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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Spineker
118
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Posted - 2012.01.24 04:35:00 -
[481] - Quote
You know I thought Incursions were a bit over powered on the isk issue but all this monkey see as monkey do bandwagon Epeens is really rather disgusting to me. |
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
123
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Posted - 2012.01.24 04:36:00 -
[482] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:Lets do some math. According to CCP incursions are paying out 621 billion a week. Lets use 30m/hour as a conservative figure on how much a level 4 mission runner can make. That gives us a total of 20700 l4 man/hours a week. Assuming 23/7 uptime we get 161 hours/week. Since Incrusion's can't be botted no one player will be able to play 23/7. In total though the isk for incursions equals the same income generation (live load) per hour as 129 level IV missions being run in that hour. (=621,000,000,000 / 30,000,000 / 161)
What this tells me is that the isk per hour of running an incursion isn't as good as most people think. While the isk per hour actually running incursions seems great, when organizational and transit times are taken into account-not so much. The current idea of incursions as an isk generator seem to be generated by a couple of things.
1. Time flys when you're having fun. People of underestimating their total time commitment.
2. Big wallet flashies and bad math.
3. Folks flying faction ships with faction fits for the the first time and underestimating how much they could make with those ships running level 4s (it's more than 30m/hour).
4. Incursions are not being run evenly but at peak times. This means that a higher hourly reward is possible, but there is a lot of down/cycle time without heavy incursion running.
Bottom line 621b/week is a drop in the bucket for the eve economy (the Plex market in Jita churns 1.2T per DAY!). All this rage is a community issue being mistaken for an ISK one. If these shinny fleets split up and ran level 4s, there pilots would probably find themselves making more isk/hour. The enjoyment of flying with people (and unfamiliarity with use of heavy faction fits in L4s) is inflating the perception of profit.
There is no mistake in perception in ISK generation. It is all part of the fiction being generated by the sociopaths who want to wipe out high sec alts of null sec pilots from making ISK in high sec Incursions.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1656
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Posted - 2012.01.24 04:57:00 -
[483] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:Andski wrote:Ai Mei wrote:Then failure to complete 0.0 incursions in your space should result in loss of
sov in the HQ system, and immediately changes sov to Sanshas Nation and the only way to take it back is to anchor SBU's and shoot the sansha ihub and tcu.
and loss of 1 level for each upgrade in all the other systems. you're an idiot NPC based risk is non-zero in incursions. That you only recognize PC based risk is not our problem. In this context it NPC risk is. Very important factor as it influences the isk/hour ratio of the sites.
you run incursions with concord protection and make 100m+/hr
you wouldn't be flying ships that would take a hundred hours of incursions to recover the cost IF THE RISK OF LOSING THEM WAS THAT GREAT
hint: it's not |
Jas Dor
Republic University Minmatar Republic
20
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Posted - 2012.01.24 04:59:00 -
[484] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Jas Dor wrote:Just a quick note, the 60bil/week number for incursions comes from the NPC news item posted by CCP and is an official number. We can argue permutations but I expect everyone here realizes that the level 4 number is a lowball. Link? https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=59084&find=unread
Or you could go fish through the NPC news.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1656
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Posted - 2012.01.24 04:59:00 -
[485] - Quote
Ai Mei wrote:Why hasnt XX Death nuked their incursion in 24 hours?
"Hey guys I know we're fighting a war with a highly competent enemy and all but let's go run that incursion in our space!!!!" |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1656
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Posted - 2012.01.24 05:03:00 -
[486] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:the Plex market in Jita churns 1.2T per DAY!
That's 1.2 trillion ISK changing hands every day. Despite what so many idiots seem to believe, there are no NPC buy orders in Jita for PLEX - it's entirely a player-controlled market. |
Jas Dor
Republic University Minmatar Republic
22
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Posted - 2012.01.24 05:15:00 -
[487] - Quote
Andski wrote:Jas Dor wrote:Andski wrote:Ai Mei wrote:Then failure to complete 0.0 incursions in your space should result in loss of
sov in the HQ system, and immediately changes sov to Sanshas Nation and the only way to take it back is to anchor SBU's and shoot the sansha ihub and tcu.
and loss of 1 level for each upgrade in all the other systems. you're an idiot NPC based risk is non-zero in incursions. That you only recognize PC based risk is not our problem. In this context it NPC risk is. Very important factor as it influences the isk/hour ratio of the sites. you run incursions with concord protection and make 100m+/hr you wouldn't be flying ships that would take a hundred hours of incursions to recover the cost IF THE RISK OF LOSING THEM WAS THAT GREAT hint: it's not
One ship pop a month/month and a half of playtime? That's about the same rate of ship loss per pilot as the alliance I was in (on the goon side) was taking during the the BoB/Kenny war. If we get lucky TiDi might up that number substantially, but the average line pilot in 0.0 is not loosing a bunch of ships (dictor and bad inty pilots are another story). |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1268
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Posted - 2012.01.24 06:28:00 -
[488] - Quote
Andski wrote:Jas Dor wrote:the Plex market in Jita churns 1.2T per DAY! That's 1.2 trillion ISK changing hands every day. Despite what so many idiots seem to believe, there are no NPC buy orders in Jita for PLEX - it's entirely a player-controlled market.
I'm imagining milking Plex for tears and churning it into a delicious, salty tear-based spread. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
545
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Posted - 2012.01.24 07:11:00 -
[489] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:One ship pop a month/month and a half of playtime? That's about the same rate of ship loss per pilot as the alliance I was in (on the goon side) was taking during the the BoB/Kenny war. If we get lucky TiDi might up that number substantially, but the average line pilot in 0.0 is not loosing a bunch of ships (dictor and bad inty pilots are another story). I lose anything between 2-10 maelstroms every month, depending on how many fights we have, and how competent the enemy is. That's not a risk, that's a certainty. |
Tore Vest
156
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Posted - 2012.01.24 07:19:00 -
[490] - Quote
Andski is on fire to day.... Highsec carebear... and proud of it |
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Darius III
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
568
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Posted - 2012.01.24 08:51:00 -
[491] - Quote
Brumi Viri wrote:Quote:Dear Pilots,
Incursions were amazing while they lasted and magnified the appreciation have for Eve Online. Unlike 0.0 people I have a job that doesn't allow me to log in 24/7 to the game. As a casual gamer Incursions allowed me to earn enough isk for day to day activities.
I am hereby canceling my account.
I implore you do the same so CCP will listen and ban Griefing.
Someone please take charge of this movement and keep a log of all the people closing accounts.
Signed, Sad Hard Working Eve Pilot. As per my thread that was shut down. This is how I feel, and I am 100% committed if CCP does fix incursions.
Tee Hee CCP and even the CSM have a lot of hardworking men and women who are very intelligent, working on making New Eden a better place-it is CCP management that I fear the most. |
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
366
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Posted - 2012.01.24 09:09:00 -
[492] - Quote
We may have a new meme - a shwep. Sad Hard Working Eve Pilot.
Oh hi Darius III any other NDA information you would like to share with us ?
The universe is an ancient desert, a vast wasteland with only occasional habitable planets as oases. We Fremen, comfortable with deserts, shall now venture into another. - STILGAR, From the Sietch to the Stars. |
Sarah Schneider
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
35
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Posted - 2012.01.24 09:16:00 -
[493] - Quote
minmatarsebiestormale20091011111 wrote:Basicly BrickSquad and co. have killed another mothership thus closing the incursion.
This is becoming a joke, i get the point that incursions need looking at and balancing. But these idiots cry because they want the whole of eve to play, the way they play. Killing the mom for a laff so the bears cant farm is punishing the normal player.
I run incursions not just for the isk, but the social aspect. This is ofc being ruined because of a bunch of goon wannabes crying because they arent making the huge isk.
CCP needs to put a stop to this now!!. If anything make the incursions run a timer of 3-4days before they move, even if the mom hasnt been killed. (As short term solution for now)
Also CSM's have been involved in these MOM killing fleets. This shows me they out for their own interests or corp/alliance interests. They are ment to be listening to the community not ruining it.
Incursions where ment to bring players together, have fun make some isk be happy, this new style which eve has enjoyed is slowly being torn apart. However i will say again, i agree incursions need balancing to make it good for everyone.
SO CCP SORT OUT THESE IDIOTS WHO ARE RUINING THE GAME
So, you're basically saying that CCP should go ahead and interfere with their sandbox? and you were saying that people shouldn't interfere with the way you play even though you are exploiting the mechanics of the game? and CSM are listening to the community, incursions need fixing and CCP is being slow at it. Youare not the community.
This is a sandbox, get used to it. |
Tallian Saotome
Fractured Core Fatal Ascension
350
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Posted - 2012.01.24 09:43:00 -
[494] - Quote
Thorn Galen wrote:We may have a new meme - a shwep. Sad Hard Working Eve Pilot. Oh hi Darius III any other NDA information you would like to share with us ? Is that related to a BattleShimp? o/`-á Lord, I want to be a gynecologist.. KY, rubber gloves, and a flashlight.-á o/` |
Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
74
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Posted - 2012.01.24 10:16:00 -
[495] - Quote
HI! is this the thread where I can complain about someone not agreeing with the rest of EVE-bears for not completing incursions for pure meta-gaming reasons ? |
LacLongQuan
Deep Space Expedition.
13
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Posted - 2012.01.24 10:44:00 -
[496] - Quote
Ispia Jaydrath wrote:Ai Mei wrote:
Why hasnt XX Death nuked their incursion in 24 hours?
they have a few thousand people in their alliance how hard is it for them to form a fleet and just run sites fast, there are enough guides to do this. No seriously answer me this, how hard is it to form a fleet out there? 50 people can bring up the mom in no time running vans. If you can form a blob to do a "roaming gang" then 0.0 can surely form a 10 man group to run incursions which atm pay better than sanctums in 0.0.
Okay, first things first. Nullsec does not work like highsec. If there is 'an incursion somewhere', not everybody in 0.0 gets to autopilot over and x up to see if there is a fleet available; incursion running is essentially restricted to an alliance's own space. And since there are only a few incursions at a time, there has never been an actual incentive to keep appropriately fitted ships available in case one just happens to land in your space (out of the 36 nullsec regions). So for any given 0.0 pilot there is hardly ever an incursion available, and as a result incursion running has never developed as a profession in 0.0 simply because it's not viable. They do not have incursion FCs, incursion formup channels, or often even any sort of plan in place to deal with them. Also, the population density is much lower. There are ~288,000 highsec pilots with access to incursions, while the largest 0.0 alliance has less than 4% that number. Second, there is little incentive at an alliance level to get rid of incursions unless they happen to land on a beacon or jump bridge that can't be rerouted. This means that running incursions is not an alliance effort, but something line pilots would have to arrange themselves. Third, some people in null are actually more interested in shooting people than shooting rats. Strange, but true. Fourth, xdeath is in the middle of a giant ****ing war and just might have better things to do.
quote this again for those hisec bears
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ShipToaster
115
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:28:00 -
[497] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:Tippia wrote:Jas Dor wrote:Just a quick note, the 60bil/week number for incursions comes from the NPC news item posted by CCP and is an official number. We can argue permutations but I expect everyone here realizes that the level 4 number is a lowball. Link? https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=59084&find=unreadOr you could go fish through the NPC news.
I see nothing there from CCP and I cannot see anything about 60bil/week. it is in no way official as you claim.
The 621 billion a week figure is "questionable math by community leaders " and this figure could easily be an order of magnitude too low. The 3000 billion a week calculation I did is probably half of what it actually is. 6000 billion a week is the equivalent of injecting the isk from 500,000 hours of level four missions every week.
If we extrapolate based on stats we do know, then all the mission runners in EVE at most inject 450 billion created ISK a day (this is complex but 383,000,000 x 1000 isk plus some mission rewards at about 10%, some LP items have no isk sink value so I rounded up for simplicity). We can also estimate that all the mission runners in EVE earn close to 2250 billion ISK between them a day while incursion runners earn 400 billion to 800 billion a day.
I freely admit much of this is contestable and CCP Diagoras will be able to give us perfect numbers, but this will have to do until we get these perfect numbers.
I say incursions inject at least as much and possibly double the ISK that all mission runners do.
CCP Diagoras JOHN TURBEFIELD, Legendary Hero of EVE who speaks words of great truth wrote:As of midday on Friday 20th Jan, the previous 72 hours had seen 1.15 billion loyalty points handed out over 507k transactions Source https://twitter.com/CCP_Diagoras
I do not know if this number includes incursion runners or FW runners but works out at an average of 383 million loyalty points a day. A week would have been better as I assume weekends earn more. Incursion math? part 1 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=678400#post678400 part 2 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=698871#post698871 |
Tore Vest
157
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:34:00 -
[498] - Quote
Darius III wrote:Brumi Viri wrote:Quote:Dear Pilots,
Incursions were amazing while they lasted and magnified the appreciation have for Eve Online. Unlike 0.0 people I have a job that doesn't allow me to log in 24/7 to the game. As a casual gamer Incursions allowed me to earn enough isk for day to day activities.
I am hereby canceling my account.
I implore you do the same so CCP will listen and ban Griefing.
Someone please take charge of this movement and keep a log of all the people closing accounts.
Signed, Sad Hard Working Eve Pilot. As per my thread that was shut down. This is how I feel, and I am 100% committed if CCP does fix incursions. Tee Hee Proof that CSM want to destroy this game... Highsec carebear... and proud of it |
Lady Hofstedar
Nexus Confederation
0
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:44:00 -
[499] - Quote
Keep trolling noobs
Keep ******* up empire and you'll see the consequences
Less new players Less new recruits Drop off in 0.0 PvP because older players quit and new players quit Industry i.e market prices hike because corps shut down who have industrial divisions Incursions become useless making anotehr aspect of eve that brings in new players gone Alliances start to die from lack of recruitment and new blood 0.0 regions become deadzones because of lack of players (see points above)
Are you getting the picture yet? Or shall i keep painting?
And as for the CSM, what a joke, they have never been useful, not now, not back then, not ever, human nature is to be selfish.
Unfortunatley people say *its my ingame personality*, no, psychology has proved that it would be the way you are in rl if it was accepted.
Bottom line is, the majority of EvE Players are players banned from other mmos for the same kinda behaviour and the so called *elite pvp corps* in Empire and *griefer corps* are slowly killing the game. I have seen so many corps die because they are 4 days old and get war decced by a random corp for no reason, the new players quit and go back on there xboxes.
CCP needs to fix empire, it should be 100mil to war dec corps a week driving the need for merc corps down forcing so called *mercs* into null sec alliances which would improve 0.0 pvp. Griefer corps would drop off because the isk would become an issue.
There are several fixes that ccp need to implement but they wont. Also mate id delete your post, all your gonan get is a bunch of nobodys trolling you saying *moar tears* and *go cry some more*. Mostly because they are nerdy, overweight socially rejected children who still live with there mummies and daddies because theya re scared of the real world and subsequently live on eve online which in effect becomes there life.
Just keep screwing empire, because u wont force players into null sec, ull force them to quit and eve will die altogether. You narrow sight means u cannot see the long term reprecussions of your own griefing and stupidity.
Hof Out |
Javajunky
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.01.24 14:09:00 -
[500] - Quote
The reason why you guys have got Brick Squad invading Incursions is because they totally lost a null sec and have no place to go. I am certaain that's the Alliance that has installed Looser V skillbook. I mean seriously, there is no sov they can actually hold on thier own. So basically empire pubbies got the crap that null sec chewed up and spit out.
Maybe you guys can talk to some russian RMT alliance and subsidize them as renters. I thinks that the only way possible Brick Squad can live in null. This is all quite hysterical actually.... Empire Pubbies going.... ISK faucet turned off, not fair, I have to run Level 4's again free from any danger of being attacked... oh poor pubbies.... |
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Javajunky
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.01.24 14:10:00 -
[501] - Quote
Oh and I wanted the #500 post as well... |
Elistea
G U N G N I R Y G G D R A S I L
46
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Posted - 2012.01.24 14:46:00 -
[502] - Quote
Incursions were big part of my EVE's social life. Got to know great group of ppl i ran them with. Now i lost that. As i mentioned B4 i used incursions to fuel my PVP. Since this income is gone i had to make tough decision - deactivate 2 of my 3 accounts. (CCP will love that) Ill give it couple more days/weeks and if nothing changes im back to Starcraft 2.
If CCP doesn't care - I don't care
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Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
546
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Posted - 2012.01.24 14:51:00 -
[503] - Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rasZzenuYxI |
Elistea
G U N G N I R Y G G D R A S I L
46
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Posted - 2012.01.24 14:59:00 -
[504] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rasZzenuYxI
Ty for Outro |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2012.01.24 15:28:00 -
[505] - Quote
Elistea wrote:Incursions were big part of my EVE's social life. Got to know great group of ppl i ran them with. Now i lost that. As i mentioned B4 i used incursions to fuel my PVP. Since this income is gone i had to make tough decision - deactivate 2 of my 3 accounts. (CCP will love that ) Ill give it couple more days/weeks and if nothing changes im back to Starcraft 2. If CCP doesn't care - I don't care
Join a 0.0 entity or start your own corp. You will get your social life back, you will be able to make money for PVP. Missions, 0.0 anos 0.0 incursions etc. Or unsub your last account. |
Alexandra Delarge
The Korova
10
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Posted - 2012.01.24 15:50:00 -
[506] - Quote
Lady Hofstedar wrote: Bottom line is, the majority of EvE Players are players banned from other mmos for the same kinda behaviour and the so called *elite pvp corps* in Empire and *griefer corps* are slowly killing the game.
Mostly because they are nerdy, overweight socially rejected children who still live with there mummies and daddies because theya re scared of the real world and subsequently live on eve online which in effect becomes there life.
I wouldn't join a corp run by someone as irrational and ignorant as you. Imagine the impression a new player gets when someone claiming to have played Eve for 5 years recruits them and starts crying and complaining about the game.
Furthermore ,it's players like you that cause a great many newbies to leave. You start a corp not knowing the first thing about Eve, invite a bunch of new players and fail to help or educate them about the game. Then, when things get tough, you run around crying 'griefer' and the new players think that every corp in Eve is as terrible as yours. There are thousands of good corps in Eve and there are thousands of bad ones too. If a new player joins a good corp he/she will have a much better time.
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Implying Implications
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
15
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Posted - 2012.01.24 15:53:00 -
[507] - Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5QGkOGZubQ |
Samantha Utama
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
40
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Posted - 2012.01.24 21:10:00 -
[508] - Quote
Elistea wrote: ... and if nothing changes im back to Starcraft 2. If CCP doesn't care - I don't care
If you're the type of player that isn't into eve for the long haul, your opinions about game changes doesn't and shouldn't count for much.
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Morgals
Sturm Reich Sturmgrenadier Syndicate
3
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Posted - 2012.01.24 21:49:00 -
[509] - Quote
Enjoy incursions but they do get stale. More dynamic vg's with more variable content so people don't min max as much. Maybe occasionally they will be long range fit and be far away, or use some e-war.
The brick thing is sort of silly but it really hurts casual players. I can only play 2h or so a night and if most of that is spent making 20 or so jumps to the next location I don;t actually get to play much. So logging in to do incursions does not happen.
In my 2h play period i want to get on and shoot stuff. Incursions lasting only 1 play period mean moving each day.
Incursions should stay in one place longer...that said incursions do not escilate.... Never seen a high sec incursion with penalties....for high sec the penalty system should be a lot harder to push. Looking for a mature, adult gaming community that has been active in EvE since 2004?Recruitment is open! Come join our public channel and get to know us. SGHQ-PUBLIC [url]http://sgeve.dai-coar.com/[/url] |
Eyeama Spy
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2012.01.24 22:14:00 -
[510] - Quote
This is eve **** happens grow a pair and stop whinning on the forums |
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