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Skraeling Shortbus
Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.12.11 00:13:00 -
[1]
With the horrendous increase on module volume to make compression impossible it is now very painful to loot missions or 0.0 npc wrecks. Not being able to loot a very short (1 stage) mission with my cargo expanded destroyer, which has over 800m3 cargo capacity is irritating.
Since the change will most likely never be reversed I point you to the question in the subject... Is it time for a dedicated salvaging vessel?
I'm thinking a ship with a bonus to tractor range (similar to marauders) and also possibly a bonus to salvager duration / power usage / chance. The ship would of course have a hefty cargo bay as well hopefully in the 1500m3 range or so before expanders or maybe a smaller initial hold size but with a bonus to cargo bay per level of "Salvaging Ships".
Looting was a pain before this change and now its a bigger pain.
Thoughts?
Love to the Assault Frigate! |
MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2007.12.11 00:38:00 -
[2]
only tech 1 modules have been increased.
which is silyl tech 1 items should just refine for 30% of what they use to.
that or ignore it :) and just keep up named stuff which is the same size as before.
Official fanboy of jenny< pink supporter! looking to work in the art department with CCP, 3 years and counting. http://www.digipen.edu/main/Gallery_Games_2004#Narbacular_Dropthi |
Aslyn Denethorn
Caldari Tsurokigaarai APEX Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.12.11 00:43:00 -
[3]
I agree with the need for a dedicated salvage ship - one with, for example, 8 High Slots, but neither turret nor launcher hardpoints, to prevent it being used for combat. Sure, decent cargo space would be nice, and the bonus to tractor beams even moreso. I don't agree on a salvage bonus, though - fun though that would be, it would unbalance salvage in the favour of those flying one, and nerf the market as a consequence - prices would drop on salvage items if we started flooding the market with them.
So, sure, a faster way to obtain them, with an opportunity to store more than usual, but definately no bonus to salvage itself. That'd be counterproductive.
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Ulstan
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Posted - 2007.12.11 00:47:00 -
[4]
Definitely. We also need a hauler somewhere in between industrials and freighters.
As long as something like a remote sensor booster (which refines for crap) is 100m3, we are going to need some sort of dedicated looting/hauling vehicle.
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Mr Siman
Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.12.11 00:49:00 -
[5]
Am I missing something here? Why don't you guys just not loot the stuff that is overly huge and leave it behind?
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Skraeling Shortbus
Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.12.11 01:39:00 -
[6]
Maybe npcs shouldnt drop any mods at all then?
Love to the Assault Frigate! |
Master Han
The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency
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Posted - 2007.12.11 01:44:00 -
[7]
Also need to fix salvage tables for Merc, EoM, Pleasure Hub and other non major factions ships. They drop only the 4 basic salvage types and the rest is metal scraps, making salvaging harder due to amount of free cargo needed to salvage all the scraps.
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Dunpeal
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.12.11 01:49:00 -
[8]
why not instead, just prevent the npc's from dropping tech1 items and instead just perhaps worst named ones? minor increase in loot value, although, not by much anyways so probably not very important, but cargo problem solved, no? Npc's + named items Tech1 + player producer's
thus making the tech1 market solely relying on player activity, making for a better life for everyone no? well perhaps not traders but plenty other items to trade on http://draken.com.sapo.pt/Backstory.htm
http://www.save-evetv.com/ |
MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2007.12.11 05:33:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Mr Siman Am I missing something here? Why don't you guys just not loot the stuff that is overly huge and leave it behind?
because some people liked filling up cargo bay wth stuff jsut to refine it.
b ut you have a point.
but then I ask you... why even have t1 loot?
make it all named?
Official fanboy of jenny< pink supporter! looking to work in the art department with CCP, 3 years and counting. http://www.digipen.edu/main/Gallery_Games_2004#Narbacular_Dropthi |
Draahk Chimera
Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.12.11 05:42:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ulstan Definitely. We also need a hauler somewhere in between industrials and freighters.
Transports?
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McFly
Path of Light R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.12.11 06:23:00 -
[11]
I think that a new tier destroyer for each race, and making it's T2 variant would be nice. A salvaging ship should be able to run 4 salvagers cap stable and 4 tractors. Have a larger cargo bay and the resistances of other industrial vessels like barges and haulers.
I'd like to see a tractor beam bonus like marauders or perhaps better. the salvaging bonus should come in a cap usage per level, tractor beam should be a role bonus. Just my .02 isk on the subject --
--my opinions do not reflect that of my corp nor my alliance-- |
Skraeling Shortbus
Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.12.11 07:45:00 -
[12]
Im assuming you mean tier2 not tech2?
Love to the Assault Frigate! |
Kurogauna
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Posted - 2007.12.11 08:34:00 -
[13]
If a didicated salvage ship will come out, i am pretty sure that salvage quantitities will ne nerfed Dont like baby blue ? Tell it to the devs HERE, Thanx. |
Carniflex
Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project
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Posted - 2007.12.11 08:44:00 -
[14]
We do have new salvage ships. They are called Marauders. Now if we could get only salvage bonus on them also in addition to tractor beam one.
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Loc Maythan
Gallente AlfaCorp
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Posted - 2007.12.11 08:58:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Draahk Chimera
Originally by: Ulstan Definitely. We also need a hauler somewhere in between industrials and freighters.
Transports?
Transports don't lie between industrial and freighters in terms of cargo capacity, and in any case, are hardly suitable as salvaging ships - looting, maybe, but not salvaging.
I currently use a souped up Brutix which gives 2048m3, and this was not enough even pre-Trinity for some of the level 4 missions. Things are obviously no better post-Trinity.
At the risk of being called a Philistine, I am thinking of using a Navy Issue Mega (2 of which I have lying around doing nothing) for salvaging. By my calculations, I can get up to 3697m3 cargohold, and 715m/s (only a bit less than the 777m/s from the Brutix), and can fit 4 tractors and 4 salvagers instead of 4/3 on the Brutix.
If I go for a slower setup - 270m/s - I can get 7169m3 cargo, and there are a range of alternatives between these two extremes.
If you have one lying around, which I unfortunately don't, you could use a Machariel and get the 4/4 arrangement with over 400m/s and 5500m3 cargo.
Loc.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.12.11 09:02:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Master Han Also need to fix salvage tables for Merc, EoM, Pleasure Hub and other non major factions ships. They drop only the 4 basic salvage types and the rest is metal scraps, making salvaging harder due to amount of free cargo needed to salvage all the scraps.
I like those. They're broken, but 'generic mission NPCs' also drop far better quality of loot - above average quantity of BS guns/mods which are well worth the time to collect.
But I'd like to see a dedicated salvager. Something like a cross between a hauler and a destroyer.
Or just give blockade runners 6-7 more highslots, a tractor beam range bonus, and a salvager bonut ;).
Actually, with a tractor range bonus, less highs'd be fine. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
OneSock
Crown Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.11 09:08:00 -
[17]
Introducing a dedicated salvage ship would surely require more dev time than simply fixing the problem.
1. Reduce mineral composition of T1 2. Set module volume = mineral volume. rather than just an arbitrary 100m3.
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Max Godsnottlingson
Amarr Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations
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Posted - 2007.12.11 12:09:00 -
[18]
I thought we'd pretty much got one with the new Marauder class? A Marauder will be pretty well able to salvage as it goes along.
Oh what do you say? Stupidly expensive? Insane skills needed? Well yes, but then again nothing is free in Eve
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Zin Zy
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Posted - 2007.12.11 12:11:00 -
[19]
Just pick any Amarr laser boat, they are useless for anything else than good looking garbage trucks.
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Max Godsnottlingson
Amarr Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations
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Posted - 2007.12.11 12:29:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Master Han Also need to fix salvage tables for Merc, EoM, Pleasure Hub and other non major factions ships. They drop only the 4 basic salvage types and the rest is metal scraps, making salvaging harder due to amount of free cargo needed to salvage all the scraps.
Actually, I believe that this is quite a deliberate thing done as a way to ballence out mission running against ratting. With mission running you get the ship kill bounty, loot/slavage and a nice pay off from your agent, The crap loot/slavage drops is to ballence out the agent payments you get when mission running
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Aslyn Denethorn
Caldari Tsurokigaarai APEX Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.12.11 12:36:00 -
[21]
I should observe that eliminating T1 Modules as loot would really put a crimp on those doing agent missions. Sure, most of it's useless, but when you pick up a T1 Arbalest Heavy Missile Launcher and sell for 14mil...
Not ALL T1 loot sucks. Just most of it.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.12.11 14:38:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Aslyn Denethorn I should observe that eliminating T1 Modules as loot would really put a crimp on those doing agent missions. Sure, most of it's useless, but when you pick up a T1 Arbalest Heavy Missile Launcher and sell for 14mil...
Not ALL T1 loot sucks. Just most of it.
I would observe that by normal usage, an 'arbalest' anything isn't usually covered by the use of 'T1 modules', it's usually referred to as a subset known as 'named'. The reason for this subset existing is because there are some modules within it that are worth more than their raw mineral value, due to utility vs. availability. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.12.11 14:41:00 -
[23]
Originally by: OneSock Introducing a dedicated salvage ship would surely require more dev time than simply fixing the problem.
1. Reduce mineral composition of T1 2. Set module volume = mineral volume. rather than just an arbitrary 100m3.
Doing a new one from scratch maybe. Slapping it on as a 'role bonus' on e.g. blockade runners, and giving them a bunch more highslots, IMO would work just fine.
's annoying to be killing the mission in a combat ship, salvaging/lootgathering in a destroyer, then bringing out a hauler to do the tidying up. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Skraeling Shortbus
Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.12.11 18:19:00 -
[24]
doesn't need to be a new hull design it would be just a variant of a current shiptype... BC sized/cost maybe?
Using a close to billion isk ship (marauders) to loot and salvage is a ludicrous solution at best. No where was i asking for anything for free putting words in my mouth really isn't an argument. Since I asked for a specific role bonus called " salvaging ships" or something of the like it would still involve skilling.
Love to the Assault Frigate! |
Natalie Jax
Battlestars
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Posted - 2007.12.11 19:23:00 -
[25]
The Hurricane makes for a pretty good salvaging ship. It can fit 4/4 tractor beams/salvagers and with six Expanded Cargohold II's it'll hold 2041m3 worth of stuff. It'll hit between 800 and 1000 m/s with a MWD depending on skills and such, or 350 m/s with an AB.
I honestly don't think we need a new ship for this purpose. However, I wouldn't really mind it and would probably grab one if it weren't painfully expensive.
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Windglaive
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Posted - 2007.12.11 19:57:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Mr Siman Am I missing something here? Why don't you guys just not loot the stuff that is overly huge and leave it behind?
I'm a little late reading this thread but here we go.We loot the massive stuff because the massive stuff makes up a majority of the loot dropped. Most people who are not dedicated miners rely on the minerals from those "worthless" items for getting things made or sell the minerals for extra profit. If a person just leaves the huge loot laying around that means lower profit and more unnamed cans (I always salvage my wrecks)littering the belt. Besides in 0.0 space it is nice to have a stockpile of t1 items for suicide missions.
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