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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.07 09:04:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Ricdic on 07/09/2007 09:05:01 This is more to allow people to see how much a person is holding in the form of public funds/goods, and I guess was partially brought on by the famous Motivated Prophet, Ray McCormack, LaVista Vista signature additions.
The question has been asked in the subject. What is the total amount of funds/assets of the public that you are in possession of. Don't count unsold shares in your corporation, or growth NAV if possible, try to give a rough indication on the amount of actual cash/assets directly handed to you.
Should provide some interesting information, and allow people to make more informed decisions when deciding things like "does this person hold too much isk" etc. Plus it's interesting to know. Now, with people like Stins and ISSO I am not sure if Stins has access to the entire amount of the IPO, or if it is split, but if it is split the amount you hold now is the one I am after.
Putting it in a different perspective, how much isk/assets of public/customers funds do you have complete take access too.
I will start:
C-R-A = 14b (IPO) C-P-H = 5b (IPO in closure status) TCCS = 20b (IPO) CAP4U = 12b (IPO secured by me inside my corporation)
Private Bond = 900m C-R-A Customer's BPO's = 12b in C-R-A TCCS Customer's BPO's = 2b in TCCS
Total = 65.9 billion isk
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LaVista Vista
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.07 09:07:00 -
[2]
Edited by: LaVista Vista on 07/09/2007 09:07:24 On the good end of about 20-21bill.
But most of it is locked down. So in reality i would only have access to 8-10bill.
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BSAC Manager
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Posted - 2007.09.07 09:57:00 -
[3]
Block Ships and Ammunitions Corporation (BSAC) net asset value (NAV) in published monthly in BSAC's monthly report.
As of August 28, 2007
BSAC NAV 34,884,313,210 ISK
û 13,413,000,000 ISK (Assets included in the NAV but in the hands of BPO Trustees)
Assets under my direct control: 21,471,313,210 ISK
I am currently raising 2,000,000,000 ISK for the Mineral Reserve which is not included in the above figures. Details can be found in this link.
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FastLearner
Fury Holdings Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.09.07 11:30:00 -
[4]
About 35 billion ISK. Detailed breakdown of this can be found weekly in the Fury Holdings reports thread. After paying salary/dividends etc this week it'll be about 34 billion ISK (20.5 billion NAV for Fury Holdings, 13.529 billion currently on deposit in Fury Bank). Typically this amount is increasing by around 2 billion per week through retained profits and new net deposits into Fury Bank.
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Zachariah Ombiby
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Posted - 2007.09.07 13:08:00 -
[5]
Isn't this the part where a horde of people are supposed to say, "This information will do the public no good, therefore, there is no need to release it."
A public corp releasing the information or individuals releasing their own information - two sides of the same coin (same information divulged from different sources).
If the first shouldn't be supported, why should it be reworded and then supported?
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.09.07 13:13:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Shar Tegral on 07/09/2007 13:14:15
Originally by: Zachariah Ombiby If the first shouldn't be supported, why should it be reworded and then supported?
Your bringing up past situations where people wanted to institute mandatory disclosures as a standard industry practice. This is voluntary. Ask any Matari about the difference... ... Oh wait you might even be one.
Edit Note: Really bad typoes.
It's A GIRL!!!!! |
FastLearner
Fury Holdings Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.09.07 13:45:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Zachariah Ombiby Isn't this the part where a horde of people are supposed to say, "This information will do the public no good, therefore, there is no need to release it."
A public corp releasing the information or individuals releasing their own information - two sides of the same coin (same information divulged from different sources).
If the first shouldn't be supported, why should it be reworded and then supported?
Not quite sure what your point is. I'm happy to provide any information about Fury Holdings with two exceptions:
1. Information which a customer, investor, or other third party could reasonably expect to be held in confidence. Hence I won't reveal details of shareholders or Bank customers without their consent. 2. Information which, if revealed, could damage my own business interest or be of benefit to competitors. Hence I'm happy to summarise the amount of ISK Fury Holdings has in T2/ship stock or in BPOs - but won't reveal which items I stock or how many I hold of each one.
Some businesses may operate in speculative areas - where revealing even the general nature of their business could undermine their profits: hence they can't reveal much detail about their operations at all. Others may just be too lazy to provide any reports - so justify it by claiming a need for secrecy. Provided investors know in advance the level of reporting they'll receive I don't see any problem with a lack of transparency.
The total ISK I manage is revealed every week in my reports anyway. Doubt anyone actually reads it - I get the impression the shareholders couldn't care less what I report on or do provided they get their 4%+ per week.
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.07 13:59:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Zachariah Ombiby Isn't this the part where a horde of people are supposed to say, "This information will do the public no good, therefore, there is no need to release it."
In what way can releasing this information (the amount of other people's isk he/she has on hand) cause any issues? As FL has said above, I don't want customer names, business secrets, or even care what type of business it is, plus I am not forcing anyone to provide the info.
I would like most public corps to come forward and advise as there is no negative impact, I just enjoy seeing the sig info that a few have adopted and would like to see the appropriate values that other individuals are dealing with.
Quote:
If the first shouldn't be supported, why should it be reworded and then supported?
The prior request by another person was for disclosure of investors names. This is completely different, and can have a lot of ramifications. All I was curious to know, was the amount of money that had been invested into the person in total. Thought I made that pretty clear tbh.
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Kylar Renpurs
Dusk Blade
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Posted - 2007.09.07 14:39:00 -
[9]
Well, I've recieved 2 billion in a past bond, but that was paid back obviously. I now hold 4 billion in assets, and I publicly list all shareholders. Once stop housesitting and get back to my desktop where most of the last months details are, I'll knock together something and give the full shareholder listing then.
Improve Market Competition!
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Femintech2
Tech 2 Ammo Holdings Limited Tech Holdings Limited
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Posted - 2007.09.07 22:28:00 -
[10]
T2AHL currently holds 88 tech 2 Ammo BPOs on behalf of investors. Estimated value approximately 130 billion. I have direct and sole control of these assets within the corp.
I also act as trustee for EMFI - circa 100 billion isk of assets currently. My trustee role gives me an overseeing role, I do not directly control the assets of EMFI.
I also act as trustee for FIN - circa 400 billion isk of assets currently. I do partially control the assets of FIN as I control 50% of the operating companies stock.
So - I have control or influence over approxiamtely 630 billion isk of public funds in EVE on behalf of the community.
Love Fem :)
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.09.08 03:24:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Ricdic What is the total amount of funds/assets of the public that you are in possession of.
I can't remember.
MP --
Proud steward of 47 billion isk in public money, and counting. Ask me about mineral compression! |
Taikun
Gallente Serenity Prime Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.09.08 05:59:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Taikun on 08/09/2007 06:00:06
Originally by: Ricdic Should provide some interesting information, and allow people to make more informed decisions when deciding things like "does this person hold too much isk" etc. Plus it's interesting to know.
Oh please... it is a D@#k measuring contest... and Femintech2 winning at the moment.
Taikun -----------------------------------
For lack of a better word ladies and gentlemen... Greed is good. |
Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.08 06:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Taikun Edited by: Taikun on 08/09/2007 06:00:06
Originally by: Ricdic Should provide some interesting information, and allow people to make more informed decisions when deciding things like "does this person hold too much isk" etc. Plus it's interesting to know.
Oh please... it is a D@#k measuring contest... and Femintech2 winning at the moment.
Taikun
Hardly, it's a great way for the public to weigh up the levels of trust that public corporation owners have on their shoulders.
For example with Fem above, I have been in the public eye for some time and wasn't aware that he had that much control. It doesn't scare of worry me in the slightest, but I think it's good to know these things.
We all know either Eefrit or Stins will win, so if I wanted a competition it would have been fixed from the start.
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.09.08 06:56:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Femintech2 T2AHL currently holds 88 tech 2 Ammo BPOs on behalf of investors. Estimated value approximately 130 billion. I have direct and sole control of these assets within the corp.
I also act as trustee for EMFI - circa 100 billion isk of assets currently. My trustee role gives me an overseeing role, I do not directly control the assets of EMFI.
I also act as trustee for FIN - circa 400 billion isk of assets currently. I do partially control the assets of FIN as I control 50% of the operating companies stock.
So - I have control or influence over approxiamtely 630 billion isk of public funds in EVE on behalf of the community.
Love Fem :)
That's just scary. Mostly because I don't recall ever seeing your name before this post, but then I don't keep up with any of those corps you've listed so I have no reason to know you.
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.08 07:08:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Shadarle
That's just scary. Mostly because I don't recall ever seeing your name before this post, but then I don't keep up with any of those corps you've listed so I have no reason to know you.
Fem is our BoB market person. I have done some deals with him/her and everything has always been peachy.
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Seylara Xanteen
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Posted - 2007.09.08 09:19:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Taikun Edited by: Taikun on 08/09/2007 06:00:06
Originally by: Ricdic Should provide some interesting information, and allow people to make more informed decisions when deciding things like "does this person hold too much isk" etc. Plus it's interesting to know.
Oh please... it is a D@#k measuring contest... and Femintech2 winning at the moment.
Taikun
AND it is not measuring the "D@#k"'s of the holders - but how many investor's "D@#k"s the person holds
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Femintaki
Gallente Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.09.08 11:04:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Femintaki on 08/09/2007 11:05:54
Originally by: Ricdic Fem is our BoB market person. I have done some deals with him/her and everything has always been peachy.
Thankyou for the kind words Ricdic. Many in Eve know me on my main character (ie This one) and many more do not know me at all (why should they). Done a lot of deals over the last 4 years or so since retail release with many many people in eve from all corners of the map and political spectrum. My manufacturing and investment activities are nothing to do with BoB in any way, they are personal or joint venture holdings run on my alt char accounts. We rarely advertise our services as we have no need to - cannot keep up with demand as it is. Demand is there becuase we are highly trusted to deliver and people know that noone else will hear that they just bought 200 BS or 300 BC or 5 billion isk of Tech 2 product etc, we never disclose who our customers are.
Lots of people have trusted me with huge amounts of assets and isk through that time, yes even people who dislike BoB have done so too - lots of them have also retrieved their items under the terms on which I held them, no fuss, no argument, no scams. Many of them will retrieve their items in the future I am sure.
Quite happy to stand on my reputation. Not too active in investment circles these days, most of my manufacturing corps are maintained and managed by very close and trusted friends (whom I have met in game) but I always keep an eye out for opportunities
Love Fem
Edited for spelling ...
Quote: Do or do not - there is no try!
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Naphtalia
Caldari The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2007.09.08 12:42:00 -
[18]
Directorate in EMFI (100b+) Directorate in HTI (250b+) CEO in FIN (50% shares) (400b+) Trustee in AATP (100b+) (though no roles atm I think, DS!! ;))
so aprox: 850b...
Though pretty sure Eefrit has more... Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
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Femintaki
Gallente Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.09.08 13:34:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Femintaki on 08/09/2007 13:34:38
Originally by: Naphtalia Directorate in EMFI (100b+) Directorate in HTI (250b+) CEO in FIN (50% shares) (400b+) Trustee in AATP (100b+) (though no roles atm I think, DS!! ;))
so aprox: 850b...
Though pretty sure Eefrit has more...
I could have added in my Tech 2 assets but those are not public by any stretch of the imagination - those are personal. Estimated value of approx 700 - 800 bil - would have took me to around 1.4 trillion or so of controlled assets - not including raw isk in these figures.
800 bil personal 630 bil public
I suspect in personal net worth terms there are many way above me - Entity and a few others for sure. Compared to some of those guys I'm probably quite poor
Edit for spelling again - must learn to type
Quote: Do or do not - there is no try!
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Shadarle
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Posted - 2007.09.08 16:05:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Naphtalia Directorate in EMFI (100b+) Directorate in HTI (250b+) CEO in FIN (50% shares) (400b+) Trustee in AATP (100b+) (though no roles atm I think, DS!! ;))
so aprox: 850b...
Though pretty sure Eefrit has more...
Considering this doesn't actually follow the question Ricdic asked I don't see this as being correct.
You and Fem both claim to have 50% of the shares of FIN, as someone who has 0 clue who owns what in FIN, is this true? You both are 50/50 owners of it and could both steal absolutely everything if you wanted to?
The entire point of Ricdic's post, as I understood it, was to see how much ISK individuals were entrusted with. This was a nice way of saying "How much ISK could you run away with if you grabbed everything you possibly could".
It seems to me both Fem's and Naph's numbers are way inflated in this regard. I do not believe either could run away with the full amounts they posted. They both list that they do not have full access in some of the corps they listed, yet they counted the value completely.
Naph, for example, says he has no roles in AATP and is only a trustee... yet he counts that 100 billion as a public asset he has control over.
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Femintaki
Gallente Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.09.08 16:35:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Femintaki on 08/09/2007 16:37:47
Originally by: Shadarle
You and Fem both claim to have 50% of the shares of FIN, as someone who has 0 clue who owns what in FIN, is this true? You both are 50/50 owners of it and could both steal absolutely everything if you wanted to?
Fin is set up as follows:
FIN - This is the corp which is used to sell shares to shareholders
ANOTHER corp (This is a secret corp) - Holds all the BPOs which are manufactured by FIN (Naph and I each own 50% each of this corps shares) all the BPOs are locked down in this corp. Naph and I could steal these if we so desired - but we would have to work together to do so. That is why it is so secure - only 2 shareholders, both trusted and would have to both work together to steal anything. FIN is one of the most secure investments in eve because of this - unless you don't trust me and Naph :)
Please note I said originally I have control or influence over these things - I did not claim total control as you imply.
===
Can redo my figure as 130 + 400 (530) I have no direct capability of removing anything from EMFI as I stated. But I do have influence over how it invests and is run. Take that as you will.
My personal holdings are not publically owned.
Quote: Do or do not - there is no try!
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Balogh
Gallente Real-time EVE Stock Exchange
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Posted - 2007.09.08 20:20:00 -
[22]
Currently, RESX holds about 6.75b ISK. At last trade prices, the value of shares held by RESX is estimated at 23b ISK. This makes an estimated total of 29.7b ISK.
Up to date values can be found at http://resx.nfshost.com/audit.php ______________________________ Real-time EVE Stock Exchange, Blog |
Dark Shikari
Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.09.08 20:44:00 -
[23]
105b or so here with AATP.
Also, expect dividends as soon as H-TI dividends come in.
23 Member
EVE Video makers: save EVE-files bandwidth! Use the H.264 AutoEncoder! |
Naphtalia
Caldari The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2007.09.08 20:53:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Femintaki Edited by: Femintaki on 08/09/2007 16:37:47
Originally by: Shadarle
You and Fem both claim to have 50% of the shares of FIN, as someone who has 0 clue who owns what in FIN, is this true? You both are 50/50 owners of it and could both steal absolutely everything if you wanted to?
Fin is set up as follows:
FIN - This is the corp which is used to sell shares to shareholders
ANOTHER corp (This is a secret corp) - Holds all the BPOs which are manufactured by FIN (Naph and I each own 50% each of this corps shares) all the BPOs are locked down in this corp. Naph and I could steal these if we so desired - but we would have to work together to do so. That is why it is so secure - only 2 shareholders, both trusted and would have to both work together to steal anything. FIN is one of the most secure investments in eve because of this - unless you don't trust me and Naph :)
Please note I said originally I have control or influence over these things - I did not claim total control as you imply.
===
Can redo my figure as 130 + 400 (530) I have no direct capability of removing anything from EMFI as I stated. But I do have influence over how it invests and is run. Take that as you will.
My personal holdings are not publically owned.
Actually, unless me, fem or eefrits builder log in every day on that our trustees, either of us could steal everything... unless I forgot something.. we could cancel all the jobs, run unlock votes and if noone notices for 24hours (to cast the countervote) either of us could run off.
But yes, if Fem and I worked together nothing could stop us.
Same really with HIT got director roles but all BPO's are locked... so would need to work together with other directors..
Wasn't a epeen showing contest I think, just to declare interests so the investment community can make choices.
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.09 04:38:00 -
[25]
Just curious with FIN and the secret corp. Who is the CEO of that corp? As that person has immediate access to all assets (without having the 24 hour wait period). As we know of the unrent office bug where all locked down assets are put into an impounded hangar and free for the CEO to take.
Just curious that's all
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Seylara Xanteen
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Posted - 2007.09.09 08:49:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Ricdic Just curious with FIN and the secret corp. Who is the CEO of that corp? As that person has immediate access to all assets (without having the 24 hour wait period). As we know of the unrent office bug where all locked down assets are put into an impounded hangar and free for the CEO to take.
Well, we all (that read this) do now.
But good point as CEOs seem to have omnipotent powers within their corporations.
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Naphtalia
Caldari The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2007.09.09 10:58:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Ricdic Just curious with FIN and the secret corp. Who is the CEO of that corp? As that person has immediate access to all assets (without having the 24 hour wait period). As we know of the unrent office bug where all locked down assets are put into an impounded hangar and free for the CEO to take.
Just curious that's all
That would be my alt.. however we checked with the GM's and this is petitionable :)
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.09 14:44:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Naphtalia
Originally by: Ricdic Just curious with FIN and the secret corp. Who is the CEO of that corp? As that person has immediate access to all assets (without having the 24 hour wait period). As we know of the unrent office bug where all locked down assets are put into an impounded hangar and free for the CEO to take.
Just curious that's all
That would be my alt.. however we checked with the GM's and this is petitionable :)
That is very interesting. I wasn't aware this is the case. I hope this means more corporations can begin offering services with locked down assets actually being secured. I might pop my own petition in as well to ensure I get the same response as LaVista is in the same boat with me as CEO protecting his shareholders assets in a similar style.
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Nyphur
Pillowsoft Total Comfort
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Posted - 2007.09.09 16:14:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Nyphur on 09/09/2007 16:23:08
Good idea for a thread, Ricdic. I remember sparring with you verbally once or twice on the issue of how much isk you had take access to and it looks like you've increased your holdings since then but I'm not bothered:).
PIF - 20b PSRS - 40b
Total: 60b
PIF liquidates 1st June 2008 and will pay out 20b back to investors on that date and PSRS won't liquidate unless in severe financial difficulties. I've been considering adding another 40b if I can find room for it in a market somewhere.
EDIT: Holy crap, some people are in direct control of too much isk ^^;. And I thought my 60b was a respectable amount. It really does show that if I pushed for it, I could probably get a lot more investment isk.
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.09.09 16:36:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Nyphur It really does show that if I pushed for it, I could probably get a lot more investment isk.
I think a lot of people could. I have always made a point with my offerings of only asking what I needed and what I felt assured I could capitalise on. I knew C-R-A couldn't truly produce hardcore profits off 60b so I didn't consider asking for it. Same with everything I guess.
With TCCS however I believe I can make some superb profits, and would love to expand the corporation but TCCS has already gone through enough (with new ownership this month, and existing shares sales). I think people want to make sure I can run it effectively before throwing an extra 20b into it
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