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Heterosexual rights = Homosexual rights?

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Author	Topic
Nuala Reece Caldari Trinity Nova Trinity Nova Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.14 09:59:00 - [121] Originally by: Kyanzes Besides you seem to accept his mentioning of a book as a clear and hard evidence while ignoring my and others' critic views of said book. Funny thing about book reviews - you find one saying that the book only covered 50 species of animal, I find one that references it as covering 450. Who's right? Who knows? But then, that's why I used words like 'seems to suggest' as I was presenting the book as a challenge to the idea that homosexuality is unnatural, not as hard and clear proof of my point of view. Science needs evidence for proof and Bagemhil does recognise that there's been limited research done on the subject. If you prefer something more specific though how about "The data included in this volume concern a broad array of species and provide support for a variety of hypotheses concerning the evolution of homosexual behaviour. The editors succeed in demonstrating that homosexual behaviour is an important component of the behavioural repertoire in some species, and that it has important evolutionary implications for social, sexual and reproductive strategies.", which comes from a review of a more recent book, "Homosexual Behaviour in Animals: An Evolutionary Perspective" editted by Volker Sommer & Paul L. Vasey. Getting back on track for where this thread started though, that does raise some issues that homosexuality may evolve in some species to meet an important social role (such as among humans for eg. If that was the case, where does it leave us if our societal rules marginalize * people? To me the fact that there's such a debate over these kind of issues is more about our changing social structures (and the very natural human resistance to changes to the familiar) than why homosexuality is there in the first place. * people have been forming partnerships, having and raising children for a long, long time already and the human species seems to have coped okay with that so far. What's changing at the moment is a move away from a selective blindness about a whole section of our society and towards a more realistic (and healthy IMO) acceptance based on our modern social concepts of tolerance, acceptance and inclusion. Trinity Nova Mercenary Services Web Site - Nominated for the 2008 E-ON Magazine Awards
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.05.14 10:39:00 - [122] Wow, i feel so progressive living in the netherlands. I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them.
LordChaos Amarr Sons Of Amun	Posted - 2008.05.14 12:11:00 - [123] LOL at the subject i dont like the idea of ***s and its against my religon too but at the same time i wont treat them like they below me and im better than them. as they getting equal rights they human like everyone else only difference is ....... you all know and i dont want to continue talking about it cause it will go on forever. you all should watch eddie murphy Delirious and Raw though :) The Master Of Chaos
annoing Amarr MisFunk Inc. Daisho Syndicate	Posted - 2008.05.14 14:08:00 - [124] Edited by: annoing on 14/05/2008 14:12:24 Originally by: Kyanzes [ Then, following your logic, we could also state that raping is also natural and should be allowed.... If we follow that G@ys are un-natural and againgst the word of God we get to very sticky ground for the religious nutters: Rape, according to the bible, is a holy thing and legal under the laws of Jehovah. Do NOT think that Jesus wanted it any differently as he stated that he came to re-inforce the word of God, not to change any of his laws. R@pe in the bible: Judges 21:10-24 , Numbers 31:7-18, Deuteronomy 20:10-14, My personal favourite - Deuteronomy 22:28-29 (If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.), Deuteronomy 22:23-24 - proof that the r@pe victim is guilty (If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife.), Proof that God loves a rapist but not the victims- 2 Samuel 12:11-14, The r@pe of female captives is perfectly good - Deuteronomy 21:10-14, Judges 5:30, Selling your children as sex slaves to be raped at will - Exodus 21:7-11 , and finally, raping women is part of reward for following Jehovahs orders - Zechariah 14:1-2. I always laugh when I hear people quote the bible for this moral standpoint or that moral high-ground. I laugh because I know that they have never read the bible and those that have breezed through it, ignore the parts they do not like. Homosexuality isnt perverted, it isnt un-natural or anything else. It is what it is, nature at work. Ive never met a g@y that opted for that lifestyle because he/she thought it would be more fun. The problem with bigots like you, and yes I still maintain you're a bigotted little fascist, is your fear that you may be like them afterall and that scares you. Dont be afraid, embrace your g@yness and be proud of it Also, while I agree 100% that g@ys should be allowed to marry, to adopt, to become parents, to live in equality within society, I dont believe it is their right to adopt without the same stringent checks that I would expect any potential adoptive parents to recieve. However, they *should* be allowed to have the same chances as hetrosexuals. Dwi Cymraig
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.14 22:05:00 - [125] Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 22:06:30 I personally do not call homosexuality moral, but it is not my problem and I don't really care. They've never harmed me, so I have no beef with them. I do however respect human life, which too little people have anyone - so I believe they should have the same rights as everyone else; wither its good or bad, they should be permitted to go through the same joys and pains we all experience. The only other thing I have a opinion on in this matter * Marriage in the United States, some isolated cases: some states they have homosexual couples demanding the right to be married - even if its in a Christian Church that does not allow it. Most Christian Churches DO NOT condone homosexuality - so it's a huge fat joke when I hear about * couples demanding the right to be married in such-and-such church, and EVEN THOUGHT the church does not permit homosexuality. This is obvious method of harassment in my opinion. I mean really - why are they so persistent to be married in this specific church, if they know it's against them and what they do? My best guess is they just want to harass and **** some bible thumper's off. This is where the line stops I think. They need equal rights, just like everyone else - but I think its really childish if its used as a tool to attack other groups, and this is where the foot needs to be put down. To the distorted and corrupt Christans: Your religion, like many other relgions, has such a old and bloody history to the point where I think its hard to take it seroiusly anymore. Your texts and doctrines have been rewritten and changed to the point where it's a joke. Too many people say they are true Christains but do not practice it either. I can't take the demands of religious zealots seriously when they corrupt their own holy scriptures, incapable of practicing what they preach, and probably have distorted their view on their god to the point where they are not even worshiping their god anymore - but worshiping a twisted vision created by the minds of blood lusting men over many century's. Religion has become more of a guideline or requirement on how to live and as a tool to control and manipulate more then a holy place that is the house of god. Until the original intent behind Religion, and the original God (not a man made fantasy), is restored, I can't take a lot of crap that comes from disillusioned and self-rightous peoples mouths seriously. To the true Christians: I have nothing to say to any true Christians, though this is pointless because chance are they are ignoring this thread entirely. As true men to their god, they know what it is to value human life, and they know the law. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Everyone Dies Caldari	Posted - 2008.05.14 23:37:00 - [126] marriage is a privilege not a right get your facts straight homo-lovers looks like the Norway government are weak and pathetic.
Solsson	Posted - 2008.05.14 23:45:00 - [127] Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 22:06:30 I personally do not call homosexuality moral How can you find it to not be moral? It's just as moral of heterosexuality.
Solsson	Posted - 2008.05.14 23:46:00 - [128] Originally by: Everyone Dies marriage is a privilege not a right get your facts straight homo-lovers looks like the Norway government are weak and pathetic. So only heterosexual people can have this privilege? Because that is discrimination and no different than being racist or sexist. And it also looks like Norway is statistically better than the United STates, which I'm assuming your a citizen of.
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.14 23:46:00 - [129] Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 23:46:32 Originally by: Solsson Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 22:06:30 I personally do not call homosexuality moral How can you find it to not be moral? It's just as moral of heterosexuality. Because it seems wrong to me - live with it. I just defended homosexuals, regardless my beliefs. Why: because its the right thing to do. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Solsson	Posted - 2008.05.15 00:03:00 - [130] Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 23:46:32 Originally by: Solsson Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 22:06:30 I personally do not call homosexuality moral How can you find it to not be moral? It's just as moral of heterosexuality. Because it seems wrong to me - live with it. I just defended homosexuals, regardless my beliefs. Why: because its the right thing to do. I still want to know why. I hear people say that, and I still have no idea why. So I want to know why you find it to be wrong.

Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 00:24:00 - [131] Originally by: Solsson Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 23:46:32 Originally by: Solsson Originally by: Amastat Edited by: Amastat on 14/05/2008 22:06:30 I personally do not call homosexuality moral How can you find it to not be moral? It's just as moral of heterosexuality. Because it seems wrong to me - live with it. I just defended homosexuals, regardless my beliefs. Why: because its the right thing to do. I still want to know why. I hear people say that, and I still have no idea why. So I want to know why you find it to be wrong. Ah ok - sorry to be defensive then. Some people just cannot settle for anything lower then total agreement and control over everyone else. As to why: It's hard to explain, it's just a instinct that and it's very foreign and unnatural. This is just how I've always felt, no priest has ever told me to think this way. It's really no different from the feeling a person gets when they see someone torture another person or animal - it's disturbing. Unlike most people however, I know they are not harming me. I also don't give into xenophobia's that most people let govern them, how they live, act, and even commit crimes. Basically - in my mind, they are just different from me, but though I may not agree with thing they do - they are not harming me and deserve no mistreatment in any way at all. Some distorted people, like a poster a few posts back, use their religion as a justification behind the way they treat homosexuals - because they are different; even though, they think that homosexually is a mutilation of what their god taught them to do - they are in fact other teachings at the same time. I however feel that its flawed human perceptions and influences that creates a lot of this - as it has with many of the blood-soaked horrors relgion has created in the past. Remember that their god is not ordering them to act in this way - it's their priests that claim they speak for god that orders them. Fear of something different, fear in general is a plague. It's a necessary emotion we all have, but it easily just as capable of driving us to destroy ourselves - and it has throughout our entire history, literally. You may find it hard to believe, but yes - regardless of how I feel; oppressing homosexuals, just like oppressing people of different race, is not right either. It's nothing but destructive, and creating another "sin". There is a time when people need to set down their own feelings and do what is right - its just a matter wither or not people see this. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Kalahari Wayrest Re-Awakened Technologies Inc	Posted - 2008.05.15 00:29:00 - [132] Quote: I mean really - why are they so persistent to be married in this specific church, if they know it's against them and what they do? Sexual preference doesn't define a person. Therefore, it's perfectly possible to be * and in all other respects follow christian values and beliefs. I think it would be important to someone (as opposed to a registry office, which would be my personal choice if I ever got married ) to get married in their own church of their own religion. Quote: but I think its really childish if its used as a tool to attack other groups Well that's my point, * and christian aren't binary oppositions - it's not neccesarily an 'other' group. Aren't there *** vicars, for example? (confounded censor messing up my link, you can guess what the starred word is ) __________________________ Indulge Me Consider Yourself Indulged - Immy ♥ Wow immy scored - Xorus
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 00:39:00 - [133] Edited by: Amastat on 15/05/2008 00:39:53 Originally by: Kalahari Wayrest Quote: I mean really - why are they so persistent to be married in this specific church, if they know it's against them and what they do? Sexual preference doesn't define a person. Therefore, it's perfectly possible to be * and in all other respects follow christian values and beliefs. I think it would be important to someone (as opposed to a registry office, which would be my personal choice if I ever got married ) to get married in their own church of their own religion. Quote: but I think its really childish if its used as a tool to attack other groups Well that's my point, * and christian aren't binary oppositions - it's not neccesarily an 'other' group. Aren't there * vicars, for example? (confounded censor messing up my link, you can guess what the starred word is ) Yea - there is -accepting churches out there; which is all good, so long people aren't being harassed, its great. But in the few cases they its used as a tool in that manner, then it's becoming a bit messed up. Some churches obviously strictly do not allow it, and won't tolerate it, these are the cases. The MAIN debate, 90% of the debate in the US is ** people have equal marriage rights and all to hetro's though. which is fine, but that one small example is the only thing I have to say against it. In those cases, law enforcement needs to do something about harassment, but besides that, it's all good. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Akiba Penrose Minmatar PAK	Posted - 2008.05.15 01:29:00 - [134] Originally by: Amastat Because it seems wrong to me - live with it. I just defended homosexuals, regardless my beliefs. Why: because its the right thing to do. I really dont understand how you can defend g@y-marrige and at the same time think its immoral. To me this seems a bit absurd,, Why do you think its the right thing to do?
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 01:37:00 - [135] Edited by: Amastat on 15/05/2008 01:37:58 Originally by: Akiba Penrose Originally by: Amastat Because it seems wrong to me - live with it. I just defended homosexuals, regardless my beliefs. Why: because its the right thing to do. I really dont understand how you can defend g@y-marrige and at the same time think its immoral. To me this seems a bit absurd,, Why do you think its the right thing to do? Because treating them as sub-human and disregarding them as another human life is wrong. Wither or not I agree with what they do - and it's not the marriage thats the problem, its the entire concept - I would be immoral myself to go around ***-bashing and treating them like crap. I rise above my own feelings to do whats right, instead of creating a second wrong. I'm apologize if your unable to comprehend how a person will rise about their own selfish interests or feelings to do whats right, for the better good - rather then give too easily into their own feelings - flawed or not, just to create another sin. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.05.15 01:45:00 - [136] Originally by: Amastat As to why: It's hard to explain, it's just a instinct that and it's very foreign and unnatural. This is just how I've always felt, no priest has ever told me to think this way. It's really no different from the feeling a person gets when they see someone torture another person or animal - it's disturbing. I agree completely, I did never understand the whole thing about anal sex between men because it's foreign, unnatural and disgusting! But, hetrosexual men having anal sex with their women is complete natural hetrosexual behavior... oh wai! I suppose we could wrap that one up as that there are alot of confused bisexual guys out there who would bang ass, anyones' ass, as long as it is tan, fine and shaved. The irony of life, I reckon.. ~No, you are not special. I insult everyone.
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 01:53:00 - [137] Originally by: Digital Solaris Originally by: Amastat As to why: It's hard to explain, it's just a instinct that and it's very foreign and unnatural. This is just how I've always felt, no priest has ever told me to think this way. It's really no different from the feeling a person gets when they see someone torture another person or animal - it's disturbing. I agree completely, I did never understand the whole thing about anal sex between men because it's foreign, unnatural and disgusting! But, hetrosexual men having anal sex with their women is complete natural hetrosexual behavior... oh wai! I suppose we could wrap that one up as that there are alot of confused bisexual guys out there who would bang ass, anyones' ass, as long as it is tan, fine and shaved. The irony of life, I reckon.. Lol I honestly have never had much care for anal with a woman, never really tried really. It seems off - even here. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.05.15 02:06:00 - [138] Originally by: Amastat Originally by: Digital Solaris Originally by: Amastat As to why: It's hard to explain, it's just a instinct that and it's very foreign and unnatural. This is just how I've always felt, no priest has ever told me to think this way. It's really no different from the feeling a person gets when they see someone torture another person or animal - it's disturbing. I agree completely, I did never understand the whole thing about anal sex between men because it's foreign, unnatural and disgusting! But, hetrosexual men having anal sex with their women is complete natural hetrosexual behavior... oh wai! I suppose we could wrap that one up as that there are alot of confused bisexual guys out there who would bang ass, anyones' ass, as long as it is tan, fine and shaved. The irony of life, I reckon.. Lol I honestly have never had much care for anal with a woman, never really tried really. It seems off - even here. But who are we to critize them for enjoying anal sex? Moral bigots? Horrified phobians who dread what they could do to our bums? ~No, you are not special. I insult everyone.
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 02:14:00 - [139] Originally by: Digital Solaris Originally by: Amastat Originally by: Digital Solaris Originally by: Amastat As to why: It's hard to explain, it's just a instinct that and it's very foreign and unnatural. This is just how I've always felt, no priest has ever told me to think this way. It's really no different from the feeling a person gets when they see someone torture another person or animal - it's disturbing. I agree completely, I did never understand the whole thing about anal sex between men because it's foreign, unnatural and disgusting! But, hetrosexual men having anal sex with their women is complete natural hetrosexual behavior... oh wai! I suppose we could wrap that one up as that there are alot of confused bisexual guys out there who would bang ass, anyones' ass, as long as it is tan, fine and shaved. The irony of life, I reckon.. Lol I honestly have never had much care for anal with a woman, never really tried really. It seems off - even here. But who are we to critize them for enjoying anal sex? Moral bigots? Horrified phobians who dread what they could do to our bums? Lol. Just so long theres protection it becomes tolerable You know what also leaves that resteraunt if you know what I mean. ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Everyone Dies Caldari	Posted - 2008.05.15 02:44:00 - [140] look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e****mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum.

Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 03:07:00 - [141] Originally by: Everyone Dies look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e****mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum. Your link is broken ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.05.15 03:24:00 - [142] Originally by: Amastat Originally by: Everyone Dies look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e****mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum. Your link is broken Eve-O Obscenity filter 1 Moral bigot with buttplug inserted 0 ~No, you are not special. I insult everyone.
Amastat Caldari Omegatech	Posted - 2008.05.15 03:33:00 - [143] Originally by: Digital Solaris Originally by: Amastat Originally by: Everyone Dies look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e****mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum. Your link is broken Eve-O Obscenity filter 1 Moral bigot with buttplug inserted 0 EPIC ____________________ "All warfare is based on deception... we must seem unable...seem inactive...and crush him " - Sun Tzu, the
LLeugh Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2008.05.15 03:35:00 - [144] The only time sexual preferences should remove peoples right to adopt children should be if they are a pedophile. Homo/hetrosexual doesn't make any difference. So long as neither prospective parent isnt addicted to mind altering substances is relatively sane and stable. Thinking laterally Ask the children ;) If you are not living life on the edge you are taking up too much room
Digital Solaris	Posted - 2008.05.15 03:39:00 - [145] Originally by: LLeugh The only time sexual preferences should remove peoples right to adopt children should be if they are a pedophile. Homo/hetrosexual doesn't make any difference. So long as neither prospective parent isnt addicted to mind altering substances is relatively sane and stable. Thinking laterally Ask the children ;) But what a book that make people go to a building with a pointy roof and a bell in it? ~No, you are not special. I insult everyone.
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.05.15 06:12:00 - [146] Originally by: LLeugh The only time sexual preferences should remove peoples right to adopt children should be if they are a pedophile. Homo/hetrosexual doesn't make any difference. So long as neither prospective parent isnt addicted to mind altering substances is relatively sane and stable. Lol bible? I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them.
mamolian Eternity INC.	Posted - 2008.05.15 06:23:00 - [147] Have the mods being editing the **** out of this thread? How can it possibly have reached 5 pages without being locked yet.. This is not the first time this topic has come up on these forums.. but god damn.. it contains by far the most sensible and reasonable viewpoints from both sides of the fence I've witnessed for this topic on these forums..? -----------
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.05.15 06:33:00 - [148] Originally by: mamolian Have the mods being editing the **** out of this thread? How can it possibly have reached 5 pages without being locked yet.. This is not the first time this topic has come up on these forums.. but god damn.. it contains by far the most sensible and reasonable viewpoints from both sides of the fence I've witnessed for this topic on these forums..? Sensible viewpoints for discriminating a harmless group of citizens? Do tell! I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them.
Aclyn Seriy Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.05.15 10:47:00 - [149] Edited by: Aclyn Seriy on 15/05/2008 10:55:06 Originally by: Everyone Dies look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e**mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum. edited for more reasonable response: I have reported you to the moderators and will be filing a complaint directly to CCP regarding your forum post. Having a certain viewpoint is fine, but to post that s are subhuman scum on these forums is something i find reprehensible. My sister is and i love her with all my heart, she is a kind, loving caring woman and to have someone say she is scum makes me sick. Without wishing to stir up a hornets nest, or land myself in any trouble, I think it is you who are scum. Originally by:** techzer0 I'm the failboat captain
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.05.15 10:56:00 - [150] Originally by: Aclyn Seriy Edited by: Aclyn Seriy on 15/05/2008 10:55:06 Originally by: Everyone Dies look there are studies that show that there's a correlation between homosexuality and child molestation. http://www.familyresearchinst.org/fri_e**mphlet2.html they are subhuman scum. edited for more reasonable response: I have reported you to the moderators and will be filing a complaint directly to CCP regarding your forum post. Having a certain viewpoint is fine, but to post that s are subhuman scum on these forums is something i find reprehensible. My sister is ** and i love her with all my heart, she is a kind, loving caring woman and to have someone say she is scum makes me sick. Without wishing to stir up a hornets nest, or land myself in any trouble, I think it is you who are scum. Reported him as well. I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them.

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