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Nybbas
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.07.03 07:32:00 -
[1]
Only heard of two people finding any of the "old school" plexes that are now supposed to be found using the very annoying discovery system... not only do the ships, that are supposed to be used for discovery (cov ops)warp too insanely fast to drop a bookmark to be able to scan as much around planets as you can, after a day of searching, me and a friend have not found 1 single old type complex... but plenty of the other high signal strength "unknowns" which of course you spend 30 minutes scanning out a system only to figure out that the only signature present in said system was this one unknown, and a total waste of your time...
So was ccps goal to completely null out the old complexes and replace them with these bugged to hell encounters?
sorry its late and im ranting...
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Nybbas
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.07.03 07:40:00 -
[2]
at the VERY least could the old deadspace combat complexes be changed to being something other than "unknown" as of now it is the biggest headache in the world to find ANY of these... (and extremely annoying to fully scan 5 systems only to realize they have nothing more than these new bugged "encounters") maybe let the multispec tell us how many unknowns there are at the very least so we know whether our scanner is missing a site, or if there really is only 1 site to be found etc...
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Gefex
Novastorm Inc Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.07.03 11:01:00 -
[3]
Fear not, everybody agrees.
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Zell
Caldari The Black Raptors
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Posted - 2007.07.03 12:22:00 -
[4]
Hello RA farmer!
A coward dies a thousand times, the brave die just once.. |
Kerfira
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Posted - 2007.07.03 15:34:00 -
[5]
Yeah, CCP actually scored a hole-in-one on this one
I think it is the first time the managed to get a much needed nerf exactly right the first time...
No, there's absolutely nothing wrong with them being unknowns!
Your ISK-printing machine got taken away from you. The rest of us are ROFL'ing at your thinly veiled attempt at whining it back
Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
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Azzy I
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Posted - 2007.07.03 16:35:00 -
[6]
As i see it, the deadspace complexes went from being possibly too good to being so difficult to find and use that they might as well not exist. The process of finding them is very awkward and frustrating, and finding one of them takes an amount of time such that one could make several times as much ISK mission running, and have more fun while doing it. -Az
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2007.07.03 16:53:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Kerfira on 03/07/2007 16:53:42
Originally by: Azzy I As i see it, the deadspace complexes went from being possibly too good to being so difficult to find and use that they might as well not exist. The process of finding them is very awkward and frustrating, and finding one of them takes an amount of time such that one could make several times as much ISK mission running, and have more fun while doing it. -Az
I think that's because your outlook is wrong tbh.
You're thinking along the lines of how it was before, i.e. being able to run a 'plex when you want to.
That's not how it is anymore, nor how it is supposed to be methinks... If a 'plex is something people WANT to run, then it's most likely giving too much reward.
Now, 'plex are not something you can set out to run (because they're difficult to find), but something that you'll find once in a while when you're exploring.
This means that they've been taken off the farming list, which is good all around (well, maybe except the farming exploiters... not mentioning any alliance names....*cough* RA). In effect, 'plex'es are now something like officer spawns for explorations. Something which is (very) nice when you find it, but not something you can depend on for an income. That is exactly the balance needed!
No need to change a thing!
Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
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Nybbas
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.07.03 18:09:00 -
[8]
except I am looking for high sec complexes not low sec ones : / not to mention with the rate of finding them, and how difficult it is... just see how high the prices of the mods they drop reach.
already gistii small shield boosters are at 190 mil isk up from 180 mil... microwarpdrives are at 140 up from 30. I can only imagine what the higher end crap is from the high level instances, you find one of those and your whole point about a money making machine goes right out the window... prices are only going to go up for this stuff, and if they stay this rare just wait to see what they top out at.
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Bleys Vontagen
Gallente Phoenix Logistics Industries
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Posted - 2007.07.03 18:18:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Azzy I As i see it, the deadspace complexes went from being possibly too good to being so difficult to find and use that they might as well not exist. The process of finding them is very awkward and frustrating, and finding one of them takes an amount of time such that one could make several times as much ISK mission running, and have more fun while doing it. -Az
Which is a good thing...
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Arushia
Nova Labs Empire Research
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Posted - 2007.07.04 10:48:00 -
[10]
I just wish the new "encounters" didn't screw-up proper exploration. I keep wasting multispectral and quest probes finding what turns out to be a site meant for the on-board scanner.
Tired of Waiting? Use Empire Research |
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Nybbas
The Scope
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Posted - 2007.07.04 22:37:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Arushia I just wish the new "encounters" didn't screw-up proper exploration. I keep wasting multispectral and quest probes finding what turns out to be a site meant for the on-board scanner.
EXACTLY. you get an unknown hit... sure one of these new places pop up on your first scan... but now we have no way of knowing whether or not there is still yet another unknown in the system... you can sit there and scan for another hour, moving probes around to get coverage in different areas etc. and end up just wasting a TON of time.... OR give up after the first few scans, and completely miss something good...
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w00t117
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Posted - 2007.07.06 16:17:00 -
[12]
agree 100%, this is just ****ing me off not knowing if I am wasting my time sitting and scanning for 1 hour if i have already found all of the unknowns in the system!!!
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Overseer Goth
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Posted - 2007.07.08 23:36:00 -
[13]
Sorry for my obviously noobish question......is the OP talking about the big plex's like the 10/10 ones that I here rumors about that pay millions in loot?
If they got nerfed how do the corps pay their system rent to their overseers??
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.07.09 00:04:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Overseer Goth Sorry for my obviously noobish question......is the OP talking about the big plex's like the 10/10 ones that I here rumors about that pay millions in loot?
If they got nerfed how do the corps pay their system rent to their overseers??
Some systems used to have a complex, which is like a dungeon with a overseer in each stage of the complex. Usually overseers are NPC enemys you can kill, but sometimes it could be a NPC building or even a jetcan. All complex's have a "boss" which is usually the strongest NPC and the one that drops the best stuff most of the time.
However this dungeon was reset every downtime, meaning that your chance of doing one was limited by the timezone you play in. You did a run just after downtime and by the time it respawns, it is sclose to downtime again, so it was possible to "squat" the plex for your timezone. CCP fixed this so that it now falls under the exploration system, so this gives anyone the chance to search for one and do one, rather than the select few who would log in at downtime and instantly be inside this "dungeon".
10/10 complex's were good money makers, each run dropping around 500mil of NPC tradegoods called Overseer effets per run. Sometimes they also dropped billions in loot run. Sometimes they dropped nothing at all. Therefore people would camp them, and people having plex wars seconds after downtime was not uncommon. I think each 10/10 in the past allowed 2 and a half runs a day, but dont quote me on that.
Now what happens is that after a run, the complex dissapears and has to be probed out via exploration - it could be in any system in the region, and has given people of multiple timezones the chance to use the service.
As for corps paying their system rent overseer's, that does not happen, since the overseer is a NPC. But some corps do pay rent for 0.0 access, and 0.0 is actually now a richer place now that exploration sites exist and also that they have a chance to do these complex's in any timezone. --
Billion Isk Mission |
OneSock
Silentia Mortalis Curse Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.09 11:11:00 -
[15]
Actually I found a 3/10 using the OnBoard Scanner. Sadly it was the drone 3/10, but hey, you can get lucky it would seem.
Also there is a chance of an officer/overseer type spawn in encounters so don't assume the prices of faction/officer stuff will change vastly. Time will tell.
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Calistro
Gallente Contraband Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.09 13:13:00 -
[16]
Been doing some of these new encounters the last few days, a lot of them actually. We've done around 25 unknown signatures or something, along with some of other signatures. I'll jot down a few comments and thoughts I've had while doing all of these.
* Commander spawnrate is too low and not balanced - After doing 25 unknown signatures, we got a single commander spawn in one of the low end missions with 3 respawns consisting of a couple of cruisers and some frigs. However when we do "pirate complex" or something near that difficulty, we see atleast 20 BS throughout the encounter, and each and everytime we get no officer spawns. We kill all structures and if we're lucky, we get a named sensor booster from a can, if one of the structures actually drop.
* Archaeology sites have problems - Two things I've noticed in these are pretty minor problems, but still should be addressed. First one is for pretty decent site where you find some racial "ruins, remains and derelicts". The ruins and remains work fine, drop nicely. However the derelict is bugged. I'm presuming you're suppose to salvage these, as they are actually wrecks, however when you activate a salvager on them, you are hold you need to have the right tools to access this container. If you attempt to hack or analyze it, you are told you need to use a module which has "salvaging" as a requirement. Second one is a site named "Forgotten Ruins". I haven't found any problems, although after battling through the first stage with atleast 20 BS and support wanting to tear you a new one, you find out that the gates in the second stage require "archaeology skill to be trained" to activate for the person. Logically it should really be on the first gate, would save people a bunch of trouble.
* Hacking sites are ok - no comment :)
In general I love this new change, lots of sites available for you to do, and a lot of cash to be made. Most importantly of all, the true security status of the system you're checking out doesn't seem to be taken into consideration what kind of complex you get, which means "bad" 0.0 systems are actually worth going into if they don't have a station. I have yet to see any of the old static complexes in the ones I've been doing, but that's probably just content-department who has to catch up with the whole thing. Also, I like that all "unknown" signatures can be found in the first try as long as you drop probes to handle all planes in the system, saves you much time. People just need to stop crying about this fact, and start doing it. Spend that extra cash on the probes, you'll feel good about yourself. Sharpening the edges, and I think most whines will disappear.
Anyway, my rant over, hope some CCP guy stumbles over this finds it useful.
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Jim Sharpe
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Posted - 2007.07.09 17:48:00 -
[17]
Again CCP aggros pilots who were enjoying Eve.
Does CCP understand that there is no successfull business model for a company that has a deliberate policy of disappointing paying customers?
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XoPhyte
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.07.09 20:53:00 -
[18]
Edited by: XoPhyte on 09/07/2007 20:54:04
Originally by: Arushia I just wish the new "encounters" didn't screw-up proper exploration. I keep wasting multispectral and quest probes finding what turns out to be a site meant for the on-board scanner.
Hopefully this will be fixed soon, tbh I wish it had been fixed in this last patch . Yet to hear anything from a dev as to timelines though.
For now I just ignore unknowns as they are almost always encounters which I wasted a lot of time and effort tracking down, and I really ignore the archeology ones as they are bugged (can't salvage the wrecks).
I did run an encounter yesterday, it turned out to be a blood haven, and it was quite difficult (like 7/10 to 8/10 difficulty). The ships completely respawned 7 times but all I got at the end was a can of livestock
Oh well, got a little bit of isk out of it and I suppose the chance of a commander spawn. I had run a blood haven previously and it was very small, this one was very large and much more fun. I dunno if they fixed it, or if the size is random, but if its a fix then its a step in the right direction.
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Lord Loom
Loom Service
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Posted - 2007.07.09 23:32:00 -
[19]
there was a (crappy) 3/10 in a 0.7 system nearby where I do most of my stuff, obviously that one's gone now but so far I've only found glorified encounter "sites" with the onboard scanner - no more of quickly flying over to have some quick fun in a cruiser or smaller, no, now I have to spend tons of time just to find ****ty replacement sites
thanks for nothing
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Commander OTG
Caldari Logistic Exposium Industries
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Posted - 2007.07.10 04:25:00 -
[20]
Calistro is right on the money with his suggestions. I have encountered exactly the same issues.
I have focused specifically on salvaging, hacking and archeology. I have all skills at 5 an should not have any issues, but like pointed out by a couple people the wrecks are bugged.
I typically can find the unknowns with quest probes easily enough and when I am focusing on grav and mag probes I drop a quick comb set and find them right off.
I also havent seen a drastic difference between low sec up to .6 ..... EXECUTIVE OFFICER
"Finder of SafeSpots-Killer of Pods" |
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Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa
The Perfect Harvesting Experience
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Posted - 2007.07.10 09:03:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Nybbas I can only imagine what the higher end crap is from the high level instances, you find one of those and your whole point about a money making machine goes right out the window... prices are only going to go up for this stuff, and if they stay this rare just wait to see what they top out at.
Hah, got you there, you ebil WoW-er !
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Originally by: Paper Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
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Boknamar
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Posted - 2007.07.10 11:24:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Boknamar on 10/07/2007 11:25:59 Edited by: Boknamar on 10/07/2007 11:25:13 Edited by: Boknamar on 10/07/2007 11:24:37
Originally by: Bleys Vontagen
Originally by: Azzy I As i see it, the deadspace complexes went from being possibly too good to being so difficult to find and use that they might as well not exist. The process of finding them is very awkward and frustrating, and finding one of them takes an amount of time such that one could make several times as much ISK mission running, and have more fun while doing it. -Az
Which is a good thing...
I'm very bad at detecting sarcasm in the morning, so my apologies in advance if you're not serious.
Do you really know what you're talking about? When you drop a multispec, and it returns an "Unknown" result, you don't know how many unknowns there are, or what quality they are. So lets say you still drop your web of quests, and start scanning. If there are any of the new encounters in the system, they will show up on the first scan, as long as you have them covered properly. To find out if there's something potentially good in the system, which will probably not show up on the first scan, you might visit and complete each of the small encounters that you find, and then drop another multispec when they are all completed, to see if there is still an Unknown signature in the system. If there is, then you're in business. Sounds good on paper, right?
Here's the real deal. Many of the new sites are bugged, and don't despawn when completed, as they're supposed to. This was supposedly addressed in the last patch, but continually in the exploration channel we get people who find completely empty encounters, and my own experiences corroborate that.
Getting out of a covert ops ship and into a combat ship to run these in low sec is very risky. And how are we rewarded for this risk? At least one of these new sites will show up on multispecs even after it's been completed, so we never really know whether there's a potentially good complex in the system unless we get lucky and find it. But how many scans should we do before giving up? 20? 30?
If you think this is such a good thing, explain why the ration of risk to reward for hunting down complexes should be so high. You might also want to explain your logic to CCP, since they have a fix coming down the pipeline.
Oh, and to everyone else, rejoice! Your grandchildren will be free from this hassle!
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Nybbas
Imperium Forces
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Posted - 2007.07.11 01:41:00 -
[23]
hey bok : D and thanks for that link... hadnt seen it before... such a relief.
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Veng3ance
Illicit Technologies
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Posted - 2007.07.11 04:53:00 -
[24]
Zomg Exploration is ruined by encounters no way!
Oh wait, we have been *****ing about this since WEEKS BEFORE THE PATCH.
Time for CCP to learn how to program.......
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Ciuci
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.07.18 14:09:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Calistro
Second one is a site named "Forgotten Ruins".
Did anyone manage to finish this site ? ... and what was the drop in it ?
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J'Mkarr Soban
Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.18 14:40:00 -
[26]
Wow, I'm going to love this.
Effort v. reward. You complain that lvl 4 mission runners had it too easy, didn't you? Yet now your high reward for little effort dealio has gone, boohoo ;-)
Yes, I live in 0.0.
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other mickey
Gallente Galaxy Punks
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Posted - 2007.07.18 16:01:00 -
[27]
I think the new system is great!! Why?
In the past, "good" plexes in empire were camped and there was ninja-looting, making it far too easy for some people to make a lot of isk. Also, static plexes in 0.0 were farmed.
Now however, in order to make money from sites, you have to put the effort in to scan them down, which gives those willing to put the effort in the chance to run them and get the loot.
Last monday I couldn't even use probes. I bought skills and started training. On friday i could use sifts, which is where the fun started. In high sec I've gotten a 15M faction AB form an encounter site (the one's u find with on-board), i got a gistii a-type mwd from a 3/10 serp plex, a daredevil BP from a 3/10 serp plex and just last nite a low-grade snake beta from a combat site that escalated. Total haul was 240M not including other loot. Not bad for less than a weeks worth of exploring with fairly mediocre skills!
It's by no means easy, as I've spent hours scanning, but I've made more isk than if I were running missions (can't do lvl 3's yet even) or mining. So I'm pretty chuffed.
Now just need to go find some more decent systems!
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Ciuci
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.07.18 16:11:00 -
[28]
Originally by: other mickey Edited by: other mickey on 18/07/2007 16:09:41 I think the new system is great!! Why?
In the past, "good" plexes in empire were camped and there was ninja-looting, making it far too easy for some people to make a lot of isk. Also, static plexes in 0.0 were farmed.
Now however, in order to make money from sites, you have to put the effort in to scan them down, which gives those willing to put the effort in the chance to run them and get the loot.
Last monday I couldn't even use probes. I bought skills and started training. On friday i could use sifts, which is where the fun started. In high sec I've gotten a 15M faction AB form an encounter site (the one's u find with on-board), i got a gistii a-type mwd from a 3/10 serp plex, a daredevil BP from a 3/10 serp plex and just last nite a low-grade snake beta from a combat site that escalated. Total haul was 240M not including other loot. Not bad for less than a weeks worth of exploring with fairly mediocre skills!
It's by no means easy, as I've spent hours scanning, but I've made more isk than if I were running missions (can't do lvl 3's yet even) or mining. So I'm pretty chuffed.
Now just need to go find some more decent systems!
(Though I agree the encounters need to be made for the on-board scanner only)
and how many hours/day did you spend doing that ?
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other mickey
Gallente Galaxy Punks
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Posted - 2007.07.18 16:24:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Ciuci
and how many hours/day did you spend doing that ?
On the weekend 5hr sat and sun each. friday, monday and yesterday, prob bout 3.
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Ciuci
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.07.18 16:28:00 -
[30]
that's 20 hours ... considering that I afk about 20-30 mil per h while ratting remember ... afk ... you do the math
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