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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.07 15:29:00 -
[1]
Sure, the "ugly American" tourist is a cultural meme pretty much everywhere. But seems Americans have shed that image (in reality even if people still believe it).
Correct answer: The French
Quote: According to a recent international survey, the French are now considered the most obnoxious tourists from European nations, and behind only Indians and the last-place Chinese as the worst among all countries worldwide. And it's not only the rest of the world that have a gripe with the Gallic attitude: the French also finished second to last among nations ranking the popularity of their own tourists who vacation at home.
SOURCE: Most Obnoxious Tourists
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Wendat Huron
Stellar Solutions
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Posted - 2008.07.07 15:33:00 -
[2]
Last I was out and about the ones pestering me the most were russians and israelis.
These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade! |
goodby4u
Logistic Technologies Incorporated
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Posted - 2008.07.07 15:40:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 07/07/2008 15:38:42 Sure, the "ugly American" tourist is a cultural meme pretty much everywhere. But seems Americans have shed that image to some extent (in reality even if people still believe it).
Correct answer: The French
Quote: According to a recent international survey, the French are now considered the most obnoxious tourists from European nations, and behind only Indians and the last-place Chinese as the worst among all countries worldwide. And it's not only the rest of the world that have a gripe with the Gallic attitude: the French also finished second to last among nations ranking the popularity of their own tourists who vacation at home.
SOURCE: Most Obnoxious Tourists
Do they dress like human tanks in hawaiian shirts aswell?
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.07 15:45:00 -
[4]
Originally by: goodby4u Do they dress like human tanks in hawaiian shirts aswell?
Apparently the French are still ranked highly as among the best dressed according to the article (behind Italians). They did not say where American's ranked there.
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Isiskhan
Gnostic Misanthropy
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Posted - 2008.07.07 16:08:00 -
[5]
The article talks about tourists and their issues of dealing with foreign languages in foreign nations... but how about tourists having issues with speaking their own language while visiting their own country?
It happened to me twice while vacationing in southern Tenerife (Canary islands, Spain): I entered a shop / restaurant and they didn't speak Spanish, only English. But then, that's southern Tenerife, the newest de-facto British colony
Apparently there's a similar situation in some eastern part of Mallorca, but with Germans: I've heard there's so many of them there they've even formed their own political party.
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Chris Bartlett
Caldari shadow and flame Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.07 20:04:00 -
[6]
I'm English.
Course i knew it was the French :P we hate the bastards
I'm highly biased about most things, but it has nothing to do with the overall view of my corp or alliance |
Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.07 20:11:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Isiskhan The article talks about tourists and their issues of dealing with foreign languages in foreign nations... but how about tourists having issues with speaking their own language while visiting their own country?
It happened to me twice while vacationing in southern Tenerife (Canary islands, Spain): I entered a shop / restaurant and they didn't speak Spanish, only English. But then, that's southern Tenerife, the newest de-facto British colony
Apparently there's a similar situation in some eastern part of Mallorca, but with Germans: I've heard there's so many of them there they've even formed their own political party.
Happens in some places in the US too. Once in awhile I will end up in an area where no one speaks English. Kind of weird but whatever.
What is REALLY weird is when they are speaking English words and you still have no clue what is being said. Some areas Louisiana have this issue. I hear English words but not a clue what they are saying. You can also get this in Pennsylvania where some few people speak "Pennsylvania Dutch". They mess up the language in weird ways. My favorite example of that is they'll say, "Throw the horse over the fence some hay."
What I hear, "Throw a horse over the fence at the hay."
After a minute of parsing I figure they meant, "Throw the horse, which is over the fence, some hay." -------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Wilko1776
Minmatar An Eye For An Eye Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2008.07.07 20:13:00 -
[8]
surely child sex tourists is the correct answer? or do you all condone such behaviour.....i'm not surprised hydra alliance does but i'd expect better from the rest of you
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Micheal Dietrich
Caldari Terradyne Networks
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Posted - 2008.07.07 20:19:00 -
[9]
I like the chinese tourists myself. Takes a half hour to explain to them where something is but it's great when you get the group OOOOOOOOOOOOH!
Originally by: Calvin Firenze ****ing filter
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Chris Bartlett
Caldari shadow and flame Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.07 20:20:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Wilko1776 surely child sex tourists is the correct answer? or do you all condone such behaviour.....i'm not surprised hydra alliance does but i'd expect better from the rest of you
WUT YOU SAYIN BOUT MAH ALLIANCE, FOO'?
I'm highly biased about most things, but it has nothing to do with the overall view of my corp or alliance |
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F'nog
Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Celestial Industrial Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.08 05:43:00 -
[11]
Hell, I've known this for 25 years. Ever since I visited the lovely UK and the French tourists were always pushing ahead of us in lines and being general asses.
And don't even get me started on visiting there. You say, "Bonjour" and they respond, "Hello, how can I help you?" or "What do you want?"
Go to Italy and say, "Buon giorno," and they're all, "BUON GIORNO! [let me give you a kiss and some pasta, maybe a little Chianti?]. Now that's a friendly people.
Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari
F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
Originally by: Chribba Go F'nog! You're a hero! Not a Zero! /me bows
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Slade Trillgon
Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.07.08 17:30:00 -
[12]
If you have seen the movie "Waiting" then you may know what I am going to write about.
I have many friends that have and still work in the resturant buisness and it seems to be a general consensus that if you get a table that has tourists from another country that you are more likely to be given a shitty tip as opposed to the typical individual from the States. This has not been associated with any one single nationality, it just seems to be a general consensus. This also could be from many US citizens not being comfortable around forigne languages, thus they end up giving inferior service due to lack of communication, but that is up for discussion.
I ask the following question because I have seen a few episodes of the TV reality show "The Amazing Race" were certain individuals did not represent me or other US citizens very positively.
What I want to know is do US citizens typically tip well, average, or below average when they are abroad? This is a generalized question unless, you the reader, have extensive background in the service industry.
Adendum: I can honestly say the worst stories about the worst customers that my friends have had to deal with are from the States. One being the infamous Jerry Falwell.
Slade
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.07.08 17:50:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Slade Trillgon If you have seen the movie "Waiting" then you may know what I am going to write about.
I have many friends that have and still work in the resturant buisness and it seems to be a general consensus that if you get a table that has tourists from another country that you are more likely to be given a shitty tip as opposed to the typical individual from the States. This has not been associated with any one single nationality, it just seems to be a general consensus. This also could be from many US citizens not being comfortable around forigne languages, thus they end up giving inferior service due to lack of communication, but that is up for discussion.
I ask the following question because I have seen a few episodes of the TV reality show "The Amazing Race" were certain individuals did not represent me or other US citizens very positively.
What I want to know is do US citizens typically tip well, average, or below average when they are abroad? This is a generalized question unless, you the reader, have extensive background in the service industry.
Adendum: I can honestly say the worst stories about the worst customers that my friends have had to deal with are from the States. One being the infamous Jerry Falwell.
Slade
All I can say is that I used to do some bar work and trying to explain to Americans that in the UK, it is NOT mandatory to tip, and that if you are going to do so then just leaving it on the bar is at best careless and at worst rude...
Ah well bless their little hearts. They mean well.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:07:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Malcanis
All I can say is that I used to do some bar work and trying to explain to Americans that in the UK, it is NOT mandatory to tip, and that if you are going to do so then just leaving it on the bar is at best careless and at worst rude...
Ah well bless their little hearts. They mean well.
Tipping is obviously a bigger thing in the US than in the UK, in part because of the minimum wage. In Britain, the minimum wage is some $10 or so (around ú5, depending on your age), while in the US it is federally $5.85/ú2.90 (higher in some states). Tipping in America is important because the person serving you may be depending on those tips for a decent living; in the UK, they're pretty much guaranteed a decent living no matter what. ------
Originally by: Micheal Dietrich You can even get a midget with a camera to sit on the floorboard.
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Slade Trillgon
Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:32:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Slade Trillgon on 08/07/2008 18:32:09
Originally by: Malcanis
All I can say is that I used to do some bar work and trying to explain to Americans that in the UK, it is NOT mandatory to tip, and that if you are going to do so then just leaving it on the bar is at best careless and at worst rude...
Ah well bless their little hearts. They mean well.
Well that is good to know if I ever make it to the UK. Now I need to know about some of the other European countries, because if this is similar in most of Europe that may explain why the European tourist do not tip well or at all. I will stop with that.
Slade
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Ravin Abai
Amarr Cruoris Seraphim
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:36:00 -
[16]
I live in Miami, arguably one of the cities in the U.S. with one of the highest numbers of foreign visitors and residents.
I can say with some degree of confidence, that many (not all!) of the South American people that live and vacation here are some of the most rude and arrogant people I have ever met.
This might have more to do with their socio-economic status (they are all rich) than where they are from, but I know plenty of very wealthy Cubans, Mexicans, and other Caribbean and Central American people who are a lot more pleasant and down to Earth than many of the South American people I meet. The exception to this "rude South American rule" are Brazilians, who imo are very fun to be around and very nice people.
Any South Americans or other people familiar with what I'm saying care to comment?
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Slade Trillgon
Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:41:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Ravin Abai I live in Miami, arguably one of the cities in the U.S. with one of the highest numbers of foreign visitors and residents.
I can say with some degree of confidence, that many (not all!) of the South American people that live and vacation here are some of the most rude and arrogant people I have ever met.
This might have more to do with their socio-economic status (they are all rich) than where they are from, but I know plenty of very wealthy Cubans, Mexicans, and other Caribbean and Central American people who are a lot more pleasant and down to Earth than many of the South American people I meet. The exception to this "rude South American rule" are Brazilians, who imo are very fun to be around and very nice people.
Any South Americans or other people familiar with what I'm saying care to comment?
Yes those Brazilians know how to party!!! I spent 4 years in Deerfield beach so I can pretty much confirm that this attitude is present in the elitist South Americans in South Florida.
Slade
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:54:00 -
[18]
I wonder how much of this comes down to basic cultural differences as opposed to outright rudeness.
For instance Japanese are used to living in crowded conditions (think of their commuter trains where guys literally push people on the train to fill it to the brim). Americans are very much into their personal space (that invisible forcefield around you that no one is supposed to violate). An American could easily perceive a Japanese person crowding them as rude whereas the Japanese person probably wouldn't think twice about it.
I have read funny stories where cultures clash in innocent and non-obvious ways (a gesture that may be considered rude one place but not another). I know "When in Rome do as the Romans do" and a tourist should try to acquaint themselves with local customs but it is not always easily remembered when you just fall back to lifelong habits.
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.07.08 18:55:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Slade Trillgon Edited by: Slade Trillgon on 08/07/2008 18:32:09
Originally by: Malcanis
All I can say is that I used to do some bar work and trying to explain to Americans that in the UK, it is NOT mandatory to tip, and that if you are going to do so then just leaving it on the bar is at best careless and at worst rude...
Ah well bless their little hearts. They mean well.
Well that is good to know if I ever make it to the UK. Now I need to know about some of the other European countries, because if this is similar in most of Europe that may explain why the European tourist do not tip well or at all. I will stop with that.
Slade
The polite way to tip the bar staff in England is to say "and get one for yourself if you like". And it's really not required or expected; it's something you'd do if the barman/woman did something particularly helpful, of you've been chatting with them for a little while. Basically, it's a way ofgiving a tip but treating them as a friend. Doing this more than once or twice is basically indicating a... personal interest, btw.
Alternatively "keep the change" is OK but a little less personal. The change shouldn't be more than the price of a drink. Doing this every time is the sign of a flash git who thinks it's cool to show off:- which is why English people don't do it.
Just leaving the change on the bar... well just don't. It's rude.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.08 19:06:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 19:10:33
Originally by: Malcanis The change shouldn't be more than the price of a drink. Doing this every time is the sign of a flash git who thinks it's cool to show off:- which is why English people don't do it.
Just leaving the change on the bar... well just don't. It's rude.
Leaving someone money that is above and beyond the payment is rude? (Not getting that one)
And one would hope a Brit would be tolerant and understanding of an American tipping every drink as not being a show off but just what Americans do. Since it is free money to the bartender/wait staff again I can hardly see where the complaint would be. I can see them thinking the American is dumb wasting their money that way and not being aware of how to tip there but not rude and it is to the bartender's benefit.
Of course in the US the reverse is not true since the bartender pretty much lives on tips so a Brit leaving a handful of change on the table is seen as rude and stiffing your server.
I have to admit when I was in Europe I struggled with not tipping. I worked as a bus boy then a waiter long ago and I am just habituated to it. If the wait staff rendered good service I tip.
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Isiskhan
Gnostic Misanthropy
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Posted - 2008.07.08 19:26:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Slade Trillgon Well that is good to know if I ever make it to the UK. Now I need to know about some of the other European countries, because if this is similar in most of Europe that may explain why the European tourist do not tip well or at all. I will stop with that.
Yes, that's the general case in European countries. Here in Spain tipping is 5%, and then not seen as "mandatory" as it is in the US, since waiters are paid a higher salary and not expected to make up for it with tips.
In the US you as a customer are effectively paying for part of the waiter's wages, whereas over here the tip is just meant as a little reward for good service. That explains why European tourists tend to undertip when they go over there.
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Wieselflinke
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Posted - 2008.07.08 19:36:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 07/07/2008 15:38:42 Sure, the "ugly American" tourist is a cultural meme pretty much everywhere. But seems Americans have shed that image to some extent (in reality even if people still believe it).
Correct answer: The French
Quote: the French are now considered the most obnoxious tourists from European nations
Well there's your problem, you can't read...
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.08 19:48:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Wieselflinke
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 07/07/2008 15:38:42 Sure, the "ugly American" tourist is a cultural meme pretty much everywhere. But seems Americans have shed that image to some extent (in reality even if people still believe it).
Correct answer: The French
Quote: the French are now considered the most obnoxious tourists from European nations
Well there's your problem, you can't read...
Finish the quote from the article...
"...and behind only Indians and the last-place Chinese as the worst among all countries worldwide." -------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.07.08 20:48:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 19:10:33
Originally by: Malcanis The change shouldn't be more than the price of a drink. Doing this every time is the sign of a flash git who thinks it's cool to show off:- which is why English people don't do it.
Just leaving the change on the bar... well just don't. It's rude.
Leaving someone money that is above and beyond the payment is rude? (Not getting that one)
And one would hope a Brit would be tolerant and understanding of an American tipping every drink as not being a show off but just what Americans do. Since it is free money to the bartender/wait staff again I can hardly see where the complaint would be. I can see them thinking the American is dumb wasting their money that way and not being aware of how to tip there but not rude and it is to the bartender's benefit.
Of course in the US the reverse is not true since the bartender pretty much lives on tips so a Brit leaving a handful of change on the table is seen as rude and stiffing your server.
I have to admit when I was in Europe I struggled with not tipping. I worked as a bus boy then a waiter long ago and I am just habituated to it. If the wait staff rendered good service I tip.
Throwing your money about is considered vulgar here. It's like... trying to buy friends. Just don't. People might take your money, I guess, but they won't respect or like you, so all you're buying is their contempt or at best embarassment.
I might as well say, saying nice things to people is good, so what's the problem with me telling your woman she's hot 20x in an evening? Once is a compliment, 20x is hitting on her and disrespectful to you as well.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Slade Trillgon
Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.07.08 20:55:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 19:10:33
Originally by: Malcanis The change shouldn't be more than the price of a drink. Doing this every time is the sign of a flash git who thinks it's cool to show off:- which is why English people don't do it.
Just leaving the change on the bar... well just don't. It's rude.
Leaving someone money that is above and beyond the payment is rude? (Not getting that one)
And one would hope a Brit would be tolerant and understanding of an American tipping every drink as not being a show off but just what Americans do. Since it is free money to the bartender/wait staff again I can hardly see where the complaint would be. I can see them thinking the American is dumb wasting their money that way and not being aware of how to tip there but not rude and it is to the bartender's benefit.
Of course in the US the reverse is not true since the bartender pretty much lives on tips so a Brit leaving a handful of change on the table is seen as rude and stiffing your server.
I have to admit when I was in Europe I struggled with not tipping. I worked as a bus boy then a waiter long ago and I am just habituated to it. If the wait staff rendered good service I tip.
Throwing your money about is considered vulgar here. It's like... trying to buy friends. Just don't. People might take your money, I guess, but they won't respect or like you, so all you're buying is their contempt or at best embarassment.
I might as well say, saying nice things to people is good, so what's the problem with me telling your woman she's hot 20x in an evening? Once is a compliment, 20x is hitting on her and disrespectful to you as well.
This is why I like the forums here in EVE, I am learning new things
Slade
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.08 20:55:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Patch86 on 08/07/2008 20:56:13
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 19:10:33
Originally by: Malcanis The change shouldn't be more than the price of a drink. Doing this every time is the sign of a flash git who thinks it's cool to show off:- which is why English people don't do it.
Just leaving the change on the bar... well just don't. It's rude.
Leaving someone money that is above and beyond the payment is rude? (Not getting that one)
And one would hope a Brit would be tolerant and understanding of an American tipping every drink as not being a show off but just what Americans do. Since it is free money to the bartender/wait staff again I can hardly see where the complaint would be. I can see them thinking the American is dumb wasting their money that way and not being aware of how to tip there but not rude and it is to the bartender's benefit.
Of course in the US the reverse is not true since the bartender pretty much lives on tips so a Brit leaving a handful of change on the table is seen as rude and stiffing your server.
I have to admit when I was in Europe I struggled with not tipping. I worked as a bus boy then a waiter long ago and I am just habituated to it. If the wait staff rendered good service I tip.
Its all a matter of social nuances. What seems perfectly reasonable in some places seems rude in others.
Take the change on the bar thing. Thats definitely something that seems rude to my English mind. Leaving tips on a table after a meal, though, seems perfectly reasonable. Whats the distinction? Who knows? Leaving money on the bar seems mealy-mouthed, since you have to go right up to the bartender and give them money face to face; waiting until they've turned around and then leaving money on the side seems like you're making some sort of point. Maybe it's because it seems to establish a superiority, master-and-servant thing. That would be very much at odds with British pub culture, where you're literally a guest in someone else's "house", where the bar-staff are your hosts (completely unlike being a customer in a shop).
Similarly, giving a tip after every drink gives the impression that you're flaunting your cash, trying to show off to everyone; the bartenders will still probably be happy to take the extra money, but they'll be chalking you up as someone best to avoid outside of work. Equate it to someone coming up to you in the street, asking you for the time, then giving you some money for looking at your watch; you'd still be happy to take their money, but you'd be justified in thinking the person is being weird, and getting a bit uncomfortable around them.
But thats reading deep in to something that really has no point- exactly the same behaviour in many other countries wouldn't raise a second thought.
@Slade Trillgon: Here you go, knock yourself out! ------
Originally by: Micheal Dietrich You can even get a midget with a camera to sit on the floorboard.
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Slade Trillgon
Siorai Iontach Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:06:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Patch86
@Slade Trillgon: Here you go, knock yourself out!
Hey that is not a quotable source
Just Kidding, never would have thought to look too wikipedia, but I guess if I had used google for that question I would have found it first.
Thanks 07
Slade
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Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:09:00 -
[28]
Here in the States I always tip 20%. Why? Because I'm lazy and 10% is rude where as 15% is an extra step in math .
It's interesting to note the tipping rules in the UK. _______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony
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pwnedgato
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:17:00 -
[29]
Waiters and such are actually usually paid below minimum wage because the government considers an average of 15% of a meal's price to be tipped and it is taxed as regular income.
As for the personal space thing yeah that is a cultural difference brought on by population density. I could never travel to any Japanese city since I am uncomfortable in just American and European cities. I like my personal space, I do not want you in it, I do not know you, in all likelihood if I got to know you I probably would not like you and so on.
Originally by: Crumplecorn These is a forum for this.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:21:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 21:26:21 Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 08/07/2008 21:21:14
Originally by: Malcanis I might as well say, saying nice things to people is good, so what's the problem with me telling your woman she's hot 20x in an evening? Once is a compliment, 20x is hitting on her and disrespectful to you as well.
Well...not the same thing. The woman is mine. My money is mine. If I choose to give either to you then I am a nice guy.
I kind of see what you are saying. I'd just think Brits would be used to their American counterparts enough to know this quirk and not be overly offended by it especially since you are literally profiting from it. It's not as if they are doing a bad thing to you and you know they are not flaunting their money...they are doing what is socially ingrained in them. Just like I doubt any Brit would get their panties in a twist when a Yank says "trunk" instead of "boot" and so on.
-------------------------------------------------- "Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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