EVE Search - How to make pi profitable

Maeste Madeveda wrote:

Scrapyard Bob wrote:

Maeste Madeveda wrote:

I wonder why people keeps running extractors. There are far more profitable setups of PI and it can rack up several hundred millions on 1 character. It requires low taxes and a rather big money investment (up to 25B for a 3 week cycle) but once you are set up, it's a ISK printing machine.

- Unless you setup at a trade-hub, you can't reliably get the raw materials needed to keep a factory planet humming.

- Factory planets require capital, which new players don't have. Most players with less then 3 months in game still think that 1M ISK is a lot of ISK. Many of them are still struggling to put together 100-200M ISK to outfit their first battleship.

- Harvest worlds are cheap, easy, low-effort, pay off in 7-12 days, and have very little ongoing costs (export tariffs, moving the ECU around). For a new player without access to 10s of millions or a few hundred million ISK in capital, that's a major selling point.

I am sure my situation is particular because my corp owns several POCO and has the means to defend it should someone decide to siege it. Still it's dumb to keep saying that the sole profitable PI is extractor setup. Far more profitable setup awaits those who have the courage to go to low-sec and that should be the goal for those wishing to keep doing better PI.

I can assure you that I have no trouble fetching all the materials I need for my PI in Jita. It requires time and market knowledge but nothing out of the ordinary.

In fact I will try the mystical 'make a PLEX in 51days' soon with only PI.

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Twulf The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact 0	Posted - 2012.03.13 19:22:00 - [31] - Quote KevLor I wrote: Your leftover P0 may disappear quickly when/if the planet depletes, which it may do under a pretty aggressive program cycle (15 hrs is relatively aggressive). For most people, either very short cycles (1 or 2 hours) or ~1 day increment cycles seem to be most popular. If you get online at the same time each day, set your cycle for 23 hours and restart every day when you get online. This may result in less 'excess' P0 for the same P1, and a tiny bit less depletion. With an Improved CC (Level 3, if I am getting the naming right), you likely can set up to ECUs with 4 heads each, one LP, and 2 sets of 2 processors (4 total), and a single P2 processor. It will depend on the length of your links. It is unlikely that you can get 2xP2 processors on an Improved CC (unless your P0s are really close and it is a small planet), but you will probably be able to easily do it with and Advanced CC. Quote: I am not sure I understand this. The reactive gas I need is not very close to my current ECU setup. If your 'new' P0 materials are not close to your ECU, you may have to relocate it (which costs some isk, but not a ton). If you have excess grid, you can locate the ECU pretty far away and still link it to you LP. If you are really industrious, scan both the current and projected P0s while you are setting up and see if you can't find an ECU location that will cover them both. When/if you get to CC4, a 2xECU(4) + LP + 2xP1 Processors (2) + P2 Processors (2) setup will leave about 2,000 grid for links. Thanks, you have been a big help. I am getting to better understand now. I will be re doing my planet when I get home tonight. Always did love the community here in EVE. It might be a PvP first game but the community is helpful for the most part, right before they blow your ship up at least.
Maeste Madeveda The Spawning Pool Team Liquid 3	Posted - 2012.03.14 00:58:00 - [32] - Quote Scrapyard Bob wrote: Maeste Madeveda wrote: I wonder why people keeps running extractors. There are far more profitable setups of PI and it can rack up several hundred millions on 1 character. It requires low taxes and a rather big money investment (up to 25B for a 3 week cycle) but once you are set up, it's a ISK printing machine. - Unless you setup at a trade-hub, you can't reliably get the raw materials needed to keep a factory planet humming. - Factory planets require capital, which new players don't have. Most players with less then 3 months in game still think that 1M ISK is a lot of ISK. Many of them are still struggling to put together 100-200M ISK to outfit their first battleship. - Harvest worlds are cheap, easy, low-effort, pay off in 7-12 days, and have very little ongoing costs (export tariffs, moving the ECU around). For a new player without access to 10s of millions or a few hundred million ISK in capital, that's a major selling point. I am sure my situation is particular because my corp owns several POCO and has the means to defend it should someone decide to siege it. Still it's dumb to keep saying that the sole profitable PI is extractor setup. Far more profitable setup awaits those who have the courage to go to low-sec and that should be the goal for those wishing to keep doing better PI. I can assure you that I have no trouble fetching all the materials I need for my PI in Jita. It requires time and market knowledge but nothing out of the ordinary. In fact I will try the mystical 'make a PLEX in 51days' soon with only PI.
KevLor I Zephyr Corp Black Thorne Alliance 5	Posted - 2012.03.14 03:31:00 - [33] - Quote Quote: It requires time[...] That is the part I am avoiding. If you have alts doing it, I just want to log on every couple of days, restart programs, fetch goods, and drop them off in corp hangar. I don't want to haul anything out to my planets from Jita or mess with buy orders, nor change my setups to 'catch' nice markups as they appear and disappear.
Tinu Moorhsum Royal Scientific Research Enterprise 72	Posted - 2012.03.14 09:16:00 - [34] - Quote Snarf Aldes wrote: I don't think there is any way to make serious isk with PI... You can however make some relatively easy isk. Well.... I do PI in a wormhole with a number of alts and make 100+ mil a day on it for about 45 min of effort daily. I don't know if that's big isk in your book but it makes me happy. Nicest part about it is you can train alts for PI in a couple of weeks so you can do it with all of the toons you otherwise wouldn't be using. YYMV T-
Tinu Moorhsum Royal Scientific Research Enterprise 72	Posted - 2012.03.14 09:19:00 - [35] - Quote oops. double post
WolfeReign T.O.R. Absolute Damage Inc. 1	Posted - 2012.03.14 18:38:00 - [36] - Quote With 1 character running 6 planets i can produce over 3k rocket fuel a day and still have plenty of P1 left over. So ya some serious isk out here in WH space if you know what to do with your pi :)
Ditra Vorthran State War Academy Caldari State 0	Posted - 2012.03.15 23:41:00 - [37] - Quote Maeste Madeveda wrote: In fact I will try the mystical 'make a PLEX in 51days' soon with only PI. I don't know what's so mystical about it. I do it on a regular basis. And I even do it in high sec. :P Oh, as per my previous example last page, I finally finished producing P2s out of my leftover P1s. I gave myself another 100 million, so my total after 5 weeks is about 1 billion in profit.
Invictra Atreides Toward the Terra 52	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:26:00 - [38] - Quote Maeste Madeveda wrote: Scrapyard Bob wrote: Maeste Madeveda wrote: I wonder why people keeps running extractors. There are far more profitable setups of PI and it can rack up several hundred millions on 1 character. It requires low taxes and a rather big money investment (up to 25B for a 3 week cycle) but once you are set up, it's a ISK printing machine. - Unless you setup at a trade-hub, you can't reliably get the raw materials needed to keep a factory planet humming. - Factory planets require capital, which new players don't have. Most players with less then 3 months in game still think that 1M ISK is a lot of ISK. Many of them are still struggling to put together 100-200M ISK to outfit their first battleship. - Harvest worlds are cheap, easy, low-effort, pay off in 7-12 days, and have very little ongoing costs (export tariffs, moving the ECU around). For a new player without access to 10s of millions or a few hundred million ISK in capital, that's a major selling point. I am sure my situation is particular because my corp owns several POCO and has the means to defend it should someone decide to siege it. Still it's dumb to keep saying that the sole profitable PI is extractor setup. Far more profitable setup awaits those who have the courage to go to low-sec and that should be the goal for those wishing to keep doing better PI. I can assure you that I have no trouble fetching all the materials I need for my PI in Jita. It requires time and market knowledge but nothing out of the ordinary. In fact I will try the mystical 'make a PLEX in 51days' soon with only PI. I'd like to see your results. I did that and have documented the 1st 21 days. Link Blog \|-aTutorials \| Youtube "I donGGVt know everything, I just know what I know."
Twulf The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact 1	Posted - 2012.03.16 17:11:00 - [39] - Quote Just to update on my setup since you guys have been a big help. I now switched over to coolant as my P2 product and moved to a gas planet. So now I have 2 ECU with 4 heads each 2 proccessors - 1 for each P0 good 1 Advance factory for P2 good All using the LP as the storage The links cost more because I had to spread out the ECU this time on a gas planet but it is running good now.
KevLor I Zephyr Corp Black Thorne Alliance 6	Posted - 2012.03.16 17:34:00 - [40] - Quote Your total grid load due to facilities is 12,600, which leaves 2,400 (for CC3) for links. That is quite a bit, but if you are on a gas planet, you might need it. How big (diameter) is your planet? My (Very rough) estimate indicates you have 13k or 14k km of links if you are running out of grid. You can also make coolant on a storm planet, which tends to be much smaller. If you were to go to CC4, you could basically add two new heads on each ECU, although that might overload your processors. If it did overload the processors, you could lengthen program time and still get the same yield with less depletion. Alternatively, instead of adding heads, you could add one of each P1 processor and another P2 processor and decrease cycle time to drive extraction harder. Remember, too, to balance out your P0 yields if one ECU is getting a lot more production with 4 heads than the other, you can re-balance them to 3 and 5 heads so that production might be closer to equal.

Twulf The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact 1	Posted - 2012.03.16 18:37:00 - [41] - Quote KevLor I wrote: Your total grid load due to facilities is 12,600, which leaves 2,400 (for CC3) for links. That is quite a bit, but if you are on a gas planet, you might need it. How big (diameter) is your planet? My (Very rough) estimate indicates you have 13k or 14k km of links if you are running out of grid. You can also make coolant on a storm planet, which tends to be much smaller. If you were to go to CC4, you could basically add two new heads on each ECU, although that might overload your processors. If it did overload the processors, you could lengthen program time and still get the same yield with less depletion. Alternatively, instead of adding heads, you could add one of each P1 processor and another P2 processor and decrease cycle time to drive extraction harder. Remember, too, to balance out your P0 yields if one ECU is getting a lot more production with 4 heads than the other, you can re-balance them to 3 and 5 heads so that production might be closer to equal. yea I was going to play with the balance and I will be getting CC4 in a bit. The links do cost alot because of the distance but it is working nowing. My power is about max right now. I moved to a gas planet because it was in the same systems as where I am running missions where as the storm planet I was using is 2 jumps out. So this is easier for now. Again thanks for the help.
Bantara Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance 5	Posted - 2012.03.16 20:44:00 - [42] - Quote Twulf, is there noone in your executor corp helping you? Should be plenty of knowledge over there. Not that this is anything wrong or lacking with our awesome forum residents, but you should have access to good help right there on your alliance channel. just wondering...
Twulf The Konvergent League Sanctuary Pact 1	Posted - 2012.03.16 21:14:00 - [43] - Quote Bantara wrote: Twulf, is there noone in your executor corp helping you? Should be plenty of knowledge over there. Not that this is anything wrong or lacking with our awesome forum residents, but you should have access to good help right there on your alliance channel. just wondering... Lol I am asking them a ton of questions as it is with ship fittings and skills and other stuff, figured this would be a good place to ask these questions. They have helped me alot in Corp and the Alliance. I ask in a few different places and listen to each person who all have their "own" correct way of doing it and then I take everything I hear and learned and make my "own" correct way. I think it has a lot to do with being in the IT world, you never just do it the way your are shown, you put your own little twist on it to make it yours.
Bantara Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance 5	Posted - 2012.03.16 21:43:00 - [44] - Quote KevLor I wrote: Regarding your future plans - you will never want to extract more than two P0s from a single planet, regardless of CC level. I have a friend who claims to be just as productive making single-planet P3. You're saying he isn't, right? Why, where's the loss?
KevLor I Zephyr Corp Black Thorne Alliance 7	Posted - 2012.03.17 04:10:00 - [45] - Quote There are a couple of different ways to do P3 on a single world, and there are multiple ways of looking at overall efficiency, as well. As to the main ways to do P3 on a single planet - start extractors and walk away: 4X ECUs (1 head each) 4X P1 processors 2X P2 Processor 1X P3 Processor 1X Launch Pad This is about all you can fit on a continuous production line, and there are multiple inefficiencies here: Your most glaring one is that your ECUs can only have one head, which wastes the huge cost of the ECU and gets little P0 extracted. You are essentially using 3,150 grid per head, whereas an ECU with 10 head is only 810 per head. Secondly, all your processors will be 'cavitating' a good percent of the time - P1 processors waiting on P0, P2s waiting on P1, and P3 waiting on P2. Again, the grid spent per unit produced will be horrible. Finally, your links will have to be pretty long to get to all the P0 ECUs. You WILL save on taxes, and I can't really say I have done the comparison, because it will be so out of line with the efficiency losses that it will not matter. A second way to do P3 on a single planet: 2x ECUs (6 head each) 4X P1 Processors 2X P2 Processors 1X P3 Processor 1X Launch Pad This is a non-continuous production line. Each head is just under 1,000 grid each, and you can likely manage to keep your P1 processors in full production (and more) if you are in low-sec or below. The down-side is you need to swap what your extractors are extracting every now and then - e.g. for robotics on a plasma world, use this as a mech parts planet for a while, then switch to a consumer elec planet for a while. When you do, the Robotics will start getting made in the final processor. To me, this is a huge hassle, since you have to redo your routes and processor settings. You should be able to reach all the deposits with the extra grid you have, though. If you are in null/w-space, you might be able to reduce heads/add processors and up the program speed - but this just makes the reconfiguring a more frequent hassle. Finally, you could go with one ECU and rotate it - but I am not even going to go through that on paper, much less in-game. TL;DR - the efficiency is lost in keeping processors busy 100 of the time, and grid lost when looked at on a head/grid ratio.

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