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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:08:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:09:58 First of all, money is power in EVE. Buying your way to power while others slowly and surely play their way towards the top (within the rules!) with their fists clenched and a mad glint in their eyes, is cheating. Plain and simple. EVE is intended to be a level playground where people either make it or not based solely on their abilities and hard work INSIDE EVE, not outside of it. It should not matter whether you are a rich man or a poor man in the real world. Once you enter the magnificent world of EVE Online, all that should matter is how well you put your abilities to use in the game and the thickness of oneÆs real world wallet should not be used to tip the balance-quoted from EVE insider
So why does CCP allow ppl to sell GTC for ISK-that uses real life money to buy in game currency. Ppl r not making money through hard work INSIDE EVE. I have only been playing this game 5 days and I know others have posted on this but I haven't seen an official response yet. I think that it is disgusting and hypocritical and ruins the PVE aspect of EVE completely. I am thinking of cancelling my subscription given that it debases such a massive part of the game. Why would i bother mining for hours and hours a day when i can work 15 minutes irl for the same reward. CCP PLEASE STOP FACILITATING PPL CHEATING. I would like an official response please-or to be directed to one.
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cal nereus
Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:12:00 -
[2]
If CCP says it isn't cheating, it isn't. It's their game, they set the rules, and the rest of us are just players. We don't own any part of their game. If it gets really bad, we can stop playing. I'm sure CCP knows this, which is why they probably won't openly condone what is generally perceived as cheating. ---
Join BH-DL Skills |
Asestorian
Domination. Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:13:00 -
[3]
Been gone over before, with some people ready to chop *****es off over it if it doesn't stop, and others who can only play because of being able to buy the GTCs via ingame money as they can't afford to pay the fee otherwise. After all this time I doubt CCP are going to change it very soon.
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MOZO
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:13:00 -
[4]
CCP is pragmatic; this way they get money from the RMT that would inevitably occur no matter what they did.
As for people succeeding in game due to RL money: a) There are so many people at so many different points in this game that a few artificially speeding up their development will make no difference b) Just having more ISK is not success, and just getting ISK will not make you successful.
But yes, it is cheating. -
I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
000Hunter000
Gallente Magners Marauders
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:15:00 -
[5]
Allthough i somewhat agree on the part where i also personally think that having a big wallet outside eve should not make a difference in what u are ingame, u will get flamed with stuff like 'can i have ur stuff' for threatning to cancel ur sub.
Best advice i can give u is not let it get to u and if someone buys stuff with gtc isk just point and laugh at them and call them noobs no amount of isk can change the fact that they are that... NOOBS
hehe like a few days ago, some ebay guy or gtc seller guy who bought a dread in hi sec, just realizing he couldn't really do crap with it but fly it around in system (he didn't have a cyno alt hehehe) CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
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Darwinia
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:16:00 -
[6]
Look at it this way: when they lose ships, they lose REAL LIFE MONEY.
That being said I don't like CCPs policy either, but I can live with it, since it's the lesser of two evils and has some positive sides. ------------------------ I don't believe in sigs. |
Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:18:00 -
[7]
They openly condone it buy facilitating it. I have played other games where devs sell in game currency but they have little if ne pve component and so it is less of an issue. Blizzard would never sell gold in WOW and would not facilitate it. I would rather play this game because part of the appeal for me of EVE is ability for players to significantly affect environment in game.CCP facilitating the selling of ISK makes a mockery of this game imo.
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Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:21:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:21:44 Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:21:15 Thanks for the intelligent replies. Interestingly nothing official yet. If i were them I would be to embarrassed, hypocritical or contradicted to say anything either. I mean really they can't have a valid argument that doesnt't sound like bs. Can they?
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northwesten
Amarr Trinity Corporate Services
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:23:00 -
[9]
better CCP get money for isk than someone else doing it.
Free Corporation website? click here
Trinity Corporate Services Website
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Asestorian
Domination. Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:24:00 -
[10]
Also Crumplecorn is right. People will buy ISK for real life money anyway, and this way CCP get that money, someone gets to play the game who otherwise couldn't because they can't afford to pay their own money, and I think that you get less ISK for the same RL money via CCP's method anyway than you would if you were doing it against the EULA. Not to mention the other points about how ISK doesn't mean you win, and because it is a game where you lose things, when the idiots who decided they needed to buy money to get ahead inevitably lose their ships they've lost real life money.
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MOZO
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Kenneth McCoy
Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:31:00 -
[11]
Stop thinking your some genius pointing this out and demanding a dev response. Your not going to get an answer that satisfies you. And I can't be assed to type more.
Go play wow.
My opinions and views are not the official views of my Corp. |
Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:39:00 -
[12]
Legalizing something just because you can't effectively stop it?
Nice logic.
Isk-buyers are getting an unfair in-game advantage. 14 dollars per month will only grant you Eve-light.
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Paulo Damarr
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:45:00 -
[13]
12th in the 173274847837847547534953th Thread about GTCs
Selling GTC for ISK is no more gaining an advantage with RL money than having multiple accounts and neither is it it different from people buying chars with ISK.
And I doubt CCP will change anything just because you made a post about it, not unless your a majority stockholder in their company.
I wont ask for your stuff because your obviously to poor to buy lots of GTCs and have nice stuff. Cloaks!! |
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:49:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Paulo Damarr 12th in the 173274847837847547534953th Thread about GTCs
Selling GTC for ISK is no more gaining an advantage with RL money than having multiple accounts and neither is it it different from people buying chars with ISK.
And I doubt CCP will change anything just because you made a post about it, not unless your a majority stockholder in their company.
I wont ask for your stuff because your obviously to poor to buy lots of GTCs and have nice stuff.
and since CCP is not publicly traded there is no threat of that!
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:50:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Cpt Fina Legalizing something just because you can't effectively stop it?
Nice logic.
Would you prefer that CCP tried to stop it on principle, knowing that all they would achieve is cutting off this revenue stream? -
I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:51:00 -
[16]
Kenneth-you're the only person who has turned this into a personal attack. I never indicated that I felt that i ws a genious for pointing this out and I am asking for a dev response because I would like them to stop doing something that seems clearly wrong. If they can justify it adequately maybe they will change my thinking as I am not that pig headed. I don't know why your being so defensive about it. Do you feel guilty because you can't make your way in this game without selling GTC? Thanks again to all the intelligent responses. I have food for thought and will probably take the view that buyers are pathetic and I can play my own way- as some of you have said. It's just a pity that CCP facilitates it and that's why i wanted dev response. Not because I'm being*****y or arrogant.
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Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:53:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:54:52 Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:54:11 Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:53:26 Yes Crumple I would prefer they stop it on principle. I would pay more per month if revenue is the concern. They have a good game and this aspect spoils it. Blizzard don't do it and they have the highest revenue game of all MMO with 9 million subscribers. They don't need to do it to make money. Imo this game is as good as WOW and suit some ppls playing style more. So, yes they should stop it on principle.
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:54:00 -
[18]
CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Paulo Damarr
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:54:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 24/11/2007 23:56:01 Feel the power of the <Enter> key!!
Originally by: Tortun Nahme CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time
This goes on my sig
Originally by: Tortun Nahme CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time
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Kenneth McCoy
Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:55:00 -
[20]
Nothing in life is truly fair.
Is it fair that... oh, lets see... say you have a 18 year old dude, lives at home with his parents, doesn't have much responsibility. So he plays EVE a lot. All day long, in fact. Why is it ok for him to get to play more than me. I have a job, and I might only get to play a couple hours a day a couple days a week. Is that fair? It certainly gives him an ingame advantage, does it not? Say we're both miners. He's getting to mine way more than me, due to circumstances outside the game world. By the logic of the OP, we may as well assign a ******* time limit on the log in time of an account, or something like that, to ensure everyone gets just the right amount of play time.
Stop ****ing in the wind because some people sell a few gtc's here and there. Just take more satisfaction when you kill them, cause your causing them to lose money in real life. People will buy isk, if they want to. CCP is making a good business decision in giving people a legal alternative to do so. Good business decisions mean continued operation. You DO want to keep playing EVE, right? If you didn't, you wouldn't be *****ing about this **** on here, wasting everyones time.
My opinions and views are not the official views of my Corp. |
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:57:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 24/11/2007 23:56:01 Feel the power of the <Enter> key!!
Originally by: Tortun Nahme CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time
This goes on my sig
aw crud, just noticed I misspelled time lol
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Liv Forever
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Posted - 2007.11.24 23:59:00 -
[22]
CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time-Tortun
Most ppls arguments have been thoughful and intelligent. This was clearly not your finest moment Tortun and you should take your own advice. Btw if this was your finest moment then play less computer games and go back to school. :)
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:00:00 -
[23]
Buahaha you have been forum podded, now gb2wow
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Valan
Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:00:00 -
[24]
Out of interest I wonder if CCP are reconsidering the GTC thing in light of the arrests in the Netherlands for online theft.
A virtual item was bought with RL money. It was then stolen. So the police stepped in.
CCP have officially placed an RL value on a virtual item with GTCs.
No official GTC support means no official exchange rate and therefore undermining the link between RL and virtual theft.
/start sig I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game four years' when I know their account has been sold on. /end sig |
Kenneth McCoy
Vale Heavy Industries Molotov Coalition
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:01:00 -
[25]
And now your attacking another person on an honest typo, insinuating he lacks intelligence and telling him to go back to school.
Nice.
My opinions and views are not the official views of my Corp. |
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:03:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Tortun Nahme on 25/11/2007 00:03:44
Originally by: Valan Out of interest I wonder if CCP are reconsidering the GTC thing in light of the arrests in the Netherlands for online theft.
A virtual item was bought with RL money. It was then stolen. So the police stepped in.
CCP have officially placed an RL value on a virtual item with GTCs.
No official GTC support means no official exchange rate and therefore undermining the link between RL and virtual theft.
just to point otu that this post is uninformed, peoples LOGIN INFORMATION was stolen, and the people arrested were charged with FRAUD not theft
edit: and I still cant spellell, beign awake for 18 consecutive hours is baaaaaaaaaaad
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:05:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Liv Forever Yes Crumple I would prefer they stop it on principle. I would pay more per month if revenue is the concern. They have a good game and this aspect spoils it. Blizzard don't do it and they have the highest revenue game of all MMO with 9 million subscribers. They don't need to do it to make money. Imo this game is as good as WOW and suit some ppls playing style more. So, yes they should stop it on principle.
I don't think they really depend on it too much as a revenue stream - I meant more in principle, that if somebody is going to be getting money from ISK buying, that somebody might as well be CCP. -
I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
Lazuran
Gallente Time And ISK Sink Corporation
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:14:00 -
[28]
It's sad, but that's how it is ... EVE is a semi-RMT game. You can feel free to doubt the following claims, but most people will know that they are facts:
- most supercap owners in EVE bought their supercaps with RL money (through illegal or legal ISK purchases) - several famous PVP corps replace their losses with RL money - many, many T2 BPO owners invested RL money to buy their BPOs
In the end, most people who are considered very successful in EVE, bought their way ahead with RL money (very few exceptions unfortunately).
If you can live with these facts, then EVE is for you. Otherwise, you might want to reconsider...
"...been designed for one purpose and one purpose only. Imagine a handful of repair drones pouring from the carebear's mouth. Now imagine they have um, nothing." -Unknown Hel redesigner (2007) |
Cailais
Amarr W A R
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:16:00 -
[29]
In order for it to be cheating, you need to be able to 'win'. Please could the OP define the 'win' conditions for EVE online.
C.
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Dehumanisation - griefers are cool and if you are not a griefer, you do not belong here.
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Malcanis
High4Life SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.25 00:19:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Liv Forever Edited by: Liv Forever on 24/11/2007 23:09:58 First of all, money is power in EVE. Buying your way to power while others slowly and surely play their way towards the top (within the rules!) with their fists clenched and a mad glint in their eyes, is cheating. Plain and simple. EVE is intended to be a level playground where people either make it or not based solely on their abilities and hard work INSIDE EVE, not outside of it. It should not matter whether you are a rich man or a poor man in the real world. Once you enter the magnificent world of EVE Online, all that should matter is how well you put your abilities to use in the game and the thickness of oneÆs real world wallet should not be used to tip the balance-quoted from EVE insider
So why does CCP allow ppl to sell GTC for ISK-that uses real life money to buy in game currency. Ppl r not making money through hard work INSIDE EVE. I have only been playing this game 5 days and I know others have posted on this but I haven't seen an official response yet. I think that it is disgusting and hypocritical and ruins the PVE aspect of EVE completely. I am thinking of cancelling my subscription given that it debases such a massive part of the game. Why would i bother mining for hours and hours a day when i can work 15 minutes irl for the same reward. CCP PLEASE STOP FACILITATING PPL CHEATING. I would like an official response please-or to be directed to one.
On the one hand, I don't like it much either. On the other hand, I have several good friends in the game who would not be able to play without GTCs being sold.
Basically people can buy ISK anyway; at least this way (1) CCP get the money rather than some sweatshop owner and (2) other people can play for free, increasing the number of people in the game. 2 - 5 evenings spent ratting or mining or missioning will get you enough ISK to play for 90 days. On the other hand selling enough GTC to get a fitted carrier or a Machariel would probably cost about $150-200, and people who buy their way into cap or faction ships usually come to grief in them very quickly. Occasionally, they come to the forums to cry about it, providing a rich source of entertainment for the community.
In my perfect world GTC sales wouldn't happen. In the real world, I accept that they're the least worst alternative.
And as said above, at the end of the day CCP get to define what "cheating" is.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
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