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cosmoray
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Posted - 2007.12.17 20:38:00 -
[181]
First rule of politics:
Don't answer the question you think you heard, answer the question you wish you heard!
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Kirjava
Lothian Quay Industries Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.17 20:44:00 -
[182]
Originally by: cosmoray First rule of politics:
Don't answer the question you think you heard, answer the question you wish you heard!
The problem is this method only works when speaking vocaly, when it's written down people can take their time to reread and find the faults in it. This is why I don't use TS or Vent when I can avoid it, I get flummoxed easily when speaking over the phone
~Nyron |
Hexxx
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.12.17 20:45:00 -
[183]
Originally by: Kirjava
Originally by: Ufl maybe that should be the new backing
$20 would cover 2.5B in assets, LOL I dont even expect that much till next year.
Now this is just getting humourous.
I now lost the small shread of hope I had that UFL had seen the light and he probably did before urinating on it to put it out for the opportunity to troll. You also dodged the issue by the way.
Unfortunately...I'm going to just go ahead and agree here. I'm done bending over backwards. I've tried more than most to get Ufl turned around and it just isn't working. I've put more energy into this then I should have.
Consulting, IPO Template, and Stock/Bond definitions.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2007.12.17 20:46:00 -
[184]
Originally by: cosmoray First rule of politics: Don't answer the question you think you heard, answer the question you wish you heard!
OH we all know this to be the case. However you forget, in this forum it is not politics that predicates these kind of aversion. Here we call it social engineering. (I.e. Scamming)
Latest Scammer Alert |
Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.17 21:22:00 -
[185]
Edited by: Ufl on 17/12/2007 21:22:33
Originally by: Hexxx Unfortunately...I'm going to just go ahead and agree here. I'm done bending over backwards. I've tried more than most to get Ufl turned around and it just isn't working. I've put more energy into this then I should have.
He's right, and I have tried to find some form of common ground but no one is willing to take it seriously, or step up to the plate.
I spoke with the NUEX team and we agreed that these posts have been pretty much useless because of all of the negativity.
Fortunately everything is moving along quickly in-game with the NUEX and we will be posting updates on our NEWSWIRE.
Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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Matalino
Gallente Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.17 21:39:00 -
[186]
Originally by: Ufl Fortunately everything is moving along quickly in-game with the NUEX and we will be posting updates on our NEWSWIRE.
Are you ever going to answer my question as to why the NEWSWIRE is only accessable after you register?
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Caliwyrm O'Libr
Red Eye .Inc.
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Posted - 2007.12.17 21:46:00 -
[187]
Originally by: Ufl
He's right, and I have tried to find some form of common ground but no one is willing to take it seriously, or step up to the plate.
I spoke with the NUEX team and we agreed that these posts have been pretty much useless because of all of the negativity.
You're so full of it.
All people asked for was information/referrals. All you did was doublespeak and throw around that you programmed a web page ....oh and insulted anyone who dared ask the same question that never got answered.
Now you have a NUEX Team. Would any of them care to step forward? And if not, why should thier reluctance inspire anyone to even *think* about using your service? (**NOTE** I am NOT asking why anyone would use your service, I am asking *SPECIFICALLY* why your "team's" reluctance to do something as easy as identify themselves should ease any doubts. If they CBA to make a simple post why should we trust them to work any harder on your endeavor? =======
Talk is cheap because supply always outweighs demand.. |
Fitz VonHeise
The New Order. United Connection's
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Posted - 2007.12.17 23:23:00 -
[188]
Edited by: Fitz VonHeise on 17/12/2007 23:26:07
Originally by: Ufl He's right, and I have tried to find some form of common ground but no one is willing to take it seriously, or step up to the plate.
I'll post the same point here I did in the other thread:
Why do you not simply ask what would be required by them for them to trust you and work with you?
It is a very simple question. (Then you just have to do what they suggest... and you will have instant credibility)
Services I Provide:
Caldari Factional Standing Increase ò Alliance Creation ò The Thieves Of EvE ò My Links
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twisted genius
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.12.18 09:20:00 -
[189]
Well I'd like to hear from the "Team" and of course those mysterious 2 corps who seem so reluctant to identify themselves, because otherwise I just have you pegged as a billy bull****ter.
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Shaitis
Caldari Domination.
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Posted - 2007.12.18 12:19:00 -
[190]
beer up for nice idea.
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Shaitis
Caldari Domination.
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Posted - 2007.12.18 12:22:00 -
[191]
beer up for nice idea.
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Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 14:22:00 -
[192]
Edited by: Ufl on 18/12/2007 14:23:17
Originally by: Fitz VonHeise Edited by: Fitz VonHeise on 17/12/2007 23:27:38
Originally by: Ufl He's right, and I have tried to find some form of common ground but no one is willing to take it seriously, or step up to the plate.
I'll post the same point here I did in the other thread:
Why do you not simply ask what would be required by them for them to trust you and work with you?
It is a very simple question.
(Then you just have to do what they suggest... and you will have instant credibility)
Services I Provide:
Caldari Factional Standing Increase ò Alliance Creation ò The Thieves Of EvE ò My Links
I would rather keep doing what Im doing, time will tell. I gave them their chance to jump on board and no one stepped up to the plate.
They dont seem to realize this is a penny-annie stock trading market, b/c most players dont have billions, the best way to get investors is to bring prices down to involve more players, and turn them into investors. So it shouldnt be a big deal to back 100% collateral on a few million isk. The whole point of this is to get your corporation worth more than other players - eventually it will be quite competative.
The NUEX Team refuses to post here because of the negativity and hostility they have seen me deal with here; they will however chat with players via voice chat - including the dissenters - if they have the balls to even try to talk over voice chat and say the same things they post here.
NUEX updates may be posted here every now and then but for the most part all information relating and regarding the NUEX and its listed corporations is available on the NUEX website at http://www.nuconcorporation.com/exchange
Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.18 14:31:00 -
[193]
Edited by: Ricdic on 18/12/2007 14:32:15 ****EDIT: Scratch that, our TS server isn't working atm
UFL I would like to chat with you and your Nucon team on TS together. Please join the EBANK teamspeak server located here:
http://www.eve-bank.net/Forums/viewtopic.php?t=160
It should be noted that you won't have a free ride, I have a lot of questions for you and your team and expect valid responses to those questions.
I am waiting on the server right now.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=500043 Largest Empire Research Alliance in EVE! |
Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 14:42:00 -
[194]
Originally by: Ricdic Edited by: Ricdic on 18/12/2007 14:40:04 edit2: Ok server up and running. Come join us Nucon
UFL I would like to chat with you and your Nucon team on TS together. Please join the EBANK teamspeak server located here:
http://www.eve-bank.net/Forums/viewtopic.php?t=160
It should be noted that you won't have a free ride, I have a lot of questions for you and your team and expect valid responses to those questions.
I am waiting on the server right now.
We all work today - we will be on later tonight. I will contact you either in game or post here. Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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Ambo
2nd Outcasters
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Posted - 2007.12.18 14:48:00 -
[195]
I'm still unable to log in with either account using any passowrd. Could it be because I never got the activation email on the first account? (Cos the address was wrong ofc...)
--------------------------------------
Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA |
Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 14:58:00 -
[196]
Edited by: Ufl on 18/12/2007 14:58:51
Originally by: Ambo I'm still unable to log in with either account using any passowrd. Could it be because I never got the activation email on the first account? (Cos the address was wrong ofc...)
Ah sorry Ambo it was still blocked
It should work now. Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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Redbad
Minmatar Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:13:00 -
[197]
Personally I cannot believe that E-BANK is somehow even considering nurturing this project after all that is said in this thread. Highly odd, to first break the entire idea down to the ground and then consider salvaging it and start talking with Nucon to perhaps participate or setting this up in a little different form.
You don't do business with people you call "scammers".
I hope this isn't going to be the usual tactic/respons for EVE-Bank to conduct business.
Appalingly amused,
RB
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:34:00 -
[198]
Originally by: Redbad
You don't do business with people you call "scammers".
I hope this isn't going to be the usual tactic/respons for EVE-Bank to conduct business.
What rubbish. I just want to get the guy and his 'team' on TS to see if they truly exist and see how the guy supports himself. There won't be any form of EBANK or even personal validation in it, I was actually one of the ones against Nucon the day it was released.
So please save your Nancy Drew drama queen act and stop trying to spin quotes and words to meet your high and mighty approach. It's one thing for a market regular to do it, but I find it far more amusing seeing a market noob show up trying to do so.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=500043 Largest Empire Research Alliance in EVE! |
Matalino
Gallente Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:37:00 -
[199]
Ufl: now that you are back on the forums this morning, are you going to answer my question from yesterday?
Why can we not read the newswire without registering?
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Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:41:00 -
[200]
Originally by: Matalino Ufl: now that you are back on the forums this morning, are you going to answer my question from yesterday?
Why can we not read the newswire without registering?
The same reason you cant get live quotes on E-Trade unless you are a member. Its called exclusive - sa***uarded from newbies and other people who may want to cause problems. Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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Matalino
Gallente Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:47:00 -
[201]
Edited by: Matalino on 18/12/2007 15:49:45
Originally by: Ufl
Originally by: Matalino Ufl: now that you are back on the forums this morning, are you going to answer my question from yesterday?
Why can we not read the newswire without registering?
The same reason you cant get live quotes on E-Trade unless you are a member. Its called exclusive - sa***uarded from newbies and other people who may want to cause problems.
Would you concider your operation a brokerage like E-Trade or a stock exchange like the NYSE?
If you are a brokerage, why are you calling yourself a stock exchange?
If you are a stock exchange, why are you not releasing information more publicly about your listed companies like the RL exchanges?
And as for the above stated reason, what prevents "newbies and other people who may want to cause problems" from registering with your service?
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Redbad
Minmatar Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.18 15:49:00 -
[202]
Originally by: Ricdic
Originally by: Redbad
You don't do business with people you call "scammers".
I hope this isn't going to be the usual tactic/respons for EVE-Bank to conduct business.
What rubbish. I just want to get the guy and his 'team' on TS to see if they truly exist and see how the guy supports himself. There won't be any form of EBANK or even personal validation in it, I was actually one of the ones against Nucon the day it was released.
So please save your Nancy Drew drama queen act and stop trying to spin quotes and words to meet your high and mighty approach. It's one thing for a market regular to do it, but I find it far more amusing seeing a market noob show up trying to do so.
One that doesn't post often doesn't necessarily be a market noob. I did not quote any of what was said in this thread and if there is anyone on a high horse, I would suggest to mind your step when unmounting.
I am just reading here in this thread that Shar Tegral doesn't leave any splinter whole when describing Nucon and this idea and using his sig for making a "scammer alert". Hexxx talking to Nucon putting time in it to suggest perhaps a better direction for them, and you getting them on a teamspeakserver "not giving them free rides".
What was I to think then?
Your answer that there won't be any for of EBANK or even personal validation in it is however enough for me to assure certain of my personal interests are not in danger.
Thanks for your answer,
RB
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Ricdic
Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.18 16:24:00 -
[203]
glad we got that sorted then. Sorry for the hostility I thought you were an Ezoran alt
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=500043 Largest Empire Research Alliance in EVE! |
Redbad
Minmatar Mean Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.18 16:28:00 -
[204]
Originally by: Ricdic glad we got that sorted then. Sorry for the hostility I thought you were an Ezoran alt
Well I perhaps might have had the same egotistical reasons for posting such a sharp edged post to get things clear. Perhaps I read Shar's posts too often and got "contaminated".
Apologies accepted and given likewise.
RB
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Assens Letta
Hunerian Science Institute Pax Atlantis
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Posted - 2007.12.18 16:33:00 -
[205]
Having read thru this entire post (flame parts included) I still have some doubts/considerations
CouldnÆt you (Ulf) have conducted this in a professional manner? and noà trolling (like you have done in some replies) is not a professional manner. any type of trolling works against the credibility you need/want to create in order to make your venture successefull. I do think you can turn it around and even so achieve a nice outcome out of this, but with that attitude alone I would not invest a dime or more than a couple of replies on you or your stock exchange.
It is true that you have created a nice enough tool, your site seems pretty sleek and has a nice design, now there is one problem, as nice as it is, it does not solve the underlying problem, which is what it is used for and the regulations behind it. As it seems you throttled on despite every ones criticism of the main idea, that is worth what it is, it proves you are confident of your ideas worth, it proves that you are stubborn, it proves a lot of things, it just doesnÆt prove the validity of your idea. ATM you are just sitting in your ôcastleö with an idea you say is good with a few other companions (that no one other than you saw) to support it, although this may be good enough for you it does not make it a good idea in the face of the market nor in the face of the potential costumer.
Reading thru the main idea discussion you are the main liability to the CEO wanting to invest or do any IPO thru NUCON, having a 3rd party to hold the isk would solve that in part , having a security index for each IPO would also do the trick for most part of it, now to get investment thru the IPO you seem to have demonstrated that it is possible to do soà. Yet many problems lie on that path, let me clarify my issues. Lets say Corp A starts small, 10% of the existing shares available thru NUCON, and some isk as collateral in order to make them worthwhile, in case orp A wanted to gain credibility and wanted to start small the amount of collateral would be small and so on and so on like you have explained, nothing against that, except that for market purposes Corp A would be better off killing rats (in high sec) than waiting 3 months to get a credibility so that the investors would buy the stocks at nice prices in order for Corp A to fund the business ventures it needed. Let us say that Corp A deposits larger sums of isk in order to make it appear that their venture is legitimate (and it may actually be), those deposits do not meant that Corp A has made profits, it only stated that it does have enough cash resources to entice the investors into it, it may even have a extremely good business plan it still doesnÆt mean its being put into practice nor that there is any peer review on its actions. Let us assume now that investors flock to it, Corp A now has the isk they need to do whatever they said they would do with it, do they any real expertise at it ? they havenÆt provided a single example they should have been trusted with that isk in the 1st place, why ? no peer review, no fail safe mechanisms, nothing at all. At that point Corp A might has well go bankrupt due to sheer incapacity of its CEO/directors. Following that example what has NUCON provided us? Nice enough system for incompetent CEO to make investors isk disappear or to get lower return than they promised (although this would be reflected in the share value in case a profit/stock for each month/week was provided by NUCON). For the CEO it creates a lot of work on the 1st stages in order to get some credibility that could have been achieved by easier (and more effective) means.
What does NUCON provide in that area ? will NUCON ask for the API key for the salesman of each corp ? will NUCON do the auditing ? who verifies NUCON audits ? does NUCON ask a 3rd party to do it ? etc etc etc.
I think those are the kind of questions you need to address to the community in case you want to move forward with your venture, IF u donÆt want the community participation, expertise or even comments I donÆt see why u did even bother to post (and reply) MD forum.
Just one more question in case you donÆt mind me asking, you keep talking about RL accomplishments etc etc, all very nice TBH, BUT on RL when a costumer/investor starts asking you questions do you reply ôif u donÆt believe me DONÆT INVESTö (that and avoiding answering questions in a direct manner) or do u even try to make fun of them if they doubt you (as u have done in the forum)? if you answer yes then I will find hard to believe anything u say about RLà making your previous statements just the delirious ramblings of a madman that should be (and probably is) in a mental house (with access to a PC in the facilities). In case you answer no, then I ask again why did you act as u do here on the forum? and if u behave like this on a computer Vs your RL why should anyone trust you with a single isk ?
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jongalt
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Posted - 2007.12.18 17:05:00 -
[206]
Edited by: jongalt on 18/12/2007 17:06:57 Edited by: jongalt on 18/12/2007 17:06:25 Edited by: jongalt on 18/12/2007 17:06:05 im not saying this specific "venture" is a scam, but it does fall under a number of confidence tricks.
but then, if you read closely, so do most of the legitimate IPO's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_trick
-jg.
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Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 17:25:00 -
[207]
Assens
To answer your last questions first - I treat kids like kids - chances are in RL they wouldnt last a minute working for me - probably loaded with excuses and insecurities - so I speak in a language they understand. If everyone here posted in the exact manner you have Assens, things would have been much simpler.
As for the questions regarding IPO's and credibilty building - thats the point. Everyone here seems to think that the RL stock market functions FOR the CEO's so that they can make TONS of money.. wrong it doesnt. The REAL stock exchanges function similar to ours except they allow for a previous history as well that is documented. We tried our best to bring that type of exchange into EVE without sacrificing too many features or regulations. If a CEO really wants to be listed, and wants to earn his credibility then it is up to him to prove it, why shouldnt it take 3 months to prove it? What if his corp suddenly is trading at 15x Book/Price value? Now his investors are burdening the risk on hopes of profit - but the CEO earned it by spending 3 months proving it. Now it doesnt need to take 3 months do accomplish anything, since this game is a 24/7 "job" technically you can issue dividends, PR's, etc on a daily basis if you really wanted to. Say you earned 100M a day - and put 1M a day towards the stock - every day - I guarantee that investors will flock to it after they see it growing and growing. A CEO who functions like that is worthy of the credibility, praise, and a multiple share price to book value.
The NUEX Team reviewed the current share trading system heavily before deciding on a plan of action, and as far as we are concerned our plan is far superior to those current share trading systems.
Sure trust is an issue, especially for those who were burned here already, and we can only promise that we will be here to help others - and in the case that we can no longer play EVE, we will put a worthy player(s) in charge of the exchange - or if we are in fear of its security and continued growth, liquidate it and distribute assets to shareholders.
Can we completely stop all types of scams or scamming on our exchange, the simple answer is no we cant stop ALL scams, but we can mitigate as many as possible through regulations that are in place, and insure investors to the last net value of their share cost. Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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LaVista Vista
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.18 17:31:00 -
[208]
Originally by: Minerva Vulcan
Originally by: Ufl The NUEX Team
Who exactly does this team consist of?
So far I believe all we've seen is you.
Have there ever been any team but Ufl and Ufail?
This signature is brought to you by EBankÖ, free space for moderators to brag. |
Ufl
Caldari Nucon
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Posted - 2007.12.18 17:32:00 -
[209]
Originally by: LaVista Vista
Originally by: Minerva Vulcan
Originally by: Ufl The NUEX Team
Who exactly does this team consist of?
So far I believe all we've seen is you.
Have there ever been any team but Ufl and Ufail?
Lol I love name games.
Im going to uninstall you, reformat and install XP.
Vista sucks. Best Regards Ufl Nucon Stock Exchange [OUR VISION]
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LaVista Vista
Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz
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Posted - 2007.12.18 17:33:00 -
[210]
Edited by: LaVista Vista on 18/12/2007 17:37:41
Originally by: Ufl
Originally by: LaVista Vista
Originally by: Minerva Vulcan
Originally by: Ufl The NUEX Team
Who exactly does this team consist of?
So far I believe all we've seen is you.
Have there ever been any team but Ufl and Ufail?
Lol I love name games.
Im going to uninstall you, reformat and install XP.
Vista sucks.
Please do. Am i supposed to get offended? I might just prefer linux ;)
But if you DO uninstall me, watch your boot.ini. Who knows where it could end up.
This signature is brought to you by EBankÖ, free space for moderators to brag. |
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