EVE Search - Experiment for Developer Posting

Search EVE-Online forums for:

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Experiment for Developer Posting

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

Author	Topic
Evelgrivion Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.05.05 09:33:00 - [1] A lot of people have been complaining lately about how developers often say so little these days. I suspect a lot of this has to do with the requirements CCP has for politeness in developer posts. A lot of the stuff that is posted these days by various community members is more or less impossible to reply to in a polite way. The statements that are replied to politely are usually met with conspiracies, making it even less tempting for them to post. But can this change? I would like to propose an experiment: remove all the restrictions and guidelines that are in place for CCP employees, and leave the forums a completely even playing field for one week. Anything a player can say, a developer can say. I believe we'll see a marked increase in CCP's presence on the forums, and a significant increase in the questions answered if they don't have to worry about a make believe corporate-image. An opportunity for the developers to tear down some of the lower quality forum posts is rather appealing to my person as well . Please, Please, Please let the developers speak their minds
Scetrov Gallente OcUK Overclockers Podpilot Services	Posted - 2008.05.05 09:38:00 - [2] I think you probably hit the nail on the head when you said: Quote: are usually met with conspiracies A developer replying to a post can quite quickly derail something that was initially productive, so I can see why an individual CCP employee holds fire on saying anything. I think also perhaps the ratio of players (particularly those active on the forums) to developers has changed over time thus diluting the number developer posts on the forum.
Eomar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.05.05 09:42:00 - [3] Theres also the issue of the OMGFIXTEHLAGGZ ******s who continutally whine about the devs 'wasting time' doing other stuff. The reason the dev team rarely reply is because theyre now chained to thier desks 23/7 FIXINGTEHLAGZ. this includes the art/sales/customer services/finance and accounting/etc etc departments, who of course are the experts on TEHLAGZ and know more about 'turning off' the lag in jita than ANYONE. ...in accordance with the prophecy
Buyerr	Posted - 2008.05.05 12:09:00 - [4] Originally by: Scetrov I think you probably hit the nail on the head when you said: Quote: are usually met with conspiracies A developer replying to a post can quite quickly derail something that was initially productive, so I can see why an individual CCP employee holds fire on saying anything. I think also perhaps the ratio of players (particularly those active on the forums) to developers has changed over time thus diluting the number developer posts on the forum. attitude in a game is the result of the devs. so if they think it is unpleasant to write because of the response from the players then maybe they should take a look on what creates this kind of attitude and fix it, instead of just hiding in a hole doing nothing. stand up and take some responsibility for your creation I declare war on stupidity
Ankhesentapemkah Gallente	Posted - 2008.05.05 12:36:00 - [5] Did you consider that a lot of devs ARE mature and wouldn't revert to insults even if there wasn't a rule saying they can't do it? --- Consider voting for me in the CSM elections. Click the banner to watch the campaign movie.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.05.05 13:17:00 - [6] Originally by: Evelgrivion Please, Please, Please let the developers speak their minds Well, at least that will keep their posts short. /Devdig2/ Eve-Online: The Text Adventure
Ka Mizu Mushroom Samba	Posted - 2008.05.05 13:18:00 - [7] Originally by: Buyerr attitude in a game is the result of the devs. so if they think it is unpleasant to write because of the response from the players then maybe they should take a look on what creates this kind of attitude and fix it, instead of just hiding in a hole doing nothing. stand up and take some responsibility for your creation I don't think that they consider writing replies on the forum "unpleasant" because they are afraid of well thought out, constructive criticism. If they are afraid of anything it is the huge number of people posting on these forums who consider themselves intelligent and able to see "all the issues", when in fact they are just self centred little children who are incapable of seeing beyond their own selfish desires. The change in frequency of, and attitude in, dev posting has happened at the same time and pace as the abusiveness of the playerbase has increased. It's not a coincidence. As far as the abuse coming from players being the devs fault for not fixing things... well, that is a perfect example of what a self centred person who cannot see the larger picture because of their selfishness would say... likely making some dev, trying his hardest, feel bad and feel much less like posting on the forums. Ka
Kolatha	Posted - 2008.05.05 13:26:00 - [8] Originally by: Eomar The reason the dev team rarely reply is because theyre now chained to thier desks 23/7 FIXINGTEHLAGZ. this includes the art/sales/customer services/finance and accounting/etc etc departments, who of course are the experts on TEHLAGZ and know more about 'turning off' the lag in jita than ANYONE. And the one hour a day they get off the Janitor takes over.
Caleese New Eden Research And Design School	Posted - 2008.05.05 13:29:00 - [9] I know if I was a dev I wouldn't post here unless I absolutely had to. I mean why put up with all the crap they get? Mind you I'd be the sorta dev that would read these forums, look at some of the whining and general bull** that goes on, think to myself, "You ungrateful son of a **, I helped create this game and you talk as if you know more than I do" deletes whining idiots account* I don't think I'd be all that good for business ----------------- Think of someone you consider of average intelligence... now realise this. Half the worlds population is dumber than that person. How does the world survive such stupidity?

CCP Eris Discordia	Posted - 2008.05.05 14:33:00 - [10] I was taught that if you can¦t say anything nice, it¦s better to say nothing at all Adding to this, when we reply and we explain things from our end, we still get replies stating the contrary. What is the point of answering if people refuse to believe what we say? It turns into a waste of time for us to answer each thread with ¦we do not hate amarr/caldari/gallente/minmatar, honest¦ everytime it is brought up, so we simply don¦t bother. Sometimes you have nice people on the forum who will repeat what we have said before and we do appreciate those efforts a lot. Fact is we simply cannot address every issue/question/thread on the forum because then we¦d never get any actual work done. Having a special person do this, well he or she would need to be on top of every project and department in CCP and that is near impossible if you have to read the forums all day too. Pink Dread has been hijacked


Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:03:00 - [11] Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Having a special person do this, well he or she would need to be on top of every project and department in CCP and that is near impossible if you have to read the forums all day too. I bet you wouldn't have a shortage of candidates for that position, were you to job-interview people 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:18:00 - [12] Originally by: Akita T Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Having a special person do this, well he or she would need to be on top of every project and department in CCP and that is near impossible if you have to read the forums all day too. I bet you wouldn't have a shortage of candidates for that position, were you to job-interview people I'm in! and conspiracy time!!! Evelgrivion is a dev alt saying that he wants to flame people with his ccp account
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:19:00 - [13] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton I'm in! Hell, what forum who... err... veteran wouldn't ? 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
Slade Trillgon Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:23:00 - [14] Originally by: Akita T Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton I'm in! Hell, what forum who... err... veteran wouldn't ? Nice one Akita, I like the tact!!! If I was in the position, knowledge wise, I would be all over it. Slade
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:36:00 - [15] anyone ever consider the devs are posting on the forums? just not with thier dev accounts and instead with thier player accounts? I mean if I became a dev someday, I wouldn't want to stop posting as me :)
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:39:00 - [16] Originally by: Akita T Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton I'm in! Hell, what forum who... err... veteran wouldn't ? I take pride in whoring myself out on the forums of course
Kazuo Ishiguro House of Marbles Zzz	Posted - 2008.05.05 15:49:00 - [17] Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Adding to this, when we reply and we explain things from our end, we still get replies stating the contrary. What is the point of answering if people refuse to believe what we say? There will always be people who will disagree, but even out of those, I expect that the majority are mature enough not to post at all. Expressions of general assent are actually frowned upon in these forums, I should point out. Any chance of letting people post polls here? Even the people who disagree are still generally pleased to have the information. For the rest of us, it's always interesting to know where the game is going, even if we don't always say so. My research services Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant stats
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 16:07:00 - [18] Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Adding to this, when we reply and we explain things from our end, we still get replies stating the contrary. What is the point of answering if people refuse to believe what we say? There will always be people who will disagree, but even out of those, I expect that the majority are mature enough not to post at all. Expressions of general assent are actually frowned upon in these forums, I should point out. Any chance of letting people post polls here? Even the people who disagree are still generally pleased to have the information. For the rest of us, it's always interesting to know where the game is going, even if we don't always say so. its also pretty damn hard to find the dev/gm responses after a bit of time goes by.
000Hunter000 Gallente Missiles 'R' Us	Posted - 2008.05.05 16:56:00 - [19] OMG AN ERIS POST!!! IT's A CONSPIRACY I TELL U!!! Personally they can speak their minds, but on the other hand usually it's not good business calling ur customers morons!!! _______________________________________________________ CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!!
Yakia TovilToba Halliburton Inc.	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:07:00 - [20] 1. Who says the devs aren't already posting a lot, but with hidden alts ? Noone forces them to use CCP accounts if they like to make more direct/offensive statements. 2. Asking the devs to act like normal players is just wrong. The words of devs have another weight/importance, if you'd get trolled by a dev that would be much more offensive, they have to be more careful about what they say. It's like in RL, if the average joe (us) talks crap, noone gives a **** about it. If a politician or celeb (devs) says the same crap, the media will tear him apart. So it makes perfect sense that devs are restricted to polite posting.


CCP Atropos C C P	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:10:00 - [21] Originally by: 000Hunter000 OMG AN ERIS POST!!! IT's A CONSPIRACY I TELL U!!! Personally they can speak their minds, but on the other hand usually it's not good business calling ur customers morons!!! Alas...


CCP Eris Discordia	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:13:00 - [22] Originally by: CCP Atropos Originally by: 000Hunter000 OMG AN ERIS POST!!! IT's A CONSPIRACY I TELL U!!! Personally they can speak their minds, but on the other hand usually it's not good business calling ur customers morons!!! Alas... Real trolls don¦t listen anyway. I keep slapping Atropos around but he never learns Pink Dread has been hijacked

Hana Lena Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:15:00 - [23] Pimp slap PIMP SLAP! _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ADHD + Dyslexia = BAD SPELLING! Proud to be in the FNA (for over a year) and not be a alt!
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:16:00 - [24] Originally by: CCP Atropos Originally by: 000Hunter000 OMG AN ERIS POST!!! IT's A CONSPIRACY I TELL U!!! Personally they can speak their minds, but on the other hand usually it's not good business calling ur customers morons!!! Alas... Posts like this are why teh forums are so fun. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:19:00 - [25] Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Originally by: CCP Atropos Originally by: 000Hunter000 OMG AN ERIS POST!!! IT's A CONSPIRACY I TELL U!!! Personally they can speak their minds, but on the other hand usually it's not good business calling ur customers morons!!! Alas... Real trolls don¦t listen anyway. I keep slapping Atropos around but he never learns when the real trolls troll no one realizes there has been a troll trolling. it takes a good listening to find out how to troll without setting of the troll is trolling alarms. its even better when its blatantly obvious See this thread for example
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:28:00 - [26] Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=762893 Heh.. Successful troll is successful. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 17:38:00 - [27] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=762893 Heh.. Successful troll is successful. i was thinking obvious troll is obvious, but it seemed to work too damn well

CCP Mitnal C C P	Posted - 2008.05.05 19:12:00 - [28] Why do I read this and immediately think, "Workload overload"? Mitnal, Community Representative EVE Online CCP Games Email/Netfang


CCP Prism X Gallente C C P	Posted - 2008.05.05 19:35:00 - [29] Originally by: CCP Mitnal Why do I read this and immediately think, "Workload overload"? Yeah my initial reaction was pretty much: "***, I'd need to take a whole week off". But on the serious side, we should be quite capable of exposing dogmatic ignorance without resorting to obvious measures. At any rate we can always just ignore it and let the community deal with it as obvious troll is obvious. That, ofcourse, has the annoying side effect of Dev presence becoming the inverse of troll rpesence but it's still an option. To be honest, I have, once, found myself doing the exact opposite of this and becoming quite obviously aggressive here and feel quite ashamed for it. Kudos to the person who broke my Zen... he/she/it also made me realise I drink way too much coffee. You live, you learn, 'eh? Nevertheless, I'd love the idea of not having to wonder whether I'm crossing the invisible line. But it's taught me a thing or two when it comes to implying what I don't say. In retrospect it's alright by me. What I'd like to see was our GMs being free to answer any accusations directed towards them full force with quotes from the transaction log and a direct posting of the persons full API key. It wont happen as it's quite draconian, but it sure would be nice to see a drop in them slander topics. Y'know, might actually keep the decent discussions from being overlooked. But that's just my silly ideas. I'm a Database Developer, not a community manager. I'd expect them to know a thing or umpteenhundred that I do not when it comes to their area of expertise. Still would be nice to see all them CCP Stole my ISK don thy tinfoil!* threads gone. Those and the Waah! I made a petition 3 days ago (define days 'minutes') and the GMs haven't answered! I don't like those one bit and really need to stop wasting my time on them. ~ Prism X EvE Database Developer Relocating your character to a cozy, secure container since 2006. Relocating your cozy, secure container to the EVE cemetery since 2008.

Franga NQX Innovations	Posted - 2008.05.05 21:44:00 - [30] Acutally, what the devs should be doing is this: MOAR DEV BLOGS And good to see Prism posting quite a number of times lately. It's hot. Whether they agree or not, most people crave the ideas and opinions of the devs. It's true. They may not like them, but they want to know. Originally by: Rachel Vend ... with 100% reliability in most cases ...

Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.05 22:00:00 - [31] Originally by: CCP Prism X Originally by: CCP Mitnal Why do I read this and immediately think, "Workload overload"? Yeah my initial reaction was pretty much: "***, I'd need to take a whole week off". But on the serious side, we should be quite capable of exposing dogmatic ignorance without resorting to obvious measures. At any rate we can always just ignore it and let the community deal with it as obvious troll is obvious. That, ofcourse, has the annoying side effect of Dev presence becoming the inverse of troll rpesence but it's still an option. To be honest, I have, once, found myself doing the exact opposite of this and becoming quite obviously aggressive here and feel quite ashamed for it. Kudos to the person who broke my Zen... he/she/it also made me realise I drink way too much coffee. You live, you learn, 'eh? Nevertheless, I'd love the idea of not having to wonder whether I'm crossing the invisible line. But it's taught me a thing or two when it comes to implying what I don't say. In retrospect it's alright by me. What I'd like to see was our GMs being free to answer any accusations directed towards them full force with quotes from the transaction log and a direct posting of the persons full API key. It wont happen as it's quite draconian, but it sure would be nice to see a drop in them slander topics. Y'know, might actually keep the decent discussions from being overlooked. But that's just my silly ideas. I'm a Database Developer, not a community manager. I'd expect them to know a thing or umpteenhundred that I do not when it comes to their area of expertise. Still would be nice to see all them CCP Stole my ISK don thy tinfoil!* threads gone. Those and the Waah! I made a petition 3 days ago (define days 'minutes') and the GMs haven't answered! I don't like those one bit and really need to stop wasting my time on them. you guys don't have to do it, you have at least 2 volunteers in the thread obvious troll is obvious doesn't always work. for a smashing example see the post i linked above... Some people don't seem to know trolls exist on the interwebs. and there are some people who i believe it is there actual opinion on the matter that just is such utter stupidity that I assume its a troll, or so sincere that giving my opinion would be like a troll to them Oh god i would love to see the publishing of full api keys and wallet logs and such. but obviously you cant do that and yes all the tinfoil hattery threads are the same and as such need a swift lock as do not discuss petitiony/gm stuff on the forums
Tek'a Rain Gallente Collegium Mechanicae Holding	Posted - 2008.05.05 22:19:00 - [32] Originally by: Franga Acutally, what the devs should be doing is this: MOAR DEV BLOGS Repeated for emphasis. More devblogs! not comments about isk sales, not moving reports pointing out that iceland is cold and for goodness sake Not "live dev blogs" We know things are happening, but not being told, anything, ever, gnaws on the nerves.
tehScoutZ0r	Posted - 2008.05.05 22:20:00 - [33] Originally by: CCP Prism X Originally by: CCP Mitnal Kudos to the person who broke my Zen... he/she/it also made me realise I drink way too much coffee. Ack, who was it who finally broke you of this amusing habit?
Karanth Gallente Eve's Brothers of Destiny FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.05.06 02:36:00 - [34] I'd make a news item. It would read, "For one week the Devs will be all over the forums, rampaging all over whatever catches their eye. Expect flames, and maybe something constructive, but no guarantees." Keep that stickied to the client, and forums, and all that, for 2 weeks. Once you start, go hard. Like, instead of wasting time copy/pasting form stuff about "inappropriate threads" or "trolling" or "duplicate threads" and stuff like that when locking threads, just say something like "Z0MG STFU N00B L0CKED TROOL TOPICZ!!11!ONE" Also, instead of couching your statements in weasel words (I'm talking to you Prism X! ) and wasting half the poast on that, just let it all hang out, and A. People who are ignorant will hopefully work themselves into a frothing frenzy, and get banned for being foolish, and B. People who are not ignorant can have a free laugh at group "A", and maybe hash something out in the resultant quiet. On top of that, I would be a very happy person if the Devs decided to start modding moar sigs. That would be what I want, but what I want and what I get are not the same thing... "Current Earth-Destruction Status"
Liang Nuren Black Sea Industries Insurgency	Posted - 2008.05.06 03:01:00 - [35] Originally by: CCP Prism X Nevertheless, I'd love the idea of not having to wonder whether I'm crossing the invisible line. But it's taught me a thing or two when it comes to implying what I don't say. In retrospect it's alright by me. What I'd like to see was our GMs being free to answer any accusations directed towards them full force with quotes from the transaction log and a direct posting of the persons full API key. It wont happen as it's quite draconian, but it sure would be nice to see a drop in them slander topics. Y'know, might actually keep the decent discussions from being overlooked. Heh, I'd probably start reading General again if you did that. Consider it a huge +1 from me. BTW, I'd volunteer to do the forum whoring for teh freez too! Hmm, wonder if my boss would like it. :p -Liang -- Originally by: Blake Abadon, Morsus Mihi insirgency caused the turn arround in the war against bob, when they forced the MM capital fleet to move back to defend their homeland.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2008.05.06 05:10:00 - [36] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: CCP Prism X Nevertheless, I'd love the idea of not having to wonder whether I'm crossing the invisible line. But it's taught me a thing or two when it comes to implying what I don't say. In retrospect it's alright by me. What I'd like to see was our GMs being free to answer any accusations directed towards them full force with quotes from the transaction log and a direct posting of the persons full API key. It wont happen as it's quite draconian, but it sure would be nice to see a drop in them slander topics. Y'know, might actually keep the decent discussions from being overlooked. Heh, I'd probably start reading General again if you did that. Consider it a huge +1 from me. BTW, I'd volunteer to do the forum whoring for teh freez too! Hmm, wonder if my boss would like it. :p -Liang get in line
Seth Ruin Minmatar Galactic Exploration and Mining Corporation	Posted - 2008.05.06 05:36:00 - [37] Originally by: Franga Acutally, what the devs should be doing is this: MOAR DEV BLOGS And good to see Prism posting quite a number of times lately. It's hot. Whether they agree or not, most people crave the ideas and opinions of the devs. It's true. They may not like them, but they want to know. I absolutely agree. However, I'd like to hear more updates as far as the progress of the game. Specifically, certain bugs, such as the annoying dancing overview bug. Why hasn't it been fixed yet? There is a good reason, I am convinced. However, I'd like to know what that reason is...
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.06 20:22:00 - [38] Edited by: Patch86 on 06/05/2008 20:22:27 Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Adding to this, when we reply and we explain things from our end, we still get replies stating the contrary. What is the point of answering if people refuse to believe what we say? It turns into a waste of time for us to answer each thread with ¦we do not hate amarr/caldari/gallente/minmatar, honest¦ everytime it is brought up, so we simply don¦t bother. While I see where you're coming from, it would be sad if that were allowed to be the case. For one, there is a difference between answering every thread, and answering some threads. Since you brought it up, the Amarr one sticks out as a good example. There was that 100+ page thread about Amarr issues, and another 50 page thread hot on it's tail, neither of which got a reply. Of all the 1000's of posters who posted in those threads, none of them had seen a CCP post on the issue worth quoting in. A simple "don't worry guys, we're working on it" post would have killed those mega-threads dead. Indeed, the moment there was mention of Amarr fixes in a dev blog, the mega-threads died off and were replaced with more constructive discursive threads. Just a single vague reassurance would have quelled one of these forums' most epic whines to more manageable levels. For the other, you shouldn't get disheartened when there are posters who seem to flat out disbelieve what you say. This game has some 250,000 users, all of which have forum access. Even assuming just 10% of the community frequent these forums, thats 25,000 potential readers of any given statement. If you say something, 24,990 might believe you, and 10 will start posting "OMFG CONSPIRACY CCP ARE LIARS". Its not really fair on the other 24.9k people to stop posting because of a handful of idiots. Assuming that these forums will ever be idiot/conspiracy/flame free is futile; they're just too damned big for that.
Karanth Gallente Eve's Brothers of Destiny FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.05.08 10:39:00 - [39] It seems that in response to the request for MOAR DEV BLOGS, we got this: The loneliest DevBlog in the world. MOAR Blogs, not NERF DevBlogs. Originally by: Marcus TheMartin Originally by: CCP Morpheus +1 reported for spam

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.