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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2234
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 06:44:00 -
[31] - Quote
Grumpy Owly wrote:Oh I see, your original comment above then was a personal attack of someone's opinions and not really relevant to the topic material, understood.
(I wont offer a comment about the accusations just made however other than not personally supporting RMT outside of CCP's approved methods.)
Personal attack? No.
Somebody who fails to see why RMT is bad for business has no business on an MMO developer's sounding board. This is not a controversial position. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
The I and F Taxation Trust
287
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 07:45:00 -
[32] - Quote
Well, apparently the opinion of CSM runners about WiS can be summarized as:
(insert cricket sound)
(insert tumbleweed) EVE residents: 5% Wormholes; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 6: 100% Nullsec residents.
EVE demographics vs CSM demographics, nothing to worry about...-á |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
376
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 07:56:00 -
[33] - Quote
I support Team Avatar, no more and no less. www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting #VoteAlek for CSM7-áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=67574&find=unread |
Akrasjel Lanate
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
611
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 09:09:00 -
[34] - Quote
Andski wrote:only dumb roleplayers who support RMT care about ambulation
you mean goons and other null blocks that do RMT
PS. every thread that dosnt support mittani as (self-proclaime chaiman for life) will be trolled by his minions |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2234
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 09:23:00 -
[35] - Quote
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:you mean goons and other null blocks that do RMT
ahahaha you actually believe that "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1689
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 09:45:00 -
[36] - Quote
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:Andski wrote:only dumb roleplayers who support RMT care about ambulation you mean goons and other null blocks that do RMT PS. every thread that dosnt support mittani as (self-proclaime chaiman for life) will be trolled by his minions
RMT stands for Randy Moose Training.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Ka P'lah
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
4
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Posted - 2012.02.28 12:09:00 -
[37] - Quote
None ofthe Above wrote:
Personally, I think CCP has struck a pretty good balance for the near future with Crucible and Team Avatar.
IMHO: The community won't stand for too many resources into ambulation while other things remain unattended to, but CCP has left the door open for future work and keeping it alive with short term improvements. It would be a pity to see this aspect of the game be abandoned entirely, but there is a lot of healing to do. Aurum and the NeX have to either be reconciled with sane goals or scrapped entirely [- - and other good stuff]
I'm pretty amazed at how so many EVE players - very much including most of the CSM candidates - freak out at the mention of WiS / ambulation. Folks...it's coming...can't you see the future direction of EVE? Dust 514 will be a success, I think, and more and more tie-ins moving in the direction of avatars walking / driving / skimming / shooting around are going to be part of EVE. The incarna thing was messed up...do you really want that kind of disaster again? Ignoring ambulation and treating the idea with utter contempt risks CCP not developing the game with player input in this critical area. The spaceships-first positive focus CCP has realized is their good core game is always going to remain the way it is as CCP has more success and starts making more money with avatar-enhancing game additions? Dismissing WiS / ambulation with a sneer as whiny ridiculous spacepantsbarbiefluff rather than recognizing that it's gonna happen and needs to be done right with the proper focus on spaceship game-first is shortsighted and dangerous to a healthy future EVE. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1690
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 12:46:00 -
[38] - Quote
Ka P'lah wrote:Dust 514 will be a success
I like when people put things like this in their posts so I know right away I can safely ignore everything they say.
Here's some realtalk:
Dust 514 is going to be a crappy console shooter infested with konsole kiddies for the few months that it is live.
Ambulation/WiS and its associated RMT store failed miserably and CCP almost went broke trying to repair the damage. People who are advocating that CCP backtrack on the steps they have made in fixing the game after the Summer of Rage should be banned or the very least soundly mocked.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
768
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 12:52:00 -
[39] - Quote
Ok here's my question to the OP. CCP has thus far been unable to convince the community that they have the resources to accomplish the tasks of rebalancing and improving the core gameplay of eve and the WiS function they've championed in the past. When CCP changed their objectives to shelve WiS for the time being to focus on FiS issues the response from the community was hugely positive. Most would agree that the concept of WiS is cool and if it were released as a finished product it might be actually kinda fun, but what makes you think they can pull off WiS properly while focusing effort on the spaceship side of the equation?
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Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
66
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 13:06:00 -
[40] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I believe ambulation is key to the future of Eve. That adding compelling ambulation will dramatically increase the subscription base of Eve
Were you asleep last year when literally the exact opposite thing happened? |
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Ka P'lah
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
4
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Posted - 2012.02.28 13:16:00 -
[41] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ka P'lah wrote:Dust 514 will be a success I like when people put things like this in their posts so I know right away I can safely ignore everything they say. Here's some realtalk: Dust 514 is going to be a crappy console shooter infested with konsole kiddies for the few months that it is live. Ambulation/WiS and its associated RMT store failed miserably and CCP almost went broke trying to repair the damage. People who are advocating that CCP backtrack on the steps they have made in fixing the game after the Summer of Rage should be banned or the very least soundly mocked.
You don't have much vision, do you? Do you think the concept of the tie-in to EVE is going to stop with dust514, whatever it's initial success? (I happen to think it will do alright) Frankly, ladie harlot, I'm finding it difficult to care whether you take me seriously or not...character flaw on my part, probably...
Vile Rat you have some valid points there...I think CCP had better find a way...it's do or die, eventually... |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
768
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 13:34:00 -
[42] - Quote
For the pro WiS crowd I think it's important to clarify a stance. Most FiS people think ambulation would be kinda cool on some level. Can you imagine how we'd be able to mess with people if we can all interact in station? It would be a goon wet dream. The sense of community while sitting in a station playing poker or whatever the hell, hanging out in a space brothel, heck I don't care, it would be cool.
The idea is a cool idea, full stop.
They aren't staffed for the task, they don't have the skillset to bring a quality WiS product, and they siphoned off too much manpower to attempt to pull this off. It hurt the game and that is what people are mostly objecting to. All this development time to give us one room and a sofa?
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Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
165
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 14:51:00 -
[43] - Quote
Ka P'lah wrote: You don't have much vision, do you? Do you think the concept of the tie-in to EVE is going to stop with dust514, whatever it's initial success?
Are you saying there's going to be a World of Darkness tie-in with Eve?
Because...
Well, actually, I'd probably play the hell out of a space vampire game, but that doesn't make it a good idea.
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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1009
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:06:00 -
[44] - Quote
Andski wrote:Grumpy Owly wrote:Are you confusing it with Micro transactions? For which there a valid methods CCP promote for payment methods for Aurum, namely plex. Actually, no. Issler believes that RMT should be allowed because it creates jobs for farmers or whatever (lol) oh and doing anything in a game for "tears" is invariably indicative of a deeper problem in the individual, you can trust her because she minored in "mental health"
Can you prove that claim? I am strongly against farmers and bots and plexes mean you've had RMT for a while now.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1009
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:08:00 -
[45] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:I support Team Avatar, no more and no less.
Finally another candidate with a position!
Thank you for responding and I support your views!
Issler Dainze The Miner's Friend CSM 7 Candidate |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1009
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:18:00 -
[46] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:Ok here's my question to the OP. CCP has thus far been unable to convince the community that they have the resources to accomplish the tasks of rebalancing and improving the core gameplay of eve and the WiS function they've championed in the past. When CCP changed their objectives to shelve WiS for the time being to focus on FiS issues the response from the community was hugely positive. Most would agree that the concept of WiS is cool and if it were released as a finished product it might be actually kinda fun, but what makes you think they can pull off WiS properly while focusing effort on the spaceship side of the equation?
A reasonable post worthy of a response, thanks for that.
Everyone that wasn't interested in ambulation likes to think all of Eve was happy that CCP stopped ambulation development. What people we happy about was that CCP finally stopped using Eve as the revenue source for focus on other games and started putting dev effort back on Eve.
What makes you think that CCP can't do both at the same time? The fact that Incarna was such a faceplant was because all the focus of CCP was on WoD and Dust, not because they couldn't do ambulation and space content at the same time.
The future of Eve and the way to get Eve out of "niche" game status will depend on ambulation.
So we'll have to agree to disagree I suspect.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1009
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:21:00 -
[47] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I believe ambulation is key to the future of Eve. That adding compelling ambulation will dramatically increase the subscription base of Eve Were you asleep last year when literally the exact opposite thing happened?
As I've repeatedly stated the events around Incarna were not because of WiS, they were because of the lame under-delivery of WiS, the leaked internal memos, the thread of "golden ammo" and the growing frustration of CCP ignoring their cash cow while chasing the new shiny of vampires and console kiddies.
So you are parroting the common false argument that the introduction of WiS was why we had the Jita riots.
Issler |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
181
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:33:00 -
[48] - Quote
I am genuinely curious whether you think there should also be walking in ships. It seems reasonable, given the size of the things. Maybe you could visit other people's ships, or decorate the interior of your own and have a party in your drake or whatever. You probably think I'm trolling you and you might be partly right but I really am curious what you think the ambulatory experience should be like and what its boundaries are.
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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1009
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:37:00 -
[49] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:I am genuinely curious whether you think there should also be walking in ships. It seems reasonable, given the size of the things. Maybe you could visit other people's ships, or decorate the interior of your own and have a party in your drake or whatever. You probably think I'm trolling you and you might be partly right but I really am curious what you think the ambulatory experience should be like and what its boundaries are.
I could see walking in ships as a great step towards fully getting out that door. It would make sense that every ship have a CQ as well.
So there have been some great ideas posted in the big ambulation thread in general discussion. I've offered a few and have some I haven't shared but I'll try and collect some of my thoughts in a later response to your question when I have a little more time to answer than my lunch break.
Issler |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1695
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:43:00 -
[50] - Quote
Ka P'lah wrote:You don't have much vision, do you? Do you think the concept of the tie-in to EVE is going to stop with dust514, whatever it's initial success? (I happen to think it will do alright) Frankly, ladie harlot, I'm finding it difficult to care whether you take me seriously or not...character flaw on my part, probably..
I think Dust will release with a bunch of marketing fanfare and then quietly die away in a few months. The vast majority of Eve players want nothing to do with a bunch of mouthbreather console kiddies and people who like console shooters don't have the attention span play in such a way to have an impact on Eve like CCP thinks they will.
I'm hopeful that CCP will admit defeat gracefully (and quickly) and not pour a ton of resources into a dumb concept which could put Eve back in the same place we were in last summer. Basically I want them to handle it the same way they handled ambulation by admitting WiS and the NEX were bad ideas and then refocusing on Eve.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
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Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1695
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 20:44:00 -
[51] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:So there have been some great ideas posted in the big ambulation thread in general discussion.
lol
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
67
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 21:42:00 -
[52] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:So there have been some great ideas posted in the big ambulation thread in general discussion. lol
Hey, wouldn't it be great if it had *stupid thing that has zero effect on actual gameplay*? Yeah, and then maybe they could *stupid thing that has zero effect on actual gameplay*! These would be great since *mass delusion about ambulation being the only thing keeping CCP from mainstream playerbases*!
Wait, what do you mean people hated it? You're so wrong, let me explain *semantic difference between ambulation as a concept and CCP's abortive implementation of it*. Stupid goonie trolls! |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
202
|
Posted - 2012.02.28 23:53:00 -
[53] - Quote
You sir hit with the force of a Hurricane fleet ganking a "completely balanced" Titan.
Duel In Stations would be hilarious, as would Ganking In Station. Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |
None ofthe Above
94
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:04:00 -
[54] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Andski wrote:Grumpy Owly wrote:Are you confusing it with Micro transactions? For which there a valid methods CCP promote for payment methods for Aurum, namely plex. Actually, no. Issler believes that RMT should be allowed because it creates jobs for farmers or whatever (lol) oh and doing anything in a game for "tears" is invariably indicative of a deeper problem in the individual, you can trust her because she minored in "mental health" Can you prove that claim? I am strongly against farmers and bots and plexes mean you've had RMT for a while now. Issler
This came from the conversation we had in the "CSM7 Townhall" channel the other night (sadly just before Chribba's archive kicked in, bot was there but when it started showing up on evelocal.com, your conversation did not appear).
I also got the impression that you where supporting RMT and chinese isk farms, but suspected you may have been taking the devil's advocate approach to mess with Andski's head (which seems to have worked).
Even None ofthe Above supports Hans Jagerblitzen for CSM7! |
T'amber Anomandari Demaleon
479
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:16:00 -
[55] - Quote
I support ambulation as long as its not a necessary feature for any pilot to use.
Ambulation/ WIS could be a great tool for player made content and I'd love to see tools that would allow players to customise NPC's and their responses.
T'amber for CSM7 - Ship and Client Customisation Take part in the 2min Ship Customisation Survey www.tinyurl.com/shipcustomisation
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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1011
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:25:00 -
[56] - Quote
None ofthe Above wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Andski wrote:Grumpy Owly wrote:Are you confusing it with Micro transactions? For which there a valid methods CCP promote for payment methods for Aurum, namely plex. Actually, no. Issler believes that RMT should be allowed because it creates jobs for farmers or whatever (lol) oh and doing anything in a game for "tears" is invariably indicative of a deeper problem in the individual, you can trust her because she minored in "mental health" Can you prove that claim? I am strongly against farmers and bots and plexes mean you've had RMT for a while now. Issler This came from the conversation we had in the "CSM7 Townhall" channel the other night (sadly just before Chribba's archive kicked in, bot was there but when it started showing up on evelocal.com, your conversation did not appear). I also got the impression that you where supporting RMT and chinese isk farms, but suspected you may have been taking the devil's advocate approach to mess with Andski's head (which seems to have worked).
I was definitely messing with a goon's head. I was saying he was confused about the connection with RMT, account hacking and the actual effect RMT and farming has on the game. I also posed to him some interesting observation you might make about human nature and what our in game actions might hint about things about our true self.
Late on a Friday night after a few adult beverages I am a fan of a good argument!
For the record,
1. I am against farming and botting. 2. I think a lot of folks misunderstand the real effect of RMT, farming and botting. 3. I believe RMT, farming and account hacking are separate issues. 4. I believe Eve has had RMT supported by CCP in at least one form for some time now with Plexes. 5. I believe having more RL $ with plexes available gives a player with more $$ an advantage in Eve. 6. I also believe that the law around the value of items in a virtual world like Eve in the RL world we live in are evolving and we can expect some interesting changes in EULAs at a minimum and even court cases like a few recently where someone treats a virtual item like an RL item to pursue civil and maybe even criminal consequences from in game theft or destruction.
Thanks for giving me the opportunity to clear that up!
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1011
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:26:00 -
[57] - Quote
T'amber Anomandari Demaleon wrote:I support ambulation as long as its not a necessary feature for any pilot to use.
Ambulation/ WIS could be a great tool for player made content and I'd love to see tools that would allow players to customise NPC's and their responses.
Thanks for joining the debate!
I think you have a very reasonable position on ambulation!
Issler |
T'amber Anomandari Demaleon
479
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:38:00 -
[58] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Ka P'lah wrote:You don't have much vision, do you? Do you think the concept of the tie-in to EVE is going to stop with dust514, whatever it's initial success? (I happen to think it will do alright) Frankly, ladie harlot, I'm finding it difficult to care whether you take me seriously or not...character flaw on my part, probably.. I think Dust will release with a bunch of marketing fanfare and then quietly die away in a few months. The vast majority of Eve players want nothing to do with a bunch of mouthbreather console kiddies and people who like console shooters don't have the attention span play in such a way to have an impact on Eve like CCP thinks they will. I'm hopeful that CCP will admit defeat gracefully (and quickly) and not pour a ton of resources into a dumb concept which could put Eve back in the same place we were in last summer. Basically I want them to handle it the same way they handled ambulation by admitting WiS and the NEX were bad ideas and then refocusing on Eve.
WIS is in itself not a bad idea and there's still a substantial amount of players who are interested in it (guessing by conversations I've had on the campaign trail and from reading the forums) - not including the people who are too afraid to admit that they're closet WISlovers because of possible ridicule from peers. The execution, lack of content and resulting waste of resources is what was most depressing and If there'd actually been something there the time spent developing could have been justified at least a little with some pressure removed from CCP. T'amber for CSM7 - Ship and Client Customisation Take part in the 2min Ship Customisation Survey www.tinyurl.com/shipcustomisation
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Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
242
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Posted - 2012.02.29 00:45:00 -
[59] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:For the pro WiS crowd I think it's important to clarify a stance. Most FiS people think ambulation would be kinda cool on some level. Can you imagine how we'd be able to mess with people if we can all interact in station? It would be a goon wet dream. The sense of community while sitting in a station playing poker or whatever the hell, hanging out in a space brothel, heck I don't care, it would be cool.
The idea is a cool idea, full stop.
They aren't staffed for the task, they don't have the skillset to bring a quality WiS product, and they siphoned off too much manpower to attempt to pull this off. It hurt the game and that is what people are mostly objecting to. All this development time to give us one room and a sofa?
Reason?
From a Goon?
Oooooh, crikey, the End-Times are upon us!
I are kyute kitten! I are in ur mishun! Redoosin' teh lag by ninja'ing ur wrekz! (CCP: Make wrecks probable, and after 30min., tractorable.) |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2238
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:00:00 -
[60] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:4. I believe Eve has had RMT supported by CCP in at least one form for some time now with Plexes.
That's irrelevant because it's a one-way deal - you buy gametime, sell it to other players for ISK. There's no sanctioned way to liquidate in-game assets for real money, and there should not be - it's bad for business. If a new player wants to drop $2000 on this game to skip months/years of grinding, they might as well pay it to CCP instead of a third party. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
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