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Author	Topic
Karn Mithralia Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 11:06:00 - [31] Don't let the yapping of the slave dog derail this message of thanks brothers. The slaughter of their fleet speaks far louder than any words. -----------------------------------------
Mr Reeth The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.19 12:24:00 - [32] Do you mean the stations formerly know as MuratorÆs Defiance and Unity?
Karn Mithralia Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 12:38:00 - [33] No, the Sylph slave dog refers to recent warring between us in Assah. -----------------------------------------
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 14:58:00 - [34] All said and well... I hope you enjoy living on the fringes of outlaw space. You have outstayed your welcome and recent events have been caused by your own doing. Constant harrasement of UK forces of peacefull citizens and pilots in our space has led to this offensive, which is far from over. The Sylph Captains and crews that gave their lives for the destruction of presumably the last inhabitated U'K structures in the conflict area did this knowning they would leave behind a safer area, ridden of the Terrorist Scum known as Ushra'Khan.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:28:00 - [35] Originally by: 128th ABC123 All said and well... I hope you enjoy living on the fringes of outlaw space. You have outstayed your welcome and recent events have been caused by your own doing. Constant harrasement of UK forces of peacefull citizens and pilots in our space has led to this offensive, which is far from over. The Sylph Captains and crews that gave their lives for the destruction of presumably the last inhabitated U'K structures in the conflict area did this knowning they would leave behind a safer area, ridden of the Terrorist Scum known as Ushra'Khan. I,m sorry but your attack on one small station and one medium took more than a week , as said before both evacuated . The medium it took 3 attempts to take it out , on the 3rd attempt you had to call in CVA , who if it wasnt for them took charge of the fiasco you had created . The system of assah was astrewn with wrecks of your fleet and I dare say you were at a point where your capitals were in grave danger if CVA hadnt arrived . You mock us for the loss of the stations , I,m baffled as is many other plots who partook in the slaughter of your ships why you found them so strategically important . We feel no loss for those stations they did a job far outstanding than any capital fleet we couldve, wouldve mustered against you . We have recorded your losses at 31 ships to our 5 , that my friend if you see as a victory you are clearly deranged . Oh by the way we the Terrorist scum of Ushra'Khan have no intention of stopping our attacks on slaver scum space , it would take a lot more than 2 wee substations to deny us our fun And fun we had in Assah . On behalf of the Ushra'Khan pilots and allies who attended that glorious day we thankyou from the*****les of our hearts
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:42:00 - [36] You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:57:00 - [37] Originally by: 128th ABC123 You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan. Turning a loss into a victory at the cost of your pilots to make yourself look better my deranged friend smells of desperation . Losses minimal you say ?. We lost 4 bombers and a tempest , you lost b/cruisers and b/ships and some small support to us , not including what the AAA gang took you for . We picked you off at the stations , planets and belts you consistently kept warping to showing lack of communication on your part . You even warped cruisers and a hauler to the medium pos at the start of the engagement ? , pray tell us why ?. Your allies showing up only shows the bad blood centred towards us . Strange description becoming of you there , CVA , BoTS , Severance have never been friends of ours so why wouldnt they . Backs against the wall is it ? . Never underestimate your foe , here endeth the lesson .
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:00:00 - [38] Originally by: 128th ABC123 You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan. Can someone from Sylph command please start educating your guys in history? :) Also, speak with your allies about minimal losses. They may be Amarr scum but they know how to fight at least! As a hint, when you lose more than you kill, thats called a loss :P
Kebabski coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:13:00 - [39] Edited by: Kebabski on 19/03/2008 16:13:26 It was well over 2bil ISK lost for you easilly. 8 bs's lost, HAC, Recon, 3x cruisers, a BC, AF, 2 Stealths, 2 inties, 4 frigs and a transport ship, that for a 600mil tower total+some smaller ships
Garreck Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:27:00 - [40] Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign...

Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:34:00 - [41] Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... if there was a strategic gain from killing the towers you might have a point... as it is, i must say i don't really feel deeply hurt or as though anything is going to be any more difficult to achieve. A full cost analysis would indeed add additional factors so we'll add in the failure of sylph to hold the field after the tower went down and thus their inability to rescue potential survivors or salvage components / modules from the battlefield. In short, if there had been some sort of strategic objective achieved then i'd say you had a point but knocking over two small towers leaving U'K with... no noticeable loss to infrastructure / forward bases of operations... I guess in one way we should thank sylph, means we have two towers that were largely doing nothing that we don't have to fuel anymore.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:46:00 - [42] Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... A far better summary I warrant , but easily Ushra'Khan held the field of battle , why do I say this ? , basically it is he who holds fast and fights at the end of the engagement . We rescued the batteries and even caught several of the enemy at the destroyed substation attemptin to steal certain items from the field of battle . To achieve strategic objectives one must first decide if the losses are worth the outcome . So lets look at the outcome shall we , ok we lost a small research and a medium research substation with modules removed before annihilation . We held the field at the end . We maintain the Burn Providence campaign that sylph decided removing our pos,s would be our punishment to maintain there space safe and hopefully remove us . I can assure you Garreck those two assets can easily be replaced again & again . All in all if we were discussing the losses of a Death Star or several then the end justified the means , but were discussing about 2 research pos,s . Whilst in reinforced we could have easily left the medium to its demise as it wasnt overly defended to start with , but we chose to increase its weaponry to gain a fight knowing it was lost , knowing eventually we would lose it . So only one summary can be concluded here , tactical efficiency was abhorrent on there part with strategic objectives a complete failure Were going nowhere !!!
Vox Thaal Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 17:27:00 - [43] I wholeheartedly encourage Sylph to pursue more strategic triumphs such as this one. Marching forward at this swift pace, and under such visionary leadership, it is only a matter of time before they achieve a victory of epic proportions and are no longer able to field a fleet at all.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 18:41:00 - [44] I have a final question for ABC 128th , according to your respective corp title you are in fact Fleet Commander . Would you be the one responsible for the sheer confusion & massacre of your force in the first hour of engagement ?.
Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.19 19:33:00 - [45] Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:33:28 Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:33:14 It's nice the Amarr worry, is not not... cause, you know, Minmatar people do not die in the Empire, right, so they have the time? EDITed to add: now taking bets that U'K will quote that out of context and without the sarcasm inside the next six months. -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 19:59:00 - [46] Originally by: Elsebeth Rhiannon Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:36:40 It's nice the Amarr worry, is not not... cause, you know, Minmatar people do not die in the Empire, right, so they have the time? EDITed to add: now taking bets that U'K will quote that out of context and without the sarcasm inside the next six months. You overrate yourself
Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:42:00 - [47] Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 20:42:57 I wish I did. But truth is, I only bet on things I know from experience are very likely odds in my favor. -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Mr Reeth The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:45:00 - [48] What was this thread about again?
Garreck Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:46:00 - [49] There seems to be a lot of chest beating for an organization who makes grand claims of numbers of kills in Providence to simply have destroyed 20 vessels in the process of losing two control towers. That aside, what I get from this is that Sylph set out to remove Ushra'Khan towers from Assah, succeeding in doing so, and the warriors of Ushra'Khan (whose determination the pilots of the CVA can attest to and whose strong showing in the recent alliance tournament was witnessed by all) made 'em pay as best they could. I did wonder the other day as I participated in a patrol of various low security systems in the Mandate, what the heck was going on in Assah...
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 21:01:00 - [50] Originally by: Garreck There seems to be a lot of chest beating for an organization who makes grand claims of numbers of kills in Providence to simply have destroyed 20 vessels in the process of losing two control towers. That aside, what I get from this is that Sylph set out to remove Ushra'Khan towers from Assah, succeeding in doing so, and the warriors of Ushra'Khan (whose determination the pilots of the CVA can attest to and whose strong showing in the recent alliance tournament was witnessed by all) made 'em pay as best they could. I did wonder the other day as I participated in a patrol of various low security systems in the Mandate, what the heck was going on in Assah... I,m sorry Garreck but you cant save him from his fate , he dug the hole he,s now in , a valiant attempt on your behalf , but one that is far from rescuable . We had decided not to mention the incident or chest beat until of course Mr ABC started the chest beating .Please refer to the first page . We are merely here to correct him on a few statistics he sadly forgot to mention and if we wanted we could spam Assah with more pos,s , but thats a road we both know well . One path we no longer wish to take . And truthfully , I hated that bloody pos . Bloody whining all the time when it wanted fed . Worse than being married

Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.20 07:57:00 - [51] Originally by: Deleanora It was good to see at least someone willing to fight in the name of Minmatar in the tournament. Actually there were more parties willing to, but the stupid registration process filled up the positions in the tournament too fast. Maybe next time. Yes, I am purposefully ignoring the death by statistics parts of this thread and trying to concentrate on the sports. Elsebeth -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Ogoel Marek The House of Marek	Posted - 2008.03.20 12:53:00 - [52] The tribals lend credence to our claim over them with their words and actions. As part of their future ruling class it pains me and the Elders of House Marek to see them fall decade after decade into such a lamentable state. Ushra Kahn, Midular there is no difference. Only Ammatar dominion will bring stability to Terra Irridente. We should go forward and take the peace talks one step further. We should begin the process of assimilating the lands of Terra Irridente, with the government of Terra Irridente. Its about time that tribal lands become part of The Mandate. For God, Empire, and the reclaiming of tribal lands. Ogoel Marek Ammatar terminal<-- --> The House of Marek
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:04:00 - [53] Originally by: Conlin Were going nowhere !!! You got that right! :P
128th ABC123	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:18:00 - [54] Originally by: Conlin Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... A far better summary I warrant , but easily Ushra'Khan held the field of battle , why do I say this ? , basically it is he who holds fast and fights at the end of the engagement . We rescued the batteries and even caught several of the enemy at the destroyed substation attemptin to steal certain items from the field of battle . To achieve strategic objectives one must first decide if the losses are worth the outcome . So lets look at the outcome shall we , ok we lost a small research and a medium research substation with modules removed before annihilation . We held the field at the end . We maintain the Burn Providence campaign that sylph decided removing our pos,s would be our punishment to maintain there space safe and hopefully remove us . I can assure you Garreck those two assets can easily be replaced again & again . All in all if we were discussing the losses of a Death Star or several then the end justified the means , but were discussing about 2 research pos,s . Whilst in reinforced we could have easily left the medium to its demise as it wasnt overly defended to start with , but we chose to increase its weaponry to gain a fight knowing it was lost , knowing eventually we would lose it . So only one summary can be concluded here , tactical efficiency was abhorrent on there part with strategic objectives a complete failure Were going nowhere !!! If U'K had any deathstars left it in the area we would make it priority to take them down. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
128th ABC123	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:25:00 - [55] Originally by: Conlin I have a final question for ABC 128th , according to your respective corp title you are in fact Fleet Commander . Would you be the one responsible for the sheer confusion & massacre of your force in the first hour of engagement ?. Just to respond to your question, I was involved in commanding the conventional fleet in the first attack only (bringing the 2 towers into reinforced) and during the takedown of the small POS. I was not able to attend the destruction of the 2nd terrorist base at which U'K finally managed to get up some defences. The location and the tactics deployed by U'K where high risk in losing ships and I see no reason to blame the FC for it. I think he did a commendable job. You either have the choice to blame our FC for our losses or your own battleprowess, hmm which would YOU want to pick? Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Conlin	Posted - 2008.03.21 15:19:00 - [56] 3 attempts at replying to my posts and 3 attempts to destroy research pos,s , I guess 3 aint your lucky number . I would put our success down to 3 things ABC ;) 1. Your poor strategy leading to our high kill ratio . 2. Our FC choosing not to engage you head on at the pos knowing full well you,d call in CVA to help you . 3. Karn Mithralia at the wheel and no sign of any alcohol , none that we know of . Next time ABC if your going to blow your own trumpet , try doing it without the help of 4 other alliances , after all we the Ushra'Khan have our backs against the wall , and I wouldve thought an alliance such as the size of Sylph could easily deal with us , No ?.
Kintaki Khan Aliastra	Posted - 2008.03.23 10:13:00 - [57] Originally by: Vox Thaal I wholeheartedly encourage Sylph to pursue more strategic triumphs such as this one. Marching forward at this swift pace, and under such visionary leadership, it is only a matter of time before they achieve a victory of epic proportions and are no longer able to field a fleet at all. if they go on like this they will achieve your victory, and will not be able to field a lfeet at all, but there is no requirement for it then anymore. Its all good. Proceed! giggles too bad CVA is not equally stupid ;)

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