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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
OfBalance
Caldari State
168
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Posted - 2012.03.17 19:29:00 -
[91] - Quote
Kessiaan wrote:If destroyers and battlecruisers were new ships, nobody would care.
As it stands now though, this idea is just terrible.
If skillpoints are refunded, then people suddenly only have one racial BC / destroyer V and can't fly all their ships. If all the racial skills are given out, then everyone who hasn't trained the generic BC / destroyer V gets hit with the nerfbat. Including people who haven't even started playing yet.
If CCP is really determined to go through with this, my suggestion would be to put the new skills in the game a few months ahead of time and make them trainable, but not required. Then on some specific day refund the skillpoints from the generic skill. Sort of like the switch to POS fuel blocks, just with skills.
With destroyers though I just don't see the point - there's only one destroyer for each race, they lack a clearly defined role, and making them mandatory for cruisers will just slow people down.
Agreed, especially with the bit about dessies. Making things arbitrarily linear isn't going to help new players and, as mentioned. skillpoint inflation does directly hinder their progress up a fully t1-capable pilot, which matters a hell of a lot more than how quickly we can train alts into command ships (I hope CCP knows they've been obsolete for a while now). |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
92
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Posted - 2012.03.17 19:41:00 -
[92] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:Remove skills
Reimburse SP
Introduce racial destroyer as rank 1 skill and racial BC as a rank 2
With the reimbursed SP and a couple of days of training, everone will be able to fly the same ships again without putting the few alts that don't have BC V yet at a major disadvantage. Who gives a toss if they're quick to train? BCs are todays frigs anyway.
No, not a chance.
I can fly all sub cap ships right now, all of them except logistics and black ops, which is what I'm doing right now. After this change I don't want any freaking SP's nor anyone should get any freaking SP's your choices in skill points are definitive and should be kept that way as it alwas been (except when skills are removed completely). But, I do expect to fly the exact same ships after this change, I don't really care how, I don't want to be crippled.
This change has 1 inherent purpose people haven't catched yet, which is the extension of skilling (basically increasing the skilling time) for vets, people who crosstrain or ppl who end up crosstraining because they have nothing else to train for, thus they increased the total skilling for spaceships to prolong the capsuleer life before they start thinking wth am I going to train and this ask for new content.
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Master Chief Sunday
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.03.17 20:37:00 -
[93] - Quote
Can CCP make it so I only have to train BS lvl 5 ones for all races?
Would make this game much easier. |
Drew Solaert
University of Caille Gallente Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.03.17 21:14:00 -
[94] - Quote
Being the wonderfully specialised person I am, I really REALLY hope they don't force me to have all 4. I don't want 3 Races BC at 4 messing up the skill sheet, as I just won't use them For every player ship that blows up, the wheels of the economy turn slightly faster. -áDo your bit today. -áGo out and PEW.
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Greg Valanti
Looney Clones
24
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Posted - 2012.03.17 21:29:00 -
[95] - Quote
EnslaverOfMinmatar wrote:Those useless skills would be Signature Analysis V, Long Range Targeting V, Weapon Upgrades V
I hope this statement was intended as a joke. |
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
353
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Posted - 2012.03.17 22:37:00 -
[96] - Quote
David Rivard wrote:No. The entire IDEA that they should remove the generic battlecruiser and destroyer skills in favor of more race specific training is abhorrent and short sited.
I clicked unsub four times
Still posting though...
Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing. |
Avid Bumhumper
Furian Necromongers
42
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Posted - 2012.03.17 22:57:00 -
[97] - Quote
The really funny thing about this thread is, no one is considering the amount of resources involved in redesigning the database. All to create separate skills for a ship class that wasn't really broken....
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5657
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Posted - 2012.03.18 08:11:00 -
[98] - Quote
Avid Bumhumper wrote:The really funny thing about this thread is, no one is considering the amount of resources involved in redesigning the database. All to create separate skills for a ship class that wasn't really broken.... That's because the thing they're trying to fix isn't the ship class, but the GÇ£database designGÇ¥.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Zagdul
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
423
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Posted - 2012.03.18 09:16:00 -
[99] - Quote
David Rivard wrote:No. The entire IDEA that they should remove the generic battlecruiser and destroyer skills in favor of more race specific training is abhorrent and short sited.
I clicked unsub four times
Or well thought out and planning for the future of additional faction battlecruiser sized ships.
It's not Rocket Surgery |
Lexmana
Imperial Stout
255
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Posted - 2012.03.18 09:32:00 -
[100] - Quote
Avid Bumhumper wrote:The really funny thing about this thread is, no one is considering the amount of resources involved in redesigning the database. All to create separate skills for a ship class that wasn't really broken.... Well, it might not have been broken when they introduced it. But now we have tier 3 BC and after tiericide rebalancing, the current mechanics would give you 12 of the most useful ships in game with one single skill and very low prereq. Some might actually think that is broken. |
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Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
47
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Posted - 2012.03.18 12:38:00 -
[101] - Quote
David Rivard wrote:No. The entire IDEA that they should remove the generic battlecruiser and destroyer skills in favor of more race specific training is abhorrent and short sited.
I clicked unsub four times Another stupid whiner. Good Riddance.... |
Kiran
Knights of Azrael The Azrael Alliance
15
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Posted - 2012.03.18 12:57:00 -
[102] - Quote
I dont like the idea of messing with the ships I can fly via slill point reallocation. If this is such a big problem with CCP then why wasn't it figured out when they was released?
At present I can fly Minmatar and Gallentte BC's and soon the Gall Command ships. With the new racial skills being put in will it mean I will have to retrain them (Gallentte race) or do I get skillpoints added for the skills I dont have after the patch ?
I can't see CCP being in the bussiness of giving away free skill points on the live server. I can see us having to retrain for the other races. Unfortuantly I see this is a timesink CCP are putting in, nothing more can be gained from doing this. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5659
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Posted - 2012.03.18 13:02:00 -
[103] - Quote
Kiran wrote:At present I can fly Minmatar and Gallentte BC's and soon the Gall Command ships. With the new racial skills being put in will it mean I will have to retrain them (Gallentte race) or do I get skillpoints added for the skills I dont have after the patch ? As they have said over and over (and over) again in the blog and comment thread: if you can fly it before the patch, you can fly it after. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
77
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Posted - 2012.03.18 13:26:00 -
[104] - Quote
Yup and I'm soon done with destroyers IV and racial frigates and cruisers IV just to "exploit" my self 3x BC V skills for free.
And I recommend for everyone of you to do the same.
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Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
47
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Posted - 2012.03.18 18:19:00 -
[105] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kiran wrote:At present I can fly Minmatar and Gallentte BC's and soon the Gall Command ships. With the new racial skills being put in will it mean I will have to retrain them (Gallentte race) or do I get skillpoints added for the skills I dont have after the patch ? As they have said over and over (and over) again in the blog and comment thread: if you can fly it before the patch, you can fly it after. Tippia, I swear people don't pay attention or read. They just like to bitchh, moan and complain... |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
12
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Posted - 2012.03.18 18:23:00 -
[106] - Quote
Buy the old non racial destroyer and battlecruiser skillbooks and keep as collectors items. I know I will. |
Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
78
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Posted - 2012.03.19 06:35:00 -
[107] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Buy the old non racial destroyer and battlecruiser skillbooks and keep as collectors items. I know I will.
AFAIK those books will be removed and your ISK will be refunded to you. |
Mokanor Lenak
Republic University Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2012.03.19 07:16:00 -
[108] - Quote
So from what I understand, in order to "exploit" this, all you need to get is BC to 5 and you will be able to fly every T1 frigate/destroyer/cruise/BC? Or for that to happen you need to get BS skills to 1 for all races, and you than you get all T1 ships frigate to BC? |
OfBalance
Caldari State
183
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Posted - 2012.03.19 07:25:00 -
[109] - Quote
Mokanor Lenak wrote:So from what I understand, in order to "exploit" this, all you need to get is BC to 5 and you will be able to fly every T1 frigate/destroyer/cruise/BC? Or for that to happen you need to get BS skills to 1 for all races, and you than you get all T1 ships frigate to BC?
BC V + All racial cruisers III. Seriously, this is not a hard concept. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
5
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Posted - 2012.03.19 07:25:00 -
[110] - Quote
Mokanor Lenak wrote:So from what I understand, in order to "exploit" this, all you need to get is BC to 5 and you will be able to fly every T1 frigate/destroyer/cruise/BC? Or for that to happen you need to get BS skills to 1 for all races, and you than you get all T1 ships frigate to BC?
Tippia wrote:As they have said over and over (and over) again in the blog and comment thread: if you can fly it before the patch, you can fly it after. Just because you have BC V does not mean you can fly a 'Cane. Likewise with Destroyers V and Catalysts. Check the prereqs for the ships you are interested in. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5687
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Posted - 2012.03.19 07:26:00 -
[111] - Quote
Mokanor Lenak wrote:So from what I understand, in order to "exploit" this, all you need to get is BC to 5 and you will be able to fly every T1 frigate/destroyer/cruise/BC? Or for that to happen you need to get BS skills to 1 for all races, and you than you get all T1 ships frigate to BC? By the sound so far, the most bang for the buck is 4+ù Frigate III, Destroyers V, 4+ù Cruiser III, BC V.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
78
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Posted - 2012.03.19 10:06:00 -
[112] - Quote
What tippia said but in case someone is still confused "what you can fly now you can fly after [the change]"
So if you have skills for all 4 racial BCs you can still fly those BCs after the change with equal skill level as before. Same goes for destroyers as well since it gives you 4 different ships to fly with and frigates are needed for cruisers and you need racial cruiser III to board a racial BC.
Hence it's obvious that you should get destroyers and BCs both to V along with 4x frigate IV and 4x cruiser III in order to get the most benefit from the proposed change.
You need frigate IV for cruisers Tippia, finally caught you on a mistake. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5690
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Posted - 2012.03.19 10:16:00 -
[113] - Quote
Baneken wrote:You need frigate IV for cruisers Tippia, finally caught you on a mistake. Nah. You only need it at III to get the benefit of the change. Sure, at some point you would have needed them at IV to get the cruiser skills, but if a podding or five has happened since to knock them down to III, you'll still get those destroyer skills.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Ocih
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
110
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Posted - 2012.03.19 10:23:00 -
[114] - Quote
They should just bann everyone who trained Destroyer or battlecruiser. |
Baneken
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate
78
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Posted - 2012.03.19 10:24:00 -
[115] - Quote
Point I'm trying to say is that if you don't have a racial cruiser III you cannot fly a racial BC *right now* which of c. after patch would mean you couldn't had boarded those BC's "before" hence you wouldn't get those extra BC skills, hence you better have those cruiser skills trained which require that racial frigate IV.
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Sade Onyx
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
18
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Posted - 2012.03.19 10:37:00 -
[116] - Quote
So the best advice is.
Train your BC & Destroyer skills to 5 NOW
Because when this change happens these skills will be quadrupled.
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JC Anderson
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
205
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Posted - 2012.03.20 05:11:00 -
[117] - Quote
Arg messed up post.. Rewriting. |
JC Anderson
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
205
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Posted - 2012.03.20 05:34:00 -
[118] - Quote
Oh and I would like to say however that I would hope if they do go the route they mentioned, that they simply give all races bc and destroyer skills to 5 to the people who currently have the generic skills trained up.
In this I mean that I hope they don't give us the option to use some of the skillpoints elsewhere as a standard reimbursement would. |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
67
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Posted - 2012.03.20 05:44:00 -
[119] - Quote
Is having generic BC and Destroyer skills really that much of a problem that they are going all these lengths to 'fix' it?
Sounds like they are trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist. Just leave the skills as they are.
Sure it might have been the better way to design it from the first place, but at this point the solution is more complicated than the problem.
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OfBalance
Caldari State
195
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Posted - 2012.03.20 06:06:00 -
[120] - Quote
Magnus Orin wrote:Is having generic BC and Destroyer skills really that much of a problem that they are going all these lengths to 'fix' it?
Sounds like they are trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist. Just leave the skills as they are.
Sure it might have been the better way to design it from the first place, but at this point the solution is more complicated than the problem.
One can only assume someone's OCD got the better of them. This attempt to make things ~simpler~ has some pretty hefty negatives for the one and only group that it's really being aimed at: players who have just started or will be playing in the future.
Of course this could just be some really contrived attempt to keep newbies away from the promised land of t2 battlecruisers in order to placate the hoards of bitter titan pilots. |
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