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Kuga
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Posted - 2004.03.05 15:38:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Kuga on 05/03/2004 15:39:01 Hello there, when Castor has been introduced, my agents were rewarding me with tons of T2 components. Nearly every mission I got some, even though I got a lot of shuttles and useless items, too. After the next (mini)patch, there were clearly less T2 components awarded, still I got some. After the wednesday (03/03/2004) patch, I am just receiving money as bonus rewards. No shuttles, no items, and no more T2 components. Anyone else experienced this?
until they pry our dead hand off the keyboard |
Tano
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Posted - 2004.03.05 16:18:00 -
[2]
I've done a few missions for Eifyr and had T2 stuff today. May be a corp specific problem or you are temporarily unlucky.
I agree the drop rate has fallen enormously.
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Threat
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Posted - 2004.03.05 16:57:00 -
[3]
I agree, I only get isk now. My agent's corp allegedly supplys virtually every item.
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Aldelphius
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Posted - 2004.03.05 18:19:00 -
[4]
Its just random, I was given components 6 times yesterday, now nothing today. hopefully tomorrow is better..
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Ronyo Dae'Loki
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Posted - 2004.03.05 18:44:00 -
[5]
Sounds like they need to up the drop rate for the T2 components or release BPs for them.
With a shortage in the components, tech II stuff will be far too rare and far too expensive. ------------- My salsa makes all the pretty girls want to dance and take off their underpants. I <3 ( . Y . ) |
Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.05 22:40:00 -
[6]
I don't think so. When castor came, they were giving lots of megacyte and zydrine when recycling. When that was removed Papa Smurf said that selling them would be more profitable then recycling was anyway. So they are meant to be very, very expensive. I know people who made 20+mill/day by recycling T2 components they got (when they gave high mins)
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Gariuys
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Posted - 2004.03.05 23:08:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Gariuys on 05/03/2004 23:11:38
Quote: Sounds like they need to up the drop rate for the T2 components or release BPs for them.
With a shortage in the components, tech II stuff will be far too rare and far too expensive.
There may someday be a shortage in tech2 comps, but as things stand now that is not the case.
Since castor counting all my missions and all my tech2 components ( and just components ) I average 10 comps per mission. Might do another stats run soon. But going through some 45 pages of standing transactions isn't all that enjoyable. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool |
LukAsh
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Posted - 2004.03.05 23:25:00 -
[8]
Today I got about 300pcs of T2 components. It is just like after castor for me.
___ WTB: +5 Implants. |
FZappa
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Posted - 2004.03.06 10:27:00 -
[9]
Quote: Today I got about 300pcs of T2 components. It is just like after castor for me.
damn , i havent got a single tech2 component in weeks sure , i got 1 run of moa , blackbird , caracal all me 0(!)
what agent/corp/division u working for man ? -------------------------
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.06 13:59:00 -
[10]
Quote: When that was removed Papa Smurf said that selling them would be more profitable then recycling was anyway. So they are meant to be very, very expensive
/me sighs
No they aren't.
He meant they would be more valueable than their recycle value. NOT their old, bugged-to-hell-and-back recycle value.. their "proper" one. (As listed by Char on this forum).
Thats the whole point of the change, to cease their previously outrageous value due to recycling worth.
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Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.06 14:29:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Hellek on 06/03/2004 14:30:46 No Morkt, I can remember pretty well. A lot of people complained about that unannounced change and the loss of worth of their T2 components and Smurf said that they would become even more valuable then the refining value WAS. Maybe he just said it to calm down the people and did not mean it but anyway, I am sure he said it and I would be very disappointed of him and CCP if they would increase the drop rate even further as I think its too high already.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.06 15:12:00 -
[12]
He probably did say it - given the number of remarks about T2Cs from different devs it wouldnt surprise me one little bit.
However the key issue is that it is the BUYERS who set the market value... and they wont, they cant, buy for "very very very expensive" prices - it isnt worth it.
Now we've made about 410million isk this week on buying and reselling tech 2 components (T2Cs) but the most we've sold any component for is 15k (with the exception of a couple of hundred to Xanadu @25k, but those were tiny volumes).
SO when people come to us saying (like that dimitri guy on the market forum) that he is selling thousands of T2Cs @ 75k AND his buyer are then re-selling them for a profit - well bascically I lmao, because I know that there is no such market for them.
You can get the very rare odd manufacturer who wants a dozen of this and that to finish off their latest Interceptor build who will fork out 50k for a miniscule number of specific components - but its not a global market for them or even anything vaguely approaching one.
We have dozens of pages of buy orders being fulfilled from 5k to 10k and have seen absolutely no signs at all of people buying in bulk, anywhere in empire, for higher prices than Xanadu recently offered (15k).
SO, thats what we base our stance on... countering it is.. what?
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Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.06 16:34:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Hellek on 06/03/2004 16:36:44 double post bug
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Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.06 16:35:00 -
[14]
Well, not the buyers set the prices, the ratio of supply and demand does. And if you say that its too expensive for T2 manufacturers, then you sell the manufactured stuff to cheap. And if nobody would buy at the price you would have to demand, well, then the market in the game is f***ed up Economics in Eve seemed kinda weird for me anyway. Anyway, I don't think that they should increase the rate at which T2 components are given out, I think they should decrease it so that the supply goes down and the prices go up so that the worth equals what Smurf said it would. If nobody is able to buy T2 ships or mods then, well then its a clear sign that the economy in the game does not work.
I really have to say that I hate it that its impossible to predict anything due to all the changes by CCP. They say this, do something else, then surprise you with weird changes, etc. How it was for me: Castor comes out, is pretty cool and I start playing eve again. I always was somebody who focused on agents so I get loads of T2 components. I see that they give mega and zyd but as I don't need the money at that moment I keep them because I think they might be useful if I get my own T2 BP and if not I thought I'd be able to recycle them later. And then, suddenly a patch comes and they don't give high mins any more. Without telling us before. There was no reason to expect such stuff as I never thought they would change what minerals those give. Because not too many people trade with them, it was easy to do it but the impact on people who kept them was as big as the impact on high-ore traders would be if they spawned unlimited arkonor in Luminaire, it totally ruined it for me and made all stuff I had almost worthless (compared to the old worth).
So I really expect of CCP that they do as Smurf said and not increase the drop rate even more. Otherwise it will be the last time that they disappointed me. If they don't know what they say, then they better say nothing than saying something wrong.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.06 18:48:00 -
[15]
So supply goes down?
Theres about 10% of all the T2 BPs out... and there's not enough supply for those!
People aren't paying the current T2 prices in some cases and you want to drive them up? I see nothing but a catastrophic end for T2 down that route.
I also don't understand why a component supplier can demand 75k for an item with 5k of minerals in it yet the same person complains of price-gouging when a T2 module that costs 500k is sold for 1 million. (Not you btw).
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Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.06 20:32:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Hellek on 06/03/2004 20:55:21 Well, the minerals in it have nothing to do with the price of the item itself, only that the price will never drop under the worth its minerals have but in the other direction (upwards) the price has no limits. A modulated Heavy Beam is more expensive than the minerals in it cause its rare and can't be manufactured. Same applies for T2 components I think. I think there is enough construction components available, only that buyers don't want to pay enough. Sure it would be hard to sell an interceptor at 15mill but if T2 stuff is too expensive CCP should bring more money into the game instead of flooding it with T2 components to drop the prices. All the new stuff is expensive, I read that the large mobile warp disruptor will cost 50 mill just in minerals and I don't want to know how much a T2 BS will cost (if we ever see them). I don't think that there is anything wrong with really high prices, for stuff like named mods people also pay a lot. For example a T2 CPU (10%) costs about 3 mill, named CPUs were traded for about that price as well but did not have so good stats I think.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.06 21:06:00 -
[17]
Yeah I understand the "Mineral Claim" but it simply doesn't work out like that does it?
A T2C with a mineral value of 5k is wanting to be sold at 75k and yet the end T2 item with a mineral vaule of 500k cant be sold for 1000k.
One cant simply ignore mineral worth as though its not a consideration, nor can one now ignore component worth.
Interceptors don't really sell very well for 7 million, let alone the equalent 18-21 million a comparable mark-up would require. And, i'll be honest, its that massive discrepancy that irritates me - even though i and our Corp (being runners and manufacturers) are in a win-win situation.
Brining more money into the game is inflationary and I dont see that as ever being viable.
The more I consider this the more I am now swaying towards Doppleganger's point:
Maybe they just don't want many people to get T2 stuff and CCP want it to be stupidly expensive and relatively hard to obtain... and we just go back and treble or quadruple all of our prices on the T2 modules.
He may very well not be wrong though.. im not saying the above lightly.
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Demitri Klashnikov
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Posted - 2004.03.07 02:21:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Demitri Klashnikov on 07/03/2004 09:03:14 Well Ive posted in other forums, and Ive argued with Morkd and BBBB, but after talking to Hardin of PIE, I am begining to see his point.
The only problem is coming to terms with the game mechanics, we have to accept the Meg and Zyd has gone, and the only thing that will help us all is a stabalization of prices one these items.
Perhaps the only way is to base this is on min cost x ?, but we need a more stable market, this will profit both runners and makers.
If component prices are to high then a frigate will cost 10 mill+., with that how the hell will anyone make, use or pay for T2 Battleships?
It is true I made a lot of ISK from my first components I put on the market, but this was before the price stabalised, if no one buys T2 then no one makes it and the components are woth the recycle value no more no less.
As someone pointed out the makers seem to often offer 2x BYOC so 2X seems fair (dont forget this does not include the T1 stuff).
from now on I will be happy to sell closer to min cost X2 (except Micro proccsors), as advertised on BBBB Necom.
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Hellek
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Posted - 2004.03.07 10:48:00 -
[19]
Well, I think that one reason why people don't want to buy at high prices is that they don't know how expensive manufacturing is. If you sell BYOM + isk or BYOM + 20% they will see it and hopefully buy their materials. I think that its good that many can't afford T2 stuff, at least until named T2 items appear, because at the moment its the best which is available.
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cypriss
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Posted - 2004.03.08 01:08:00 -
[20]
Quote: Maybe they just don't want many people to get T2 stuff and CCP want it to be stupidly expensive and relatively hard to obtain... and we just go back and treble or quadruple all of our prices on the T2 modules.
man i hope so. cause if that is the case, my gamble will have paid off and i will be a rich man. if not, oh well. i have always been a gambler.
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Nashal Couronne
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Posted - 2004.03.08 01:27:00 -
[21]
Out of interest: Does each corp only give out one type of T2 componant? Or is it random how much of what you get, no matter what corp your with?
I ask because Im making all my cash through agent running, and I had planned to use the T2 componants I got from them to get BYOC deals on elite frigates.
Im working for Federation Navy and Roden Shipyards at the moment, but Im still on level 2 agents.
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Viduus
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Posted - 2004.03.08 04:02:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Viduus on 08/03/2004 04:03:40 When you talk about supply and demad curves, you must also remember that when supply is low, prices will rise only to the highest price the market will support.
And quite frankly, Morkt is right; the market simply won't support prices that many runners think are viable. If interceptors are selling for a price the market at this time can barely support, what would happen if the T2C prices were as high as some wish? Especially when the T2 Cruisers come out? It's simply not possible. Remember too that T2-BPo require T2C for all aspects of manipulation -- ME included.
If the average runner makes 10 T2C per mission median, then 10-15k per unit is a fair price. That means with the avg. pay being 100k + 100-150k in T2C you're making good money as a runner.
--- edit: sp
* Public Channel: NEA * |
Doppleganger
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Posted - 2004.03.08 05:57:00 -
[23]
Well Morkt has influenced my ideas on how much these T2C should sell for but again that is changing back to where it was. I have been running agent missions for 3 days with only 22 ram to show for it and that definately effects my sale price. I might not get the price I'm asking for but then I hate to price it less for 3 days of running just to acuire that. Good thing I'm actually more interested in pr then T2C stuff.
Has anyone noticed if the division of the corp makes any more of a difference in T2C stuff handed out? My last 3 days have been dealing with a manufacturing div but as you can see either my luck sucks or its paying out diddly.
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Slik
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Posted - 2004.03.08 07:51:00 -
[24]
I have the best Manufacturing agent for a certain corp, and I get quite a lot of T2 items...and im not selling...im haurding it all.
__________________________________ Slik Do Not RUN...we are your friends!! |
Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.08 13:37:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Morkt Drak on 08/03/2004 13:40:08
Quote: Well Morkt has influenced my ideas on how much these T2C should sell for but again that is changing back to where it was. I have been running agent missions for 3 days with only 22 ram to show for it and that definately effects my sale price. I might not get the price I'm asking for but then I hate to price it less for 3 days of running just to acuire that. Good thing I'm actually more interested in pr then T2C stuff.
Has anyone noticed if the division of the corp makes any more of a difference in T2C stuff handed out? My last 3 days have been dealing with a manufacturing div but as you can see either my luck sucks or its paying out diddly.
Not really - but the navy agents seem to be uber tight on drops now.
We've had one totally duff day where we got nothing at all - and 3 days of 'ok' drops and one day of fabbo drops (Thats over the corp as a whole, Edit - spread between the top LaiDai and Kaalakiota Agents, various divisions)
So hard call atm as to how the drops are... picture is a tad confused to say the least.
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Doppleganger
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Posted - 2004.03.08 14:02:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Doppleganger on 08/03/2004 14:05:09 Well I have been using Core Complexion manufacturing agent with a eff rating of well over 40+. Guess I will need to take the time and check back with all my old caldari agents and see how they do.
I swear the higher eff rating you get the worse the drops.... tho from what CCP says that cant be true, it just feels that way.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.08 15:14:00 -
[27]
yeah - we dont just think thats "true" we act as though its gospel. As such we move corp once our ratings get too high, or deliberately lower them through repeat-fails.
Seems to us that the moment you get great standing your rewards go through the floor in terms of items given.. plenty of isk but thats about it.
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Novo DuPont
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Posted - 2004.03.08 18:19:00 -
[28]
Not having any problem getting components, just getting the wrong ones :(
I am working for a DuVolle agent which is a Gallente company but I get ALOT of CAldari components. like superconducting rails and the such. This is quite odd and will not make me happy when I have to go buy Gallente components when my agent gives me all caldari items :(
"To succeed greatly one must sacrifice greatly"
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.08 19:26:00 -
[29]
Getting ass-loads of Components today again... there appears to be streaks of good/bad... seems to average out as "ok" tough.
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Demitri Klashnikov
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Posted - 2004.03.08 19:36:00 -
[30]
Thanks Morkd,
Ive noticed once you get to about 6.0 with the agent, he craps out on the good stuff and starts throwing in 27 jump missions.
I ask becuase you seem to have a fair idea of how to max your agent, and seem to help others on the forums. Also more stuff on the market should mean lower prices, somthing you seem to want (tbh I no longer what price gets set for them) -----------------------------------------------
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