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IDF187
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Posted - 2008.02.20 01:17:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: CetusOfAsuran
Originally by: Keyn Thror
Hello!
5 energy neutralizer towers + lots of warp scrmabling drones... And the damage is enough to destroy the heavily tanked battleship, that survived most lvl 4 missions... Isn't it too much for a lvl 3 mission, that is supposed to be done with a Battlecruiser at most?
Dear CCP, if you could, please rebalance this mission. It's nearly impossible to be done.
This mission is BIT TRICKY AT BEST cant really say i had much trouble in an ACTIVE tank drake even when the towers had sapped all my cap take the towers first then the scramble drones and heh presto cakewalk.
wimp
What kind of a stupid suggestion is this? He needs a drake to finish this mission, and you call him wimp. So as a person who flyes Amarr you need to suddenly just for that mission start flying caldari??? If thats the case this mission shouldnt even be given to amarr. Amarr if you havent realised yet havily rely on energy, If their energy is gone no pew pew anymore get it??? Dont know how to explain it better, would Russian work for you m8? If the towers sap all OP's energy as they did for ur drake, he wont be able to shoot. If you call him wimp you are simply not as smart as u think, cause apperantly u cant think
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Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.02.20 01:35:00 -
[62]
I did this one in a dual-rep Typhoon (I'm lazy); 4 ACs, 4 Cruises. The Cruises took down the towers quickly and drones took out the scramblers. It did get interesting for a bit while the cap recovered and I had to cycle the reppers but no warps needed. I wouldn't dare run it in my Geddon though, or anything other than a Drake or Myrmi on the BC sized ships...
To me it seems to be a level 4 difficulty, not a level 3. And unlike the 10/10 storyline you don't just have the option of popping the center tower and running.
Originally by: Audri Fisher
On the other, the emo tears being cryed in this thread tell me that just because you shoot somebody for a living, does not mean you aren't a carebear
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Ayumi Hikari
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Posted - 2008.02.20 16:53:00 -
[63]
a buddy of mine had problems with this mission the other day...i fitted 6 medium smartbombs, charged in and pop pop pop pop pop pop pop
easy as pie 
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Kathryn Dougans
B. S. Radioactive Sheep Farm
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Posted - 2008.02.20 17:12:00 -
[64]
Options for this mission with Amarr ships?
From what I hear from others, it is so much easier in a passive tanked Drake, suggesting that for an Amarr pilot esp. one without lots of skillpoints, you're better off not doing the mission at all.
I did this mission in a Harbinger, no rigs. T2 tank, T1 guns, T1 drones.
It was the proverbial "teh suck".
Midslots fitted with cap injectors, and hold filled with charges for them.
Drone control link in high, to extend drone control range.
The neutralising towers drained my capacitor before I got to within about 50km, hence cap injectors, so I could actually do something, and the drone control link so my drones could do something.
Sent my drones out after the towers. Shot as many of the rats as I could. Able to take down 1 tower and several npcs before running out of charges and hammerheads. Warped out. Came back, shot another tower, lost another 5 drones, Repeat 3 times. Last time out, swap cap injectors for other modules, destroy all remaining npcs.
Final cost. 15 Hammerheads, plus some 250,000 isk in structure repairs, plus the cost of the cap booster charges.
Overall, this mission required a lot more effort than other level3s, and several level4s.
I suppose the equivalent for Caldari pilots would be a mission with several towers that shoot defender missiles at your missiles regardless of who you were shooting at. Possibly also a reverse shield transporter.
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Goa Vibe
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Posted - 2008.02.20 17:14:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Goa Vibe on 20/02/2008 17:19:08
argh... I watched my passive tanked drake go pop last weekend. after doing this a couple times in the past (diff strat) with no problems. This time I was taking about 550 dps (ie: I was tanked to 270 hp/sec max, with about 50% resist across the board) (4xSRPII, 2xSRII, 2xLSEII, PassEM, Pass??).... one more lvl in shield comp, battlecruiser, or one more LSE would have cut it.
My fatal flaw was ignoring the inital wave of drones, and instead... popping the neuts, statis towers, and bunkers which doubled the number of drones on me... like 40-ish... I *almost* had enough tank... I was pure passive and probably could have pulled it off with an invuln, as i had my cap back after killing the neuts. I was hovering at 28% for the longest time, then I guess a bunch of lucky shots got me to 24%-ish which going below that decreases my shield regen... all over after that... since i was still scrammed.
i've sat thru this before tanking fine, but i guess eventually with that many drones firing at you, you are going to have a string of 'excellent' shots on you which can break your tank... even though you can tank.. average damage well, those infrequent strings of crits against you will get you. so I want to avoid this chance occurance altogether....
so revised my strategy: do NOT pop the neuts, statis, and missile batteries... because killing them spawns 2 drones each. fit for pure passive and ignore the loss of cap.
now, since you know you will be at 0 cap, you aren't going to warp out anytime soon - so ignore the scramming strain drones.
highest priority is violator drones, they do most damage, I think.
take out the rest of the drones, if you fit guns, target any new drones when they come in your optimal range since they'll be at 0 transversal and easy to pop. Ignore mommy ship til last.
after killing all small drones, pop a tower, kill the spawns, then work on next tower.
when you get to the mommy ship, if you use missiles, try to stay <10km so his defenders won't pop ur missiles... more dps for you.
if you have 2 players and can't tank these, you can always use a 'wild weasel'... warp your big dps ship in first, start warping out immediately, the towers will aggro you, you then warp out - since strains havent gotten to you yet. during this time warp in your wild weasel - a fast frig, quickly get out of 50km range of all ships. when your dps ship warps out, you'll get aggro of the towers, you'll be cap drained to 160km, and have aggro of all the frigs... kite them at range. Once you have 160km from towers, youll get cap back for AB usage. Fly ur dps ship back in, kill the towers and the spawns since they will target the closer dps ship. After taking out all structures, kill the kited drones... if your kiter knows what he is doing, he can kite the drones in a big circle so they never stray far from the center of the area...
if you are an active tanker, pop the neuts asap, your cap will last you for a bit, and you'll regain cap once they are all down - be warned you'll have a ton of drones on you by killing the structures ....
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FlameGlow
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Posted - 2008.02.21 07:52:00 -
[66]
Popping bunkers really boosts drone numbers, towers add only 2-3 and a bunker adds 8-10, so save bunkers for later.
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Gregor64
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Posted - 2008.02.21 16:17:00 -
[67]
Yes it is a very hard but fun mission, i have completed this twice now in a passive tanked drake. I used 3 passive hardiners and 3 large shield extender 2's in my mids. I usually run 2 bcu 2's in my lows but only ran 1 for this one opting for the extra shield recharge. I also use 3 purger rigs. I have also lost a big shiney amarr battleship on this mission  LOL, the 1st time I did it.
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Ragnar Darkstar
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Posted - 2008.02.22 07:41:00 -
[68]
First time I ran this mission (one of the first level 3s I got) I agg'd the whole room and neary got pwned. However, once you know what triggers what it is pretty easy.
I just ran this again tonight and breezed through easily in a tech I fit Drake. Key is a setup that requires no cap.
High: 7 Malkuth HML
Mid: 4 passive hardener I (2EM, 1Therm, 1 Kin), 2 LSE I
Lows: 2 BCU I, 1 named SPR, 1 CFC I
Rigs: none
Warp in and maintain at least 45 KM distance from all towers. Don't shoot anything. Wait for various drone waves to spawn and kill them as they spawn, flying away from them if necessary to keep damage down. Eventually battleship spawns. Kill it and any additional drone waves that spawn.
Wait until it is clear that no more spawns are coming, then kill towers one by one. Some towers will spawn more drone after you kill them, so wait after to kill each one to clear the spawn before moving onto the next.
My skills are still very noobish (BC 3, relevant missile/shield skills to 3/4) but I never got below 70% shield.
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Gwen Rockpounder
D.M.Z.
Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.03.15 04:24:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Gwen Rockpounder on 15/03/2008 04:28:16
I just did all the steps in a ishtar with 2 x ccc and 2 x medium t2 armor reps and 3 energized adaptive nano t2, worked like a charm didnt even have trouble with the neut. towers :)
could run my 1 rep perm and the other rep on and off every 10 sec without problems, however if you let those small drones get close it hurts so fit a smartbomb guys =D +5k range pls ;)
and lost 0 drones =D
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Kaleidon Reth
Intercommercial Aerospace Retail United Stations
ICARUS Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.15 06:20:00 -
[70]
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this mission say "WARNING! Bring a friend" or something o that effect in red(!) text?
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Gwen Rockpounder
D.M.Z.
Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.03.15 15:23:00 -
[71]
Yes it does, i was also worried about my ishtar because it said this, but due to my good target calling etc i where holding it pretty good, sometimes i was licking the hull but that was due to crap calling =D
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Lordbeefy
renewed common wealth
Black Sun Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.17 13:04:00 -
[72]
I took this one on first time about a month ago, solo, in a 95% passive drake. The only thing acitve were my 2 T2 invuln fields. Other than that a fairly standard Drake loadout.
I havnt done a single lvl 4 ever, and my character had about 3mill sp's.
Yes it was difficult....no, actually it wasnt difficult...it was scary. Let me explain....I jumped in, started flying towards the base, and realised the nos towers were there....I target prioritised, and flew right into range for my hvy missiles and targetted only the nis and webber towers. I took them out, then turned around and flew away.
I used my drones to taske on the small stuff while I was doing this, and then after the nos towers were down and my shileds started coming back up (dropped to 15% at one point)I started going after the various installations that were left...then the bs last.
I have done it three more times since. twice helping others, and once solo.
I am not particularly experience, nor some uber character. It was a fun, scary mission, and put a bit of variety into my more mundane isk generating missions. Oh, and it generated a fair amount of isk once fully salvaged.
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Caius Sivaris
Dark Nexxus
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Posted - 2008.03.17 17:16:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Keyn Thror
And the damage is enough to destroy the heavily tanked battleship, that survived most lvl 4 missions... Isn't it too much for a lvl 3 mission, that is supposed to be done with a Battlecruiser at most?
Didn't it cross your mind that a BC is actually a better ship than a BS for level 3 missions?
Even with less theorical DPS on small target the effective dps of cruiser guns will be much higher on the target you usually encounter in L3 missions (no BS).
Not having done this particular mission yet I can't comment on its possible imbalance, but when I feel like doing a L3 mission I take a HAC or BC, not a BS.
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Evil Incarn8
Special Operations Corp
Final Retribution Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.17 17:29:00 -
[74]
ok I have read most replies but cant seem to see a solution other then fly a drake you noob.
I am Amarrian I fly Amarr with lasers and have a few basic drone skills, i would appreciate a solution that would work for characters that are not caldari, dont fly caldari and/or dont have millions of ISK/sp to burn on fittings.
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Spaztick
Canadian Assault Network
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Posted - 2008.03.17 21:56:00 -
[75]
I'd be fine if this mission said that you would be reamed with scramblers or at least told that it's an almost guaranteed loss of your ship if you go in with anything other than a beefed up passive tank. But that's just my opinion. I actually think it's good to have some humility once in a while.
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Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.03.17 23:52:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Evil Incarn8
ok I have read most replies but cant seem to see a solution other then fly a drake you noob.
I am Amarrian I fly Amarr with lasers and have a few basic drone skills, i would appreciate a solution that would work for characters that are not caldari, dont fly caldari and/or dont have millions of ISK/sp to burn on fittings.
Didn't do it but I'd say a Harbinger with heavy beams (so you are in range immediately) and a cap booster should be OK. Start by popping the neutralizers, cap charges should sustain your tank long enough. And while you pop the neutralizing towers have light drones work on the "strain" drones, those are the ones that scramble and are not really tough.
--
Heat, easy to burn your mods by mistake, hard to get it to work when you need it the most. Well designed interface CCP! |
BorisHotch
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2008.03.18 00:07:00 -
[77]
Just been reading through all the posts, and it seems to me like it's an ideal mission if you are an experienced player who usually does lvl 4 missions, but would be very hard for a few month old character who is only able to do lvl 3 missions.
I've not done it personally, but sounds like fun 
BTW, if anyone is struggling doing it, i've created a channel specifically for helping people on missions called "helpmymission".
Please feel free to pop in there and take a look. It's totally genuine, with lots of very experienced people happy to help out |
Reven Cordelle
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.03.18 09:41:00 -
[78]
New Frontiers is definately one you need to fleet up for. Ideally a Passive Tanked Drake with a bit of shield repping from a Logistics ship will breeze this. The DPS is mental and although my passive Drake tanks other Level 3s at 70 - 80% shield, it couldn't keep up with the damage on its own for very long at all.
You get absolutely pounded. Smartbombs help with the swarming but it's not an ideal situation when fleeted. For example, I made a previous post a while ago about a fleetmate smartbombing my drones by accident, so his Drake was concorded in a timely fashion. However during the whole Op, this was the only loss we had with one warp out each.
I think the trick is (in a passive drake) to hit the Strain drones first. They're the warp jamming bastards so if you take them out, you're free to warp. You shouldnt need cap so the neut towers aren't really primary.
Despite how much of a bastard New Frontiers is, the story elements are pretty deep during the mission briefing. Also after completing New Frontiers for the first time, my hatred of Drones was driven home. Its an absolute hellhole of a level 3, and should never be attempted alone unless you have some serious fittings. I had less trouble running "Down the Slavers" Level 4 in my Drake with one fleetmate assisting than in New Frontiers. (Though getting the DPS from a Drake for level 4s is hard, and taking down shield repping battleships takes bloody ages).
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Hanneshannes
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.18 12:01:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Hanneshannes on 18/03/2008 12:01:57
Ignoring everything that has been said in this topic (I love to do that)
I (2.5M SP) have soloed this mission in a drake (every part of it, eexcept for the mining part since the drake doesn't have turret slots for mining lasers).
I was using active hardeners and the neut towers annoyed me but anyway:
Drake
7 Malkuths
1 Tractor
2 LSE II
2 Hardeners (Invuln and Photon Scattering Field)
2 SR II
3 SPR II
1 BCS I
There was one stage with 5 or so neu towers and a ****load of frigates spawned when I attacked and killed the towers I think, but I killed the neut towers, thent he scramming frigates (Strain), then warped out with 40% shield left. Let my cap and shield get up to normal lvl, warped back in and finished the mission.
nor probs at all really, but one of the missions that require a bit more attention.
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Chewie Soloh
SkillzKillz
United For 0rder
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Posted - 2008.03.18 12:13:00 -
[80]
Edited by: Chewie Soloh on 18/03/2008 12:14:06
That was a wierd call, most passive dranks get down to a bout 23-27% and then just sit their laughing at anything short of a T2 Voided (neutron II) deimos....
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Hanneshannes
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.18 12:16:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Evil Incarn8
ok I have read most replies but cant seem to see a solution other then fly a drake you noob.
I am Amarrian I fly Amarr with lasers and have a few basic drone skills, i would appreciate a solution that would work for characters that are not caldari, dont fly caldari and/or dont have millions of ISK/sp to burn on fittings.
Train caldari cruiser to lvl 4 (about 6 days with +3 implants and learning + advanced ones at 4) and get a drake.
It's the best choice for lvl 3 missions really and while you are at it, train for a raven as well and get your engineering, esp cap skills up for that.
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Salpad
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Posted - 2008.03.18 21:37:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby
I did this one in a dual-rep Typhoon (I'm lazy); 4 ACs, 4 Cruises. The Cruises took down the towers quickly and drones took out the scramblers. It did get interesting for a bit while the cap recovered and I had to cycle the reppers but no warps needed. I wouldn't dare run it in my Geddon though, or anything other than a Drake or Myrmi on the BC sized ships...
To me it seems to be a level 4 difficulty, not a level 3. And unlike the 10/10 storyline you don't just have the option of popping the center tower and running.
At the very least, perhaps the ISK completion reward, ISK time bonus and LP reward needs to be increased, for the sole purpose of signaling to players that this is heavy duty stuff?
That's how my mind works. If I see lots of ISK and lots of LP, I think "gotta be careful with this one, dude". Or even if the time bonus deadline is generous, like 5-7 hours.
I got this mission myself, haven't started it yet (deadline 22nd), and until reading this thread I didn't know it was a super-tricky one, but fortunately I have a friend or two who will probably help me out. Still, I'm somewhat intimidated...
--
Salpad |
Tomogara
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Posted - 2008.03.21 03:11:00 -
[83]
Here's one question, does anyone know if there's a damage breakdown of this mission? It's not in eveinfo's database of missions.
Was curious to see the ratios of damage -- I know you get all 4 types but they're probably not a 25%/25%/25%/25% ratio, and so when I'm fitting as if they are all equally important, I may be fitting suboptimally.
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Iain Cubair
Gattaca Co
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Posted - 2008.03.22 14:55:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Lubomir Penev
Didn't do it but I'd say a Harbinger with heavy beams (so you are in range immediately) and a cap booster should be OK. Start by popping the neutralizers, cap charges should sustain your tank long enough. And while you pop the neutralizing towers have light drones work on the "strain" drones, those are the ones that scramble and are not really tough.[/quote
Exactly. You don't need a drake although that might be the easiest way.
I used a Harbinger with an active tank fitted for cap recharge (4*CRII, 1*CPRII, no rigs, recharge rate of 175s) and had no cap problems. Kept a nice range and let the hobgoblins do the dirty job at a distance. Scoop them back at each respawn so you don't lose them.
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Tomogara
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.24 22:21:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Tomogara on 24/03/2008 22:25:48
By the way, this is absolute cake if you:
1. Don't need capacitor to deal DPS (missiles or drones),
2. Have long DPS range (again, missiles or drones).
You'll need to set up yourself to passive tank, but it need not be all that great -- really you need to be tanking only a single NPC (the battleship drone) for most of the fight.
The ideal of course is the drake (easy to set up a strong passive tank, 7 missile launchers to DPS from range), but anyone using missiles and/or drones is going to do pretty decently, so, for example, a Dominix should be able to handle themselves pretty easily too. If this is a tall order for you, grab a friend who can and make sure they warp in first (just "warp fleet" then cancel your own warp to send him there first). Only the first person to warp in will have their energy depleted.
Anyhow, to do it the easy way:
1. Warp in and ignore the energy neuts. Start moving away from the drone structures (at this point, nothing except towers should exist).
2. There will be a wave or two of timed drone spawns, they will be far away and slow, so kill them.
3. After the initial waves, you'll basically be following a pattern of attacking one of the structures (drone bunker or one of the towers), killing the wave of drones that spawn, and then attacking another structure. Zero to eight drones spawn with each structure as soon as you first fire upon it, nothing spawns on structure death. I always killed Drone Bunkers, then missile towers, then neut towers, then stasis towers (which never webified me, their range is terrible).
4. At some point a battleship appears, just leave this one for last. Killing it spawned another eight drones for me. For me, this was about the only thing that actually dealt damage to me -- the rest was killed when it was so far away they didn't even hurt me. And I could passively tank this one indefinitely.
Overall, the only trick to the mission is getting a ship (or a friend) who can do just fine with zero capacitor, because my cap was gone within fifty seconds (granted my capacity and recharge suck anyway; a ship with good cap may hold out longer). Warp-outs are impossible, you're playing with your ship as the stakes.
However, if you ignore the neut towers at first and clear things systematically, the enemy DPS is laughably small -- it's only if you put all the towers first and spawn 50+ drones on yourself will it hurt badly.
When I did it, I used 7 launchers with EM missiles for the initial waves, then swapped to 4 EM/3 Kinetic for towers -- I'd launch an EM volley which would take out the shields and also spawn the wave of drones, swap the EM launchers to drones and use the 3 kinetic to take out the armor/structure of the tower, then move to the next tower. When I went to the battleship and the final wave that follows the battleship's death, I went to all EM again.
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Tomogara
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.24 22:41:00 -
[86]
By the way, my core stats were about:
12k shield, all shield resistances in the 60-75% range, 545 second shield recharge. I have no riggings fit; I was using 4x tech II resistance amplifiers and 2x large shield extender IIs in my med slots, and 4x shield power relay II in low slots (which was drastic overkill as I'd heard the horror stories, next time I will go to 2x ballistic control II and 2x power relay II). Shields never dropped below 90%ish. I had no possibility of warping out but saw no need to.
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Stauner
Titans of Freespace
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Posted - 2008.03.25 12:10:00 -
[87]
Completed this mission (and the other 6 in the story line) in a passive tech 1 drake at the weekend. This mission was fun and a good learning experience although by the end of the storyline I was getting a bit annoyed at the effort/payoff ratio - Drones really should have bounties!!!
Anyway my (improvised) approach was:
1. warp in - lose cap immediately - get in firing range of the towers as fast as possible and take out the energy vampire towers and then the webbers - while this is happening the drones will realy start to hit you hard. From memory there was probably one webbing tower left when i got out with zero shields and minor armour damage
2. warp out - remove all but 3 of your heaviy missle launchers - buy and train energy pulse weapons, buy and fit 2 medium EMP smartbombs
3. warp in - use remaining missles to take out any remaining towers and the bigger drones that stay at range) while the little drones swarm around you - zap them with the smartbombs until they are all dead
4. Kill remaining drones with the missles (you might want to warp out and remove the smartbombs and put missiles back on)
5. go get a salvager
Like I said - this was my approach - very much ad-libbed but seemed to work quite well.
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Visko Altertunity
Incorpus CaP
Legion of Honor
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Posted - 2008.04.02 01:15:00 -
[88]
I come back to this thread with a 2nd opinion. First time I was completely newbish and didn't really know anything.. (turns out I was mistaking Deadspace Complexes with missions) so I by now understand 1 frig, 2 cruis, 3 bc, 4 bs is the basic outline. Now I'm flying in a T2 Passive Drake (fitted properly) and this mission is actually really easy, it does punch more than any other lvl3 mission for sure, but as long as you aim at the right targets it's not that difficult. The EVE mission survival guide does offer advice. (although this come from a missile user perspective, using lasers or hybrid weapons might be painful with the neut towers)
But now with the new patch showing you who's scrambling you it shouldn't be a problem for a battleship, just put the your drones on the right targets. (even before you just had to look a lil closer) It's a bit more challenging in the regard you kind of have to look for things and pay attention. When all you do is run missions, this mission is kind of refreshing in the aspect that you actually have to play the game instead of choosing a random target, setting all your weapons to attack it, and watch tv till you hear an explosion.
But nowadays I run lvl4's with my Drake anyways so, this mission is old news to me.
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Synnyr
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.04.02 13:29:00 -
[89]
My character has less than 3 million skill points.
I fly a T1 Drake with T1 gear, T1 Missiles, and no rigs whatsoever.
While this mission is difficult it is do-able. My secret was that I researched it before I went in and found out that if you take out the energy neutralizers you'll trigger addional spawns.
Sometimes brains > brawn.
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Yogo Hong
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.04.02 14:00:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Reven Cordelle
New Frontiers is definately one you need to fleet up for.
Oh please, Reven. I have done New Frontiers twice, and while I agree that first time can be hard, second time was a breeze with my Myrmidon.
- Warp in
Park ship
Launch Drones
??
PROFIT!
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