this the first time I have done mineral investemnt - no. Is this the first time i have done mineral investment with other peoples isk - yes
Of course i am not the only person capable of investing minerals, however i believe i am the right person due to my attention to detail and experience with investing my own isk before
2) Monthly profit can obviously never be fully predicted but studying the average inflation rates for the minerals i am looking to invest into, around 10-20% profit per month. I know thats a bit vague but its just to ensure you your profit isnt going to be microscopic, and certainly don't get your hopes up that you will have 200% back within the first month
But of course there is always the chance you could make huge isk quickly, just look at the morphite inflation :)
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Mr DanielXY
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Posted - 2007.06.27 15:24:00 -
[4]
Hm well, I guess it cant hurt (much) to invest a 100M to get you started :)
isk send
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The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.06.27 16:18:00 -
[5]
thank you for the investement
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Saint Lazarus
C R Y O FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.06.27 18:15:00 -
[6]
Well I like the idea, would love to give it a go but.....as you said yourself theres no way of tellin if this is a scam or not. be so easy for you to run off with the isk :P
But I might send 20 mil to test the water, we'll see =)
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The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.06.30 10:04:00 -
[7]
Just cause I scare carebears doesnt mean I am an ***hole and a scammer
For the record I have had more than 3 oppourtunitys to steal over 2 billion isk and never have, loyalty is more valuable than isk in eve. If you want evidence feel free to convo me
Simple reply - I am investing my own cash into this, but believe it or not I don't have a great deal of isk atm due to my spending amounts and other investments of my own. So this is just something i am hoping to give a boost of isk while I am low
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YunFu Yan
Yan Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:12:00 -
[8]
Originally by: The S1lenc3er For the record I have had more than 3 oppourtunitys to steal over 2 billion isk and never have
I have lost more than that in mineral trading during may cause of sudden price drops. I was lucky to be able to compensate for most of it thou and lose only 11% share value after the dividend had been payed.
The mineral market is highly voilative. You can earn alot by good timing but you can also lose alot. Not material for public activity tbh.
Yan Enterprises - We mean business. |
The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:14:00 -
[9]
If you can loose over 2 bil in a day from mineral trading then there is something obviously wrong with you
Ever thought to wait until the prices rise again? lol
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YunFu Yan
Yan Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:16:00 -
[10]
Edited by: YunFu Yan on 01/07/2007 16:16:21 May <-> day... spot the difference!
And about waiting for prices to raise... I guarantee a minimum interest of 10% of my NAV. Impossible to reach that by longterm speculation. I have 18bil of isk in constant flow.
Yan Enterprises - We mean business. |
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The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:19:00 -
[11]
I'd just like to say that was the fastest reply ever and good luck with that
moving on...
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YunFu Yan
Yan Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:29:00 -
[12]
Originally by: The S1lenc3er I'd just like to say that was the fastest reply ever and good luck with that
moving on...
You got me wrong mate. I'm not saying you shouldn't try what you have in mind. I didn't want to question your credibility. There are enough people here, who can do that better than me. I was just pointing out the catch 22 in that sector of the market when asking for public money.
You will either have to play safe but then your monthly ROI will be so low, that noone will bother investing or you gamble. Then you can get extreme returns... or lose everything. Again noone will bother to invest because it's too risky.
I've been active in this sector for 8 months now and I had my fair bit of up's and downs. I wouldn't dare to go public with my corp simply cause I'd not only risk the public money but also my reputation.
Yan Enterprises - We mean business. |
The S1lenc3er
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:33:00 -
[13]
Fair enough, however there is a risk in any IPO of how long it will take for a return investment and whether it will be profitable.
I believe I can predict the market well enough to get a high ROI without the risk you claim there is
After all people do this in RL with various materials and currencies
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STARKEY 07
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Posted - 2007.07.01 17:06:00 -
[14]
100 mil invested, my personal experience in this shows me that it is very profitable, fiddly as hell though so this investment suits me perfectly.
And yes im a corp mate before you flamers jump all over this.
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The S1lenc3er
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.05 11:45:00 -
[15]
bump
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The S1lenc3er
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.08 22:15:00 -
[16]
bump The Logo Shop
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.07.09 00:26:00 -
[17]
I don't understand how this can be even remotely assured to make money. It seems almost as equally likely to lose money as make it. Unless you're selling very quickly, in which case this isn't really any different than any other kind of trading. If you're selling quickly then you might as well do any kind of trading, not restrict yourself to minerals. But hey... thats just my opinion. Guess I don't think there is enough information listed to make this worthy of investment. I don't fully understand why any random person couldn't do this and keep 100% of their profits.
Tanking Setups Compared
Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.07.09 06:11:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Shadarle I don't fully understand why any random person couldn't do this and keep 100% of their profits.
I also see it like this... however I recognize that there is an influx of players starting to get some serious grips on the eve economy (mental grips that is). Instead of earning up the nest egg to properly fund their business they are coming here, mostly out of the woodworks, and trying to make their names.
That's about the only reason I see. Just hard to decide who is honest and who is not. (Additionally there is the who is honest and who is just being honest till they can get a really big ipo going!)
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
Misanthropy: It's not just for Rednecks! |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.07.09 09:28:00 -
[19]
I don't like it....
How many more Red Army investments will there be before the whole thing turns scam?
Either way, I don't like the way this idea has been presented, nor the chances of success (not even counting my worries in the validity of this investment)
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The S1lenc3er
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.09 13:42:00 -
[20]
Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 09/07/2007 13:43:23 The person who has invested in me has known me for over a year in eve and he just thinks this is a good investment to make, thats all it is
The Logo Shop
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Ulrich Sternaxe
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Posted - 2007.07.09 15:12:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Ricdic I don't like it....
How many more Red Army investments will there be before the whole thing turns scam?
Either way, I don't like the way this idea has been presented, nor the chances of success (not even counting my worries in the validity of this investment)
Let's sum some things up in this thread and what my gut feeling is making of it (I'm sorry if my gut feeling is wrong, I don't want to insult you, this is just my feeling):
- This guy has a low security rating (according to Ricdic, haven't checked) > he's a pirate and likes to play without honor (or a different view of honor, shooting people that have done nothing wrong to him, playing the scoundrel, stealing ISK, etc.) - This guy talks about scaring carebears in a funny way > he has no respect for and looks down on players who focus on highsec to make their ISK (mostly businessmen and investors), he finds them weak, pathetic and laughable - This guy has other IPO's as well (or at least Red Army has) > he's trying to maximize his ISK raising before he's found out as a scammer - This guy talks about the mineral market as if prices are always inflating and would always inflate to a point beyond what he originally payed > this proves he has no or little experience in trading in the mineral market for the past 8 months, or he's promising things he can't make true, as others have mentioned here, the mineral market can go both ways, pick the wrong mineral to invest in and you're screwed (for example zydrine going from 4000 to almost 1000 ISK p/unit). Overall, the mineral market has deflated almost 10% in the past 8 months (not counting morphite) - This guy says he's got experience in the mineral market > see above, I don't believe it, or he's promising profits he can't possibly be sure of to make his offer look more attractive (OK, that's a good possibility which, if true, would change my entire gut feeling) - His IPO is quite short > he doesn't want to spend too much effort on raising the ISK (could be understandable if he's a legit businessman, I had the same issue) - There's no limit to this IPO > he basicly wants as much ISK as he can get his hands on
private investors wanted - 8% fixed return per month (30.5 days) |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.07.09 15:22:00 -
[22]
Holy crap, you are a shrink! BTW, I didn't even mention the sec-status, was someone else. I wouldn't write it off as a scam, I just don't like the feeling I get when reading this, coupled with the rumors and information surrounding some of the Red Army issues etc.
Just my opinion.
Oh, and I definetly don't think the business plan is up to scratch. If it was, I probably wouldn't have questioned this whole operation in the first place.
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LaVista Vista
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.09 15:29:00 -
[23]
Red army inc does NOT support this investment. We had no knowledge about this before it was posted. And we have now sorted this out, to make sure that theres no connection to red army inc.
Yet i personally wouldnt invest in this, because of the big risk. We do NOT support this IPO.
CEO Of Red Army Inc. |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.07.09 15:34:00 -
[24]
I take back my Red Army remarks, now that it has been advised that they don't support the OP.
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The S1lenc3er
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.09 15:52:00 -
[25]
Edited by: The S1lenc3er on 09/07/2007 15:52:42 Urlrich first of all post with your main
Secondly you have make some huge judgments based on your own opinion of eve players
If you had checked my logo shop, you would see from the masses of positive replies that I get buisness done and I am generally a nice person :)
Becuase I (wording carefully) like to pvp in a pvp game this somehow makes me a petty theif and a low individual?
It is obvious you have a personall vendetta against pirates and people who use numbers in there name, I would like to clarify just for Ulrich Sternaxe (or whatever his main is) that the reason numbers are in my name is becuase "the silencer" is already taken :) 2 years ago I didn't realise that having numbers in your name meant you were a 12 year old mkay?
Yes the IPO is a risk, I didn't say it wasn't
Yes there is no way of proving it is a scam, but you can sure as hell bet yourself that my reputation would be ruined if it was, and my logo buisness (which earns me ALOT of isk) would be ruined also
The initial thoughts of investors now-a-days is whether or not an investment is a scam or not. The only way oyu can be sure is by investing a small amount of money into something first and then building up (but that doesnt work either becuase then you get scammed when you invest lots of isk you say) so I really have no way of convincing everyone that this isn't a scam
Just don't invest if you don't want the risk, but please refrain from completly slating me based on loose opionions about pirates and avatar names, that, is just childish :)
The Logo Shop
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WredStorm
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2007.07.09 16:39:00 -
[26]
OP, You might get more interest if you explained your plans a bit more. For example, are you going to be buying up cheap minerals and transporting them to other stations where they can be sold for more, or are you going to sit in one station and simply work the margin between current buy and sell orders there? Do you own a freighter that you'll be using to move minerals around? What market(s) are you going to work out of? What mineral(s) are you planning on dabbling in? What is your accounting skill and broker relations skill at (if you're going to play in the tritanium market this can make a huge difference).
I've made billions ISK over the last 10 months almost exclusively through the minerals market and your statement regarding sitting on minerals for months at a time doesn't make much sense to me. That amounts to gambling, really, and there is no need to gamble in the minerals market if you know what you're doing. Is it your intent to just wait for a "low" in the price on a given mineral, buy up tons of it, sit on it for months and pray the price goes up?
I have no idea if this is a scam or not, but I don't think the OP has provided enough information to get any serious attention from serious investors. That, in and of itself, will probably be a red flag to most folks, I suspect.
WredStorm ----- Think out of the box, consider passive shield tanking your Myrmidon, you'll be pleasantly surprised! |
Ulrich Sternaxe
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Posted - 2007.07.09 18:26:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Ulrich Sternaxe on 09/07/2007 18:30:05
Originally by: The S1lenc3er
Urlrich first of all post with your main
Maybe this is my main?
Quote:
Secondly you have make some huge judgments based on your own opinion of eve players
If you had checked my logo shop, you would see from the masses of positive replies that I get buisness done and I am generally a nice person :)
You are absolutely right and I'm sorry that my post was so sloppy not to point out the fact more clearly that I was merely basing this on hunches and feelings that could be totally wrong or influenced by the bad experiences with IPO's I've read about on this forum. I should have also pointed out that I based these hunches merely on what I read in this thread and that I didn't do any further research. I wanted to do all this but I was a little stressed for time and posted it as it was because I had to leave.
Quote:
Becuase I (wording carefully) like to pvp in a pvp game this somehow makes me a petty theif and a low individual?
I have the utmost respect for both pirates and other good pvp'ers Especially if they know what they're doing Without pvp (or pirates for that matter), EVE would be very boring to me, without pirates or other enemies there would be no challenge, there would be no nemesis
I do believe though that when someone is role-playing a pirate he's more likely to steal or scam as well, at least their rules are different than that from a role-playing businessman or law-abiding citizen.
I forgot to say though, that because of my noobness with the inner workings of living in lowsec and 0.0, I did not consider what happens to your security rating when you're just pvp-ing for fun, not per se to role-play as a pirate.
Quote: It is obvious you have a personall vendetta against pirates and people who use numbers in there name, I would like to clarify just for Ulrich Sternaxe (or whatever his main is) that the reason numbers are in my name is becuase "the silencer" is already taken :) 2 years ago I didn't realise that having numbers in your name meant you were a 12 year old mkay?
Yeah, I knew that was probably the reason, that's why I said it was a little far-fetched. I just felt like adding another negative argument, I was about to get to the positive arguments, just that damn timeclock again.
Quote: Just don't invest if you don't want the risk, but please refrain from completly slating me based on loose opionions about pirates and avatar names, that, is just childish :)
You're right here again, allthough I didn't mean to slate you, I just didn't get to finish and edit my post properly. I kind of got halfway through, just about when I wanted to put in some arguments on your behalve discrediting my own hunches and bad feelings. It was kind of like me scribbling down some thoughts on paper but not properly formatted for publication I had my reasons to click post though, couldn't keep the text for editing later for some reasons I don't want to get into right now. Consider this the edit
private investors wanted - 8% fixed return per month (30.5 days) |
Ulrich Sternaxe
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Posted - 2007.07.09 18:40:00 -
[28]
Originally by: WredStorm
I've made billions ISK over the last 10 months almost exclusively through the minerals market and your statement regarding sitting on minerals for months at a time doesn't make much sense to me. That amounts to gambling, really, and there is no need to gamble in the minerals market if you know what you're doing. Is it your intent to just wait for a "low" in the price on a given mineral, buy up tons of it, sit on it for months and pray the price goes up? WredStorm
To the OP, unless you agree with this man and already knew all of the above but just didn't want to post it in your business plan for security reasons, I suggest you try to talk and learn from this fellow. He's quite right that you can definitely play with the market if you know what you're doing and make lots of ISK with it. But if you just plan to sit on the mineral for months hoping it will go up in price you'd better make some really good guesses, and a lot of luck wouldn't hurt either
private investors wanted - 8% fixed return per month (30.5 days) |
The S1lenc3er
Red Army Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.09 18:57:00 -
[29]
Okay just to calarify the exact idea of this ipo for people who have asked :)
This does not involve mineral trading from one region to another
The basic idea of the ipo is just to buy minerals, wait, then sell them
But I don't understand why people believe this is highly risky and is a 50/50 gamble between making a prfit or loosing anything
I will explain this with a few simple rules of my buying/selling
1. I will only buy minerals that are substaintially lower in price than at any other point within a one year perion on the graph 2. Even if the mineral prices drop after i have bought the product by a universal law of inflation, they are bound to rise at some point again (the skill is about knowing how long that will take) 3. I will not be buying minerals that are notouriously rising and dropping within a small amount of time, as there is a higher risk 4. I believe i am able to predict whether a mineral will rise based on triggers within eve (such as demand and supply)
The Logo Shop
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WredStorm
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2007.07.09 21:27:00 -
[30]
OP, Thanks for elaborating on your plans. Unfortunately I think your returns will be far too low for the risk involved and will not participate, but I wish you the best of luck.
If you want to learn how to make billions in the minerals market and are willing to pay for such knowledge then feel free to drop me an in-game email and we can discuss terms. It takes a lot of work, but I've made ~7B over the last 10 months almost exclusively in the minerals trade, starting from scratch.
WredStorm ----- Think out of the box, consider passive shield tanking your Myrmidon, you'll be pleasantly surprised! |
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