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FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.24 16:50:00 -
[1]
What T2 BPOs commonly go for less than 2 bil? Low end ore crystals seem to, I think I saw some rocket bpos too. I take it most ammunition, drones, weapons etc are well over 2 bil?
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Richard Kitan
United Space Republic Research
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Posted - 2007.08.24 18:19:00 -
[2]
The ones you've mentioned - mining crystals, some ammo, I think I've seen a T2 drone BPO or two around 2bn. T2 BPOs are too rich for my blood at the moment, but I believe they generally cost what you'd make in profit from 1 year of producing from them. So, if there's a BPO you have your eye on, you can do the math and figure out how many you could build in a year, times the profit per item, and have a rough idea of how much the BPO ought to be.
I could be a bit off though - as I said, T2 BPOs aren't part of my "game plan" currently :) --
Richard Kitan Builder of Stuff |
FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.24 19:38:00 -
[3]
You do tech 1 at all? I'm just feeling a bit disillusioned with shares as a side method of having isk flow. I always wanted a t2 bpo during the lottery but never got my skills and agent quality there in time. Its so satisfying to see that little II on items, yanno? Making em would be nice.
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Richard Kitan
United Space Republic Research
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Posted - 2007.08.24 19:49:00 -
[4]
I do a little bit of everything, and that does include T2, I just don't own any BPOs, and dont' plan to at this point in time. If I find a good deal on a T2 BPC on contracts I'll pick it up, but those are few and far between. I do T1 also, and some other "stuff", it all just depends on what I can make the most cash on when I have free manufacturing slots, and what I already have sell orders up for. Some of the things I produce are high margin, but they sell very slowly so if I already have a bunch of those stored up, I'll fill up my slots with things that makes less but will sell quick. I'm mostly just interested in making money. I don't really care what I build but having to wait a year to have the BPO paid off doesn't really appeal to me. That being said, if I saw a particularly good deal on a T2 BPO, I'd pick it up. --
Richard Kitan Builder of Stuff |
FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.24 19:52:00 -
[5]
Yeh, its a heavy investment. Especially when you can't predict dev changes a year ahead. Although I think I heard they're using 6 months now.
Do you do invention?
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Richard Kitan
United Space Republic Research
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Posted - 2007.08.24 20:01:00 -
[6]
Originally by: FreelancerAlpha
Do you do invention?
Not personally. I'm not dealing with enough cash to ride out a streak of bad luck at the moment. I've had some friends who went in to invention with a billion or so to spend, invented a decent BPC or two, and then failed their next 10 or so tries (I don't recall the exact numbers - so I might be off). Since they had good skills, and it's chance based, they ought to be due to get some more good BPCs soon, but they didn't have the cash to keep up with it, and wound up just taking the loss and quitting invention.
Once I do get a few billion together (My damn PvP accounts are isk sinks. bah) I'd like to get in to invention, but for now I'm just stockpiling RP to cash in on datacores when I finally do decide to do it - which is looking like it might be quite some time away.
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Richard Kitan Builder of Stuff |
Ramblin Man
Empyreum
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Posted - 2007.08.24 21:25:00 -
[7]
By and large, BPOs < 1B are a horrible investment. Below that price, they're usually bumped up to 'speculative value' as opposed to earning potential - so if you're looking for long-term investment it's not so great.
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FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.25 14:38:00 -
[8]
I just want to build something I can sell. I buy shares, and get like 5% back a month or something, which is fine. But thats like buying minerals and re-selling a few months later. I want to get involved with generating isk out of isk, but I lack the skills the time and the isk to do it seriously.
So I figure if I got a t2 bpo, I can always sell for about 6% above build price. I get to be involved and I get to be lazy about it. Win!
Course..lacking the isk for the BPO is really quite the setback yes?
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.08.25 16:40:00 -
[9]
Originally by: FreelancerAlpha I just want to build something I can sell. I buy shares, and get like 5% back a month or something, which is fine. But thats like buying minerals and re-selling a few months later. I want to get involved with generating isk out of isk, but I lack the skills the time and the isk to do it seriously.
So I figure if I got a t2 bpo, I can always sell for about 6% above build price. I get to be involved and I get to be lazy about it. Win!
Course..lacking the isk for the BPO is really quite the setback yes?
Surprisingly enough, there are hundreds of T1 items out there that give the same percentage if not far higher, of profit. I own a handful of t2 bpo's, and generally just build them every now and then. If anything, I see them as an investment as my firm belief is that the demand on t2 bpo's will raise their prices right back up again over time.
So, i make a few isk here and there, buy up cheap t2 bpo's as people get rid of them thinking they are gone for good, and stockpile for a rainy day. (or a boost on my bpo meaning insta-raking-profits)
I could probably list 40 t1 bpo's where you can return a 8% profit margin on sales. Just pick random ones and calculate it (making sure to use researched bpos)
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FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.25 19:58:00 -
[10]
The margin is a secondary concern. I just don't want to play 0.1 isk games. I figure T2 will move because there aren't that many inventors & bpos vs T1 manufacturers. Any idiot can buy a t1 bpo, research it and develop it. Hell, so many tier 3 bc bpos in sell forum I'm amazed people are still buying em.
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.08.25 23:13:00 -
[11]
Originally by: FreelancerAlpha The margin is a secondary concern. I just don't want to play 0.1 isk games. I figure T2 will move because there aren't that many inventors & bpos vs T1 manufacturers. Any idiot can buy a t1 bpo, research it and develop it. Hell, so many tier 3 bc bpos in sell forum I'm amazed people are still buying em.
The reason you are having to deal with 0.1 isk games is most commonly due to the area you are selling in. Really, it is like a fruit dealer who only ever sells his produce in fruit markets. That, to me, is Jita when I watch the producers struggle to turn a profit there.
Anyway, price wars also occur on t2, so don't think that having a t2 bpo will alleviate this issue. If you want to successfully sell t1 items, first find a demand in the area, and then provide the supply.
ie> a system in empire 1 jump from 0.0 or lowsec leading to 0.0 regions will be buying a lot of new ships and modules
iie> selling battlecruiser, hac and cruiser gear and ships in the cosmo's areas as you know these will be in the highest demand in said system/s.
You just need to remove that mindset that t2 will change everything, because it doesn't
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Robacz
Essence Trade Essence Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.08.26 08:15:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Robacz on 26/08/2007 08:14:51
Originally by: FreelancerAlpha The margin is a secondary concern. I just don't want to play 0.1 isk games. I figure T2 will move because there aren't that many inventors & bpos vs T1 manufacturers. Any idiot can buy a t1 bpo, research it and develop it. Hell, so many tier 3 bc bpos in sell forum I'm amazed people are still buying em.
Hm I hate to disappoint you, but I have to play 0.01/1 ISK wars on every Tech2 product I have. Maybe its better with cheaper items, but 1M+ priced Tech2 modules have strong competetion on all important markets.
_________ Always buying: pirate implants & high-end hardwirings Tech2 distribution service: 8 regions covered |
Gallente McNuggets
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Posted - 2007.08.27 11:21:00 -
[13]
Tech2 within the trade hubs is the most cutthroat market I've dabbled in. Set a price and 5 minutes later you've been undercut. Mainly because people that are selling T2 have so much money invested in it that they need quick turnover and thus watch their prices like hawks.
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Calladen Nimitz
Caldari Sovereign Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.08.27 12:04:00 -
[14]
I concur with Ricdic there are several T1 BPO out there that can return decent profit. The real challenge in being a successful T1 builder isn't so much in profit margin as it is in volume sales along with supply and demand. I have a friend who just makes crystals (T1) for lasers but he has a certain area of space he sells them in where they're always in heavy demand. Getting comfortable using the market interface ingame (including the volume and graph features) is key to finding out who needs what where.
Another tactic I've used is to locate a busy system in space that is underserved. The Evemap ingame will show you the number of pilots in space and the number of recent jumps. I've hopped in a shuttle before and flown to these busy systems to check out the region market. I made a spreadsheet that lets me enter prices and volumes and I don't really even do that unless I see alot of volume moving in the area of certain things. For example if I see heavy Caracal volume I know I'll see heavy missile launcher and heavy missile sales. Knowning which ships translate into which modules is key. Then I'll return in a hauler full of missile stuff and drop it for sale at the same station as the Caracals that someone else is selling. Little things like that can work if you're patient and willing to put in the time needed.
As for T1 ships there likewise are some that are profitable but it is very much a real .01isk "game". I personally hate the undercutters as I have a real life and can't sit in Eve 24/7 and "bump" sales .01isk every ten minutes (I see people do this and picture some 38 year old kid in his moms basement who works at the corner McDonalds). You need to either live like that or sell enough volume that even at 3-6% profit margins you're making alot of isk. Having a Freighter (or two) is essential if you plan to play the volume game.
Good luck with your building career.
Calladen
SOVEREIGN ENTERPRISES WEBPAGE AND FORUMS |
Jon Asus
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Posted - 2007.08.28 19:01:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ricdic
I could probably list 40 t1 bpo's where you can return a 8% profit margin on sales. Just pick random ones and calculate it (making sure to use researched bpos)
Just to say, this really is doable. For instance just now I found that I can make 1250% profit [no, not a typo] on a certain T1 product in a certain region.
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FreelancerAlpha
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Posted - 2007.08.28 23:56:00 -
[16]
Heehee, crystals are now inventable.
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