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| Author |
Topic |
Chi Quan
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.03 08:23:00 -
[1]
why they need to be looked at:
- cap problems on the t2 ships
- scrambler role loss due to recent heavy interdictor introduction
- dampener role is stragely defined, as for a long range weapon the range on the damps is too short (optimal 30, falloff 60 or 90 with frequency modulation 5) and as a short range weapon the dampening effect is too weak
- lack of any tank capability when fitting the medslots with damps
- damps can augment ecm, true, but a second ecm ship would be a plain better choice.
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You don't have to like it - I don't blame you for not liking it. |
Orchid Ix
X-ile
Pupule 'Ohana
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Posted - 2008.07.03 13:22:00 -
[2]
Yes it appears the Celestis has lost it's role. 
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Sig Under Construction |
Monsara
Federation Zone Operations Command
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Posted - 2008.07.03 16:17:00 -
[3]
suh suh suh signed
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Aionstar
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Posted - 2008.07.04 12:39:00 -
[4]
signed
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Miss KillSome
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.07.05 14:57:00 -
[5]
yep
celestis is not viable for everything anymore.
I tried to shield tank it :) it fails even there:D
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Nick Bison
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Posted - 2008.07.06 07:39:00 -
[6]
Sad but true, mine only sits in the hanger gathering dust. Unless I take it out as a "throw away" PvP ship.
At least they are inexpensive.
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Stakhanov
Metafarmers
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Posted - 2008.07.06 09:20:00 -
[7]
I wouldn't say they suffer from cap issues. You can fit CPRs or CCC to perma run damps and scrams , tho a cap injector is more efficient in combat as it allows steady MWD usage and limited tanking.
Damps had a fine role before , there should be celestis/lachesis/arazu only scripts that decrease or remove drawbacks to be more useful in gang.
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Chi Quan
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.06 12:34:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Stakhanov
I wouldn't say they suffer from cap issues. You can fit CPRs or CCC to perma run damps and scrams , tho a cap injector is more efficient in combat as it allows steady MWD usage and limited tanking.
Damps had a fine role before , there should be celestis/lachesis/arazu only scripts that decrease or remove drawbacks to be more useful in gang.
excuseme?
Armor Explosive Hardener II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
800mm Reinforced Crystalline Carbonide Plates I
Remote Sensor Dampener II, Targeting Range Dampening
Remote Sensor Dampener II, Targeting Range Dampening
Remote Sensor Dampener II, Scan Resolution Dampening
Remote Sensor Dampener II, Scan Resolution Dampening
Remote Sensor Dampener II, Scan Resolution Dampening
Stasis Webifier II
10MN Afterburner II
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
200mm Railgun II, Spike M
200mm Railgun II, Spike M
eft-maxed skills (as i am not the self mutilation type, training uselss skills to 5). 25% more capregen are needed to be even and have about 2.5 minutes of cap, that's with an afterburner and a capmod
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You don't have to like it - I don't blame you for not liking it. |
Alak D'bor
Viper Squad
Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.07.06 13:22:00 -
[9]
And this is in GD why? Whines go in features discussion.
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Crausaum
Ixion Defence Systems
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Posted - 2008.07.06 14:44:00 -
[10]
The best way to tell if a ship is gimped is to check its market price, in the case of the Lachesis this price is basically the cost to build the ship.
Individually people may whine but overall the market speaks truthfully and when a ship has nearly no demand you know something is wrong.
While I can see the point of CCP separating the range and locking time effects of the damps everything after that was just kind of overkill.
Add to that the fact that even one commonly fitted sensor booster with a range script can counteract a fair number of damps and you've got some problems.
Let's not even get into the havoc that the heavy interdict or class has caused.
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absit iniuria verbis |
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Manfred Rickenbocker
The Elliance
Delta.Green
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Posted - 2008.07.07 19:38:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Manfred Rickenbocker on 07/07/2008 19:39:28
All the damp-class ships need a boost. ECM ships got a boost, so damps should get their day in the sun too. Damps vs. Sensor Boosters is a tricky proposition since not only do they counteract each other, but incur a stacking penalty as well making it doubly stupid. If sensor boosters were operationally like ECCM (as in no benefit except when being damped) maybe...
Heres a thing: why dont they make sensor boosting responsible for targeting range, and sensor strength responsible for targeting speed? Throw resolution to the wayside as a multiplier on the formula. Throw sensor booster stacking vs. damps away as well. That way its worthwhile fitting ECCM mods; damps and ECM thus are inline (via a stealth route).
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Peace through superior firepower: a guiding principle for uncertain times. |
here'n'there
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Posted - 2008.07.09 09:30:00 -
[12]
bump! |
Chi Quan
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.14 20:58:00 -
[13]
go go gadget reminder bump
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You don't have to like it - I don't blame you for not liking it. |
Dzajic
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Posted - 2008.07.15 10:50:00 -
[14]
Dedicated Damp E-war ships should get a moderate to small boost to damper effectiveness. IF that proves insufficient that boost a little bit more.
Grid and cap issues should be investigated separately from the damp weakness.
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Straight Chillen
Gallente
Solar Wind
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.07.15 15:41:00 -
[15]
CCP! Set my Dampners FREEE!!!
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Chi Quan
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.16 00:17:00 -
[16]
*cough*
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You don't have to like it - I don't blame you for not liking it. |
here'n'there
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Posted - 2008.07.18 11:45:00 -
[17]
dont let this topic disappear!
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theteck
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Posted - 2008.07.18 18:32:00 -
[18]
/signed
i just train for it when i see that
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ghost st
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Posted - 2008.07.19 02:00:00 -
[19]
I think that damps as well as td need to be looked at. (Td to a lesser extent)
The problem with these items is that thier effective range is rather limited, but reducing range is where they are most effective.
I think that at the least we should have modules (similar to ecm) that increase the range/strength, of damps, and tds.
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Hippo117
Caldari
Wings of Redemption
Black Flag Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.19 02:27:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Chi Quan
Edited by: Chi Quan on 06/07/2008 12:41:10
Originally by: Stakhanov
I wouldn't say they suffer from cap issues. You can fit CPRs or CCC to perma run damps and scrams , tho a cap injector is more efficient in combat as it allows steady MWD usage and limited tanking.
excuseme?
Armor Explosive Hardener II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
800mm RT Plate
4x Remote Sensor Dampener II
Stasis Webifier II
10MN Afterburner II
3x Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
2x 200mm Railgun II, Spike M
eft-maxed skills (as i am not the self mutilation type, training uselss skills to 5). 25% more capregen are needed to be even and have about 2.5 minutes of cap, that's with an afterburner and a capmod. god forbid i try a mwd.
edit: i know that a DC would yeald better effective hp, but everyone able to switch to explo against gallente ships will do so it seems
WTB 6 mid celestis 
i put this through eft myself as it didnt sound right
with EM/ESO5 (a whopping 14 days of training  ) i can sustain this whole setup (yes, guns, ab, hardener, damps, web) for 2m9s without fitting a low slot cap mod or cap rigs
fitting a CPR (instead of a silly flux) gets me to 3m11s (2m28 with the flux)
fitting 2 ccc's makes it possible to sustain it forever
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Qduhaf
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Posted - 2008.07.21 19:34:00 -
[21]
Arazu and Lachesis are also now close to worthless, damps needed to be nerfed as every ship was using them too effectively. But they need to still work on the class specific ships. CCP did the same to ECM ships, nerf so they weren' tuseful then buffed and introduced mods to make them effective if not dominating.
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oniplE
Loving Pirates
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Posted - 2008.07.21 20:51:00 -
[22]
Although i fully support this thread, i'm afraid it will be as effective as talking to a brick wall. There have been dozens of threads about boosting these ships and they've all been ignored.
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here'n'there
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Posted - 2008.07.24 13:23:00 -
[23]
*cough* |
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