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III LightBringer
Okkelen Grave Robbers
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:32:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Zwik Edited by: Zwik on 26/03/2008 15:04:47 Edited by: Zwik on 26/03/2008 15:03:57 Peace be upon everyone.
Dear Crowd Control Productions (CCP),
I would like to highlight a serious matter to you.
The group of people who put up this website: http://www.jihadswarm.com/?a=message .. are doing exactly what is banned according to you, as written in your policy.
FACT Jihadswarm is misrepresenting Islam. How do I know this? I know this because I am a Muslim. Yes, be afraid now..
Here are a few false statements that have been made by Jihadswarm. :refer to http://www.jihadswarm.com/?a=message
False Statement #1 "I am Karttoon, Shiekh of JihadSwarm and prophet of Allah" The truth: There is no prophet of Allah named Karttoon in Islam.
False Statement #2 "Praise be to Allah, there is no god but allah, and Karttoon is his prophet!" The truth: Praise be to Allah, there is no god but Allah, and Muhammad is his last and final prophet!
VERDICT Therefore according to CCP's own SUSPENSION AND BAN POLICY, they have flouted rule no 3.a and possibly rule 3.b
WHAT WILL YOU DO NOW, CCP ? Jihadswarm's false statements and actions in EVE is detrimental to ISLAM. Why? Because what they do is opposite of what ISLAM teaches. They mis-use the name of Allah, they pervert the true meaning of Jihad, and make a mockery of all this. Jihad is never holy war. The meaning of Jihad is "to strive, to struggle", and totally not "holy war".
JihadSwarm is behaving like Al-Qaeda. The real terrorists. Not the behaviour of a true Muslim.
CCP your rules clearly state what is acceptable in this game. Will you then not act?
Peace,
A Muslim
------------------------------------------------------ CCP's SUSPENSION AND BAN POLICY, Here: http://www.eve-online.com/pnp/banning.asp
3. HARASSMENT
An immediate permanent ban of an account may result if a player: a. Organizes or participates in a corporation or group that is based on or advocates any anti-ethnic, anti-***, anti-religious, racist, sexist or other hate-mongering philosophies.
Severe offences may result in an immediate ban without warning; however, warnings may be given for first time offenses, followed by account suspensions of varying degree and ultimately a permanent ban if a player: a. Is abusive, obscene, offensive, sexually explicit, ethnically or racially offensive, or threatening to another player or an official EVE Online representative. b. Uses role-playing as an excuse for violating the guidelines regarding fair play with others. c. Sends excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or petitions, petitions with false information or repeatedly petitions under the wrong category in an effort to circumvent the customer support queue.
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*fact on* Dear mister RL Muslim.
This game takes place in the future, as in, tens of thousands of years from now, and the people in here, are races that left EARTH *fact off*
Now, if we take this to an in game thing, I do not give a **** about your religion, because it is based on something that happend tens of thousands of years ago, and false prophets are all over the world. Any decent psych-ward have atleast a napoleon and a few jesus's... What stops Karttoon from claiming he have heard the 'voice'?
You keep RL out of my game
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Avon
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:35:00 -
[32]
Originally by: III LightBringer Any decent psych-ward have atleast a napoleon and a few jesus's... What stops Karttoon from claiming he have heard the 'voice'?
Actually, the rules do. They state that Roleplay can not be used as justification for griefing.
Just sayin'.
Eve-Online: The Text Adventure |
An Anarchyyt
Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:37:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: III LightBringer Any decent psych-ward have atleast a napoleon and a few jesus's... What stops Karttoon from claiming he have heard the 'voice'?
Actually, the rules do. They state that Roleplay can not be used as justification for griefing.
Just sayin'.
However, suicide ganking has never counted as griefing in the entire history of Eve.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
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Fink Angel
The Merry Men
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:37:00 -
[34]
This is exactly why RL politics and religious crossovers should be kept well, well away from Eve and definitely away from the forums.
This thread will go horribly wrong and crash and burn when a mod locks it Real Soon Now (tm).
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Omber Zombie
Frontier Technologies
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:40:00 -
[35]
Quote: Muslim faith doesn't endorse suicide bombing, which is the message Goonswarm sends.
orly? I suppose it depends on which sub-sect of islam you are referring to ----------------------
The Amalgamated CSM Thread | 1st Campaign Vid |
Jimdoogan
State War Academy
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:40:00 -
[36]
Be real. The goons made it rain man parts in an ingame event in another mmo. It's what they do. The break stuff, mouth off, ruin gameplay for others sometimes. And on ocasion I've heard them say things small people should not hear. So what. You should hear what they call the Tractor Beam is TS. It rymes with Dew Maw. |
Malar
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:41:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Malar on 26/03/2008 15:42:19
Originally by: Lucas Avignon
And why can't they play terrorists, oh wait you said it might hurt some people, are you for ******* real, terrorists really do hurt people in the real world, this is the virtual world and if someone is hurt by someone else playing a terrorist then tbqfh they are pretty sad, and if you take your head out of the sand you will see that almost all games people play now a days involve playing a terrorist, did you forget the fact that religon is already a part of this game as is slavery.
Actually what i wanted to say is that they could just as well play terrorist, except that - unless they add rascist or anti-religious remarks to it - they wouldnt hurt muslims that way.
They can all pretend to be minmatar terrorists working to free their enslaved brothers in amarr space for all i care. That would be plain roleplaying. They do pretend to wage a jihad against whatever they are fighting against.
A jihad is not just playing terrorists, its playing fanatical religious zealots of a particular REAL WORLD religion.
While it might still be roleplaying, it would be about as much roleplaying as me playing to be the newsreporter spreading false accusations about your mother. Role playing should not be used as an excuse to mask generally abusive behavior. --------------------------------------------- *Comments in this post are mine and mine only* |
Tippia
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:41:00 -
[38]
Originally by: An Anarchyyt However, suicide ganking has never counted as griefing in the entire history of Eve.
No, but insulting other player's faith does...
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Winterblink
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:42:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Avon Actually, the rules do. They state that Roleplay can not be used as justification for griefing.
Just sayin'.
How are they griefing?
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Raijin Iyo
Nova Mining Manufacturing and Research LTD
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:43:00 -
[40]
you know, I haven't had an opinion on the the whole jihadswarm thing, but I think the parallels between their motives and real world terrorism that is perpetrated by religious extremists is in poor taste at best. Whether or not poor taste is a bannable offense, I don't know, but it seems like they are going out of their way to step on people's toes when they don't have to. It just really isn't that amusing.
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Malar
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:43:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Fink Angel This is exactly why RL politics and religious crossovers should be kept well, well away from Eve and definitely away from the forums.
This thread will go horribly wrong and crash and burn when a mod locks it Real Soon Now (tm).
QFT. Oh man QFT x 1000. --------------------------------------------- *Comments in this post are mine and mine only* |
Ki Tetro
Vanquish Inc
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:45:00 -
[42]
Griefing? There isnt any going on......
Banning for out of game website names, I dont see anything like that in the EULA.
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An Anarchyyt
Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:45:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: An Anarchyyt However, suicide ganking has never counted as griefing in the entire history of Eve.
No, but insulting other player's faith does...
Nowhere do we say Islam is bad or anything, it is hardly our fault if people have thin skin and are just whiners. And every time one of you whines, another Goon is born.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
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Daylen Drazzi
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:46:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: III LightBringer Any decent psych-ward have atleast a napoleon and a few jesus's... What stops Karttoon from claiming he have heard the 'voice'?
Actually, the rules do. They state that Roleplay can not be used as justification for griefing.
Just sayin'.
Define griefing and compare that to what Jihadswarm is doing and then try to prove it. Obviously you can't, otherwise CCP would have banned Jihadswarm (they love banning members of Goonfleet, btw).
We are playing within the limitations of the game using a legitimate tactic - deal with it.
"Ya see us Goons neva lose, If we'r dead, we'r dead so nobody cares, If'n we win we'v won, so's only we cares If'n we run away we always come back later so Goons neva lose ya see?" |
Hamfast
Lightfoot Industries
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:49:00 -
[45]
Little publicized fact about suicide bombings... the bomber dies most of the time...even if they kill nobody else... if they live they are referred to as "Failed Suicide Bomber"
So if the Goons are "Role Playing" Suicide bombers, each attack should result in the deletion of the character used...
--------*****--------
Learn and be informed, because a Politicians worst nightmare is an informed voter...
So choose your CSM Candidates wisely
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Lateralus
The Order of Chivalry Nex Eternus
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:49:00 -
[46]
So, does this mean we should ban all Amarr as well? For being defamatory to the Roman Catholic religion?
pfft. This is 'PC' going too far.
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Tippia
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:52:00 -
[47]
Originally by: An Anarchyyt it is hardly our fault if people have thin skin and are just whiners
True, but irrelevant - the rules are still there to protect their thin in particular.
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Omarvelous
Destry's Lounge XIII Legio
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:54:00 -
[48]
To the OP - its a mockery, ignore it - posts like this just keep attention on something that's silly more than offensive.
I feel your frustration on their use of terminology - and you have correctly defined 'jihad' - it's struggle, not holy war. However its perception that only matters, and jihad is perceived as a holy war - sometimes mockery comes across as reinforcing false perceptions.
You should only be offended if they claimed something real (like claiming Karttoon was a prophet of Islam). Since Allah is just an Arabic word for God (of no religious denomination - Christian Arabs say Allah in Church services) - claiming Karttoon is a prophet of Allah (God) - should mean no more to you as a Muslim as someone proclaiming Bugs Bunny the Son of God.
I doubt a Christian would be offended by someone claiming a holy trinity of Father, son and the holy rabbit. __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
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Malar
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:54:00 -
[49]
Originally by: An Anarchyyt
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: An Anarchyyt However, suicide ganking has never counted as griefing in the entire history of Eve.
No, but insulting other player's faith does...
Nowhere do we say Islam is bad or anything, it is hardly our fault if people have thin skin and are just whiners. And every time one of you whines, another Goon is born.
If i shoot someone its hardly my fault they didnt wear a bulletproof west that day aye?
Oh please. You never said Islam is a bad thing, you just twist its ideologies to use them for the purpose of a game. If you think that a muslim flips out by seeing a mohamed parody then what do you think does he feel when you talk about 'false prophets' of his faith as if they were ready.
For you it is a 'game'. For him/her it is his/her life / the basis of it anyway. I doubt thats too hard to understand. It only takes little self control to know the line between stepping onto someones toe and avoiding it. You guys seem to be keen on intentionally stepping onto those toes.
If you find it fun to intentionally try and mock other people / their beliefs, then at least do us the favor and try not to defend it by talking bullsh*t. If you do not agree with such practices, then think about your actions / how people might feel in response to them before you do anything.
And to the other dimwit goon: this isnt about the people you kill. It is about the communication accompanying this little campaign of yours. --------------------------------------------- *Comments in this post are mine and mine only* |
Gabriel Karade
Nulli-Secundus
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:54:00 -
[50]
ZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzz..........
no, just no
Goons are taking the **** out of themselves if anything, and if you want to attribute it to RL ****-take, the nutjobs who do misrepresent Islam.
(Love the Apoc image with the "This side towards enemy" )
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Video - 'War-Machine' |
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Avon
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:55:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Winterblink
Originally by: Avon Actually, the rules do. They state that Roleplay can not be used as justification for griefing.
Just sayin'.
How are they griefing?
It used to be that suicide ganking was allowed if it was done for profit, rather than just epic lulz. No idea if that has changed.
It wasn't really my point though, I was more trying to point out that roleplay excuses are not allowed (which is kinda dumb in lots of situations).
Eve-Online: The Text Adventure |
Winterblink
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:56:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Omarvelous I doubt a Christian would be offended by someone claiming a holy trinity of Father, son and the holy rabbit.
Blessed be the Holy Rabbit, for its tasty stew will nourish our souls
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Heavyn
Pegasus Reborn Research Corp 101010 Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:56:00 -
[53]
CCP law is law, or it is bull****.....
there have been many a name changes due to improper use in reference to religion (I have 2 evemails that I can post myself)
So fact is, if name change due to peoples God and improper reference is slammed down upon so quickly, the problem of an entire group of people abusing this should be adressed more quickly...., not neccesarely the mission of these people, but the name/use/referenses they use.
It's that simple
H Stalker...unfortunatly you arent as smart as me so I have to speak up. |
Malar
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2008.03.26 15:56:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Lateralus So, does this mean we should ban all Amarr as well? For being defamatory to the Roman Catholic religion?
pfft. This is 'PC' going too far.
Here is a key difference. CCP did not use the terms / ideologies of the catholic church for the purposes of the game, or at least altered them enough so that they are not obvious. Yes.. they might have similarities, but they are not the same.
A guy pretending to be a holy warrior of islam fighting a jihad against carebears on the other hand is pretty straightforward. Not much room to question what he really means. --------------------------------------------- *Comments in this post are mine and mine only* |
Inconstant Moon
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:00:00 -
[55]
I find the Goons' use of jihadist themes to be in particularly poor taste, especially as I believe the offense is intentional.
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Rodj Blake
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:00:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Heavyn CCP law is law, or it is bull****.....
there have been many a name changes due to improper use in reference to religion (I have 2 evemails that I can post myself)
So fact is, if name change due to peoples God and improper reference is slammed down upon so quickly, the problem of an entire group of people abusing this should be adressed more quickly...., not neccesarely the mission of these people, but the name/use/referenses they use.
It's that simple
H
There's a massive difference between naming your character after Christ or the Prophet or any other religious figure on one hand, and using language reminiscent of cultural terminology on the other.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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Winterblink
Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:00:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Avon It used to be that suicide ganking was allowed if it was done for profit, rather than just epic lulz. No idea if that has changed.
It wasn't really my point though, I was more trying to point out that roleplay excuses are not allowed (which is kinda dumb in lots of situations).
Indeed.
The reason I raise the question is that they're not targeting a specific corporation, alliance, or individual. They're chasing down Hulk pilots. If that falls into the classic definition of griefing then everyone with an Interdictors Only overview setting is screwed. :)
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Dirk Magnum
Spearhead Endeavors
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:04:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Inconstant Moon I find the Goons' use of jihadist themes to be in particularly poor taste, especially as I believe the offense is intentional.
The only thing the Goons have ever done that wasn't in poor taste was accept brand new pilots with no skills into the major alliance that is Goonswarm. Oh, and those YouTube videos they make.
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Malar
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:04:00 -
[59]
Originally by: An Anarchyyt
Originally by: Malar If i shoot someone its hardly my fault they didnt wear a bulletproof west that day aye?
Action =/= words and ideas. If you're going to compare two things, at least make a relevant comparison.
You thinking about pretending to be an islam extremist fighting a jihad is an idea. You saying you are waging a jihad against carebears is an action. Speaking words - FYI - is an action already. Not to mention that words can cause deeper wounds than bullets. So yea.. i guess my analogy was quite flawed.
Originally by: An Anarchyyt
I'll try and put it in simple terms for you. Words, do not have any power by thsemvles, they can not harm you, and they can not kill your by themselves. Actions on the other hand, it is not as if that other person had any say in how they'd react to a bullet going through them.
You are just proving me wrong.. if words would have no power in themselves then you wouldnt feel the need to argue with me. The fact that people argue show that words indeed have power.
--------------------------------------------- *Comments in this post are mine and mine only* |
An Anarchyyt
Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.26 16:05:00 -
[60]
I am not arguing with you. I was pointing out that your comparison is incorrect, I just can't think of the name of its logical fallacy.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
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