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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
534
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Posted - 2012.01.26 08:45:00 -
[31] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote:Ris Dnalor wrote:I can only guess that CCP is "simplifying" things in order to attract more folks. That would be affirmative. The WOW-ification of EVE has been underway for a while. You can even buy Mounts, er ..I mean goggles and space pants in the NeX.
CCP trolled us with this some time ago...
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
4547
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Posted - 2012.01.26 08:51:00 -
[32] - Quote
Ris Dnalor wrote:I can only guess that CCP is "simplifying" things in order to attract more folks. If that's your only guess, you really should try harder.
New folks won't have any idea about what the names are regardless, so simplifying them won't attract anyone. Isn't it far more likely that they simplified the names toGǪ you knowGǪ simplify the names? It has a value in and of itself, after all. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |
EnslaverOfMinmatar
Viziam Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2012.01.26 09:08:00 -
[33] - Quote
Ris Dnalor wrote: Caldari Long Range ECM battleship I Minmatar sacrificial tackling frigate II ORE Ice Mining Vessell II - Mackinaw Nomad -- Minmatar Freighter I
Minmatar Tier 3 Tackling Battlecruiser Gallente Nanofiber Shield-Tanking Carrier I Amarr Navy Asteroid-Obliterating Battleship Guristas Reinforced Armor Battleship Chelm's Titan Every EVE player must read this http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=29-01-07 or uninstall and DIAF |
Vera Algaert
Republic University Minmatar Republic
5
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Posted - 2012.01.26 09:09:00 -
[34] - Quote
there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.
then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.
One type adds to the game, the other doesn't. |
Danfen Fenix
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.01.26 09:23:00 -
[35] - Quote
As a new player (just gone 30 days) I have to say thank god Been loving the game so far, definatly something I'm sticking with, but my one gripe so far has been the fact that, with all of the named loot etc I get, the amount of times I have to go to show info to see exactly what said loot is, in quite annoying tbh (as a new player at least )
Sure its only a few extra clicks, and you can learn all the modules 'eventually', but at the beggining, multiplying those 'few extra clicks' even for around 20 items gained from one mission (to see if its worth selling or keeping) can be tedious, especially when I want to be getting back out in to space. Course, i could always let them build up, but thats just making a painful experience longer
*Edit, course, I also believe unique names are important to roleplay, but does it really affect the game that much to have a word or two in said name describing what said item is? If anything it makes more sense in a naming scheme way. |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
661
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Posted - 2012.01.26 09:42:00 -
[36] - Quote
The only thing that's dumb are the flaming pedants that want complexity for complexity's sake.
Mr Epeen Me too!-á I ate one sour, too! |
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CCP Lemur
174
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Posted - 2012.01.26 09:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
Vera Algaert wrote:there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.
then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.
One type adds to the game, the other doesn't.
This fine lady hits the point home. Yes, people love the old names and we all got accustomed to them since back in the days. But I like the new system way better since I don't have to go through dozens of clicks and comparisons to find the thing I want. So no meaningful complexity at all is lost only a naming scheme that was based on randomness alone.
QA Guy | Special Ops Picture up to your IMGination. |
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Vera Algaert
Republic University Minmatar Republic
5
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:02:00 -
[38] - Quote
CCP Lemur wrote:Vera Algaert wrote:there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.
then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.
One type adds to the game, the other doesn't. This fine lady hits the point home. Yes, people love the old names and we all got accustomed to them since back in the days. But I like the new system way better since I don't have to go through dozens of clicks and comparisons to find the thing I want. So no meaningful complexity at all is lost only a naming scheme that was based on randomness alone. now please resolve the "prototype" issue
("prototype" indicates meta3 for projectiles but meta4 for hybrids and propulsion mods) |
March rabbit
Ganse Shadow of xXDEATHXx
118
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:08:00 -
[39] - Quote
Alaric Faelen wrote:I can take or leave the overly complicated names. Pretty much everything in Eve comes with this little blue button or a right click and hit 'Show Info' and viola...no real confusion. Most people only memorize the meta 4 modules they use instead of T2. I don't actually care what the names are- it's just something to remember later, and again, comes with a Show Info option......
That said, having actual names for things is more interesting than the bland designations of RL military equipment. Because I have at my fingertips this god-like ability to open a box who's sole purpose is to explain in great detail everything relevant about any given item/ship/module in the game- I really didn't need the dumbing down of item names either.
well. try to buy fit somewhere in a little market. Let's say you need capacitor booster and there is no T1 or T2 ones around. What will you do? Yes: select t1 and see "variations" page to find other names....
Is it really what you need to do to feel better? Personally i've never seen any reasons for those cryptic names. |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
379
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:17:00 -
[40] - Quote
CCP Lemur wrote:Vera Algaert wrote:there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.
then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.
One type adds to the game, the other doesn't. This fine lady hits the point home. Yes, people love the old names and we all got accustomed to them since back in the days. But I like the new system way better since I don't have to go through dozens of clicks and comparisons to find the thing I want. So no meaningful complexity at all is lost only a naming scheme that was based on randomness alone.
Except now you can't find the missile type you want without sorting through another dozen missile types you don't want.
Mjolnir Rocket is insufficient because it doesn't show the t2 variants because the naming scheme doesn't match.
And still, Trauma is an awful name, and Nova is just... ya.
Nova means "new". It doesn't mean anything to do with thermic reactions. "Supernova" has to do with the birth of a star.
"Nova Torpedo" means "New Torpedo".
The names are stupid. Seriously, straight out. Change them again to something that isn't useless.
Also, there is no reason that "Guided Missiles" and "unguided missiles" should share the same names anyways. They're very different. This whole "I want EM missiles to share the same name" needs to have been handled a different way.
Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
538
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:25:00 -
[41] - Quote
The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.
Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.
(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.) |
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Ciar Meara
Virtus Vindice
507
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:45:00 -
[42] - Quote
OP: If you think the game got easier because somebody changed the name of a module you are not playing EVE. - [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow] |
DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
854
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:47:00 -
[43] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.) Quizzes are fun! EVE needs more mandatory quizzes! |
Kata Amentis
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
25
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:52:00 -
[44] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote: We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.
maybe not for a undock quiz.... but put that kind of thing on a trivia game in the WiS "pub" establishment and you've got a fun game that's better than the ship spinning counter! ... might want to add to the categories though, just corp logos would get boring after a while |
Cryten Jones
Advantage Inc The Matari Consortium
46
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:52:00 -
[45] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.
Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.
(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)
Don't disagree with you but would rather that the little things that make this a believable world to live in don't all get removed in favor of easy to understand names.
The old names had a 'product feel' about them
-CJ
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Vera Algaert
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2012.01.26 10:56:00 -
[46] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote: (We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)
http://phase.org/Eve/ShipQuiz/
one of my first CEOs actually made us practice with this
(his idea was a sound one - you have to know the different ships/shiptypes to be a good scout; but memorizing that "the chimera is a caldari carrier" when you have never seen a chimera and have no idea what a carrier is supposed to do in EVE was a little stupid^^) |
Fix Lag
250
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Posted - 2012.01.26 11:04:00 -
[47] - Quote
Instead of giving everything a generic and terrible name, you could've renamed it slightly to something like "1 MN Inferior Catalyzed Cold Gas Arcjet Thrusters" and "1 MN Superior Catalyzed Cold Gas Arcjet Thrusters" and people would be able to figure out the damn difference without being treated like idiots. Or you could've put in the description something that made the superior one sound better so people would take the hint. But no. You chose the literal dumb route and made things for stupid people.
I have some bad news for you, Greyscale. Eve doesn't tolerate stupid people, and renaming modules isn't gonna help said morons. I don't know why I'm telling you this because you work on a game whose learning curve made it famous, but then again, you guys thought the NeX store was brilliant too. vOv some people, you just can't reach. |
Disdaine
211
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Posted - 2012.01.26 11:21:00 -
[48] - Quote
Is not simple enuff.
I suggest followink meta level naming convention :
1mn Afterburner 1mn Better Afterburner 1mn More Betterer Afterburner 1mn Bestest Afterburner
Der will be no confusion anymore.
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Niko Takahashi
United Starbase Systems
28
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Posted - 2012.01.26 11:55:00 -
[49] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:CCP Lemur wrote:Vera Algaert wrote:there is complexity that revolves around decisions and trade-offs.
then there is complexity that revolves around memorizing random stuff.
One type adds to the game, the other doesn't. This fine lady hits the point home. Yes, people love the old names and we all got accustomed to them since back in the days. But I like the new system way better since I don't have to go through dozens of clicks and comparisons to find the thing I want. So no meaningful complexity at all is lost only a naming scheme that was based on randomness alone. Except now you can't find the missile type you want without sorting through another dozen missile types you don't want. Mjolnir Rocket is insufficient because it doesn't show the t2 variants because the naming scheme doesn't match. And still, Trauma is an awful name, and Nova is just... ya. Nova means "new". It doesn't mean anything to do with thermic reactions. "Supernova" has to do with the birth of a star. "Nova Torpedo" means "New Torpedo". The names are stupid. Seriously, straight out. Change them again to something that isn't useless. Also, there is no reason that "Guided Missiles" and "unguided missiles" should share the same names anyways. They're very different. This whole "I want EM missiles to share the same name" needs to have been handled a different way.
Wow a voice of reason in the forums pretty much what ther person said. Naming conventions should be adjusted I agree with CCP on that but could have been done better |
DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
856
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Posted - 2012.01.26 11:59:00 -
[50] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote: "Nova Torpedo" means "New Torpedo".
The names are stupid. Seriously, straight out. Change them again to something that isn't useless.
A 'nova' is also a cataclysmic nuclear explosion in a star. Not to be confused with supernova, which is just a much, much, much more powerful variety.
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Lilly Shiroimozu
SyNgeN-Z
2
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:02:00 -
[51] - Quote
I think this could have been handled better by keeping the flavor text in the titles but adding the damage type somewhere within it so they were easily distinguishable/searchable.
I.E. Thorn kinetic rockets I, Flamebusrt thermal rockets I etc.
P.S. trauma is a horrible name.
As for the AB/MWD I miss the flavor titles, and the same thing could have been applied having a quality descriptor added to the flavor titles so they are easy to distinguish/search but retain their charm. (also the new names pretty much make no sense as I cant determine if limited, prototype or experimental is supposed to be the top tier in either category)
It would be better to have something like stabalized Improved accelerated optimized as the quality descriptors and add them tot he flavor titles so you stilll have the flavor, but you have a common quality word to seach for and remember.
I.E 1MN Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Optimized Thrusters etc,..
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Ravcharas
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
78
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:04:00 -
[52] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.
Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.
(We could add a window that doesn't let you undock until you can identify the NPC corp a random logo belongs to, and people could spend a lot of time learning all the logos, and become "really good" at "the undock quiz", but it would still be a terrible mechanic.)
"Quad LiF Fueled Booster Rockets" are now known as "Prototype 100MN MicroWarpdrive I "Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters" are now known as "Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I" "Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon Microwarpdrive" are now known as "Experimental 10MN MicroWarpdrive I"
These are the meta mwd modules you usually go with. The prefix is different for all three sizes and are in no way aptly named. Limited sounds like something you'd rather not use, gotta be a downside with one of those.
How is this a simplification? You've traded one set of obfuscating names for another, confusing old players without helping new players one iota. |
Something Random
The Barrow Boys
120
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:22:00 -
[53] - Quote
Alara IonStorm wrote:Roosterton wrote: LET'S MAKE A FORUM THREAD ABOUT THIS!
No the five people who care won't be able to convince CCP like that. THEY SHOULD MAKE FIFTEEN EACH AND EACH ONE AFTER THE OTHER NEEDS TO BE FARTHER AWAY FROM REALITY THEN THE LAST!Missiles have been renamed EVE is Dead.
OK - were getting a consensus going here....
Lets make threads people!!! THIS is SERIOUS BUSINESS!!!!!
"caught on fire a little bit, just a little." "Delinquents, check, weirdos, check, hippies, check, pillheads, check, freaks, check, potheads, check .....gangsn++ all here!" |
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
269
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:26:00 -
[54] - Quote
Ravcharas wrote:
How is this a simplification? You've traded one set of obfuscating names for another, confusing old players without helping new players one iota.
It is a simplification once you consider that all meta items in the game will be renamed in this way. I.e. all meta 4 items will be "prototype" ones.
Personally I support thses changes, for reasons given by Greyscale. Complexity is good, but only if it enhances gameplay. One point though Greyscale, if you are still monitoring this thread, is that once again CCP fails at communication. The player reaction to this change - given that people are heavily invested in the game for years - should have been pretty predictable. Yet you just do it, without prior communication.
But since you are planning to do this change all across the board, I strongly advise you to train player commiunication to level 5. Come on mate, you dont want to leave an essential support skill like that at level 2. |
Siigari Kitawa
Push Industries Push Interstellar Network
107
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:37:00 -
[55] - Quote
DUMBING DOWN EVE IS NOT THE ANSWER TO YOUR PROBLEMS CCP (whatever problems they may be.) Need stuff moved? Push Industries will handle it. Servicing highsec and lowsec - and we do it faster and more reliably than anyone else. Ingame channel: PUSHX |
Revajin
15 Minute Outliers Chained Reactions
30
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:52:00 -
[56] - Quote
Are you guys seriously crying now because of the name change? You people will ***** about anything. The game hasn't changed because Catalyzed Cold Gas Arc-Jet Thrusters are now called what...Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive?
Wait a second. Holy **** that's way easier to understand. Now I know its a microwarpdrive, I know a general power comparison to other microwarpdrives, and I know by the fluff adjective that it is slightly different than the typical module. But no, you guys are right, having a new player learn what a Catalyzed Cold Gas Arc-Jet Thruster is definitely seems more important. |
Imuran
Zentor Industries
9
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:57:00 -
[57] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:The less time you have to spend fighting the game, the more time you have left over to play it. Any simplification which increases the amount of time players can be interacting with each other, while keeping the interaction sufficiently interesting, is a good simplification.
Or, put another way, how good a player you are should be defined by how good your decisions are, not by how many tasks and lists you've memorized.
So the Science and Industry dialogs are high on your list for streamlining? or is it the view that industrialists dont need to interact with other players? |
Solstice Project
Cult of Personality
1280
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Posted - 2012.01.26 12:58:00 -
[58] - Quote
Making stuff sound less interesting sure in hell will attract people... *rollseyes*
Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire |
Dr Sodius
State War Academy Caldari State
19
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Posted - 2012.01.26 13:03:00 -
[59] - Quote
this thread....not sure if serious..... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
4555
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Posted - 2012.01.26 13:04:00 -
[60] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:Making stuff sound less interesting sure in hell will attract people... *rollseyes* It certainly won't drive them away.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |
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