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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Famble
Three's a Crowd
262
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Posted - 2012.01.21 23:26:00 -
[31] - Quote
My bowels are time dilated. Too much cheese I think.
If anyone ever looks at you and says, "Hold my beer, watch this,"-á you're probably going to want to pay attention. |
Sarina Rhoda
Viral Target
1
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Posted - 2012.01.21 23:28:00 -
[32] - Quote
Correct me if i'm wrong but time dilation wasn't created to fix lag..... Time dilation was introduced to make fights fairer under extreme lag conditions. Previously the server would just randomly accept some peoples commands while completely ignoring other peoples. This meant some people were able to fight as if there was nothing wrong whilst other people were completely locked out.
Time dilation was simply a method of slowing everything down so that the server has a fair chance and processing everyone's commands. |
Buzzmong
Aliastra Gallente Federation
111
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Posted - 2012.01.21 23:32:00 -
[33] - Quote
Sarina Rhoda wrote:Correct me if i'm wrong but time dilation wasn't created to fix lag..... Time dilation was introduced to make fights fairer under extreme lag conditions. Previously the server would just randomly accept some peoples commands while completely ignoring other peoples. This meant some people were able to fight as if there was nothing wrong whilst other people were completely locked out.
Time dilation was simply a method of slowing everything down so that the server has a fair chance and processing everyone's commands.
That's how I understood it.
Fixin' lag involves CCP's ongoing process of code iteration (updated client + server), refactoring, and the new technologies they're planning on adding in this year! |
Atticus Fynch
374
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Posted - 2012.01.22 12:16:00 -
[34] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote: and CCP policy about documentation is: "documentation is optional and you do it in your spare time".)
Ooh...bad move. That's like performing surgery and telling the surgeon, stitching is optional...just do it when you get around to it.
Im an proponent of over-documenting code. Makes life much easier. GÿàGÿàGÿàCargo Pilots Unite!!!GÿàGÿàGÿà https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=668132&#post668132 |
Marcus Harikari
Aegis Requiem.
15
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Posted - 2012.01.22 12:36:00 -
[35] - Quote
Atticus Fynch wrote:Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote: and CCP policy about documentation is: "documentation is optional and you do it in your spare time".) Ooh...bad move. That's like performing surgery and telling the surgeon, stitching is optional...just do it when you get around to it.Im an proponent of over-documenting code. Makes life much easier. i don't even write code :-D even EASIER |
Sandrestal
University of Caille Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2012.01.22 12:46:00 -
[36] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. So you find black loading screens very amusing I take it? Quote:CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. Funny how two seemingly different things can be so unequivocally one and the same. The alternative is that you won't be allowed to be in the fight at all, would you prefer that?
Forgive me but a couple of years ago we were fighting in Delve with 1400 people in system and lag was O.K. I forget which "upgrade" caused the lag monster to return but since then we've had to look under our beds before engaging in large fleet jousting.
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Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
22
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Posted - 2012.01.22 12:57:00 -
[37] - Quote
Marcus Harikari wrote:Atticus Fynch wrote:Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote: and CCP policy about documentation is: "documentation is optional and you do it in your spare time".) Ooh...bad move. That's like performing surgery and telling the surgeon, stitching is optional...just do it when you get around to it.Im an proponent of over-documenting code. Makes life much easier. i don't even write code :-D even EASIER
LOL what a cute little troll. Kill it before it grows! |
Zleon Leigh
67
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:04:00 -
[38] - Quote
TiDi is implemented because there does not exist a hardware solution that will handle the computation load and also the time of flight problem across the net.
The fix to this is simple - limit fleet battle size. But CCP is too fail to admit the truth. Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
368
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:05:00 -
[39] - Quote
Poetic Stanziel wrote:Valei Khurelem wrote:From what I've seen it isn't much of a solution, it'd be more cost effective in the long run to give all EVE subscribers free fibre optic connections with the amount of subscription money frankly. The problem isn't the connection to the servers ... it is the workload the servers are doing that is the bottleneck. CCP would need to invest in Deep Blue style machines to fix lag. They don't have that sort of money.
exactly.
as I said a few months ago when they said they were implementing this: It is not a permanent solution, just a stopgap, but a very large and "semi-permanent-temporary" stopgap, while they try to make the code work better.
there was the Infiniband project a few years back, where they were trying to make processing threads mobile across clusters using Infiniband-linked servers (google for "Infiniband"), but it was put on hold due to the extremely massive technical undertake that it was (and probably still is, moving entire processing threads seamlessly across several nodes is a daunting task), and decided to implement a stopgap procedure that involved Time Dilatation so that they could get some more time.
also, no. Hard Limits don't work on EVE. there will always be a way to go around them/make them play to your advantage. TiDi was supposed to be the "fairier" way to make fleetbattles happen. [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities
86
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:07:00 -
[40] - Quote
Poetic Stanziel wrote:Valei Khurelem wrote:From what I've seen it isn't much of a solution, it'd be more cost effective in the long run to give all EVE subscribers free fibre optic connections with the amount of subscription money frankly. The problem isn't the connection to the servers ... it is the workload the servers are doing that is the bottleneck. CCP would need to invest in Deep Blue style machines to fix lag. They don't have that sort of money.
7000 systems @ one bladeper system 14 per blade center, $5000 per blade and and $20,000 for each chassis.....that is HS22 dual 4 core xenons 8GB ECC ram with 100Gig-E capability in HT chassis....and I I may be on the low side I'd have to go to work and pull invoices.
Oh and that doesn't count literally MILLIONS in enterprise switches to wire it all together.
.....and I don't feel like getting out the calculator. |
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DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
823
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:13:00 -
[41] - Quote
Hey OP, Without tidi, you'd be staring at a black screen as your ship explodes to death for no apparent reason. Please report yourself to the nearest biomass facility in order to atone for your crimes against humanity. Sincerely, The entire EVE community |
Dilaro thagriin
Brothers Intensive Fighting Team Air
30
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:15:00 -
[42] - Quote
Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game.
so... did you ask for node reinforcement?
no???
then it's your own fault. Quit whining. |
Aineko Macx
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
117
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:19:00 -
[43] - Quote
TiDi is working rather well actually.
However, what worries is the amount of TiDi, i.e., how easily the server gets overloaded. 150 jump anywhere in or out... bam, TiDi. If 1400 makes TiDi run at 10-15%, it means the server would only support about 140-210 pilots fighting at full speed (right, it doesn't scale linearly, so it's a bit more). I thought the server(code) was in better shape by now. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1620
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 13:21:00 -
[44] - Quote
Dilaro thagriin wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. so... did you ask for node reinforcement? no??? then it's your own fault. Quit whining.
actually, both RDN and GSF asked for the node to be reinforced, but HEH it never happened and we fought with 10% dilation
well they fought with 10% dilation i was OUTSIDE not playing eve online |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities
86
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:23:00 -
[45] - Quote
Aineko Macx wrote:TiDi is working rather well actually.
However, what worries is the amount of TiDi, i.e., how easily the server gets overloaded. 150 jump anywhere in or out... bam, TiDi. If 1400 makes TiDi run at 10-15%, it means the server would only support about 140-210 pilots fighting at full speed (right, it doesn't scale linearly, so it's a bit more). I thought the server(code) was in better shape by now.
Yeah I noted that in the feedback thread.
I would think that they could crack it down or add a pre-check loop that would allow fleets to move easier, because warping around at half speed when you are trying to move from system to system is aggravating. |
Biytor
Star Frontiers Initiative Mercenaries
4
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:27:00 -
[46] - Quote
TiDi seemed to work just fine.
Yes things were slow, but that's the entire point of TiDi. I was able to load the entire grid, target, shoot, move and die. It is interesting to see yourself die in slow motion, most of the time I just was back in station and had to read a kill mail to find out what happened. So I would say it's working, now it needs improvement. |
Grimner
THORN Syndicate Initiative Mercenaries
0
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:53:00 -
[47] - Quote
It work great for me also. |
Zleon Leigh
67
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Posted - 2012.01.22 13:55:00 -
[48] - Quote
Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game.
You can't "fix" physics.
CCP should be happy that they can support 300 vs 300 (or whatever a non-reinforced node will support) and put gate locks in place to keep it below that. Spawn bypass gates (or reroute in place gates) to jump people past the fight - allowing reinforcing fleets to engage in nearby systems.
CCP won the epeen award for largest true PvP many-on-many a long time ago at much lower numbers. Enough already. CCP encouraging ever larger massive battles is simply wasting resources that could be used to fix addressable bugs and realistic, usable content. Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
baltec1
470
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 14:50:00 -
[49] - Quote
Zleon Leigh wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. You can't "fix" physics. CCP should be happy that they can support 300 vs 300 (or whatever a non-reinforced node will support) and put gate locks in place to keep it below that. Spawn bypass gates (or reroute in place gates) to jump people past the fight - allowing reinforcing fleets to engage in nearby systems. CCP won the epeen award for largest true PvP many-on-many a long time ago at much lower numbers. Enough already. CCP encouraging ever larger massive battles is simply wasting resources that could be used to fix addressable bugs and realistic, usable content.
The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good. |
Zleon Leigh
67
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Posted - 2012.01.22 15:34:00 -
[50] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Zleon Leigh wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. You can't "fix" physics. CCP should be happy that they can support 300 vs 300 (or whatever a non-reinforced node will support) and put gate locks in place to keep it below that. Spawn bypass gates (or reroute in place gates) to jump people past the fight - allowing reinforcing fleets to engage in nearby systems. CCP won the epeen award for largest true PvP many-on-many a long time ago at much lower numbers. Enough already. CCP encouraging ever larger massive battles is simply wasting resources that could be used to fix addressable bugs and realistic, usable content. The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good.
Nope, just tired of hearing about tears of "I was in 500 man fleet and couldn't do ****!" for the past two years.
BTW - don't talk about something you don't have a clue about. Client side has NOTHING to do with your 500vs500 fight lag. It's all server side.
Because of TiDi being rolled out - I just now experienced TiDi in a 0.0 system with ***17*** people in local. Not a fight to be seen.... yet another broken mechanic brought on by efforts to babysit the monster alliances. Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
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baltec1
470
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Posted - 2012.01.22 15:40:00 -
[51] - Quote
Zleon Leigh wrote:baltec1 wrote:
The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good.
Nope, just tired of hearing about tears of "I was in 500 man fleet and couldn't do ****!" for the past two years. BTW - don't talk about something you don't have a clue about. Client side has NOTHING to do with your 500vs500 fight lag. It's all server side.
Because its CCP that makes your pooter crash in a big fight. Theres a reason why people say turn down the graphics and turn off brakets in these fights |
Zleon Leigh
67
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Posted - 2012.01.22 15:46:00 -
[52] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Zleon Leigh wrote:baltec1 wrote:
The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good.
Nope, just tired of hearing about tears of "I was in 500 man fleet and couldn't do ****!" for the past two years. BTW - don't talk about something you don't have a clue about. Client side has NOTHING to do with your 500vs500 fight lag. It's all server side. Because its CCP that makes your pooter crash in a big fight. Theres a reason why people say turn down the graphics and turn off brakets in these fights
If the server side is drawing brackets CCP implementation is plain stupid. Turning off brackets and turning down graphics does help low-end systems. Still has nothing to do with server lag/freeze/fail. Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
YkkonenOnKakkonen
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 15:47:00 -
[53] - Quote
Zleon Leigh wrote:baltec1 wrote:Zleon Leigh wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. You can't "fix" physics. CCP should be happy that they can support 300 vs 300 (or whatever a non-reinforced node will support) and put gate locks in place to keep it below that. Spawn bypass gates (or reroute in place gates) to jump people past the fight - allowing reinforcing fleets to engage in nearby systems. CCP won the epeen award for largest true PvP many-on-many a long time ago at much lower numbers. Enough already. CCP encouraging ever larger massive battles is simply wasting resources that could be used to fix addressable bugs and realistic, usable content. The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good. Nope, just tired of hearing about tears of "I was in 500 man fleet and couldn't do ****!" for the past two years. BTW - don't talk about something you don't have a clue about. Client side has NOTHING to do with your 500vs500 fight lag. It's all server side. Because of TiDi being rolled out - I just now experienced TiDi in a 0.0 system with ***17*** people in local. Not a fight to be seen.... yet another broken mechanic brought on by efforts to babysit the monster alliances.
TiDi is node wide. So it might that there was a fight going on some other system on the node? And fleets (200+) cause tidi to spike to 10% when they jump systems.
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Zleon Leigh
67
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Posted - 2012.01.22 15:58:00 -
[54] - Quote
YkkonenOnKakkonen wrote:
TiDi is node wide. So it might that there was a fight going on some other system on the node? And fleets (200+) cause tidi to spike to 10% when they jump systems.
If TiDi is node wide - then the implementation is completely wrong.
Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
Mire Stoude
Capital Industries Research And Development Fidelas Constans
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 15:59:00 -
[55] - Quote
My experience with TiDi is that it is great for fleet battles but horrible for jumping through gates. Yes it is hard to lock targets, but it is harder to lock targets with a black or frozen screen. TiDi is a step in the right direction. Now, if we could only cut down on the 5 minute stargate jumps (with traffic control) ... |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities
86
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 16:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
YkkonenOnKakkonen wrote:Zleon Leigh wrote:baltec1 wrote:Zleon Leigh wrote:Milli Sanchez wrote:Currently fighting in 92D. 1260 in local and dilation is so bad I cant lock anything. Dilation is FAIL. This is NOT fun and simply not worth participating in big fleet PvP anymore. CCP stop thinking up awesome technical work arounds and fix the #$% game. You can't "fix" physics. CCP should be happy that they can support 300 vs 300 (or whatever a non-reinforced node will support) and put gate locks in place to keep it below that. Spawn bypass gates (or reroute in place gates) to jump people past the fight - allowing reinforcing fleets to engage in nearby systems. CCP won the epeen award for largest true PvP many-on-many a long time ago at much lower numbers. Enough already. CCP encouraging ever larger massive battles is simply wasting resources that could be used to fix addressable bugs and realistic, usable content. The only people who say this are those who wernt there or are bitter they try to play on a poor mans PC from 2002. The last two fights have been epic and worked oh so good. Nope, just tired of hearing about tears of "I was in 500 man fleet and couldn't do ****!" for the past two years. BTW - don't talk about something you don't have a clue about. Client side has NOTHING to do with your 500vs500 fight lag. It's all server side. Because of TiDi being rolled out - I just now experienced TiDi in a 0.0 system with ***17*** people in local. Not a fight to be seen.... yet another broken mechanic brought on by efforts to babysit the monster alliances. TiDi is node wide. So it might that there was a fight going on some other system on the node? And fleets (200+) cause tidi to spike to 10% when they jump systems.
200 was getting 25-30 yesterday, 400 was getting to 10.......which means you warp in like 1/8th time |
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
50
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 16:04:00 -
[57] - Quote
Zleon Leigh wrote:*snip*
If the server side is drawing brackets CCP implementation is plain stupid. Turning off brackets and turning down graphics does help low-end systems. Still has nothing to do with server lag/freeze/fail. Server doesn't draw brackets.. the client is.
The physics simulation of that star system (that's the one we're talking about here) is being overloaded and to get all the calculations done in one loop to serve every dataset in it's realm (modules activation, ship movements, locks, repps, shooting, etc. pp.) it increases it's loop time = TiDi.
To the other brainiac with the python bashing.. 90% of the critical code is already in C++/C server and client side. CCP explained that about 9 months ago in one of their blogs.. the remaining 10% are being worked on, but are more complex so no easy & fast results there.
Afaik currently they're working on a method to pull star systems from a node where one star system is being overloaded.. mild reinforcing on the fly if you so will (so the overloaded starsystem then has a full node to calc the crap out of it). The problem they got with that is: for moving solar systems from one node to another you'll loose your connection to it and so far would need to log in again.. dunno how far they made it with this. Last news 8+ months old.
As for the multi-threading thing.. where you spread a solar system over several nodes - so you might end up with a single grid running on one node.. future talk. Can't remember any specific talk by CCP about this.. so not within the next 24 months. |
Zleon Leigh
67
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 16:04:00 -
[58] - Quote
Mire Stoude wrote:My experience with TiDi is that it is great for fleet battles but horrible for jumping through gates. Yes it is hard to lock targets, but it is harder to lock targets with a black or frozen screen. TiDi is a step in the right direction. Now, if we could only cut down on the 5 minute stargate jumps (with traffic control) ...
Can't be done - once you unsync clock of the fleet fight system from the rest of EVE you have to make up the any lag difference when you eventually rejoin the rest of EVE. Better hope those blob fleet fights don't last long - you could be sitting on that dark screen for a looong time.
Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
YkkonenOnKakkonen
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 16:04:00 -
[59] - Quote
Zleon Leigh wrote:YkkonenOnKakkonen wrote:
TiDi is node wide. So it might that there was a fight going on some other system on the node? And fleets (200+) cause tidi to spike to 10% when they jump systems.
If TiDi is node wide - then the implementation is completely wrong.
If the node is getting hammered so much that it has to slow the game down to 10% of its normal speed then why should it work any faster on other systems the node is running? It somehow magically gets more cpu time out of thin air to run the other systems on the node? |
Zleon Leigh
67
|
Posted - 2012.01.22 16:06:00 -
[60] - Quote
I've changed my mind about TiDi breaking low populated systems. If TiDi kicks in I know a blob fleet is on its way. Thanks for expanding local!!!
Incarna - Newest business example of mismanaged capital.
CCP - Continuing to gank independent PI producers every day |
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