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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 11:46:00 -
[391]
Originally by: Kailen Thorn lol, you sir, are a tool.
But of course I am. I'm telling the truth. The truth hurt you. And that made me a tool. Amirite?
Quote: firstly carebears get laughed at cause they compain about everything and anything which remotely effects them. We are only asking for minors fixes which should have been sorted long ago.
Another case of "if I complain it's fair and not a whine. If you complain it's a whine and you should L2P and can i haz your stuffz noob?". [Yawn] But of course Privatears' whines are fair and never fueled by self interest. .
Quote: Yes, our time and hard work is valuable for us to survive. We do very few other activities to gain money, and thus we need the loot to sell on and survive. From your awesome record there, 60 losses, between your ibis and your pod. I can see you awesome at what you do. Seem like one of those who steal stuff from our loot and make your money off our hard work.
And yet another fine and fair post by a selfless privatear thinking about the "well-being" of the game as a whole and not just his interests... Not. When you grow older you'll understand (hopefully) to be consistent with yuour beliefs and understand that either everyone's time and hard work is important or none, but atleast you'll be consistent and be less hypocritical. But I'm thinking not. And yes, my alt is used to bust gate camps. Does it upset you that a bully is bullying you? I'm sowwy.
Quote: Now go run along to somewhere else to cry and make me write more than what i planned to, oh yea, and grow some balls to post with your main, -.-
Oh noes! You mean I don't have e-balls? I'd like to have a pair of e-balls. Where could I get some of those? Do Privatears have e-balls? So like, do you get all teh sexes with a pair of big e-balls? I'll tell you what. Why don't you post with your real main :). I mean your REAL MAIN self. No hiding behind avatars :). Name, address, number... You're not a coward, are you?
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Shan Dollean
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 12:49:00 -
[392]
/signed
If you want the loot I just liberated from a target - you should expect to have to fight for it. Simple as.
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The PitBoss
Caldari Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 15:37:00 -
[393]
Originally by: Matrix Skye .... SNIP ....
USELESS TROLL argument UNTIL you grow a set and post with your main
Thank-You,
The Pitboss (Space between The & Pitboss)
Signatures by: Kalen Vox |
Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 15:47:00 -
[394]
NO U!
Fake edit: This thread needs more teers. <== see what i did there?
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NickSuccorso
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 17:05:00 -
[395]
Edited by: NickSuccorso on 22/05/2009 17:06:54
Quote: And yet another fine and fair post by a selfless privatear thinking about the "well-being" of the game as a whole and not just his interests... Not.
I don't pay for, play, or post with my accounts to make sure that you're having fun. Frankly, I'm pretty sure you must have fallen and broken your head since you're actually whining about people wanting to make it so they get the most fun out of the game they play and pay for.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 17:14:00 -
[396]
Originally by: NickSuccorso I don't pay for, play, or post with my accounts to make sure that you're having fun. Frankly, I'm pretty sure you must have fallen and broken your head since you're actually whining about people wanting to make it so they get the most fun out of the game they play and pay for.
Funny you should say this considering that when a carebear plays to play HIS style of game he's accused of being selfish/greedy/idiotic/[insert Privateer rant here] but when it's YOU well, that's just acceptable now isn't it . You're just hypocrites and I'm calling you out for what you are while having some fun at it. Don't get mad at me for telling you the truth. Quite frankly this thread needs moar teers. They fuel my ship. Don't hate the player, hate the game, 'bro'.
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NickSuccorso
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 17:34:00 -
[397]
Quote: Funny you should say this considering that when a carebear plays to play HIS style of game he's accused of being selfish/greedy/idiotic/[insert Privateer rant here] but when it's YOU well, that's just acceptable now isn't it
When did I complain about other people wanting to maximize their own fun, broken head?
Quote: You're just hypocrites and I'm calling you out for what you are while having some fun at it. Don't get mad at me for telling you the truth. Quite frankly this thread needs moar teers. They fuel my ship. Don't hate the player, hate the game, 'bro'.
There you go again, lumping everyone into a single ready made mould. That's poor arguement technique, broken head.
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The Jackhammer
Unity Thru Aggression Unity Thru Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.05.22 17:46:00 -
[398]
Ha Ha ... Broken Head
Matrix Skye - State War Academy
OBVIOUSLY He's a douche bag alt that survives in-game by feeding off of someone else's hard work that needs to burn ...
Next argument for -or- against this ... we know your stance matrix .. please move on
Mmmmm,
The Jackhammer
Banners and Signatures by: Kalen Vox
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 18:11:00 -
[399]
Please dont call me broken head and then laugh at me . That makes me angry.
So back on topic, where can I find these illustrious e-balls? Are they part of a COSMOS event?
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 18:23:00 -
[400]
Originally by: NickSuccorso When did I complain about other people wanting to maximize their own fun, broken head?
You don't know much of your own history, Privatear. I suggest you ask around what Privatear was/has been all about.
Quote: There you go again, lumping everyone into a single ready made mould. That's poor arguement technique, broken head.
I'm lumping Privatears into one sigle mold. You're a Privatear. If you don't like or don't agree what Privatear stands for then perhaps you should look for another alliance? Otherwise don't get mad when your alliance is called for what they are.
And stop calling me 'broken head'. Seriously, it's making me angry.
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NickSuccorso
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 18:40:00 -
[401]
Quote: You don't know much of your own history, Privatear. I suggest you ask around what Privatear was/has been all about.
No, that's an easy one. Legally sanctioned empire piracy, and disruption. Noobs at trade hubs etc. etc. etc.
Quote: I'm lumping Privatears into one sigle mold. You're a Privatear. If you don't like or don't agree what Privatear stands for then perhaps you should look for another alliance? Otherwise don't get mad when your alliance is called for what they are.
You're still using your flawed arguements. That's very poor form, and not in the spirit of lively discussion that's to be expected on this forum. Also, your trolling technique is not working either because you refuse to evolve the style of attack to fit the flow of discussion. That's just lazy. You need more practice.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 19:02:00 -
[402]
Playing the mature card now are we? :)
OK, let's see how long it lasts before your alliance degenerates it into a smack 'U n00b U quit!1!'. And explain to me why the current mechanic is 'broken'. If you agressed or attack someone why would that automatically make you the owner of their possesion? Just because you attack someone and managed to kill them doesn't mean you somehow legally own their stuff. Eve isn't a prize-fighting game like Counterstrike. Eve is more real in the sense that you can agress and you can steal from someone else. Loot isn't handed down to you because you dueled an opponent and won the tournament.
The possessions still belong to the victim UNTIL you steal them. But you HAVE TO STEAL IT FIRST. It's more realistic and it's what makes Eve so special and different from other MMOs. It's a cruel world even for the cruelest of the cruelest.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 19:07:00 -
[403]
I also would like to add that Eve is a vicious cycle where the predators also become prey. And it's more fun that way. You could be the baddest killhog out there, but then a low-down dirty scoundrel comes along and dogs you just like you dogged your prey. It's what Eve is all about. Sure you'll get mad when you get dogged. It's natural. And the scoundrel will laugh at you just as you laughed at your prey. And in the end no one likes to be dogged. But it's what Eve is all about :).
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NickSuccorso
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 19:37:00 -
[404]
Edited by: NickSuccorso on 22/05/2009 19:42:46
Quote: If you agressed or attack someone why would that automatically make you the owner of their possesion?
No, the prize is up for grabs to anyone who can grab it. Nobody is saying that this shouldn't be the case. And if anyone does, than they're ******ed. What people are saying here is that they'd like some way to legally (per concord) attempt to discourage the vulture from the picking scraps. Is it reasonable that being a pvp loot thief has absolutely 0 risk and great rewards?
Quote: You should have friends there with you ready to steal the victim's loot. Not everyone in your gank squad need to put out DPS. You could have someone be the dedicated looter. In Eve you need to think of all sides of the angle and be prepared to be attacked in your weakest side.
That's a very valid point until you see that now I have to bring an extra guy along with my gang (putting another ship at risk for the vague possibility of him being able to serve his purpose in the gang), or sacrifice an existing part of my gangs dps/ewar/logistic etc in order to have him play space vaccuum (again putting someone in harm's way for the vague possibility of having him serve his purpose). Do you really expect that to become a valid profession in Eve? Do you really believe that this is a fair balance of risk and reward for the hunters, or the hunted?
EDIT:
Quote: I like to laugh and poke fun of you by stealing what you thought was your loot :). This, my friend, is what Eve is all about.
I would agree with you on this, except that you can not truthfully say that it is balanced game play. You need to be put at risk if you're going to pull from the wrecks of others in the scenario we're discussing. And no, being flagged to the victim doesn't always matter. Besides, the guy just lost his ship.
Loot stealing is really funny, I agree with you. It's just broken.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:01:00 -
[405]
Originally by: NickSuccorso No, the prize is up for grabs to anyone who can grab it. Nobody is saying that this shouldn't be the case. And if anyone does, than they're ******ed. What people are saying here is that they'd like some way to legally (per concord) attempt to discourage the vulture from the picking scraps. Is it reasonable that being a pvp loot thief has absolutely 0 risk and great rewards?
What you say here doesn't make much sense. You admit that the loot should be up for grabs but then you add that you'd like to discourage other players from picking it. You can't have it both ways because you're not the owner of the loot UNTIL YOU STEAL IT. But you MUST steal it first. Now if what you'd like is for any loot stealer (including the aggressor) to be blinky to everyone else including bi-standers this makes a little more sense. And then the aggressor is opening up himself to becoming a target himself for STEALING loot, which is a whole separate offense and rightfully so. This I could agree with.
Quote: That's a very valid point until you see that now I have to bring an extra guy along with my gang (putting another ship at risk for the vague possibility of him being able to serve his purpose in the gang), or sacrifice an existing part of my gangs dps/ewar/logistic etc in order to have him play space vaccuum (again putting someone in harm's way for the vague possibility of having him serve his purpose). Do you really expect that to become a valid profession in Eve? Do you really believe that this is a fair balance of risk and reward for the hunters, or the hunted?
You invalidate your point as soon as you lock yourself with the mentality that everyone in your gang NEEDS to physically engage in DPS/EWAR/etc. You're opening yourself up to loot thieves. When you pick up the loot that makes you a loot thief and you don't blink to anyone else BUT the owner of the wreck. So why would a bistander blink red to you if you haven't picked up the loot yourself? Like I said, I think it's better if ANY loot thief picks up the loot he can be aggressed by anyone.
Quote: I would agree with you on this, except that you can not truthfully say that it is balanced game play. You need to be put at risk if you're going to pull from the wrecks of others in the scenario we're discussing. And no, being flagged to the victim doesn't always matter. Besides, the guy just lost his ship.
But there IS risk to the loot stealer. He is being flagged to the rightful owner and his corp members. If the victim chooses to do so he and his corp members can hunt down the loot thief and engage him. Now I'd be willing to bet the victim would probably welcome loot stealers to steal his loot just to not give you the pleasure of taking it but that's a whole different story now :P. And it is a VALID MECHANIC. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it isn't fair.
You have to look at combat and stealing as two separate actions. You can PVP someone either through a war, or whatever. And then you can also choose to steal their wreck, a totally separate action which will cause you to agress the true owner of the wreck.
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The PitBoss
Caldari Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:14:00 -
[406]
Edited by: The PitBoss on 22/05/2009 20:16:58
Originally by: The PitBoss NOTABLE POINTS
1. BEFORE there were wrecks ... when you killed a Player Character's ship ... there were can drops ... IF you looted from them ... you were FLAGGED.
2. IF you kill a NPC and someone loots that wreck ... They become FLAGGED to you.
3. In cases happening against myself ... OVER 90% of the offenders were in NPC corps ... KNOWING I would have no recourse against them (ie. war dec)
@ Matrix Skye:
Simple risk -VS- reward ...
As it stands the looter has NO risk in looting the ship AND reaps ALL rewards ....
What EXACTLY is so hard for you to understand ?
or are you bumping my topic with your flawed arguments out of the kindness of your heart ...
Like The Jackhammer stated ... your NO SUPPORT is noted .. please move to CAOD to continue your TROLLING
Thank-You,
The Pitboss (Space between The & Pitboss)
Signatures by: Kalen Vox |
Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:16:00 -
[407]
There IS RISK TO THE LOOTER.
What's so hard for you to understand about this?
The looter is being flagged to the owner of the wreck as it should be. It p***es you off that someone else is beating you to stealing the loot and therefore being flagged to the owner, but that is not a reason to ask CCP to change the mechanics in your favor. The system is fair as it is now.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:19:00 -
[408]
Originally by: The PitBoss @ Matrix Skye:
Simple risk -VS- reward ...
As it stands the looter has NO risk in looting the ship AND reaps ALL rewards ....
What EXACTLY is so hard for you to understand ?
or are you bumping my topic with your flawed arguments out of the kindness of your heart ...
Like The Jackhammer stated ... your NO SUPPORT is noted .. please move to CAOD to continue your TROLLING
And now we're back to personal attacks and insults. I knew Privatears wouldn't last long in a conversation. Your ADD gives you away every time . Anyway... NO U!
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The Jackhammer
Unity Thru Aggression Unity Thru Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:20:00 -
[409]
Originally by: Matrix Skye There IS RISK TO THE LOOTER.
What's so hard for you to understand about this.
Lets see ... IF you consider a POD a risk ... you should be playing Hello Kitty online ...
PLEANTY of time to loot and be on your merry way because the Original owner still has to get to a station ... dock up ... wait to jump in a ship ... undock and get back to the wreck.
HMMMMM ... sounds like a HUGE risk to the looter ...
Mmmmm,
The Jackhammer
Banners and Signatures by: Kalen Vox
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:23:00 -
[410]
Edited by: Matrix Skye on 22/05/2009 20:27:41 Dont be idiotic, Mr. Jackhammer. If the victim happens to have a replacement ship in the system, OR FRIENDS nearby, as you yourself admit he should have, then he IS a threat.
Now if the victim CHOOSES not to persue that is a call for HIM to make, NOT YOU.
Now if your argument is that the victim doesn't have friends/corp or doesn't have PVP ships and that the thief is just taking advantage of the situation (the fact that the victim is careless/weak/nonPVPer), please explain to me how you yourself aren't taking advantage of that very same situation by attacking the victim.
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The Jackhammer
Unity Thru Aggression Unity Thru Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:26:00 -
[411]
Originally by: Matrix Skye Dont be idiotic, Mr. Jackhammer. If the victim happens to have a replacement ship in the system, OR FRIENDS nearby, as you yourself admit he should have, then he IS a threat.
Now if the victim CHOOSES not to persue that is a call for HIM to make, NOT YOU.
Go away already ...
Mmmmm,
The Jackhammer
Banners and Signatures by: Kalen Vox
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:28:00 -
[412]
Originally by: The Jackhammer Go away already ...
Answer the question:
Now if your argument is that the victim doesn't have friends/corp or doesn't have PVP ships and that the thief is just taking advantage of the situation (the fact that the victim is careless/weak/nonPVPer), please explain to me how you yourself aren't taking advantage of that very same situation by attacking the victim.
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NickSuccorso
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 20:39:00 -
[413]
Quote: Now if your argument is that the victim doesn't have friends/corp or doesn't have PVP ships and that the thief is just taking advantage of the situation (the fact that the victim is careless/weak/nonPVPer), please explain to me how you yourself aren't taking advantage of that very same situation by attacking the victim.
We all agree with the point you're making already. We've been agreeing with it. The problem is that you're not arguing the point you think you are by posting this. What the supporters of this proposal are saying is that we want to have a stronger ability to balance the scales between risk and reward for people who act as vultures. I want you to still be able to loot "my" wreck from my kill. I think that it's a fine profession, in fact, if people want to do that. I just want to be able to point some revenge at you if you do. This isn't game breaking, there is precedence for this in the game's history that wasn't game breaking, this is a fair request.
Thanks for the chat on this, thanks for the trolling, and it's Priva*****s, not Privatears.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.22 21:30:00 -
[414]
You are going round and round in circles. I'll point out your flaw once again:
Privatears attack a target, you gank it and then some. Fair enough. Target could have had friends, corpies, bigger ship, etc. In the end it's the victim's fault for not defending back. With me so far? It's no excuse that he was alone or that he's just a miner. In your opinion the risk, although practically non-existent, IS THERE. Agree? That is the Privatears' defense, so you should agree with this so far.
Now, a "vulture" comes along and ALSO takes advantage of the victim's inability to come back and protect its loot. And your take on it is that THERE IS NO RISK? There is the SAME EXACT RISK that YOUR gank squad took, no more no less.
It's just you want to be able to attack the vulture because you feel the defenseless target that YOU YOURSELF attacked isn't able to defend itself. If that's the case, then might as well make it so that even if you're at war if you attack anyone in high sec, at war or not, you become flashy to everyone, meaning global timer for you. But of course you wouldn't agree with this because what you really want is just what benefits you and you alone.
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The PitBoss
Caldari Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 22:11:00 -
[415]
Edited by: The PitBoss on 22/05/2009 22:12:59
Originally by: Matrix Skye Privatears attack a target, you gank it and then some. Fair enough. Target could have had friends, corpies, bigger ship, etc. In the end it's the victim's fault for not defending back. With me so far? It's no excuse that he was alone or that he's just a miner. In your opinion the risk, although practically non-existent, IS THERE. Agree? That is the Privatears' defense, so you should agree with this so far.
Now, a "vulture" comes along and ALSO takes advantage of the victim's inability to come back and protect its loot. And your take on it is that THERE IS NO RISK? There is the SAME EXACT RISK that YOUR gank squad took, no more no less.
It's just you want to be able to attack the vulture because you feel the defenseless target that YOU YOURSELF attacked isn't able to defend itself. If that's the case, then might as well make it so that even if you're at war if you attack anyone in high sec, at war or not, you become flashy to everyone, meaning global timer for you. But of course you wouldn't agree with this because what you really want is just what benefits you and you alone.
AND that my friend shows the HUGE flaw in your argument.
You're centering this ISSUE about WHO proposed the change AND not the mechanic that is being talked about ...
Your 'NO Support' is duly STILL noted .. please leave the thread
Thank-You,
The Pitboss (Space between The & Pitboss)
Signatures by: Kalen Vox |
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CCP Mitnal
C C P
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Posted - 2009.05.22 23:01:00 -
[416]
Cleaned.
Please stay on topic and resist the urge to flame one another.
Mitnal Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us |
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.23 03:50:00 -
[417]
Originally by: The PitBoss You're centering this ISSUE about WHO proposed the change AND not the mechanic that is being talked about ...
No, I'm pointing out the flaw as to why your reasoning is wrong. You claim the risk 'practically' is non-existant because the victim now has to dock and get another ship or call corpmates to defend his loot. But that is how EVE works. Theoretically, when you gank a miner in an asteroid field he COULD bring corpmates to defend him against your gank squad. Theoretically he can fit his barge with guns to fight you. Theoretically, he can come back in a PVP ship to fight you again. But PRACTICALLY that rarely happens. BUT THE RISK IS STILL THERE, isn't it? So now you come along and ask CCP to change a mechanic based on practical risk when your entire defense against you ganking noobs is that there is a theoretical risk.
When it suits you, you use theoretical risk to defend your position. And when it suits you, you'll use practical risk (or the real risk) when it suits you. This, my friend, is double standard.
Quote: Your 'NO Support' is duly STILL noted .. please leave the thread
Mr. Pitboss, you may be the boss of.... pits, I guess? But you're not the boss of me. You posted a thread in a public forum where it's open for debate, even for those that disagree with your views. Mr. Pitboss, you'll have learn to accept that if you want post your ideas here :)
You have a wonderful nite!
Sincerely,
Matrix Skye <3 <3 <3
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Zey Nadar
Stormwatch Galactic Enforcers of Serenity
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Posted - 2009.05.24 07:39:00 -
[418]
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spinarax
Method of Destruction Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.24 10:53:00 -
[419]
Originally by: Matrix Skye Edited by: Matrix Skye on 23/05/2009 18:02:36
Originally by: The PitBoss You're centering this ISSUE about WHO proposed the change AND not the mechanic that is being talked about ...
No, I'm pointing out the flaw as to why your reasoning is wrong. You claim the risk 'practically' is non-existant because the victim now has to dock and get another ship or call corpmates to defend his loot. But that is how EVE works. Theoretically, when you gank a miner in an asteroid field he COULD bring corpmates to defend him against your gank squad. Theoretically he can fit his barge with guns to fight you. Theoretically, he can come back in a PVP ship to fight you again. But PRACTICALLY that rarely happens. BUT THE RISK IS STILL THERE, isn't it? So now you come along and ask CCP to change a mechanic based on practical risk when your entire defense against you ganking noobs is that there is a theoretical risk.
When it suits you, you use theoretical risk to defend your position. And when it suits you, you'll use practical risk (or the real risk) when it suits you. This, my friend, is double standard.
Quote: Your 'NO Support' is duly STILL noted .. please leave the thread
Mr. Pitboss, you may be the boss of.... pits, I guess? But you're not the boss of me. You posted a thread in a public forum where it's open for debate, even for those that disagree with your views. Mr. Pitboss, you'll have to learn to accept that if you want to post your ideas here :)
You have a wonderful nite!
Sincerely,
Matrix Skye <3 <3 <3
Dear Mr. Skye, it seems that your whole argument revolves around your hatred towards Privateers. That's sad.
BTW, this issues doesn't only effect us, FW for example could greatly benefit from these changes.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.24 12:59:00 -
[420]
Originally by: spinarax Dear Mr. Skye, it seems that your whole argument revolves around your hatred towards Privateers. That's sad.
BTW, this issues doesn't only effect us, FW for example could greatly benefit from these changes.
You're spinning the issue again. And you keep avoiding the question. You claim there is no risk to a loot stealer. So then allow me to ask you again.
What is the risk to a gang that catches a miner or missioner (whether it be a wartarget or out in lo sec) in an asteroid field or deadspace?
And compare your answer to this quesiton:
What is the risk to a loot stealer that steals loot from a wreck that doesn't belong to him?
If you answer these questions sincerely and honestly you'll notice that either for both you point out practical risk or for both you point out theoretical risk.
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