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Wrayeth
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.05.15 07:36:00 -
[1]
Okay, I've finally gotten the money together, the parts are in stock or about to be, and I already have the CPU itself on order. As such, I'd like to get some input as to what people think regarding the system I'm building and anything I might do to improve it without massively increasing the cost. It's also been quite some time since I've put together a system, so I'm more than a little rusty and would appreciate someone checking me on component compatability.
The specs:
CPU: Intel Q9450 Quad-Core 2.66GHz 1333MHz FSB 12MB cache (45nm)
Motherboard: EVGA nForce 790i Ultra SLI
RAM:4GB (2 x 2GB) OCZ Reaper DDR3 1333MHz
Graphics: PALiT GeForce 8800GTS (G92) Sonic 1GB x 2
Hard Disk: Western Digital Raptor 150GB 10k RPM, 16MB cache x 2
DVD ROM/Burner: Sony 18x DVD/DVD-RW Burner
Power Supply: ?
Case: ?
I've got pretty much all of it nailed down aside from the power supply and the case. I'm wondering exactly how much power I'm going to need to run this puppy given the fact that I'll be running two factory overclocked 8800GTS (G92) in SLI. Also, I'm looking for a case with a lot of room inside to work and many fan mounts. I could definitely use suggestions for those items, and any other suggestions anyone might have.
As an additional note, I'll be getting Vista Ultimate 64 (yes, boo, hiss Vista...) so I can take advantage of DirectX 10 on games like Crysis and also fit (eventually, when I get the cash) the full 8GB of memory it and the motherboard can handle.
Finally, I'd like to run my hard drives in RAID (one with the OS, one with programs; I intend to get a standard 7200 RPM hard drive for storage later) but have no idea how to set up a RAID array. I could use some pointers.
Thanks for the help.
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
Wrayeth
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.05.15 07:36:00 -
[2]
Okay, I've finally gotten the money together, the parts are in stock or about to be, and I already have the CPU itself on order. As such, I'd like to get some input as to what people think regarding the system I'm building and anything I might do to improve it without massively increasing the cost. It's also been quite some time since I've put together a system, so I'm more than a little rusty and would appreciate someone checking me on component compatability.
The specs:
CPU: Intel Q9450 Quad-Core 2.66GHz 1333MHz FSB 12MB cache (45nm)
Motherboard: EVGA nForce 790i Ultra SLI
RAM:4GB (2 x 2GB) OCZ Reaper DDR3 1333MHz
Graphics: PALiT GeForce 8800GTS (G92) Sonic 1GB x 2
Hard Disk: Western Digital Raptor 150GB 10k RPM, 16MB cache x 2
DVD ROM/Burner: Sony 18x DVD/DVD-RW Burner
Power Supply: ?
Case: ?
I've got pretty much all of it nailed down aside from the power supply and the case. I'm wondering exactly how much power I'm going to need to run this puppy given the fact that I'll be running two factory overclocked 8800GTS (G92) in SLI. Also, I'm looking for a case with a lot of room inside to work and many fan mounts. I could definitely use suggestions for those items, and any other suggestions anyone might have.
As an additional note, I'll be getting Vista Ultimate 64 (yes, boo, hiss Vista...) so I can take advantage of DirectX 10 on games like Crysis and also fit (eventually, when I get the cash) the full 8GB of memory it and the motherboard can handle.
Finally, I'd like to run my hard drives in RAID (one with the OS, one with programs; I intend to get a standard 7200 RPM hard drive for storage later) but have no idea how to set up a RAID array. I could use some pointers.
Thanks for the help.
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
Reven Cordelle
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Posted - 2008.05.15 08:32:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Reven Cordelle on 15/05/2008 08:33:08
Looks good, burly set up.
You say its a gaming system though, so i'd go for an AMD CPU (queue flaming).
Why AMD? When it comes to games, its cheaper and offers similar, if not exact performance to the Intel chip. Intel CPUs are better as multitaskers in video editing etc.
IMO, the cost of an Intel CPU over an AMD one isn't worth it if this is your gaming rig. Of course if you can budget for Intel, you might as well get Intel.
Also, two of those graphics cards will take up an assload of space. Get a big case, something like a Stacker, you'll be glad you did when it comes to building the machine.
Check that you can fit 2 Sticks of OCZ Reaper on your board, those heatsinks on the top can get in the way occasionally. Looks good to me, but consider cable routing, the front bays, side fan etc. Safe to say you won't fit 4 sticks of this on your board if you upgrade to 8gb later on.
IMO, nout wrong with Vista in my experience, others will tell you otherwise, but we saw people shunning XP when that came out. Vista Ultimate may be too much for what you need. Home Premium has all the good stuff for most users.
Harddrives too, You may want a bit more space, I have a 250gb and that only has aabout 90gb left on it, I'd suggest some BIG storage. Smaller drives are awesome for defraggin' but games take up a lot of space these days.. For example, Age of Conan is 32gb Installed. 
Lastly, the PSU will need to be at least 750 watt, modular if possible (Less effort when cable managing in the case). 850w will happily power your cards and all additionals. Brand of PSU is up to you, Zalman, Thermaltake, OCZ, Corsair, they all make good units.
Remember gaming systems are LOUD. Like a pro-street built 572ci V8, they make some noise, but pack the horsepower. If noise isn't an issue then theres no problem. Consider some Noctua fans if you do want it quieter, or even a small liquid cooling solution if you can stretch that far.
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
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Posted - 2008.05.15 08:46:00 -
[4]
Since you are probably going to be running dual-channel RAM, you can save money by taking 666mhz RAM instead.
Also, which brand 8800GTS are you getting? I have horrible experience with BFG. My XFX 8800 GTS is running absolutely awesome.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.05.15 09:04:00 -
[5]
The only critique I can offer is "omg, massive waste of money".
But then again, it's your cash, so if you want "the best money can get" for a certain (rather large) lump of cash... well... spend away.
Personally, I'll never ever again spend more than 800 USD on a machine, and I'd like to try and keep it even below 600 if possible.
__
CSM candidates - quick reference cards (NEW: spreadsheet)
Or just vote for LaVista Vista or Leandro Salazar like I did.
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Forum Warrior
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Posted - 2008.05.15 09:16:00 -
[6]
If you're not running an XBOX HUEG screen that system is not cost-efficient. 1 GB gfx card probably isn't worth it for anything below 22" or something. Also, don't listen to the guy recommending AMD and to the guy recommending lower freq RAM. Intel CPUs these days overclock like putting snakes and nanofag together, and you'll need the MHz for that.
Also NOT overclocking your Intel CPU is almost criminal money waste. For instance I'm running a 1,5 year old e6600 at 3.15 GHz on stock vcore with air cooling (41¦C idle, 56¦C peak).
If you want a good, cheap, large HDD to go along with those raptors just for storage, get a WD 6400AAKS btw. They're nice.
In closing .. I consider that system a waste of money if you're not too lazy to upgrade every 12-18 months. As I said, I'm still running that e6600 together with a 9600GT (at 750 core/1100 RAM) and play everything at high to max smoothly. 36 fps Crysis timedemo, high settings, 1280x1024 - 11400-something 3dmark06, and I didn't optimize **** to run the benchmarks, really.
You'd get a comparable system for what, below 500Ç these days? Easily, probably.
This means that you can run everything nicely at 500Ç/year or less .. and your system there probably won't be "enough" for more than 3, if that.
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Kappas.
Galaxy Punks
Black Core Alliance
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Posted - 2008.05.15 12:16:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Kappas. on 15/05/2008 12:17:12
You better have a huge monitor to justify those 1gb cards.
I'd say 700 watts as a minimum to be running that (700 watts from a good company, not a company no-ones ever heard of). Modular PSU's are the way to go these days and they are a lot better since you don't have to have cables tied up somewhere if you're not using them. As for a case get either a midi tower or a full tower considering the size of some of your components (ie, sli cards & the huge heatsinks on your ram (which btw, will get in your way at every turn  ))
Only other comment I have is: you're spending all that cash and not getting a separate sound card?
__________________
Recruitment temporarily closed. |
Verone
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.05.15 12:29:00 -
[8]
Machine looks good mate, I still prefer the Q6600 over anything else though for some reason. Performance increases are marginal at best tbh on it's replacement.
I'm in the process of building a new machine myself, the last of the parts just arrived today :
Antec 900
Asus Striker II Extreme NF790i
Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 G0 SLACR (Intend to overclock to about 3.5G/core)
1000W Akasa AK-P100FG-BKUK V2
OCZ 8GB DDR3 PC3-10666C7 1333MHz (4x2GB)DDR3
Asus nVidia GeForce 9800GX2 TOP EDITION
Asus nVidia GeForce 9800GX2 TOP EDITION
Zalman CNPS9700-LED Super Aero Flower Cooler
4x 500 GB Samsung HD501LJ Spinpoint T166
Along with Vista64. Should do nice for new Eve-Movie work and running Crysis.
For those whining about 1GB cards only being worth it for large screens, it'll be running on 2 Dell 24" TFT panels once they arrive.
Should be good 
\o/ EON FICTION WRITER OF THE YEAR! \o/
>>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<< |
Wrayeth
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.05.15 12:59:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Wrayeth on 15/05/2008 13:00:48
Thank you, everyone, for your input. I'll definitely have to look into modular power supplies, then, and I'll check for 800 watt versions. Keep it coming, please!
A couple of things I wanted to clarify: as far as the processor, Reven, I did my homework and determined that even the best AMD Phenom chip out there can't even come close to matching the Intel quads. Check the Tom's Hardware website benchmarks for various video games. This was greatly disappointing to me as I've long been a fan of AMD - I like their business practices a lot more than Intel's. I've built systems with an AMD Athlon Thorobred XP 2600 and an AMD Athlon 64 3200+ before (the latter is my current rig).
Regarding the hard drive, I'll definitely want more space. I'll be getting another hard drive (not a raptor) for storage later on, or maybe even right when I purchase everything depending on the exact state of my finances and if I can squeeze a little more money out of them.
LaVista, the names of the components up top are actually links to the components' listings on Newegg (or, in the case of the CPU, Tiger Direct). 
As far as the 1GB graphics cards, a couple of things about 'em:
First, yes, I'll be running a large monitor. I've currently got a 22' wide with a native resolution of 1680 x 1050, which will require significantly more graphics bandwidth (I may also be getting another monitor to use with this computer, and the newer versions have a higher native resolution). Also, I will be using DirectX 10 for any game that supports it, and all of my research suggests that DX10 uses a ridiculous amount of video RAM. Furthermore, certain high-end games such as Crysis practically EAT video RAM when you have the settings maxed/near maxed, and tests have conclusively proven that more RAM on your graphics card will allow it to function better with said games. (This is why the 8800GTX/Ultra still outperforms the 9800GTX on some games despite the 9800's higher clock speeds.) Link to a review of the graphics cards in question.
As far as costs go, I'm tired of buying cheap and having to upgrade every five seconds, never feeling satisfied with my system once I've gotten it. I've been saving up for this for a year, and this time I'm going high-end to start so I'll have longer between upgrades and also so my motherboard and other components are more future-proof (hence why I got a DDR3 board instead of a cheaper DDR2 board...with cheaper RAM, too). Plus, I simply want a system that I can be proud of. 
In regards to the sound card, will one actually FIT on the board with two of those beastly overclocked, non-spec 8800GTS in SLI? I'd left that out of my calculations because I didn't think one would.
EDIT: Damned nice system, Verone. 
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
Havok Dryke
Golden Gavel Enterprises
The Cooperative
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Posted - 2008.05.15 14:11:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Havok Dryke on 15/05/2008 14:14:19
For case: Thermaltake Armor ftw.
Other than that, sounds good. AMD vs Intel is really personal preference (Intel myself), but make sure you have a 700W+ power supply. SLI and quadcores suck down a lot of juice.
Edit: Fixed link.
------------------------------
EVE is a cold, harsh world, filled with people that would kill you without a second thought. The forums are even worse.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.05.15 14:34:00 -
[11]
 Originally by: Wrayeth
Hard Disk: Western Digital Raptor 150GB 10k RPM, 16MB cache x 2
If you are going nuts then try and grab the newer (should be on the market now or very, very soon) Western Digital VelociRaptor drives. Review after review has them as the fastest drives available short of 15k SCSI drives. 300GB each as well.
Of course those things cost a pretty penny but I currently use Raptors in RAID-0 and the speed is noticeable to the point it spoils you and you hate working on anything else (laptops kill me in comparison with their miserable drive speeds).
--------------------------------------------------
"Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Ryysa
The Illuminati.
Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2008.05.15 15:35:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Ryysa on 15/05/2008 15:35:47
There is a joke about RAID.
"The RAID level multiplied by % means how much data you will be able to recover"... (only applies to RAID0 and RAID1 though).
That said, if you are running RAID with a dedicated controller, raptors are pointless.
4x normal drives will heavily outspace and outperform 2 raptors in raid5, while providing redundancy, in case one fails. The cost should be similar, if not less for more normal drives.
Second thing is - latency > clockspeed in case of memory.
And yeah, as Akita T put it... way overpriced.
Computers = throwing your money away, they just lose value with time. So unless you are filthy rich, I wouldn't waste so much to get an extra 5-10% of performance.
EW Guide - KB Tool - My Music |
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2008.05.15 16:14:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Ryysa
Edited by: Ryysa on 15/05/2008 15:35:47
There is a joke about RAID.
"The RAID level multiplied by % means how much data you will be able to recover"... (only applies to RAID0 and RAID1 though).
RAID-1 is fully fault tolerant. You just lose 50% of your drive space to get it so RAID-5 tends to be preferable although that requires at least a third drive.
Quote:
That said, if you are running RAID with a dedicated controller, raptors are pointless.
4x normal drives will heavily outspace and outperform 2 raptors in raid5, while providing redundancy, in case one fails. The cost should be similar, if not less for more normal drives.
I'd like to see benchmarks on that. RAID-0 definitely shows significant performance improvements over a single drive in almost all cases (some very few instances a single drive can outperform a RAID-0 setup although then not by much at all).
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"Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Euriti
Gallente
Caritas.
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Posted - 2008.05.15 17:08:00 -
[14]
If you buy nvidia cards, it's mandatory to buy XFX variants :D
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Atomos Darksun
Infortunatus Eventus
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Posted - 2008.05.15 23:20:00 -
[15]
My future build looks similar to that...also go modular power supply. Thermaltake armor is also the best.
I'll be running a Intel board unless I can find a mobo that rivals the EVGA 790i. DDR3 is the future, man!
Originally by: Amoxin
My vent is talking to me in a devil voice...
Atomos' Guide to Forum Flaming |
Wrayeth
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.05.16 05:30:00 -
[16]
Well, the forums seem to have eaten the first version of this post, so I'll try again...
Okay, I've just finished purchasing everything but the graphics cards (which Newegg won't have in stock until Tuesday) and the keyboard (which Newegg doesn't have in stock, doesn't have an ETA for, and I can purchase from my local Fry's Electronics anyway). I ended up following a previous poster's suggestions regarding the case and ended up getting the same Thermaltake Armor that he linked. Also following some generously-offered advice, I ended up going with a modular 800W power supply, though I can't recall the exact brand and model off the top of my head (little known brand, but good reviews) and I'm too lazy to load up my confirmation email to check.
I did end up making one change to my planned setup: I ended up purchasing different hard drives. I had originally planned on going with the twin 150GB raptors, but then a few people made posts about RAID and I realized I had completed misunderstood what RAID actually is/does. As such, I did a little research courtesy of Wikipedia to get a basic overview of the general premise behind RAID and the different RAID version, though I don't trust Wikipedia on specifics. As a result, I decided I wanted to go with a RAID 5 setup, and, as such, the twin raptors weren't going to a.) leave me enough working storage, and b.) be sufficient in and of themselves. As a result, I ended up copying Verone's hard drive solution (4x Samsung 500GB 7200rpm) as the drives he chose were the best bang for the buck that I could find on Newegg and totalled to pretty much the same price as the two Raptors I was going to get.
Thank you, everyone, for your help with this. It's been much appreciated.
I do, however, have one further request for info: I'd like to know more about how a RAID 5 array would actually be set up on a 790i Ultra motherboard. First and foremost, I know it would be attached to the motherboard via SATA cables instead of the old-school IDE cables. I also seem to recall that it would most likely be set up through the system BIOS. As such, I'd like to get some more specifics regarding what, exactly, will have to be done once the shipments arrive and I attempt this.
Can I get confirmation that it would, in fact, be set up through the BIOS?
Also, do the master/slave jumpers on each particular hard drive have to be set in a particular fashion?
What about the initial OS install? Would it function as if I was installing the OS on a single, normal hard drive, or would there be something special involved?
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
Ryysa
The Illuminati.
Cruel Intentions
|
Posted - 2008.05.16 05:53:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Ryysa on 16/05/2008 06:01:58
For RAID5 I seriously recommend purchasing a dedicated RAID controller.
The software raid you get, which is set up through the bios will be detrimental to your performance.
RAID controllers are fairly cheap these days, just get a plug-in PCI one.
However, if you don't feel like spending another 150-200$, then just stick with NVIDIA software RAID, it'll do the job.
Also, I am glad you realized you can get 1.5TB storage with faster speed and data reliability instead of the raptors 
EW Guide - KB Tool - My Music |
Wrayeth
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.05.16 06:07:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Wrayeth on 16/05/2008 06:12:58
Edited by: Wrayeth on 16/05/2008 06:09:49
Good to know. That does, however, beg the question: how does one tell if the RAID setup provided by the board is, in fact, software or hardware? EDIT: Or is the board-provided RAID always software-based, even with the most recent (i.e. 790i Ultra) board?
EDIT #2: BTW, what about loading the OS - is it like a normal OS install once the RAID array is set up?
-Wrayeth
n00b Extraordinaire
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" |
Ryysa
The Illuminati.
Cruel Intentions
|
Posted - 2008.05.16 06:15:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Ryysa on 16/05/2008 06:15:40
All NVIDIA onboard RAID is fakeraid.
Regarding loading OS.
Some controllers are supported out of the box (NVIDIA fakeraid is on XP SP2+).
EW Guide - KB Tool - My Music |
Zalathar
Minmatar
Stellar Research Incorporated
DEFI4NT
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Posted - 2008.05.16 06:50:00 -
[20]
as i say on most thread, quad is overrated, go with faster dual core, like the E6850, same FSB, but haster cores.
~~~~~~
*mods, if you think i'm ugly please say "eeek!"*
~~~~~~
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you soo pretty
I think you're stunningly handsome and let me just say that you're wearing that dead parrot on your shoulder in a particularly dashing way today. -Hango
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