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Jenina Hawke
Core Domination Big Bang Quantum
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Posted - 2008.06.04 11:22:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Jenina Hawke on 04/06/2008 11:22:48
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Estel Arador The other option is training diplomacy V, getting that -4.57 standing and making sure it doesn't get worse.
Yes it will require a change in what you've been doing for the past 2 years, but you could've thought of that earlier. It's not like factional warfare coming is a surprise, neither is the empires not like people with horrible standings to them. Your actions have consequences and now, for the first time, there will be a way out of the standings hole and you're complaining it's not easy enough. Lady, it being possible is a huge lot easier than it being impossible as it was for years...
Before berating the other people, have you tried it?
1) FW agents will give mission to someone with -2 or worse standing with the faction if he is in a militia?
2) Militia mission give faction standing gains or only militia?
3) Capturing complex give faction standing and not only militia standing?
I am almost sure that the reply to 1 is no.
You know... you are right. I did not even think about that. Silly me, good thing I haven't dropped roles in a panick.
Jen
***** No signature is good enough *****
DGAF Newbie Guide
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Arous Drephius
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.06.04 11:30:00 -
[32]
You can't join the militias with a faction standing less than 0.5.
Sorry to burst the bubble.
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Effy Muller
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Posted - 2008.06.04 11:33:00 -
[33]
SO **** *** ******* you ****** cant ******* **** **** ******* ***** whats the point?
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Estel Arador
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Posted - 2008.06.04 11:53:00 -
[34]
Geez, I guess jumping to conclusions is so much easier than actually reading information that's been given us. If anyone else has any questions or misconceptions about factional warfare, please do read the dev blogs and dev comments before posting anything.
Originally by: Venkul Mul Before berating the other people, have you tried it?
No I have not, the dev statements on this are clear and unambiguous.
CCP Greyscale answering the question "Is there going to be a way back from -5 standing to a faction?" with: Actually amusingly, yes, by signing up for a player corp in that faction.
CCP Greyscale again, this time in a dev blog talking about what happens when you secure a site: score points for your faction and earn a little personal glory (manifested as standings increases)
CCP Ginger in a dev blog: In addition for every rank gained your overall faction standing gets an incremental increase.
So there you have it, both militia standing increases and faction standing increases, without even having to talk to an agent.
Originally by: Arous Drephius You can't join the militias with a faction standing less than 0.5.
Sorry to burst the bubble.
You can't, but your corporation can. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
Jenina Hawke
Core Domination Big Bang Quantum
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Posted - 2008.06.04 12:38:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Jenina Hawke on 04/06/2008 12:38:09
Originally by: Victor Vision Jen, you have probably been working for pirate agents. They used to give nice implants, did they not?
Yeah, I work for the pirate agents in my part of 0.0. They still give implants, btw. But mainly, they are the agents available in the part of the world where I live.
The main problem is that even one single storyline after training diplomacy 5 will probably send me back to -5 or less with Amarr. That means I cannot increase the faction standing of the faction I do work with (pirate) to the level I wish without getting fubared in Amarr space because of the beefed up navies that are coming with FW.
I was hoping I would have a chance with one of the related factions, but even with diplomacy 5, the best is at -2.6.
Originally by: Victor Vision
In roleplay terms it makes sense that the empires do not want you in their armies, if your standings are too low. I guess for people in your situation it might make sense if pirate factions were somehow involved in FW. You could then work for these.
And I think I would - if I was interested in FW. I am not, I am happy to be in an alliance in 0.0 - I just want to be able to pass through empire space in a ship.
Originally by: Victor Vision
Also, CCP stated in the last dev chat that they were looking into ways for players to be able to increase empire faction standings when they are below -2. But this will not be in at the same time as the FW patch, but later.
Looking forward to that and I guess I'll just stay in 0.0 until that happens.
***** No signature is good enough *****
DGAF Newbie Guide
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Idril Celebrindar
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Posted - 2008.06.04 14:38:00 -
[36]
How about ganging with buddy that can do missions for amarr/caldari and will share corp stadings with you? Once you are able to run at least lvl 1 missions by yourself you have access to storyline missions too.
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 15:25:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Ki Tarra on 04/06/2008 15:36:15
Originally by: Estel Arador CCP Greyscale answering the question "Is there going to be a way back from -5 standing to a faction?" with: Actually amusingly, yes, by signing up for a player corp in that faction.
This is basicly a refer to point 3. In itself it does not specify how practical that will be. Originally by: Estel Arador CCP Greyscale again, this time in a dev blog talking about what happens when you secure a site: score points for your faction and earn a little personal glory (manifested as standings increases)
This does not specify faction standings gains. Although I have not tested it myself, the posts in this thead lead me to believe that you get a 1.5% increase to the militia for capturing a facility, but I have seen nothing to indicate that you get any direct faction standings increases. Further this post seems to directly refute the possiblity of getting faction standings from conquering capture points. Originally by: Estel Arador CCP Ginger in a dev blog: In addition for every rank gained your overall faction standing gets an incremental increase.
That post, along with the quote you provided seems to indicate that the possiblity for factions standings increases is tightly limited in faction warfare. You get 9 faction standings increases. Thats it! One for each promotion. Unless those standings increases are hefty, (Gingers use of the word incremental, does not imply hefty to me) you will be hard pressed to get back access to agents to allow the restoration of your standings.
Oh, and if you do make the attempt, don't screw up your standings a second time, as you can only get the faction standings increases for your promtions once.
For the OP, if you want to give FW a try as far as restoring your faction standings, I would recommend working for Caldari, not because it might be easier to gain acceptance into a corp, but because the derived standings gains for Mordu's Legion, might gain you access to that faction sooner than any of the others. As per Greyscale: the faction boost applies a full set of derived standings as per usual. That means what ever standings gain you get for Caldari, you will gain 1.5x that with Mordu's Legion. If your lucky it won't take much to get your standings with them back above -2.0, you can then work for them directly again.
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 15:43:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Idril Celebrindar How about ganging with buddy that can do missions for amarr/caldari and will share corp stadings with you? Once you are able to run at least lvl 1 missions by yourself you have access to storyline missions too.
As has been stated in this thread, along with many other: you CANNOT share faction standings increases.
You can only share corp/agent standings increases.
That is helpful for gaining quicker access to higher level agents, but does nothing to allow you to repair your faction standings once your bases standings drop below -5.
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Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2008.06.04 15:55:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Estel Arador Geez, I guess jumping to conclusions is so much easier than actually reading information that's been given us. If anyone else has any questions or misconceptions about factional warfare, please do read the dev blogs and dev comments before posting anything.
Originally by: Venkul Mul Before berating the other people, have you tried it?
No I have not, the dev statements on this are clear and unambiguous.
CCP Greyscale answering the question "Is there going to be a way back from -5 standing to a faction?" with: Actually amusingly, yes, by signing up for a player corp in that faction.
CCP Greyscale again, this time in a dev blog talking about what happens when you secure a site: score points for your faction and earn a little personal glory (manifested as standings increases)
CCP Ginger in a dev blog: In addition for every rank gained your overall faction standing gets an incremental increase.
So there you have it, both militia standing increases and faction standing increases, without even having to talk to an agent.
So it is possible to recover standing conquering complexes, good.
And I posted some clear question that you had left hanging. You were posting as you were the holder of the truth revelated "join militia and you will have a way to mend your standing", without any explanation.
Now you have graciously shared the font of so much wisdom. Much better.
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:01:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Venkul Mul So it is possible to recover standing conquering complexes, good.
Not really: read this.
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Nachshon
Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:04:00 -
[41]
Come on - why do you want good standing with the Amarr so bad?
Join the Matari. We have cookies and rifters. An unbeatable combination, I think. ____________________________________ Caldari by birth, Minmatar by citizenship.
The True Meaning of Freedom
My v |
Estel Arador
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:09:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Ki Tarra
Originally by: Venkul Mul So it is possible to recover standing conquering complexes, good.
Not really: read this.
You mean: "Correct, but it'll be hard". As I've said, it being hard is better than it being impossible. Sure, the exact amount of standing increase is yet to be seen, but it getting at least one of the factions of a block above -2.00 (after diplomacy) is likely and from there you can move to missions and storylines for that faction.
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:26:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Ki Tarra on 04/06/2008 16:27:09
Originally by: Estel Arador Sure, the exact amount of standing increase is yet to be seen, but it getting at least one of the factions of a block above -2.00 (after diplomacy) is likely and from there you can move to missions and storylines for that faction.
That is significant. As long as the minimum standings increase with Caldari is 2.1% for each rank, you should be able to restore your Mordu's standings no matter how bad they are initially. From there you can restore your other standings.
However, the fact that you only get one chance to restore your standings remains, and watch out that you don't screw up your Gallente/Minmatar standings in the process.
It would be nice if CCP would provide us with documentation on what the rewards are for each rank instead of making us grind up the standings to find out.
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Idril Celebrindar
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:40:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Ki Tarra
Originally by: Idril Celebrindar How about ganging with buddy that can do missions for amarr/caldari and will share corp stadings with you? Once you are able to run at least lvl 1 missions by yourself you have access to storyline missions too.
As has been stated in this thread, along with many other: you CANNOT share faction standings increases.
You can only share corp/agent standings increases.
That is helpful for gaining quicker access to higher level agents, but does nothing to allow you to repair your faction standings once your bases standings drop below -5.
I never said you get faction standings increase from sharing missions. I said you improve CORP standings to that point where you can run regular missions for them and from that point you have access to your own storyline missions which DOES increase your faction standings.
Or are you saying that after -5 with faction your storylines does not increase faction standings?
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:44:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Ki Tarra on 04/06/2008 16:46:04
Originally by: Idril Celebrindar Or are you saying that after -5 with faction your storylines does not increase faction standings?
I am saying that if you have -5 base standing, diplomacy will only raise your effective standigs to -2.
If any standing (agent, corp, or faction) is -2 or less, that agent will not talk to you regardless of how good your other standings might be.
Therefore, if you have a -5 base faction standing, no agent in that faction will talk to you.
If no agent will talk to you, there is no way to get any storyline (or COSMOS) missions.
Once you have -5 with all allied factions, like the OP, there is no way back.
FW will add a new way to increase your faction standings aside from missions. Depending on how big those increases are, it might allow you to restore your standings with atleast one allied faction.
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Ehranavaar
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Posted - 2008.06.04 16:50:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Jenina Hawke
With Diplomacy 5, I have -3.68 to Caldari, -3.6 to Ammatar, -3.3 to Khanid, -2.46 to Mordus Legion. Yeah, I am a bad case.
Jen
if you mission a lot for one of the factions you will eventually hose yourself with the others. looking at the bright side you have firm allies to go with the enemies you've made along the way.
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Eventy One
Magellan Exploration and Survey Phoenix Rising Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.04 18:26:00 -
[47]
I like your idea of opening up Concord agents. There is actually one in game, and his mish either really helps your sec status, or it screws it (depending on if you complete his rather tough mission or not).
Still, more concord agents would be nice.
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Bronson Hughes
The. Conspiracy
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Posted - 2008.06.04 18:40:00 -
[48]
CCP will not likely put storyline agents back in for InterBus because they have positive standings with all 4 major Empires; people could just grind InterBus missions all day long and end up with everyone in Empire loving them.
Check the 'other' factions: Servent Sisters of EvE, ORE, Mordu's Legion, etc. You may be able to do storylines for one of them and in the process get standings with the other Empire factions. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne |
Rooker
Lysian Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.06.04 18:46:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Rooker on 04/06/2008 18:47:06 I understand there should be consequences for having standings so far in the negative but this really is a ridiculous situation.
Maybe they should change it so that NPC factions can't set a person any lower than -4.99 or change it so that you can access a lvl1 agent with Diplomacy 5 regardless of standings so you can grind your way back up.
@ Jenina Hawke
If I were you, I'd turn down all the storyline missions from that pirate corp from now on. You don't take a faction standings hit with anyone if you do that.
-- Let Us Avoid Systems Via Autopilot |
Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2008.06.04 19:00:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Eventy One I like your idea of opening up Concord agents. There is actually one in game, and his mish either really helps your sec status, or it screws it (depending on if you complete his rather tough mission or not).
Still, more concord agents would be nice.
They were removed because doing Concord mission rise Security status (sec status essentially is your Concord standing) so it was too easy to recover security standing.
As it is already too easy to recover security standing, making it even easier is the wrong way to go.
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Ki Tarra
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.06.04 19:24:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Bronson Hughes CCP will not likely put storyline agents back in for InterBus because they have positive standings with all 4 major Empires; people could just grind InterBus missions all day long and end up with everyone in Empire loving them.
Derived standings cap out at the relationship level of the two factions.
Gallente standings would cap out at +3.0, Caldari at +1.5, Minmatar at +1.25 and Amarr at +0.25.
That could hardly be called "loving".
You can get higher standings rotating between opposing faction blocks.
Adding InterBus storyline agents would fix the problem of being locked out of the Empire factions but wouldn't help with being locked out of the pirate factions. Originally by: Bronson Hughes Check the 'other' factions: Servent Sisters of EvE, ORE, Mordu's Legion, etc. You may be able to do storylines for one of them and in the process get standings with the other Empire factions.
As the OP already stated, she is locked out of all five allied factions in that block. Originally by: Rooker Maybe they should change it so that NPC factions can't set a person any lower than -4.99 or change it so that you can access a lvl1 agent with Diplomacy 5 regardless of standings so you can grind your way back up.
Your empire factions standings will not drop below -5 by simply working for the empire factions.
To get below -5 you need to either kill that faction's ships or work the pirate factions.
Ruining your pirate faction standings is done very quickly by working for empire factions, both because of derived standings losses and because they send you out to kill the pirate factions.
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Jenina Hawke
Core Domination Big Bang Quantum
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Posted - 2008.06.04 21:08:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Jenina Hawke on 04/06/2008 21:09:35
Originally by: Rooker Edited by: Rooker on 04/06/2008 18:47:06
@ Jenina Hawke
If I were you, I'd turn down all the storyline missions from that pirate corp from now on. You don't take a faction standings hit with anyone if you do that.
Yes, refusing all storylines + all missions against Amarr + Caldari + Mordus Headhunters would make me stay at -4.57 to Amarr - but also mean that I will never get any higher faction standing with the faction I am working for (Sansha). Ever. And that sucks, when you have been working on that faction standing for a very long time.
I am essentially just a 0.0 player interested in staying in 0.0, but being able to travel through empire when I have ships to move. Is that really such an unusual thing? With FW coming, the navies are being beefed up - fair enough - and then I am now forced to stop working for my "bad" faction because of something that I cannot participate in (and don't want to participate in) and without the option of a work-around.
And of course the main jump-off points to Sansha-space is in... Amarr
That's really all...
Jen
***** No signature is good enough *****
DGAF Newbie Guide
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Masterkiller
Fear Factory
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Posted - 2008.06.09 18:47:00 -
[53]
Yeah that hidden CONCORD mission in Mandoo is really funny ;) |
Mazzarins Demise
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Posted - 2008.06.09 19:03:00 -
[54]
I was always afraid to run kill missions for this very reason. After i noticed my standing going down with Gallente and Minmatar after running many, many missions I stopped. I really didn't want to limit myself and the places I could go with no means of getting back up if I do in fact get too low in standing.
Sadly the only way you can truly be balanced with all empire factions is to never run missions and that kinda bites.
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