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Topic |
SKINK0429
Final Conflict UK
SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.18 12:31:00 -
[1]
I understand torps have been nerfed but having never used them dnt know in what way? Whats the range of both of the above and why is one better than the other as I am about to start using them.
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Amberly Coteaz
Amarr
Blood Corsair's
Blood Blind
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Posted - 2008.02.18 13:24:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: SKINK0429
I understand torps have been nerfed but having never used them dnt know in what way? Whats the range of both of the above and why is one better than the other as I am about to start using them.
Torps were not nerfed, the range was reduced and the rate of fire on the launchers was reduced. The net effect was a 33% increase in damage per second and a reduction to a 20km max range (30km raven).
Basically if you want to PvP with a high damage missile battleship use torps. If you want lesser damage but great range be it for PvP or PvE use Cruise
If you find yourself in a fair fight, something has gone wrong |
Fraggl
Black Sheeps
Solidus Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.18 23:30:00 -
[3]
yeah on the one hand it itsnt a nerv - but on the other hand you cant go hunting with them anymore, so in that aspect its an nerv =(
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Beef Hardslab
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
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Posted - 2008.02.18 23:34:00 -
[4]
Basically they just made torps/cruise akin to most every other weapon system in the game - if you want high damage, you have **** range. If you want high range, you have **** damage.
Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve:
Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii
Podding my own alt in a gatecamp while drunk, he was carrying a hauler full of tech II goods, Oops.
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Mr Abbadon
Illuminati Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.02.18 23:52:00 -
[5]
i dont know if im doing something wrong but i cant shoot torps beyond 10k
_______________________________________________________________
Quote:
[22:28] <Druid> as far as I know the BPO's were gotten legitimately.
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Dust Rocket
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Posted - 2008.02.19 00:14:00 -
[6]
U probably lack skills and Raven is mandatory for longer range. Golem will do also
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Lady Octavia
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Posted - 2008.02.19 00:19:00 -
[7]
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Black-Out
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Posted - 2008.02.19 00:41:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Lady Octavia
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
Unless you're firing at, say, anything using a MWD.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.02.19 07:40:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 19/02/2008 07:41:25
Originally by: Amberly Coteaz
Torps were not nerfed, the range was reduced and the rate of fire on the launchers was reduced. The net effect was a 33% increase in damage per second and a reduction to a 20km max range (30km raven).
Sure they were nerfed, for PvE that is. Now they are only viable in about half the missions, where before they were effective for 90% of them. And the damage boost wasn't 33%, as no mission can be done without reloading, which now happens 25% more frequently. Coupled with the already mentioned exp radius increase, means with a single painter you will only do full damage to most battleships, and not even all of the npc battleships, with T1 ammo. Much less BC's and cruisers.
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Gamesguy
Amarr
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.02.19 08:00:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Lady Octavia
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
Which is a lie, even without a painter the new torp still does 20+% more dps than the old one.
Cruise is ********ly easy to fit compared to rails/tach/arty.
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Anon Forumalt
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Posted - 2008.02.19 12:08:00 -
[11]
The new torps are fun for PVP, but effectively useless for PVE. Maybe somebody out there has a Raven setup that is anything close to stable with a MWD, but I haven't found one. This sentences the entire Caldari ratting/missioning population to the use of Cruise Missiles, which do agonizingly little damage.  |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.19 12:40:00 -
[12]
Torps are perfectly fine for missions. You just need to bring jav torps now for longer range, and forgo permatanking unless you have a Golem with Gist booster. But permatanking is for only for inefficient wusses or fools running in Motsu anyway.
Oh and of course torps for missions got *slightly* more skill intensive ;)
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Derek Sigres
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Posted - 2008.02.19 14:56:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: Lady Octavia
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
Which is a lie, even without a painter the new torp still does 20+% more dps than the old one.
Cruise is ********ly easy to fit compared to rails/tach/arty.
I have always wondered why no one rails against caldari because of the ease of fitting many of the missile systems. 6 Cruise, and all the t2 fittings I could want in the rest of the slots and I have plenty of room to spare. If I go for torps then I have to really wedge some of the gear in there. On the other side of the coin, I can barely fit 8 425mm rail II's in a Rokh without fitting mods.
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Bronson Hughes
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2008.02.19 15:54:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Lady Octavia
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
Have you ever looked at the signature radius on most NPC battleships?
It's 700m.
That's large enough to take significant damage from capital torps, let alone battleship torps. You will need fo fit a painter to damage battlecruisers and cruisers of course since they usually only have a signature radius of 300m, but even then, the reduced damage is more than enough to kill them efficiently.
Range is an issue, I will grant you, but on a Raven with an Afterburner and good navigation skills that shouldn't be too much of a problem. Sure you can't uber-tank, but no other PvE battleship can mount an AB, short-range high-damage weapons, and an uber-tank.
And anyone saying that torps got nerfed for PvP just doesn't know how to use them. Being able to do (non-gank-fit) Blasterthron damage from 30km is sick.
--------------------
"I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.19 19:18:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Bronson Hughes
Originally by: Lady Octavia
It was a huge nerf. They increased the sign radius of torps so if you dont use painters you do the same dmg as before nerf at much lower range. And while other weapons short range type needs much less fitting than long range guns, torps remained hard to fit.
Have you ever looked at the signature radius on most NPC battleships?
It's 700m.
That's large enough to take significant damage from capital torps, let alone battleship torps. You will need fo fit a painter to damage battlecruisers and cruisers of course since they usually only have a signature radius of 300m, but even then, the reduced damage is more than enough to kill them efficiently.
Range is an issue, I will grant you, but on a Raven with an Afterburner and good navigation skills that shouldn't be too much of a problem. Sure you can't uber-tank, but no other PvE battleship can mount an AB, short-range high-damage weapons, and an uber-tank.
And anyone saying that torps got nerfed for PvP just doesn't know how to use them. Being able to do (non-gank-fit) Blasterthron damage from 30km is sick.
Uhm... Don't talk about stuff you don't know jack about. Most NPC battleships have sig radii of less than 400m, and the largest ones are 460m. Nothing comes even close to 700, and Angels go as low as 320m.
Not saying that torps aren't fine anyway, but I hate it when people act like they are experts when they know fk all 
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Exlegion
New Light
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.19 19:45:00 -
[16]
Leandro Salazar,
What range are you getting with the Jav torps?
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
Bronson Hughes
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2008.02.19 19:46:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Most NPC battleships have sig radii of less than 400m, and the largest ones are 460m. Nothing comes even close to 700, and Angels go as low as 320m.
Not saying that torps aren't fine anyway, but I hate it when people act like they are experts when they know fk all
If that's the case then  .
I assumed that CCP had gotten their size column on the overview to actually show signature radius correctly; my overview shows most NPC battleships at 700m, with drone battleships being one of the few exceptions.
I guess we know what happens when people assume....
--------------------
"I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.19 20:11:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 19/02/2008 20:13:21
Originally by: Exlegion
Leandro Salazar,
What range are you getting with the Jav torps?
Personally I have a theoretical range of 55.2 km and and effective range of roughly 50km atm, but with perfect skills, T2 rigs and the best implant, you can go out to 67.4 km theoretical on a Golem and 74.6 on a CNR.
And even with just 50 I do fine, havent found a BS yet that orbits further away than that and if you make them race towards you right away, the delay until you can waste them is very low.
@ Bronson: Well, that is at least a good explanation for your misinformation. Easy to fall victim to that. But size really doesn't have much to do with sig radius. Just look at the Mach, its a big as a carrier but has only 340m...
And what faction torps do to the stuff closer than 33km is just beautiful.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Bronson Hughes
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2008.02.19 20:17:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Bronson Hughes on 19/02/2008 20:19:35
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
@ Bronson: Well, that is at least a good explanation for your misinformation. Easy to fall victim to that. But size really doesn't have much to do with sig radius. Just look at the Mach, its a big as a carrier but has only 340m...
And what faction torps do to the stuff closer than 33km is just beautiful.
Just out of curiosity, how do you get a reliable measure of a target's signature radius?
EDIT: Not the base values of player ships, but the actual values for ships in space after things like shield extenders, shield rigs, IStabs, etc. have jacked it up.
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"I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Anon Forumalt
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Posted - 2008.02.19 20:20:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 19/02/2008 20:13:21
Originally by: Exlegion
Leandro Salazar,
What range are you getting with the Jav torps?
Personally I have a theoretical range of 55.2 km and and effective range of roughly 50km atm, but with perfect skills, T2 rigs and the best implant, you can go out to 67.4 km theoretical on a Golem and 74.6 on a CNR.
And even with just 50 I do fine, havent found a BS yet that orbits further away than that and if you make them race towards you right away, the delay until you can waste them is very low.
@ Bronson: Well, that is at least a good explanation for your misinformation. Easy to fall victim to that. But size really doesn't have much to do with sig radius. Just look at the Mach, its a big as a carrier but has only 340m...
And what faction torps do to the stuff closer than 33km is just beautiful.
How exactly are you getting different range numbers on a CNR vs a Golem? Different rigs? |
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Bronson Hughes
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2008.02.19 20:21:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Anon Forumalt
How exactly are you getting different range numbers on a CNR vs a Golem? Different rigs?
Different number of rigs most likely. 3 for a CNR vs 2 for a Golem.
--------------------
"I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.19 20:59:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 19/02/2008 21:01:46
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 19/02/2008 21:00:17
Originally by: Bronson Hughes
Originally by: Anon Forumalt
How exactly are you getting different range numbers on a CNR vs a Golem? Different rigs?
Different number of rigs most likely. 3 for a CNR vs 2 for a Golem.
Yup. CNR can field 1 HBT2, 1 HBT1 and 1 RFC1. Golem is stuck with 2 HBT2.
And NPC ship sigs come from NPC data sites, my preferred one is elfarto.
For player ships, no idea aside from showinfo on your own ship.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Bronson Hughes
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2008.02.19 21:29:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
And NPC ship sigs come from NPC data sites, my preferred one is elfarto.
For player ships, no idea aside from showinfo on your own ship.
Thanks muchly for the tip Leandro.
--------------------
"I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Exlegion
New Light
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.20 00:14:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Personally I have a theoretical range of 55.2 km and and effective range of roughly 50km atm, but with perfect skills, T2 rigs and the best implant, you can go out to 67.4 km theoretical on a Golem and 74.6 on a CNR.
And even with just 50 I do fine, havent found a BS yet that orbits further away than that and if you make them race towards you right away, the delay until you can waste them is very low.
And what faction torps do to the stuff closer than 33km is just beautiful.
Very helpful info, Leandro. Thanks o/.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us,
you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
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