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Orin Valari
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Posted - 2008.02.28 16:05:00 -
[1]
Tell me what you guys think of these ideas. Just some broad ideas. Feel free to help me think of more specific, balanced bonuses.
new Tech 1, tier 2 destroyer: Role: Anti-EW Fleet Support Description: we'd have to hammer out the exact bonuses to make this balanced, but I'm thinking it would get bonuses on remote sensor-boosting, and maybe the ability to do some remote ECCM (which would probably require some new modules). This could maybe be extended to being a small logistics ship. Something along those lines.
new Tech 1, tier 3 destroyer: Role: squad command ship Description: thinking it can have the ability to fit 1 gang warfare module... maybe even if it only applies to frigates and destroyers. Perhaps give a base command bonus per level in destroyers as well, without a module fitted.
new Tech 2 destroyer: Role: Patrol Craft Description: Thinking this could fit 3 or 4 battleship size weapons similar to the stealth bomber. Perhaps they can only fit Torps... though I'm sure Large Guns would be okay too. I'm thinking to balance this they could have crap scan resolution, and crap tank. Decent speed. The idea would be DPS support with a larger fleet, but on their own they wouldn't be able to take much. Because of the larger weapons they'd be awful at killing frigs, but have HAC DPS against larger targets.
Anyways, your thoughts?
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Perfect Diamond
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:04:00 -
[2]
My thoughts:
First Idea: No need. EW ships are already primaried pretty quickly. Thats a faster solution then trying to counter their effectives directly.
Second Idea: Command ships do this pretty well as it is. But, I would be interested in discussion some different bonuses it could give. Note: This can't be tech 1 gang bonus mods are for t2 ships.
Third Idea: There would be some modeling problems with this idea. The exact size and number of guns would be debatable. The idea of a turret using "bomber" is appealing to me.
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Orin Valari
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:16:00 -
[3]
Good point on #1, maybe it could get some other fleet support bonuses... or maybe you could combine the 1st and 2nd ideas into a general purpose "support" destroyer... perhaps the support would depend on the race?
As for the "command" destroyer, maybe the command bonuses could be built in to the destroyer as it's bonuses. So they wouldn't be great, but it'd be a cool way to get into a ship with that role before investing millions of SPs into a command ship. I suppose it could be a T2 variant instead. It'd be neat if it could only provide leadership bonuses to other frigates/destroyers, though that might be tough to do programatically.
True about the modelling on the T2 ship, but I'm sure it could be worked out.
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Perfect Diamond
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:25:00 -
[4]
A thought about the possible bonuses: 1) Bonus to size warp disruption probe's field and/or WDFG 2) Bonus to increase max flight time of disruption probe
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Kronos Hopeslayer
Blueprint Haus Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:36:00 -
[5]
Just replace destroyers with salvage ships. Seriously, it's what they're used for so might as well give the bonus to salvage and cargo space instead of the combat bonus.
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Orin Valari
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:38:00 -
[6]
That actually isn't that bad of an idea. Maybe a T2 salvage specialized ship that gets salvaging bonuses/cargo space bonus, but has no weapon hardpoints.
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McClan
Caldari The Nightcrawlers
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:58:00 -
[7]
All destroyers should drop one high slot for a mid or low slot
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Dr Depression
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Posted - 2008.02.28 17:59:00 -
[8]
Originally by: McClan All destroyers should drop one high slot for a mid or low slot
agreed
or increased natural resists
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Nian Banks
Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.02.28 19:07:00 -
[9]
I was thinking more alone these lines for new t2 destroyers.
Name: Torrential Hull: Thrasher Role: Fleet Command Support Vessel
With the introduction of Fleet Command Ships came the requirement of the minmatar fleet to introduce a remodelled destroyer class ship as its entourage, with a greater survivability in large engagements compared to its base model the Thrasher, the Torrential is the cornerstone of a good defensive line to protect the fleets command ship from frigate and cruiser aggressors.
Developer: Core Complexions
ore Complexion's ships are unusual in that they favor electronics and defense over the "lots of guns" approach traditionally favored by the Minmatar.
Destroyer Skill Bonus: 10% bonus to Small Projectile Turret tracking speed and 5% bonus to Small Projectile Turret damage per level
Fleet Command Support Ship Bonus: 5% bonus to Small Projectile Turret rate of fire and 7.5% bonus to Shield Booster effectiveness per level
Penalty: -25% Rate Of Fire for all turrets Bonus: 50% bonus to optimal range for small projectile turrets
Slots 8(7/2):5:2 45km Targeting. T2 HAC resists. 25m3 Drone Bay, 10Mbit Drone Bandwidth
More powergrid and cpu, all other stats stay the same as the Thrasher.
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Twin blade
Minmatar The Triangle Exa Nation
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Posted - 2008.02.28 20:19:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Orin Valari That actually isn't that bad of an idea. Maybe a T2 salvage specialized ship that gets salvaging bonuses/cargo space bonus, but has no weapon hardpoints.
I would love that as i might then take up salvaging and not just leaving it all.
Note don't salvage's need a turret slots ? Death is great rember where all dying to get there. |
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Granth Roden
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Posted - 2008.02.29 00:32:00 -
[11]
Destroyers should be setup more like light cruisers, in terms of tank - just using small guns for anti-frig support. As it is they don't really have that much firepower and they're thin in the skin, plus they're big targets.
Think tier-1 or 2 cruisers (in terms of tank, armor and slots) with bonii for small guns (tracking + range) (4-6 guns no more) rather than medium. Same sig as current destroyers.
That'd make them nasty close-range gun platforms that would not be so easily killed, wouldn't be able to outrun cruisers but could deny space around a fleet.
The counter for these would be real cruisers, which with comparable/higher tank and bigger guns would hurt them.
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Moridan
Caldari GalacTECH Unlimited
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Posted - 2008.02.29 00:58:00 -
[12]
For fleet support role I would like to see them changed to a very long range frig killer. 50 to 100% optimal bonus, higher targeting range. Maybe lower number of turrets.
Another idea would make them mini huginns-rapiers. Give em a bonus to web and a little more tank with additional mid n low slots.
Might be too powerful, but fun. Really put a kink into interceptors. "Speak quietly and carry a big torpedo."
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Aegis Osiris
Gallente Demonic Retribution Pure.
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Posted - 2008.02.29 02:39:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Aegis Osiris on 29/02/2008 02:41:52 The EAW frigs kind of override some of the roles being bandied about here, and frankly it seems like most of these are being forcefully wedged in where they don't necessarily belong.
I agree that a tech 2 or tier 2 (or modified tier 1) salvage ship based on a destroyer hull would be useful and have a real point. Give it a bonus to salvage ability, tractor beam range, and cargo hold.
There is also another use for these, one that is actually more historical (not that it matters) and would fulfill a currently empty spot in the ship list.
Concept: Cloak Hunter Hull: Destroyer Bonus: fitting bonus for the 'advanced scanner' module, bonus to 'advanced scanner' success rate per ship level, perhaps a fitting bonus for recon launchers as well with bonus to special 'advanced system scanner' probe Changes from base hull: increase CPU, lower PG. This is intended to be a primarily electronic platform, not so much a pure combat ship.
'Advanced scanner' module: gives a % chance of detecting a cloaked ship within x range (50km radius? 100?). Chance is positively affected by player skills(s)and ship bonus, negatively affected by cloak type (proto's easier then improved easier then covert ops) and hostile ship bonus.
Probe would be similar, with a decent chance of picking up cloakers and getting the hunter onto the grid. Could be limited by range and/or scan time.
Prototype cloaks on ships not designed for cloaking would have a fairly high chance of being discovered. Improved cloaks would decrease the chance of discovery. Stealth bombers would get a good sized bonus to avoid detection, though chance would still exist. Covert Ops cloaked Recons would be VERY difficult, though again not impossible, and Covert Ops frigs would be either nearly impossible or simply immune to discovery. Modify the whole thing by the target ships sig radius.
Make sure that it makes a noticeable sound and/or visual effect (bring on the WWII asdic 'ping' baby!!), and you get some lovely cat and mouse. This provides a defense against cloaker gangs, but not a foolproof one, and a way to hunt down cloaking ratters that aren't careful.
Personally, I think this is long overdue. Everything else has a counter, why not this?
Plus, it'd provide an actual use for dessies....and it PINGS!! ________________________________________________ This thread does not exist
Sig in process.... |
Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Worms Corp
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Posted - 2008.02.29 03:00:00 -
[14]
first remove the ROF Penalty from current destroyers. second id love to see a T2 ASW ship built on destroyers. ASW(anti-Submarine warfare) ships would have tools for fighting the subs of EVE, cloaked ships. basicly would have the ability use three exclusive modules, Sonar Pulse, the Sonar Buoy Launcher, and the Hedgehog Spread Proximity Rocket(named after the WW2 Depth Charge that slaughtered 100s of U-Boats).
Sonar Pulse: basicly the Sonar Pulse module would be like a smartbomb except it would make a cloaked vessel "glow". this would be limited to 10km around the ship. Sonar Buoy: the Sonar Buoy would be kinda the same idea as an interdictor sphere except it would send out sonar pulses over a 15km radius, if a stealthed ship flies into the field it would glow but not fully decloak.
Hedgehog Rockets: these are the teeth of the ASW Destroyer, when a sonar pulse illuminates a cloaked ship these can be fired and they not only deal damage but of course cause the ship to decloak.
now for game balance reasons it would probally be smart to have the Hedgehogs not do enough to instagib ships like they did to submarines. but such a ship would be rather handy when defending something of value or working covert covert ops. id also say such ships should be classified under covops.
*I know that space has no Sound and as such Sonar wouldnt work, However i used Sonar as a term due to the content of the post i figured people would know what i ment better if i used something familiar(including refs to ASW). however im pretty sure the devs and lore guys at CCP could come up with EVE applicalble terms for such systems and ships.
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Orin Valari
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Posted - 2008.02.29 03:33:00 -
[15]
I love the idea of them being cloaked ship hunters! Not sure how much that'd be used, but that sounds hot.
t2 salvage boat makes a ton of sense.
I do like the idea of a mini command ship. It makes sense that you'd want something that does a similar job only smaller.
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Aegis Osiris
Gallente Demonic Retribution Pure.
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Posted - 2008.02.29 04:06:00 -
[16]
A 'Cloak Hunter' dessie would be used quite a bit, no doubt.
And I still disagree with the minicommand ship, but I can see how it might be fun.
________________________________________________ This thread does not exist
Sig in process.... |
Kirkus Jameus
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Posted - 2008.02.29 05:27:00 -
[17]
Viktor,
This is a wondermous idea! CCP - Work on this please!
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker first remove the ROF Penalty from current destroyers. second id love to see a T2 ASW ship built on destroyers. ASW(anti-Submarine warfare) ships would have tools for fighting the subs of EVE, cloaked ships. basicly would have the ability use three exclusive modules, Sonar Pulse, the Sonar Buoy Launcher, and the Hedgehog Spread Proximity Rocket(named after the WW2 Depth Charge that slaughtered 100s of U-Boats).
Sonar Pulse: basicly the Sonar Pulse module would be like a smartbomb except it would make a cloaked vessel "glow". this would be limited to 10km around the ship. Sonar Buoy: the Sonar Buoy would be kinda the same idea as an interdictor sphere except it would send out sonar pulses over a 15km radius, if a stealthed ship flies into the field it would glow but not fully decloak.
Hedgehog Rockets: these are the teeth of the ASW Destroyer, when a sonar pulse illuminates a cloaked ship these can be fired and they not only deal damage but of course cause the ship to decloak.
now for game balance reasons it would probally be smart to have the Hedgehogs not do enough to instagib ships like they did to submarines. but such a ship would be rather handy when defending something of value or working covert covert ops. id also say such ships should be classified under covops.
*I know that space has no Sound and as such Sonar wouldnt work, However i used Sonar as a term due to the content of the post i figured people would know what i ment better if i used something familiar(including refs to ASW). however im pretty sure the devs and lore guys at CCP could come up with EVE applicalble terms for such systems and ships.
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ceyriot
Crimson Rebellion
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Posted - 2008.02.29 06:23:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Aegis Osiris Edited by: Aegis Osiris on 29/02/2008 02:41:52 The EAW frigs kind of override some of the roles being bandied about here, and frankly it seems like most of these are being forcefully wedged in where they don't necessarily belong.
I agree that a tech 2 or tier 2 (or modified tier 1) salvage ship based on a destroyer hull would be useful and have a real point. Give it a bonus to salvage ability, tractor beam range, and cargo hold.
There is also another use for these, one that is actually more historical (not that it matters) and would fulfill a currently empty spot in the ship list.
Concept: Cloak Hunter Hull: Destroyer Bonus: fitting bonus for the 'advanced scanner' module, bonus to 'advanced scanner' success rate per ship level, perhaps a fitting bonus for recon launchers as well with bonus to special 'advanced system scanner' probe Changes from base hull: increase CPU, lower PG. This is intended to be a primarily electronic platform, not so much a pure combat ship.
'Advanced scanner' module: gives a % chance of detecting a cloaked ship within x range (50km radius? 100?). Chance is positively affected by player skills(s)and ship bonus, negatively affected by cloak type (proto's easier then improved easier then covert ops) and hostile ship bonus.
Probe would be similar, with a decent chance of picking up cloakers and getting the hunter onto the grid. Could be limited by range and/or scan time.
Prototype cloaks on ships not designed for cloaking would have a fairly high chance of being discovered. Improved cloaks would decrease the chance of discovery. Stealth bombers would get a good sized bonus to avoid detection, though chance would still exist. Covert Ops cloaked Recons would be VERY difficult, though again not impossible, and Covert Ops frigs would be either nearly impossible or simply immune to discovery. Modify the whole thing by the target ships sig radius.
Make sure that it makes a noticeable sound and/or visual effect (bring on the WWII asdic 'ping' baby!!), and you get some lovely cat and mouse. This provides a defense against cloaker gangs, but not a foolproof one, and a way to hunt down cloaking ratters that aren't careful.
Personally, I think this is long overdue. Everything else has a counter, why not this?
Plus, it'd provide an actual use for dessies....and it PINGS!!
/signed
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Xindi Kraid
Caldari Unethical Heroes Edge Of Sanity
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Posted - 2008.02.29 06:30:00 -
[19]
All great ideas. --Bird of Prey: Forum God |
Ban Shui
Eve University Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.02.29 10:46:00 -
[20]
I really like the idea of cloak hunter able to fit either a special scanner module or a special proble launcher with a smaller range (in the uhundreds of kms).
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Draeca
Combat-Evolved
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Posted - 2008.02.29 12:07:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:12:36 Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:07:41 I want a bomber. Not another stealth boat, just a good old bomber, serving as a small anti-capital and battleship platform. This could prolly help with the carrier overpopulation since carrier hotdrops wouldn't be a instant I-win-tactics anymore with these small bastards around. Deploying capital ships would require a bit more balls, planning and support.
Of course they'd have to be implemented carefully, since we'd want the bombers to be a strategic weapon against capital targets, not some sologankmobiles.
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Orin Valari
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Posted - 2008.02.29 18:58:00 -
[22]
Draeca that was more or less my idea with the "patrol" ship.
Fast, heavy damage. But should be very vulnerable when alone. Maybe insanely bad scan resolution or something
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Trevor Warps
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Posted - 2008.02.29 19:15:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Perfect Diamond
Second Idea: Command ships do this pretty well as it is. But, I would be interested in discussion some different bonuses it could give. Note: This can't be tech 1 gang bonus mods are for t2 ships.
Wrong. Command mods where first intended to be fitted on T1 BC. I would like to have more options than BCs or cap ship to fit a command mod.
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Xindi Kraid
Caldari Unethical Heroes Edge Of Sanity
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Posted - 2008.03.01 04:20:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Draeca Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:12:36 Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:07:41 I want a bomber. Not another stealth boat, just a good old bomber, serving as a small anti-capital and battleship platform. This could prolly help with the carrier overpopulation since carrier hotdrops wouldn't be a instant I-win-tactics anymore with these small bastards around. Deploying capital ships would require a bit more balls, planning and support.
Of course they'd have to be implemented carefully, since we'd want the bombers to be a strategic weapon against capital targets, not some sologankmobiles.
Can't have a stealth bomber without the regular version --Bird of Prey: Forum God |
William Darkk
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2008.03.01 05:10:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Draeca Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:12:36 Edited by: Draeca on 29/02/2008 12:07:41 I want a bomber. Not another stealth boat, just a good old bomber, serving as a small anti-capital and battleship platform. This could prolly help with the carrier overpopulation since carrier hotdrops wouldn't be a instant I-win-tactics anymore with these small bastards around. Deploying capital ships would require a bit more balls, planning and support.
Of course they'd have to be implemented carefully, since we'd want the bombers to be a strategic weapon against capital targets, not some sologankmobiles.
Maybe whatever it fires has an ugodly sig radius, so anything smaller than a BS would be barely scratched. Of course you'd still get the occasional "wrecking for instapop" hit though. -------------------------------------------------- <3 my Drones |
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