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Clyde Barrow
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Posted - 2004.01.30 11:38:00 -
[1]
["un-skilled" as in not having the DCM skill.]
Is there a demand for Morphite in significant quantaties?
I know you can get this mineral without ever using a DCM laser or having to invest time in training the skill, so all I want to know is what's the point in specialising in DCM at the moment?
Will the Tech II items (specifically ships) need vast quantaties of Morphite?... because if they don't I can't see the point in going through all the logistical hassle of DCM when I can get morphite from Arkonor, Bistot, and Spod.
Anyone have any numbers on what the new Tech II items need mineral-wise?
Thanks.
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zincol
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:05:00 -
[2]
u can/could get morph from spodumain stuff
w00t!
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Psy Corp
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:21:00 -
[3]
yeah i have also thought about why you should even bother to get dcm sense you can get it from arkanor,spod,bist.. and as ive heard you get loads of it from ark as it seems ark is worth more then merx ore
i say take it away from them it should only be from dcm mining you get it.. cause now you can just mine as usual and get the amount ehh you need?
I Have The Power Of The Mighty Lo.0lipop..
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Annatar
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:24:00 -
[4]
When looking at the now building tech Lv 1 BS , you see that they need from each surce of minerals. Wich is Down from Tritanium top to Megacyte divided by around 4.
Example Lv 1 BS: (with rounded Numbers for better look]
4,4 MIL Tritanium 1,1 MIL Pyerite 275 k Mexallon 68750 Isogen 17188 Nocxium 4297 Zydrine 1.000 Megacyte (this dosenŠt Match) = 1.700
If we do suggest that the need of Morphite does go in this way we have a range of 425 up to 700 Morphite per ship.
I dont know anything more about this. and it is a short maked calculation but i expect below 1.000 Morphite for a Tech 2 BS.
Becourse we dont know how mutch each Tech 2 BS will need in general on other minerals the whoule calculation sucks. (i Just realize this)
maybe we could calculate something as soon as we got the numbers from the Intercepor class.
...
we need more infos..
-------------------------------------------- Never argue with an Idoit, they will drag you down to their Level and beat you with experience. |
Psy Corp
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:28:00 -
[5]
Quote: When looking at the now building tech Lv 1 BS , you see that they need from each surce of minerals. Wich is Down from Tritanium top to Megacyte divided by around 4.
Example Lv 1 BS: (with rounded Numbers for better look]
4,4 MIL Tritanium 1,1 MIL Pyerite 275 k Mexallon 68750 Isogen 17188 Nocxium 4297 Zydrine 1.000 Megacyte (this dosenŠt Match) = 1.700
If we do suggest that the need of Morphite does go in this way we have a range of 425 up to 700 Morphite per ship.
I dont know anything more about this. and it is a short maked calculation but i expect below 1.000 Morphite for a Tech 2 BS.
Becourse we dont know how mutch each Tech 2 BS will need in general on other minerals the whoule calculation sucks. (i Just realize this)
maybe we could calculate something as soon as we got the numbers from the Intercepor class.
...
we need more infos..
yeah but fact is this.. if you mine merx it will take you longer time to get 10k morph from that then to mine spod and refine it and get morph from that
I Have The Power Of The Mighty Lo.0lipop..
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Cobalt Digger
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:33:00 -
[6]
Ok you only get 6 morphite per refine from spod you get 1 per refine of dark ochre and none from bisot I haven't found any Arkonor to refine so I don't know what you get from it the question shouldn't be is it worth training deep core mining but astrology 5 and mining 5 personally I say yes because thats what my character does It depends on wiether you want to mine with the big boys or suck scordite :-)
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Omniwar
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:42:00 -
[7]
The worst thing about this all that you have no chance what so ever to get more than 1 unit of merx per cycle of the laser, that is utter bull imo.
ItŠs really really nice to have a new ore and all that, but its useless, it needs either many times more morph or put in mega and zyd, add to the laser so we have a chance of mining more than 1 unit per cycle, as it stands its useless. Spawn of the Devil
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Cloudbase
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:58:00 -
[8]
What about if morph was still available in small quantities from the above ore's BUT you have to use a DCM in order to get it. Therfore requiring the skills.
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Clyde Barrow
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Posted - 2004.01.30 12:59:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Clyde Barrow on 30/01/2004 13:14:49
Quote: When looking at the now building tech Lv 1 BS , you see that they need from each surce of minerals. Wich is Down from Tritanium top to Megacyte divided by around 4.
Example Lv 1 BS: (with rounded Numbers for better look]
4,4 MIL Tritanium 1,1 MIL Pyerite 275 k Mexallon 68750 Isogen 17188 Nocxium 4297 Zydrine 1.000 Megacyte (this dosenŠt Match) = 1.700
If we do suggest that the need of Morphite does go in this way we have a range of 425 up to 700 Morphite per ship.
I dont know anything more about this. and it is a short maked calculation but i expect below 1.000 Morphite for a Tech 2 BS.
Becourse we dont know how mutch each Tech 2 BS will need in general on other minerals the whoule calculation sucks. (i Just realize this)
maybe we could calculate something as soon as we got the numbers from the Intercepor class.
...
we need more infos..
The morphite I've seen for sale has been in relativly low amounts so far and its selling for as little as 22K in some places - these low prices and low amounts of Morphite are comming onto the market from miners that have NOT been mining Mercoxit. For the amount of time, effort, and risk it takes to mine enough Mercoxit for 1 refine and haul it back to a station I really hope that 22K is the lowest it will go (for the effort and risk invovled, IMHO it should be selling for no less than 50K).
I've spent the last 5 weeks training the skill up to level 5 and I'd like to think those of us that are dedicted Deep Core Miners will be rewarded appropriately for the time, effort, and risk it takes to get those minerals to the manufacturers. I think the only way that effort will be rewarded is if the amount of Morphite needed for the top-end Tech II stuff is substantial (Maybe 1000 pieces of Morphite for a tech II BS?).
Personally, I think CCP made a mistake in allowing people to get morphite from anything but Mercoxit.
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Clyde Barrow
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Posted - 2004.01.30 13:09:00 -
[10]
Quote: What about if morph was still available in small quantities from the above ore's BUT you have to use a DCM in order to get it. Therfore requiring the skills.
Yes, I'd agree with that to some extent but the 'hard' part of DCM is the logistics of it. 1 unit has a volume of 40m3 and you need 250 units for 1 refine. And like someone mentioned, you only get 1 piece of Mercoxit per minute per laser. 3 or 4 lasers on a Thorax max, maybe 4 or 5 on a BS, and you get the idea of just how long it takes to get 1 refines worth. And thats without having the added fun of dealing with Mining Pollution clouds and crazy NPC's.
From a logistics point of view, DCM can be very tedious and time consuming. Thats why the Tech II items should require LOTS of Morphite otherwise why bother with DCM at all when mining other ores will yield enough Morphite to satisfy the Tech II market.
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Duracell
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Posted - 2004.01.30 13:12:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Duracell on 30/01/2004 13:14:33 I'm Totally open to be wrong as i havent as yet had any mex to refine into morphite
Assume 250 Mex refine to 250 Morphite (feel free to correct me)
to mine 250 Morpite with 1 DCM 250 minutes
to mine 250 Morphite with 1 miner2 and ARk 5 ark per minute 200 per refine 16 Morph per refine is approximatly 625 minutes
so yes DCM should be more profitable. (just looking at Morphite, i havent taken the Megacyte into the equation, as i mearly looking at time to aquire morphite)
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Clyde Barrow
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Posted - 2004.01.30 13:26:00 -
[12]
Quote: Edited by: Duracell on 30/01/2004 13:14:33 I'm Totally open to be wrong as i havent as yet had any mex to refine into morphite
Assume 250 Mex refine to 250 Morphite (feel free to correct me)
to mine 250 Morpite with 1 DCM 250 minutes
to mine 250 Morphite with 1 miner2 and ARk 5 ark per minute 200 per refine 16 Morph per refine is approximatly 625 minutes
so yes DCM should be more profitable. (just looking at Morphite, i havent taken the Megacyte into the equation, as i mearly looking at time to aquire morphite)
From 250 Mercoxit I get 504 pieces of Morphite with 16 pieces wasted. I don't have a problem with the yields, its the fact that its takes such a long time to get 1 refines worth in the first place (especially when you have to deal with polution clouds - ergo can't mine to a can, and NPC BS's & Cruiser spawns). You're in a very high risk environment for a very long time compared to someone whose mining 1 refines worth of Arkonor.
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Dell Boy
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Posted - 2004.01.30 13:45:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Dell Boy on 30/01/2004 13:46:01
Quote: ergo can't mine to a can
Why don't you have your hauler drop a huge sec container so you can mine straight into that?
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Duracell
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Posted - 2004.01.30 13:45:00 -
[14]
Quote:
From 250 Mercoxit I get 504 pieces of Morphite with 16 pieces wasted.
Bit more than I would have guessed, still it all depends if ever any usefully tech2 bp's come out that require morphite, and the qty of morphite required in them.
For now its all guesswork as to the value of morphite
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Synex
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Posted - 2004.01.30 14:57:00 -
[15]
Ok... a few comments about DCM.
I am a miner, that is my role ingame. I have trained AstroG 5, Mining 5, Drones L9 etc. etc. to maximise my mining performance. I would like to think I'm top of my game.
DCM : This should be very profitable, due to the high skill requirements etc. etc.
The current DCM Laser is a basic one - and 'pre-tech 1' laser if you want. A Tech 2 variant IS coming that works a lot better.
Damage Clouds - these suck at the moment and don't ever do enough damage to your ship, only enough to kill a can, which I think is a good way of dealing with mining into a can.
The difficulty in mining should ALWAYS be logistical. True, it's ok to have a few pirates etc, but in RL you don't mine minerals carrying a gun... DCM is fairly well balanced at the moment (tho the Spod situation needs looking at) and the decision between hiring a hauler (and mining all the time) or hauling yourself (and cutting down on amount mined) is a good choice. This game (the manufactuing / mining side of it at least) should be about these choices.
However, I think DCM was released way too early before any tech 2 goodies where released. Why? Because the market is getting flooded with morphite before it is even needed. The supply (even from Spod / other mins) is far greater than the demand (from a few minor tech 2 goodies). Therefore the price has dropped dramatically, right down to unprofitable levels. I know lots of people sat on a huge pile of Morphite, with nothing to do with it because no-one will buy it at a decent price.
Will this get fixed when Tech 2 items / ship get released? Yes, but I still think the market will be flooded with cheap Morphite and this is not good for business.
The Tech 2 items should have been released BEFORE DCM came in, thus creating a demand for Morphite. That way, those of us who had the right skills at the right time could have made a decent profit while the rest of the world caught up. Then the price of Morphite would have stabilised at a level that would reflect the difficulty in mining/hauling it.
Synex eveDB Code Monkey
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Tyria Evenstar
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Posted - 2004.01.30 15:03:00 -
[16]
Quote: I really hope that 22K is the lowest it will go (for the effort and risk invovled, IMHO it should be selling for no less than 50K).
I bought some for 18k each yesterday. I figured I can sell it for more (or keep it for my own uses) as prices will increase when demand is present for it.
-Tyria.
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Wolvious Sealus
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Posted - 2004.01.30 16:38:00 -
[17]
I am sitting on a few thousand Morphite myself....just waitin until the stuff is needed....its a pain in the arse to mine and then peeps want to give ya crap money for it....I will wait until the price goes up when tech 2 ships are in game....and then sell, sell, sell....
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Shoopy
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Posted - 2004.01.30 17:29:00 -
[18]
Apprently you are not suppose to get morphite from refining any other ores...
Unless the dev has changed their mind, morphite can only be obtained from mining mexorite with DCM lasers....
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Gafton
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Posted - 2004.01.30 20:37:00 -
[19]
Mining mercoxit isnt that hard if you know how to do it. A megathron can fit 7 dcm miners on and keep them running. You'll have to have some maxed skills and some nice mods to do this. With 7 lasers you can pull in a refine of merc in 35 minutes. If you get two ships going you cut the time down again. Once tech 2 production starts up and the demand for morphite increases, mining spod/do for it will take too long to sustain demand. DCM will be required to keep the production lines running.
Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead. |
Clyde Barrow
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Posted - 2004.01.31 11:16:00 -
[20]
Quote: Mining mercoxit isnt that hard if you know how to do it. A megathron can fit 7 dcm miners on and keep them running. You'll have to have some maxed skills and some nice mods to do this. With 7 lasers you can pull in a refine of merc in 35 minutes. If you get two ships going you cut the time down again. Once tech 2 production starts up and the demand for morphite increases, mining spod/do for it will take too long to sustain demand. DCM will be required to keep the production lines running.
Thats what I'm hoping for.
I just hope the Devs don't screw the dedicated Deep Core Miners by keeping the morphite required for Tech II Battleships down to less than 1000 pieces per ship (approx. 2 refines worth of Mercoxit).
Bottom line, the amount of morphite needed for top-end Tech II production should be substantial and way more than that of megacyte is for Tech I.
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