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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.06.30 02:02:00 -
[1]
Welcome to my thread.
I will be working with high end T1 blueprints. I have several researched now. I am able to produce from them at a rapid pace. I will sell at several systems around eve. I will also trade T2 items within market hubs around Eve. These include your common weapons systems to propulsion modules as well as defensive modules. The type of trading is in station. It does not include any risk as the goods are always safe within the station. I make sure not to buy overpriced.
The returns are guaranteed to you no matter how bad I trade. I have enough experience to break even at the very worst. A significant amount of personal assets to pay dividends when they are due.
My offer to you consists of a 6% return every 4 weeks for 8 months. At the end of the period your 100% of your investment is returned. The goal this time is 2 billion isk.
Invest any amount rounded to 1/2 million. If you choose to ask for the amount back before the deadline then I will return it at 75% value. Costs of plan delays.
The timer starts this Saturday. Eight months ends at 0:00 Eve time on March 1 2008.
Please ask any serious questions. I am happy to answer you to the fullest. Looking forward for your participation. How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.06.30 02:42:00 -
[2]
Here I will update the amount currently raised.
with any additional information How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.06.30 05:06:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Ricdic on 30/06/2007 05:05:07
Originally by: DragonRiderTao
The returns are guaranteed to you no matter how bad I trade. I have enough experience to break even at the very worst. A significant amount of personal assets to pay dividends when they are due.
Very well, if you want to go ahead with this operation, I request that you transfer 2 billion isk worth of personal assets to a trustee nominated by the group here.
Quote:
My offer to you consists of a 6% return every 4 weeks for 8 months. At the end of the period your 100% of your investment is returned. The goal this time is 2 billion isk.
Sure, as long as you can provide the above security in front of a trustee. Failure to do so means this thread will be shot down just like all of your others on this matter. The day you endorsed yourself and your IPO with your alt, was the day you lost all credibility with the playerbase.
Need Empire Research Slots. Click here |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.06.30 06:06:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Ricdic
Very well, if you want to go ahead with this operation, I request that you transfer 2 billion isk worth of personal assets to a trustee nominated by the group here.
Sure, as long as you can provide the above security in front of a trustee. Failure to do so means this thread will be shot down just like all of your others on this matter. The day you endorsed yourself and your IPO with your alt, was the day you lost all credibility with the playerbase.
If I had that 2 billion isk I would not need to post here. My assets would cover the dividends at the very worst possible outcome. They are in constant use.
You post enough to know that signatures are not shared by all characters on an account. Why it is so hard to believe that some troll posted in my thread I do not know.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary Terror In The System
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Posted - 2007.06.30 12:11:00 -
[5]
I suppose there are always suckers that you can find, but to be honest I would think that even the least savvy individuals in this game would be on to you by now. Despite the fact that there is a recognized and working system in place, you decide to go on your own to raise your money. You refuse to do anything that several potential, very successful investors advise/request.
I'd be amazed and deeply disturbed if anyone fell for this.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.06.30 12:52:00 -
[6]
Why not make it easier to give all the same non-answer answers you previously gave? (For smart investors)
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
Shar Tegral> Some pew-pew at doo-doo for free-whee!!!! |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.06.30 21:28:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Daeva Vios I suppose there are always suckers that you can find, but to be honest I would think that even the least savvy individuals in this game would be on to you by now. Despite the fact that there is a recognized and working system in place, you decide to go on your own to raise your money. You refuse to do anything that several potential, very successful investors advise/request.
I'd be amazed and deeply disturbed if anyone fell for this.
Ask any questions you may have for me to answer.
Originally by: Shar Tegral Why not make it easier to give all the same non-answer answers you previously gave? (For smart investors)
Do not spam.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Dread Phantom
Caldari Project-Chaos
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Posted - 2007.07.01 00:28:00 -
[8]
Stop spamming your scam, you think we forgot about last time?
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DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.01 00:42:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Dread Phantom Stop spamming your scam, you think we forgot about last time?
Karma will return to you.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Investigador
Caldari Hator inc
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Posted - 2007.07.01 03:44:00 -
[10]
Originally by: DragonRiderTao
Originally by: Dread Phantom Stop spamming your scam, you think we forgot about last time?
Karma will return to you.
lol, look who's talking.
The one whose old scams haunt his new scams.
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DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.01 08:29:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Investigador
Originally by: DragonRiderTao
Originally by: Dread Phantom Stop spamming your scam, you think we forgot about last time?
Karma will return to you.
lol, look who's talking.
The one whose old scams haunt his new scams.
Go read the old thread.
Stop trolling.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.01 16:44:00 -
[12]
Ask for any information you need to know to invest.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Jennai
The Silent Rage R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.07.01 18:14:00 -
[13]
answering the questions from the previous thread would be a good start.
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DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.01 18:28:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Jennai answering the questions from the previous thread would be a good start.
Ask anything I have not answered in this thread. My OP answers all the questions I have had so far.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.07.01 20:39:00 -
[15]
Serious questions eh? Originally by: DragonRiderTao The returns are guaranteed to you no matter how bad I trade.
Can you provide any verification of this statement? Originally by: DragonRiderTao My offer to you consists of a 6% return every 4 weeks for 8 months. At the end of the period your 100% of your investment is returned.
Do you have any references to verify your trustworthiness? Originally by: DragonRiderTao The goal this time is 2 billion isk.
"This time"? Does this mean that you have previously run such a project? (If so, will you disclose any information about it?) Or does this mean that you've tried to raise funds and "this time" you are asking for this much as opposed to any previous request?
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
Shar Tegral> Some pew-pew at doo-doo for free-whee!!!! |
Investigador
Caldari Hator inc
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Posted - 2007.07.01 20:54:00 -
[16]
Originally by: DragonRiderTao
Originally by: Investigador
Originally by: DragonRiderTao
Originally by: Dread Phantom Stop spamming your scam, you think we forgot about last time?
Karma will return to you.
lol, look who's talking.
The one whose old scams haunt his new scams.
Go read the old thread.
Stop trolling.
No, saying that you are trying to scam is not trolling. It's the statment of an obvious fact.
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DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.01 21:58:00 -
[17]
Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 01/07/2007 22:01:08
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Serious questions eh? Originally by: DragonRiderTao The returns are guaranteed to you no matter how bad I trade.
Can you provide any verification of this statement?
I have enough experience to break even at worst. If I become the victim of brilliant long term market manipulation then I have a strategy to bring returns for the investors. Currently I am able to get loans at 20% or more. This is too high for a successful business loan for me. It will be what I use to reimburse investors should the very worst occur. Then it will be my private problem. I reassure you that realistically the worst that will happen is that I will not get any profit. I will simply pay the investors. Quote:
Do you have any references to verify your trustworthiness?
My own word is all that I can offer you. I realize it is not enough for some. Quote:
Originally by: DragonRiderTao The goal this time is 2 billion isk.
"This time"? Does this mean that you have previously run such a project?
It means I have the ability to utilize this sum. Previously I have not worked with sums this large. Quote: (If so, will you disclose any information about it?) Or does this mean that you've tried to raise funds and "this time" you are asking for this much as opposed to any previous request?
I used money from private investors to profit from trading 101. Some friends hauled for me for any trades out of station. Research was performed on several blueprints. These were used to their utmost potential to bring about revenue where the margins were slim for trading.
Originally by: Investigador
No, saying that you are trying to scam is not trolling. It's the statment of an obvious fact.
Can you provide proof of this fact?
If you have any further questions do not hesitate to ask.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.07.01 22:35:00 -
[18]
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
Shar Tegral> Some pew-pew at doo-doo for free-whee!!!! |
Calladen Nimitz
Caldari Sovereign Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.07.01 22:47:00 -
[19]
Who are your main characters? Who are your previous investors I'm sure SOME of them would be willing to come here and vouch for you. I can't believe ALL your previous investors require confidentiality.
If you can't reveal your main character publically for some 0.0 security issue I'm sure a couple trusted people here would be happy to find out who it is, confirmed with an evemail from that character, who could then vouch for your reputation.
What previous business did you run? What was the corp name? What did you do? Lets see some balance sheets?
Until then all I can think of is the addage "a fool and his money are soon parted".
Calladen
SOVEREIGN ENTERPRISES WEBPAGE AND FORUMS |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.02 00:13:00 -
[20]
Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 02/07/2007 00:21:46 Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 02/07/2007 00:16:09
Originally by: Shar Tegral
So basically, no you have no way to verify your ability to guarantee your guaranteed return.
I have explained my strategy for dealing with any issues.
Quote:
So, again, the answer is simply no.
If that is how you value my word. Quote:
Since you have not worked with sums this large how do you explain your absolute guarantee of investor security? I have worked with isk that is not my own at relatively significant levels. I noticed that I could easily use more isk to buffer the times I am not active.
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I used money from private investors to profit from trading 101. Some friends hauled for me for any trades out of station. Research was performed on several blueprints. These were used to their utmost potential to bring about revenue where the margins were slim for trading.
You previously, in another thread, mentioned this however you give no other details besides this broad brush strokes. I would assume that if your previous private investment was successful that someone would be willing to step forward and say something positive for you.
That is not up to me. It was certainly not part of my initial deals. Hopefully with more investors some will not mind being public about it.
Quote:
Until you can provide proof of your own statements... you lack the moral position to question anyone else's credibility or statements. (Not that it won't stop you.)
With no proof its one word against another.
Quote:
Your spoken word is not enough. You have disclosed something of a plan but as of yet you have refused to provide any factual information.
I am giving you answers that can not get any clearer. If you are insure about any of them please do not hesitate to ask. Quote: (Claims != Fact) You are also an alt with no credible history of any kind. (The ducking and weaving here is not credibility.)
You need to provide more to get anything at all.
I am definitely not an alt. My plan is not complicated. If anyone thinks there is something more to know then I expect them to ask.
Originally by: Calladen Nimitz
Who are your main characters?
This is my main. Quote: Who are your previous investors I'm sure SOME of them would be willing to come here and vouch for you. I can't believe ALL your previous investors require confidentiality.
It is my guarantee. I have not had that many investors.
Quote: If you can't reveal your main character publically for some 0.0 security issue I'm sure a couple trusted people here would be happy to find out who it is, confirmed with an evemail from that character, who could then vouch for your reputation.
What previous business did you run? What was the corp name? What did you do? Lets see some balance sheets?
As I said this is my main. I did not have any corp. Everything I do is alone. I do not use balance sheets because my plan is not complicated. This is a game after all. There were no previous businesses. This can not really be called a business either.
Quote:
Until then all I can think of is the addage "a fool and his money are soon parted".
Calladen
Skepticism is to be expected.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
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Jennai
The Silent Rage R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.07.02 00:40:00 -
[21]
Quote: With no proof its one word against another.
since you're the one asking for money, it's up to you to provide enough information to prove that you are trustworthy and competent. so far you've done nothing but dodge questions and refuse to give any concrete information at all.
Quote: As I said this is my main. I did not have any corp. Everything I do is alone. I do not use balance sheets because my plan is not complicated. This is a game after all. There were no previous businesses. This can not really be called a business either.
so then what reason is there for anyone to believe that you're willing and able to put in the work of tracking, updating, and publishing your finances when there's absolutely no evidence of you having done anything at all before?
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DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.02 00:55:00 -
[22]
Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 02/07/2007 00:57:12
Originally by: Jennai
Quote: With no proof its one word against another.
since you're the one asking for money, it's up to you to provide enough information to prove that you are trustworthy and competent. so far you've done nothing but dodge questions and refuse to give any concrete information at all.
This is untrue. I have answered each question asked of me. Everyone has to start somewhere. For now there are only my claims.
Quote:
Quote: As I said this is my main. I did not have any corp. Everything I do is alone. I do not use balance sheets because my plan is not complicated. This is a game after all. There were no previous businesses. This can not really be called a business either.
so then what reason is there for anyone to believe that you're willing and able to put in the work of tracking, updating, and publishing your finances when there's absolutely no evidence of you having done anything at all before?
I do not have a history yet to provide any evidence. If I did keep spreadsheets then who is to say if they are legitimate? I can tell you that the market is there for the taking. I need the isk to seize it. I have been doing this for quite some time with smaller amounts. Eve provides a suitable tool I call a journal from which tracking finances is a quick task. Dividends only require a few clicks as well as the input of an amount.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:08:00 -
[23]
Contradicting Statements 4tw
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I do not have a history yet to provide any evidence.
But I thought you managed to do this with private investors over the past few weeks? So you either have the history there, or you are full of it with the whole lot. You have advised in this thread that this is your first attempt at trading as well, so would you care to explain what you done with prior investors money?
Quote: If I did keep spreadsheets then who is to say if they are legitimate?
This doesn't necessarily determine legitimacy, as they can be doctored. What it does show, is competency and levels of skill. If you are attempting to run a public business with no prior knowledge or activity in this business, and expect to succeed without even some basic paperwork or documentation, you are destined for failure. That is, if this wasn't a scam, which would truly shock me.
Quote: I can tell you that the market is there for the taking. I need the isk to seize it. I have been doing this for quite some time with smaller amounts.
Great, so why not liquidate the reported assets you have (start of post), and use that 2b to make all this isk you are talking about? Reasons why you won't do this may include:
* Don't want to use your own money in case it fails * Don't even have any assets * Don't even have a business idea (no point scamming yourself) * Need those assets to make your money
Now, you have reported that this is your main. May I ask how long you have been playing this game for? Also, we need to consider you from the date you posted your first request.
So from time of conception to time of first request for money (about 2 months ago). Can someone please advise how old the char is, using the above calcs.
Eve provides a suitable tool I call a journal from which tracking finances is a quick task. Dividends only require a few clicks as well as the input of an amount.
Need Empire Research Slots. Click here |
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:10:00 -
[24]
OK, let me get this straight. Your claims are: - You require 2b to begin trading and manufacturing. - You will pay out 6% interest every four weeks. - At the end of 8 months, invested isk will be paid back. - You will somehow make a large profit by trading modules within a single station. - Even if you screw up your trading, returns are magically guaranteed.
So far, you have demonstrated that you lack the following things: - References. - Evidence of previous experience. - Evidence of trustworthiness. - Evidence of trading competence. - Evidence of manufacturing competence. - A detailed business plan. - Any skills trained to your current character (yes, it's an obvious alt). - A body.
Without all of these things, you will get no investors. Do you understand?
Eve-Tanking.com - Nobody reads this slogan. |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:42:00 -
[25]
Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 02/07/2007 02:42:25
Originally by: Ricdic Contradicting Statements 4tw
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I do not have a history yet to provide any evidence.
But I thought you managed to do this with private investors over the past few weeks? So you either have the history there, or you are full of it with the whole lot.
Is this even a question? It has already been discussed that there will be no breaches of privacy. Quote: You have advised in this thread that this is your first attempt at trading as well, so would you care to explain what you done with prior investors money?
I have not made such a claim. A quote would be welcome for this accusation. I traded with prior investors as I will now.
Quote:
Quote: If I did keep spreadsheets then who is to say if they are legitimate?
This doesn't necessarily determine legitimacy, as they can be doctored. What it does show, is competency and levels of skill. If you are attempting to run a public business with no prior knowledge or activity in this business, and expect to succeed without even some basic paperwork or documentation, you are destined for failure. That is, if this wasn't a scam, which would truly shock me.
I hope you do not get a heart attack. I do not require paperwork for trades that a five year old could do if you could get them to stay interested. I am not sure where you have read me post that I have not traded before. That is not the case. Can you explain how these hypothetical papers would "show competency and levels of skill" if they were to be doctored just so you have some documentation to look at?
Quote:
Quote: I can tell you that the market is there for the taking. I need the isk to seize it. I have been doing this for quite some time with smaller amounts.
Great, so why not liquidate the reported assets you have (start of post), and use that 2b to make all this isk you are talking about?
If you read my original answer to your question, you might notice that I do not have that much in assets. Quote: Reasons why you won't do this may include:
* Don't want to use your own money in case it fails * Don't even have any assets * Don't even have a business idea (no point scamming yourself) * Need those assets to make your money
My business idea has been discussed several times. If you have any further questions about it then ask. You are right on one point. I do use the assets to make more money.
Quote: Now, you have reported that this is your main. May I ask how long you have been playing this game for? [/quoted] I have been playing the game for over 3 months.
Quote:
Also, we need to consider you from the date you posted your first request. So from time of conception to time of first request for money (about 2 months ago). Can someone please advise how old the char is, using the above calcs.
You only need to look at the posting date for my last thread. This has nothing to do with my age.
How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:52:00 -
[26]
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I have been playing the game for over 3 months.
No one will invest in someone with so little time in game. A common eve-ism, "Don't invest more money than what the character would sell for." You would be priced at about zero isk so you would be trustworthy for about half that. Originally by: DragonRiderTao I hope you do not get a heart attack. I do not require paperwork for trades that a five year old could do if you could get them to stay interested.
This doesn't even warrant a response.
The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it.
Shar Tegral> Some pew-pew at doo-doo for free-whee!!!! |
DragonRiderTao
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:54:00 -
[27]
Edited by: DragonRiderTao on 02/07/2007 02:57:06
Originally by: Nyphur OK, let me get this straight. Your claims are: - You require 2b to begin trading and manufacturing. - You will pay out 6% interest every four weeks. - At the end of 8 months, invested isk will be paid back. - You will somehow make a large profit by trading modules within a single station.
No. This is only part of the plan. I am able to trade within a region without undocking.
Quote:
- Even if you screw up your trading, returns are magically guaranteed.
I have explained that I have confidence in my plan. I am able to get this money at loss to myself. If my word means nothing to you then no they are not guaranteed as you can tell that no one is here to vouch for me.
Quote: So far, you have demonstrated that you lack the following things: - References. - Evidence of trustworthiness.
This can only be expected from someone new to the public investing game.
Quote:
- Evidence of previous experience. - Evidence of trading competence. - Evidence of manufacturing competence.
This is simply slander.
Quote:
- A detailed business plan.
How many more details to you need? Ask the questions because this plan is not complex at all. If you have trouble understanding it then do not be shy. Ask what you need to know.
Quote:
- Any skills trained to your current character (yes, it's an obvious alt). - A body.
This is nonsense. How would you tell what skills I have trained? You can not.
Quote:
Without all of these things, you will get no investors. Do you understand?
My body leaves as it pleases.
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I have been playing the game for over 3 months.
No one will invest in someone with so little time in game. A common eve-ism, "Don't invest more money than what the character would sell for." You would be priced at about zero isk so you would be trustworthy for about half that.
The time I have spent in this game is more than enough to do basic trading and manufacturing. I will certainly not go about grinding missions for two months as that is not my style of play.
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I hope you do not get a heart attack. I do not require paperwork for trades that a five year old could do if you could get them to stay interested.
This doesn't even warrant a response. Buying low and selling high is complicated in your opinion? The journal is not enough to keep you organized? How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine. |
Jennai
The Silent Rage R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:56:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Jennai on 02/07/2007 02:57:39
Originally by: Ricdic Now, you have reported that this is your main. May I ask how long you have been playing this game for? Also, we need to consider you from the date you posted your first request.
So from time of conception to time of first request for money (about 2 months ago). Can someone please advise how old the char is, using the above calcs.
3 months 19 days, and he's been in noob corp the entire time.
thanks to Chribba's wonderful eve-search.com, I was able to find his previous posts and have a good laugh.
first "investment" thread, April 6-17 second "investment" thread, April 11, closed for spamming because the first thread was still active some random thread, April 17. "... just research less and go as soon as you have a nice trade. Why research for eight hour when you can do it for eight minutes?" another random thread, April 19. "Most stuff is severely overpriced ... The consumer deserves prices much closer to the mineral costs."
nothing else of note except the thread from early June where he and his "associates" got a freighter to "half health" in "about 20 seconds" and then the server crashed.
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moskowitz
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Posted - 2007.07.02 02:58:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Originally by: DragonRiderTao I have been playing the game for over 3 months.
No one will invest in someone with so little time in game. A common eve-ism, "Don't invest more money than what the character would sell for." You would be priced at about zero isk so you would be trustworthy for about half that. Originally by: DragonRiderTao I hope you do not get a heart attack. I do not require paperwork for trades that a five year old could do if you could get them to stay interested.
This doesn't even warrant a response.
Here presents another problem with investing opportunities in eve.....apparently if u want to start an IPO u need lots of gameplay to launch your IPO.......this is a monopoly.......the benefits vets have are rediculous vs. a newer player. too bad about that.
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Nyphur
Pillowsoft
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Posted - 2007.07.02 03:03:00 -
[30]
Originally by: DragonRiderTao Stuff
Without all of these things, you will get no investors. Do you understand?
Eve-Tanking.com - Nobody reads this slogan. |
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