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Sola Sun
Jita Trade Services
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:09:00 -
[1]
Cloaking deivces, prototype, and T2:
[1] It would be great, if they can only be activated when ship speed is exactly 0.0 m/s, and disallow ship movement, while cloaking is active (except for stealth bombers).
[2] Scan probes should have 5-10% of base chance to find cloaked ships in same grid, so ship can not be cloaked in sight of enemy and have a chance to remain intact just because no-one remember where it was.
This will still allow 'offensive' use of cloaks on PvP ships in ambush/camps (like cloaked dictor near gate waiting for those annoying noob-corp scouts to pass), but will cut "safespot+cloak" iskfarmers and "mwd+cloak" wannabe covert-ops.
Cloaking - for covert ops / recon ships, not for ravens!
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Endica Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.10.30 18:33:00 -
[2]
Maybe a % CPU, Powergrid or Capacitor reduction like on MWDs would do the trick.
Losing, for example, 25% PG on a Raven would hurt.
_________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well - |
bulabuba
Gallente Klima Galactic
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Posted - 2007.10.30 19:02:00 -
[3]
Edited by: bulabuba on 30/10/2007 19:03:16 Cloaks work just fine, and as intended, as is. They are a way to evade/avoid an enemy. You have to sacrifice some offensive power (a high slot) to fit one. You're arguing for being able to gate camp or belt pirate without any effective counter. Nice if you're a gate camper or belt pirate, I suppose, but not everyone is.
MWD+Cloak is the only counter to the ubiquitous bubble camp that a blockade runner has, and even that isn't so effective against a camp who knows what they're doing, especially one with a 'dictor. If the campers are clueless, the 'runner deserves to skate by. If you make a blockade runner basically a sitting duck to any bubble camp, mind exlaining to me how it's worthy of being called a "blockade runner"?
The "nerf anything that keeps me from having the definitiive upper-hand" whining is really, really getting out of hand. Rev. 3 has already got to be the nerf heaviest patch in the history of the game if everything that is on the boards actually makes it to tranquility. Enough already. Leave cloaks alone. -----------------------------------------------
Are GoonSwarm ever going to be allowed to build up in any way in 0.0 space again? No.
-DB Preacher[BoB] |
Sola Sun
Jita Trade Services
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Posted - 2007.10.30 21:02:00 -
[4]
Were cloaks meant to be "obligatory" on carebear battleships? So, at first sight of local increase it can warp+cloak? And continue to inflate ISK mass, when left alone, with no real risk of loosing a ship?
Were they meant for suckers, without covops training, to pass camps on 7km+ capable inties, just by using mwd+cloak? What about "true" covert ops, looks like they are obsolete, every monkey now can do this?
Blockade runners? Several people with needed skills and setup spending their time in true PVP manner - NOT ALLOWING other players to complete their goals. So, you want to go all alone and survive, just because ship class is called "blockade runner"?
Cloaking is WAY overused on carebear ships, to break "risk-vs-reward" principles. Ability to instacloak while retaining speed for some time is too good for non-covert ships.
Making non-covert cloaks work "in cyno manner" can balance this. If some carebear wants to travel with less risk, it should use a real covops ship.
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Nixxxs
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Posted - 2007.10.30 21:09:00 -
[5]
I agree, No cloaks on any ship other than cov opts. I can say this because I fly a bomber and Helios and have earned those entire skill trees god it took two months to fly a frigate and 9 months to rock at it.
Wanabe afk cloakers are the problem, nobody complains about us because we know what we are doing and you rarely see us.
Cloaking V...IIEEE... Covert Ops V.... AGGGG -pulls Hair out- Frigate V OOZZ..Zz.zz.zzà Electronics V Onzzz.zzzàz Electronics Upgrades Và.Sonz Sonzzà I could keep going but you get the pointà.we are highly specilized
We earned the right to use these over newbs with electronics V
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bulabuba
Gallente Klima Galactic
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Posted - 2007.10.30 21:51:00 -
[6]
Edited by: bulabuba on 30/10/2007 21:53:01
Originally by: Sola Sun Were cloaks meant to be "obligatory" on carebear battleships? So, at first sight of local increase it can warp+cloak? And continue to inflate ISK mass, when left alone, with no real risk of loosing a ship?
What game are you playing? In the eve I'm playing, the general trend of the prices of things is DOWN. Sorry, but ebil farmers creating hyperinflation doesn't help your argument. At least not in this game.
I feel your pain. You want those Ravens with a PvE setup that don't have a chance in hell of holding their own PvP to be a nice soft target for your mad PvP skillz. I guess you'll have to excuse them if they don't agree. How about you go try to kill someone who is set up to kill you back?
Quote: Were they meant for suckers, without covops training, to pass camps on 7km+ capable inties, just by using mwd+cloak? What about "true" covert ops, looks like they are obsolete, every monkey now can do this?
Do you even fly a cov-ops? I do. I fly a blockade runner too. They aren't even remotely used for the same thing. I have no idea how anyone with much of a clue would think that one would obsolete the other. I hate to break it to you, but if "suckers" can consistantly pass your uber inty gate camp in non cov-ops ships using just mwd+cloak, you suck. Should they have a non-zero chance of making it? Sure. A gate camp shouldn't be an automatic "I win".
Quote: Blockade runners? Several people with needed skills and setup spending their time in true PVP manner - NOT ALLOWING other players to complete their goals. So, you want to go all alone and survive, just because ship class is called "blockade runner"?
Yeah, I do. That's why it's called a "blockade runner". Its for, you know, running blockades. If I can or want to go with an escort any old transport will do. Should I always get through? No. Should I have no chance? No. I have passed many a noobish gate camp with a 'runner. I have also been killed by highly skilled players in one with the right ships and tactics too. It's called fun. You should try it.
Quote: Cloaking is WAY overused on carebear ships, to break "risk-vs-reward" principles. Ability to instacloak while retaining speed for some time is too good for non-covert ships.
Choke point gate-camping is WAY overused by lazy, noobish piwats to break the "risk-vs-reward" principal. Player detonatable haulers full of bombs should be allowed in the game that destroy everything within a 50KM blast radius. You sure you want to play the name calling game when it comes to the play styles of others?
Quote: Making non-covert cloaks work "in cyno manner" can balance this. If some carebear wants to travel with less risk, it should use a real covops ship.
If some wannabe piwat wants to stop mwd+cloak at a gate camp he should find some folks who know how and learn2play instead of crying for a nerf. How bout we stop with the insults and just play the damn game? -----------------------------------------------
Are GoonSwarm ever going to be allowed to build up in any way in 0.0 space again? No.
-DB Preacher[BoB] |
VJ Maverick
Caldari Maverick Specialized Services
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Posted - 2007.10.30 23:38:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Sola Sun Were cloaks meant to be "obligatory" on carebear battleships? So, at first sight of local increase it can warp+cloak?
Nerf Local! Leave cloaks alone.
Originally by: Bodhisattvas
by the way you keep on missing the "a" from pwn, do you need any help with its pl |
Lagar
Caldari Core Domination
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Posted - 2007.10.30 23:50:00 -
[8]
Cloak is an exelent escape tool if you can handle it correctly however it's an extreamly poor hit and run (ruling out the stealthbombers ofcorse) beceause their drawbacks means that those ships can be easly killed when detected.. there doesn't need for a long range detector.. YET..
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bulabuba
Gallente Klima Galactic
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Posted - 2007.10.31 00:25:00 -
[9]
Originally by: VJ Maverick
Nerf Local! Leave cloaks alone.
Win. Local should be like every other channel where you don't appear until you talk. It shouldn't be a free system-wide scanner. -----------------------------------------------
Are GoonSwarm ever going to be allowed to build up in any way in 0.0 space again? No.
-DB Preacher[BoB] |
ViolenTUK
Gallente Vindicated Exiles 101010 Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.31 11:34:00 -
[10]
Cloaking devices are fine as they are. They dont need any nerfing at all they are nerfed enough anyway.
If a ship that has a cloaking device and sees someone in local and they want to warp off then that is fine thats the WHOLE point of a cloaking device. You arent supposed to be detected. If anything this leads to the point that there shouldnt be a local channel at all. If there was no local you could probe ships whilst ratting and then warp to them. As soon as you have engaged then they cant cloak so thats your problem.
www.eve-players.com |
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Do Or Die And Live Or Try
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Posted - 2007.10.31 12:15:00 -
[11]
Yep. Cloaks are fine, only local is wrong. It should be changed to constalation wide, so it does tell who is there or not, just not in system. As the op says, when local increases, the ratters just warp and cloaks. What he forgets to mention, is he uses local to save time. Only in the systems with more then him will be scanned, if he had to scan every single belt in every single system he was in, he would be bored to tears.
Another solution could be to up the rats so they do more damage. At present, i can quite easily rat with a Maller in 0.0 against multiple BS's (well, been a while, but I think its still possible).
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