Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 [10] 11 12 13 .. 13 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Sc0rphion
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 20:13:00 -
[271]
Edited by: Sc0rphion on 26/10/2007 20:14:48 return to the thread
/signed
------------------- I think CCP are Natzis and amarr Judish CCP are white texas boys and Amarr are Black guys CCP are European and Amarr southamericans CCp's wife was found having sex with an Amarrian To add CCP is a gallente guy why gallente have pretty womans? why gallente have More sofisticated looking ships Why the textures of Gallente are near to Jovian's one? Why in the name of god, Mimmatar are ugly? Why bugs bunny dosnt fugged The Rabit girl of Space jam? Why Chavez still rule Venezuela?
nothing more....
|
Khan Soriano
Beyond Divinity Inc Terra Incognita.
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 21:37:00 -
[272]
Originally by: Amelia O amarr = wow shamans
/signed
Dude, whats 'wow shaman'? ----- Arbitrator - Life & Death |
Bentula
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 21:48:00 -
[273]
Originally by: Dopefish Paladin gets a hidden cap use bonus for lasers with the reduction in turrets.
Actually its so hidden it doesnt even exist on the same plane of existence as other boni. Cause ccp while cutting the turrets in half also removed the -50% cap need bonus ...
|
Terianna Eri
Amarr STK Scientific Black-Out
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 22:24:00 -
[274]
Suggested fix for Paladin:
-web bonus (!?????) +damage bonus (5%/level) -armor rep amount bonus +resist bonus
Yep, this is what you get when you add an apoc and an abaddon together and then throw in a tracking bonus. It has -50% cap use for lasers (good!) 25% better resists (better than rep amount becuase it increases ability to plate tank and get remote repped, also it's an AMARR bonus, instead of the GALLENTE bonus) 25% better laser damage (better than RoF bonus cause it doesn't increase cap use) 25% more cap (cap is good! run those reps! [would rather have cap recharge bonus but it should inherit something other than the hull from the Apoc]) 37.5% better tracking (about 2x t2 tracking comps with stacking penalty, for free, will make pulse lasers track pretty damn well)
75 mb/s bandwith, 150 m3 drone bay
now THIS is a ship I would fly. Good, but not overpowered. I hope.
To summarize (if you want to quote this post)
NEW PALADIN 7/4/7, fitting the same 4 turrets
Amarr Battleship Skill Bonus: +5% Capacitor Capacity / level +5% bonus to Large Energy Turrets / level Marauders Skill Bonus +5% to all Armor Resists / level +7.5% to Large Energy Turret tracking / level
Role Bonus: 100% Bonus to Large Energy Turret Damage [Some **** about tractor beams that really nobody cares about] __________________________________
|
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 22:37:00 -
[275]
Another classical solution for the apoc is exchange the cap bonus per a 10% armor HP per level.
Then it wouyld be a whole niche. A sturdy not very high damage long life space brick
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
Neon Genesis
The Landed Gentry
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 22:49:00 -
[276]
Originally by: shinsushi
Originally by: Low Blow
Originally by: Arenis Xemdal Whew, good thing game design isn't a democracy.
yes
Hmmm... I wonder. Whats more likely, the vast majority are crazy, or the tiny minority are crazy?
Well it dosn't matter wether you're the minority or majority if you make 10x your share of threads.
_
|
Sarah Moonshine
MEPS Inc.
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 23:03:00 -
[277]
Edited by: Sarah Moonshine on 26/10/2007 23:05:17 I've read so many threads regarding amarr ships it's no longer funny; tach nerfs, nos nerf, dron bay nerf, crappy bonuses, lack of powergrid AND cap. It's no surprive that, when one of the last devblogs came out, amarr ranked last in terms of used ships in ALL CATEGORIES.
Of course, amarr does have some nice ships (namely the abaddon and the armageddon, plus the whole lot of Khanid Mk.2 ships) but even those are blatantly inferior to their Gallente, Minmatar and - even - Caldari counterparts. The Paladin, by the way, only adds to the insult.
Amarr could use some love, indeed, and I gladly present some suggestions:
1 - Give amarr ships powergrid enough to use their weapons;
2 - Give lasers a small boost to their damage; 3% ~ 7% would be enough;
3 - Give pulse better tracking speeds;
4 - Tweak crystals a bit, swaping a bit more of EM for Thermal;
Special "10% bonus to capacitor use" category
5 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% more cap; it won't solve laser problems, but make the whole bunch much more useful (then, you could effectively use other weapon systems and still have some edge on your enemies) and versatile;
6 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% on all resists, which would make amarr nber tankers (even if at expense of their current lame damage-dealing capabilities);
7 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% or even 10% bonus to capacitor use ON ARMOR REPAIRERS (once again, making them the resilient race their supposed to be);
8 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% powergrid bonus, making them actually able to use their big guns, even if not forever;
9 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% bonus to cap recharge rate (durability);
10 - Swap all those "10% bonus to capacitor use" for 5% or even 10% bonus to armor hitpoints (again, durability).
I could come up with a load more of suggestions, but I think these make for a nice starting point.
|
Wayward Hooligan
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 23:04:00 -
[278]
Edited by: Wayward Hooligan on 26/10/2007 23:07:30 I fly Amarr because lasers are cool but I think they could use some work:
My probably worthless suggestions to help out Amarr:
1 - The NOS nerf: Undo the nos nerf and just change the transfer amount to 1/3 the original value. Basically NOS is no longer an IWIN button but it still allows NOS boats Curse/Pilgrim/Bhaalgorn to use NOS to power their tanks/MWD/Neuts and what not.
2 - T1 Ship Lineup: Amarr should have 3 lines of t1 ships imho:
--1.1-- ROF/Optimal boats: +5% ROF per level, +5% optimal per level (Can't be 10% range as uber long range is Caldari) Executioner/Omen/Prophecy/Geddon
--2-- Damage/Armor Resist boats: +5% Damage per level, +5% armor resists per level Punisher/Maller/Harb/Abaddon
--3-- Wierdness boats: Any boat that isn't one of the above goes here Inquisitor/Arbitrator/Apoc
Compared to Gallente Rail/Blaster boats Amarr Laser boats should have 1 less turret hardpoint but laser dps should make up for it.
3 - Laser fix:
Dual Pulse are comparable to Electron Blasters Medium/Heavy/Mega Pulse are comparable to Neutron Blastes
Dual Beam are comparable to the smaller of the size equivalent Railguns Medium/Heavy/Mega Beams are comparable to the larger of the size equivalent Railguns
Tachyons are in a class of their own
Lasers should have: - 20% more cap use per shot than comparable Hyrbid - Higher fittings than any size class comparable weapon(Hyrbid or Projectile)
- Pulse: -- Less DPS inside optimal of comparable Blaster but better DPS outside optimal of comparable Blaster. -- That is, if a blaster does 120 dps out to 5km then the pulse laser should do 110 dps out to whatever. Once a blaster is in first falloff it should do less dps than the equivalent puslse laser.
- Beam: -- More DPS inside optimal than comparable Railgun but shorter optimal than comparable Railgun. -- At say 100km railgun is doing 100 dps, beam should be doing 140 dps.
I don't have exact numbers because I haven't created graphs to figure exactly where things need to be but the idea is lasers should do noticeably more dps than Hyrbids at all ranges other than point blank -vs- blasters.
The cost for this should be higher cap use and higher fitting requirements.
Other stat changes: Remove 10% base EM armor resist for all Gall/Min/Amarr/Caldari ships
Amarr ship design: Larger base capacitor than equivalent ships Faster base cap regen than equivalent ships Lower base shield amount than equivalent ships Slower base shield regen than equivalent ships Higher base armor than equivalent ships Average base hull of equivalent ships
Changes along these lines would allow Amarr laser boats to fill their role as high dps passive armor tankers.
Blah, probably a waste of time to type all that but thats how I see Amarr laser boats.
Low diversity. Low speed. Passive armor tanks. High DPS. Capacitor superiority.
|
Tisanta
Amarr Militaris Industries
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 23:56:00 -
[279]
/Signed
the banana boat sucks Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected]) |
Nyxus
Amarr GALAXIAN
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 00:55:00 -
[280]
Paladin needs:
+5% damage per level +10% Armor amount per level +5% resist per level +10% cap recharge per level
Make it a monster tank boat with huge amounts of armor. You know, distinctly Amarrian.
Nyxus
The Gallente ideals of Freedom, Liberty and Equality will be met by the Amarr realities of Lasers, Armor and Battleships. |
|
LF9000
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 02:08:00 -
[281]
/nuked. I agree yellow megathrons sound cool lol. I love my companion cube. The cake is a lie. The cake is a lie. The cake is a lie. |
Cleron
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 02:35:00 -
[282]
The more i think about the capacitor bonus the less i like it. It would have to be pretty dam high to equal out our cap usage & frankly speaking if it can't do that it's as good as a wasted bonus. 50% Weapon cap reduction bonus works on all our weapons & brings them into line with there Glenty counterparts or at least close enough so that they become viable options.
I just can't see CCP giving us a capacitor bonus that would yield a 16-18 cap a second advantage witch is roughly what we would need to counter laser consumption costs of beam's & tachs. That's like giving the Abbadon double its capacitor or halving its recharge time. So that can go out the window & to be honest i'm really tired of having to lvl up my ship bonus to lvl 5 to see an even playing field so how about this time we get the FULL 50% weapon cap reduction bonus at the very start.
The Webber bonus was actually a nice idea, but they went in the wrong direction. Effectiveness means very little to a player were they are for all intense purposes stuck in a flying brick that can't lure enemy's into the kill zone. On the other hand a 90% Webber with a 20km range would be another matter. We could effectively slow down enemy ships within OUR optimal range.
Tracking bonus was poor. Our "Medium" range weapons would require most of this bonus to simply get up to "scratch" with the other races short range weapons. To effectively compete with ships like the Megathorn we would require something in the order of a 10% bonus. On the other hand our long range weapons have the best tracking of any race so CCP will never allow that.
So over all it's not a total stuff up. They just got some things wrong, again. My revised changes would be something similar to the below. Armor resistance is a nice bonus, but also one that features diminishing returns especially on T-2 boats such as these. I would much rather increase the armor bonus to 20% witch may actually be required for this ship to become competitive with out a damage bonus. I simply have not done the figures on that.
50% Weapon Cap Reduction (Static full bonus up front) 20% Webber range (Per level) 10% Armor (Per level) 7.5% Armor Rep (Per Level)
125Mbit 250m3 Drone bay
or
50% Weapon Cap Reduction (Static full bonus up front) 20% Webber range (Per level) 10% Armor (Per level) 5% Weapon Damage (Per Level)
The Mr Tank approach
50% Weapon Cap Reduction (Static full bonus up front) 5% Armor resistance 10% Armor (Per level) 7.5% Armor Rep (Per Level)
125Mbit 250m3 Drone bay
|
Letifer Deus
A Astroid Belt
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 07:23:00 -
[283]
Edited by: Letifer Deus on 27/10/2007 07:24:33
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer 80dps off the blasters? So what? Thats no biggy, youre still gonna do thermal/kinetic damage and we are still stuck with EM/TH, it evens out. We need a damage boost.
Why would a weapon system have the highest fitting requirements and the highest cap use and not be a good damage dealer? Seems kinda stupid to me...
You're right, the apoc, which isn't supposed to be a damage ship, having higher DPS than a megathron doesn't matter at all because lasers are em/therm damage.
Man I hate you.
Originally by: Nyxus Paladin needs:
+5% damage per level +10% Armor amount per level +5% resist per level +10% cap recharge per level
Make it a monster tank boat with huge amounts of armor. You know, distinctly Amarrian.
Nyxus
The fact that you think those bonuses are even remotely close to in-line with the other marauders is beyond laughable. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!" |
Alyxa Mahan
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 07:36:00 -
[284]
Originally by: Dopefish Paladin gets a hidden cap use bonus for lasers with the reduction in turrets.
No it doesn't Sheesh, you guys grow on trees or what, learn how Amarr ships work!
Originally by: Cleron 50% Weapon Cap Reduction (Static full bonus up front) 20% Webber range (Per level) 10% Armor (Per level) 7.5% Armor Rep (Per Level)
No armor rep bonus, thats Gallente! The racial defense boni are armor resists for Amarr, rep amount for Gallente, shield res or boost for Caldari, and the Minmatar are all over the place, including speed mods. So give the Paladin the usual 5% resists, or screw it.
Originally by: Letifer Deus The fact that you think those bonuses are even remotely close to in-line with the other marauders is beyond laughable.
You think its still not enuff? Remember, its based on the Apocalypse...
|
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 07:37:00 -
[285]
The cornerstones of a good Paladin would be +5% damage and +7.5% tracking. Add two other useful bonuses to the mix, and you get a ship that will be really good. The totally overtanked stuff some people are suggesting here would be just as worthless as the current design. Interactive missioning (and I assume CCP prefers people actually playing their game rather than AFK-grinding) is about as much gank as possible and as little tank as you can get away with, so an ubertank really is not needed for professional PvE. And for PvP, who would use a 500+ mil ship as damage soaker? I know I would not at least... Might as well get a capital and soak a lot more in that case.
There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Letifer Deus
A Astroid Belt
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 07:50:00 -
[286]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar The cornerstones of a good Paladin would be +5% damage and +7.5% tracking. Add two other useful bonuses to the mix, and you get a ship that will be really good. The totally overtanked stuff some people are suggesting here would be just as worthless as the current design. Interactive missioning (and I assume CCP prefers people actually playing their game rather than AFK-grinding) is about as much gank as possible and as little tank as you can get away with, so an ubertank really is not needed for professional PvE. And for PvP, who would use a 500+ mil ship as damage soaker? I know I would not at least... Might as well get a capital and soak a lot more in that case.
NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Right, right, right, there's no use for an uber tanker marauder (you know, they will be 225-250 mil after initial price gouging drops, not 500) because you could simply use a capital. It's not like the skills alone for a cap ship cost more than a few marauders will, or that the ships themselves dont cost many times more. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!" |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 07:58:00 -
[287]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 27/10/2007 08:02:25
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Originally by: Leandro Salazar The cornerstones of a good Paladin would be +5% damage and +7.5% tracking. Add two other useful bonuses to the mix, and you get a ship that will be really good. The totally overtanked stuff some people are suggesting here would be just as worthless as the current design. Interactive missioning (and I assume CCP prefers people actually playing their game rather than AFK-grinding) is about as much gank as possible and as little tank as you can get away with, so an ubertank really is not needed for professional PvE. And for PvP, who would use a 500+ mil ship as damage soaker? I know I would not at least... Might as well get a capital and soak a lot more in that case.
NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Right, right, right, there's no use for an uber tanker marauder (you know, they will be 225-250 mil after initial price gouging drops, not 500) because you could simply use a capital. It's not like the skills alone for a cap ship cost more than a few marauders will, or that the ships themselves dont cost many times more.
I don't know about that price. Judging by HAC prices which still are like 10 times T1 cruiser, I would say your estimate is way low. That is just guessing though. But I DO know that it needs to do the same damage as an Abaddon to be competitive. By your logic, the Abaddon needs a nerf as well then or what? And where are your threads complaining about the wtfpwnoverpowered Kronos? (And no, I don't think the Kronos is overpowered, it is what ALL Marauders should be, but extending your arguments it must be terribly unbalanced to you...)
There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Letifer Deus
A Astroid Belt
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:08:00 -
[288]
Edited by: Letifer Deus on 27/10/2007 08:12:33
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't know about that price. Judging by HAC prices which still are like 10 times T1 cruiser, I would say your estimate is way low. That is just guessing though. But I DO know that it needs to do the same damage as an Abaddon to be competitive. By your logic, the Abaddon need a nerf as well then or what? And where are your threads complaining about the wtfpwnoverpowered Kronos?
Meh, you're right, I retract my statement on cost. They'll probably be right around 500, like you said (I'm tired as ****, i hardly even know what's going on right now).
for what possible reason does it need to do as much damage as an abaddon? It's a tanker, not a ganker. And no, the abbadon doesn't need a nerf, it is supposed to be a pimp damage ship. Besides, it has insane cap usage which definitely balances things out.
How is the kronos overpowered? It's not much more than a very expensive hyperion with less HP, better fitting and a megathron's slot layout. I really wish people would spend less time whining about gallente and more time either A) flying gallente or B) learning to beat gallente. Heck, I know for a fact that I could beat my own blaster kronos with a pulse abbadon. In fact, I bet I could beat my blaster kronos with a pulse paladin (if I could use MP2s, as is i just have large engy 5 and amarr bs 5).
If you want to meet up on sisi, I'd be more than happy to help you find some good abbadon or paladin setups. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!" |
Arshes Nei
Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:09:00 -
[289]
Edited by: Arshes Nei on 27/10/2007 08:11:21
Originally by: Letifer Deus Edited by: Letifer Deus on 27/10/2007 07:59:08 NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
No ofc not. Let me rephrase that: The Paladin DOES NOT have a reason to do the same turret damage as a abaddon. If you you want to do more damage than your racial tier 3 fly the kronos.
P.S. Comparing t1 BS to t2 BS ftl. Especially if you use the t1 BS of the only race that gets a damageboost with their t2.
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:10:00 -
[290]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 27/10/2007 08:12:59
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Where do you get a 5% difference from? If the Paladin had a 5%/level turret bonus it would be equivalent to an Abaddon for damage and that is nearly 15% less than a Megathron (assuming T2 Pulse/Neutron and max damage T1 ammo). And note here I am comparing a tier-3 battleship (Abbadon) to a tier-2 battleship (Megathron).
Quote: Right, right, right, there's no use for an uber tanker marauder (you know, they will be 225-250 mil after initial price gouging drops, not 500) because you could simply use a capital. It's not like the skills alone for a cap ship cost more than a few marauders will, or that the ships themselves dont cost many times more.
These are T2 ships so they need to be invented. I guarantee you the cost will be WAY more than 250 mil. And how do you see the Paladin as an uber tanker? Frankly it tank doesn't sound particularly special at all and certainly no better than any other Marauder. As mentioned if you want a damage sink you will not be using the Paladin for it.
|
|
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:19:00 -
[291]
Originally by: Letifer Deus
for what possible reason does it need to do as much damage as an abaddon? It's a tanker, not a ganker. And no, the abbadon doesn't need a nerf, it is supposed to be a pimp damage ship. Besides, it has insane cap usage which definitely balances things out.
How is the kronos overpowered? It's not much more than a very expensive hyperion with less HP, better fitting and a megathron's slot layout. I really wish people would spend less time whining about gallente and more time either A) flying gallente or B) learning to beat gallente. Heck, I know for a fact that I could beat my own blaster kronos with a pulse abbadon. In fact, I bet I could beat my blaster kronos with a pulse paladin (if I could use MP2s, as is i just have large engy 5 and amarr bs 5).
If you want to meet up on sisi, I'd be more than happy to help you find some good abbadon or paladin setups.
It needs a damage bonus simply because otherwise there will be little reason to use it at all in missions, which despite a lot of bla bla is at least 50% of the purpose of these ships. If they do not do at least the same damage as T1 ships, why bother with them? Tankboats are redundant in todays missioning environment, unless you AFK your missions which is not a game style I like to promote. It is all about the ganktank. Kill them so fast that they can't do enough damage to you.
And like I said, the Kronos is not at all overpowered, but the other Marauders are underpowered and the Paladin is the worst of them. At least in PvE. And while normally ships in EVE are balanced for PvP, for these boats I consider balance in PvE just as if not more important. And due to NPC resists, you cannot 'just get a Kronos' if you run for example Amarr agents.
There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Letifer Deus
A Astroid Belt
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:23:00 -
[292]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Where do you get a 5% difference from? If the Paladin had a 5%/level turret bonus it would be equivalent to an Abaddon for damage and that is nearly 15% less than a Megathron (assuming T2 Pulse/Neutron and max damage T1 ammo). And note here I am comparing a tier-3 battleship (Abbadon) to a tier-2 battleship (Megathron).
Abbadon : 926.4 turret dps mega: 963 turret dps
I said turret, not total. and if the abbadon didn't suck up cap so dang fast, this difference would be highly in the abbadon's favor.
TRY telling me that this isn't more than fair dps differences considering neuts have 4.5km opti (w/navy AM) and MPs have 15km opti. (navy MS), and if they really want to, 45km optimal with scorch.
Or maybe you would like to compare beams/tachs and 425s?
And let us not forget, as much as you and I want them to be geared for pvp, these ships are technically for mission running. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!" |
Letifer Deus
A Astroid Belt
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:26:00 -
[293]
Edited by: Letifer Deus on 27/10/2007 08:26:56
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
It needs a damage bonus simply because otherwise there will be little reason to use it at all in missions, which despite a lot of bla bla is at least 50% of the purpose of these ships. If they do not do at least the same damage as T1 ships, why bother with them?
It does more damage than the T1 amarr BS because it A) tanks better and B) can fit top guns and a tank at the same time much more easily. I guarantee you if it wasn't 4:25 am and I wasn't drunk, and I didn't have to get up in the morning and drink heavily for the football game, I'd go on SiSi and whip up a kickass paladin.
LD out. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!" |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:34:00 -
[294]
Originally by: Letifer Deus Edited by: Letifer Deus on 27/10/2007 08:26:56
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
It needs a damage bonus simply because otherwise there will be little reason to use it at all in missions, which despite a lot of bla bla is at least 50% of the purpose of these ships. If they do not do at least the same damage as T1 ships, why bother with them?
It does more damage than the T1 amarr BS because it A) tanks better and B) can fit top guns and a tank at the same time much more easily. I guarantee you if it wasn't 4:25 am and I wasn't drunk, and I didn't have to get up in the morning and drink heavily for the football game, I'd go on SiSi and whip up a kickass paladin.
LD out.
My mission Abaddon can already fit 3 Tachs and 5 Megabeams (All Officer so high fitting reqs) and 3 HS, and tanks the appropriate missions fine. The Paladin can probably fit the equivalent of 8 Tachs, but 5% more damage on 5/8 guns does not come close to offsetting the lack of a damage bonus. And what kind of liquor makes you think being able to tank better increases damage? It is actually the other way around, more damage makes you tank better
There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 08:46:00 -
[295]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 27/10/2007 08:47:43
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Where do you get a 5% difference from? If the Paladin had a 5%/level turret bonus it would be equivalent to an Abaddon for damage and that is nearly 15% less than a Megathron (assuming T2 Pulse/Neutron and max damage T1 ammo). And note here I am comparing a tier-3 battleship (Abbadon) to a tier-2 battleship (Megathron).
Abbadon : 926.4 turret dps mega: 963 turret dps
I said turret, not total. and if the abbadon didn't suck up cap so dang fast, this difference would be highly in the abbadon's favor.
TRY telling me that this isn't more than fair dps differences considering neuts have 4.5km opti (w/navy AM) and MPs have 15km opti. (navy MS), and if they really want to, 45km optimal with scorch.
Or maybe you would like to compare beams/tachs and 425s?
And let us not forget, as much as you and I want them to be geared for pvp, these ships are technically for mission running.
Erm....How about you compare the Abaddon to the Hyperion. Both tier-3 Battleships. If you want to compare Megathron DPS then do it to the Apoc. Actually I'll do it for you (no fitting except T2 pulse/neuts, highest damage T1 ammo, perfect skills):
Apoc: 386 DPS Mega: 492 DPS 21.5% difference in favor of the Mega
Abaddon: 482 Hyperion: 562 14.3% difference in favor of the Hyperion
Add in drones and it gets even worse for the Amarr ships.
|
Shevar
Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 09:31:00 -
[296]
Edited by: Shevar on 27/10/2007 09:32:47
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 27/10/2007 08:47:43
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Where do you get a 5% difference from? If the Paladin had a 5%/level turret bonus it would be equivalent to an Abaddon for damage and that is nearly 15% less than a Megathron (assuming T2 Pulse/Neutron and max damage T1 ammo). And note here I am comparing a tier-3 battleship (Abbadon) to a tier-2 battleship (Megathron).
Abbadon : 926.4 turret dps mega: 963 turret dps
I said turret, not total. and if the abbadon didn't suck up cap so dang fast, this difference would be highly in the abbadon's favor.
TRY telling me that this isn't more than fair dps differences considering neuts have 4.5km opti (w/navy AM) and MPs have 15km opti. (navy MS), and if they really want to, 45km optimal with scorch.
Or maybe you would like to compare beams/tachs and 425s?
And let us not forget, as much as you and I want them to be geared for pvp, these ships are technically for mission running.
Compare the hyp to the abbadon or the megathron to the apoc please.
Also you didn't mention the fact that the mega almost has double the tracking of the abbadon so if it's a 4km vs 4km (which it will be due to the faster speed of the mega) the tracking of the abba would be considerably worse. Nor did you mention the fact that the abba uses 57 cap/s vs the mega's 22 cap/s for just it's guns.
Fyi the hyp with a full rack of neutrons and 4 mag stabs does 1131 DPS vs the abba's 929. ---
-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs |
Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Uninvited Guests
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 09:43:00 -
[297]
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Or maybe you would like to compare beams/tachs and 425s?
Yes compare their ranges please.
|
Alyxa Mahan
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 09:50:00 -
[298]
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Why not? The Megathron/Kronos still has a sizable advantage in drones.
And if you really want to talk about longrange guns and tanking... fitting four tachyons the Paladin has 2025mw left, after four 425mm the Kronos has 4500mw left over, who do you think will end up with the better tank?
|
Lyria Skydancer
Amarr Uninvited Guests
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 09:52:00 -
[299]
Originally by: Alyxa Mahan
Originally by: Letifer Deus NO, the paladin doesn't need a friggin damage bonus. It does not, repeat, DOES NOT have any reason to do 95% of the turret damage a blasterthron does at 6km at 15km.
Why not? The Megathron/Kronos still has a sizable advantage in drones.
And if you really want to talk about longrange guns and tanking... fitting four tachyons the Paladin has 2025mw left, after four 425mm the Kronos has 4500mw left over, who do you think will end up with the better tank?
Gallente: "W00t, we have to fit our ships before we compare their stats?!"
|
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 10:26:00 -
[300]
Someone that think the Apoc or paladin is OK must be the dumbest and blindest, more biased human being that ever existed!
The apoc cannot even fit heavy guns and a 2 lar tank (to make use of its cap bonus).
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 [10] 11 12 13 .. 13 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |