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Nian Banks
Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:01:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Nian Banks on 08/07/2008 21:04:39 With all things nano, I find it strange that what seems to me to be one of the most potentially dangerous nano cruisers of them all, Lacks a fittings thread. Yes its the Scimitar. A non combat ship, The logistics have no damage or weapon bonuses at all. But what it does have is pure potential gankage when teamed up with one or more of its own kind. Reading the description will bring some hind sight as to why.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hull: Scythe Class Role: Support Cruiser
Built with special tracking support arrays, the Scimitar was designed in large part to assist heavy combat vessels in tracking fast-moving targets. Relatively nimble for a support cruiser, it can often be found ducking between battleships, protecting its own back while lending the behemoths the support they need to take out their enemies.
Developer: Core Complexions, Inc.
Core Complexions ships are unusual in that they favor electronics and defense over the "Lots of guns" approach traditionally favored by the Minmatar. Being a support cruiser, the Scimitar therefore fits ideally into their design scheme.
Minmatar Cruiser Skill Bonus: 150% bonus to Tracking Link and Shield Transport range and 20% bonus to Shield Maintenance Bot transport amount per level
Logistics Skill Bonus: 10% bonus to Tracking Link efficiency and 15% reduction in Shield Transport capacitor use per level
Role Bonus: -50% CPU need for Shield Transporters -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok let me explain what i have highlighted, basically this ship is FAST, its small in signature and has a massive range for the shield transporter, plus it gives a bonus to tracking links. Now one of the greatest issues with a ship using turret based weapons is tracking, EvE is none too bright on the old transversal and so even if your orbiting a slow vessel, if your going rather fast, you start to miss. Strange as if your orbiting, your guns should not need to track much at all, they should always be pointing at the same thing at all times. Still in EvE its a fundamental fact and flaw to nano ships, the faster you are the less you hit. Tracking links alleviate the problem quite a bit, a rather handy thing to have to be honest. The next module of interest is the Shield Transporter, using a Large ST you get over 70km's of range, gives out a battleship quality active tank and on a scimitar, had way way less cap useage. Great for repairing a friend and been repaired.
Next we have the other defining qualities of a Scimitar, it has a good amount of med slots, it also can still fit weapons, and it has a nice drone bay of 45m3/gbit. Oh and I did mention the signature radius, well it has a meager size with a LSE II and 10mn MWD II of just 649m. It also goes over 5Km/s.
Here is a fit I was considering. Though cap seems to be an issue, unsure how to fix it unless I try the 2nd variant of the fit.
[Scimitar, Nano Support]
High 1x Large Shield Transporter II 2x Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Barrage M 2x Assault Missile Launcher II, Sabretooth Light Missile
Medium 1x Large Shield Extender II 1x Tracking Link II 1x 10MN MicroWarpdrive II 1x Warp Disruptor II 1x Stasis Webifier II
Low 1x Power Diagnostic System II 2x Overdrive Injector System II 1x Inertia Stabilizers II
Rig 2x Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Drone 9x Hobgoblin II
The modification, is to drop the MWD and PDU and put in a third Overdrive Injector System II and a 10MN Afterburner II. This drastically drops the speed down to a sluggish 1623m/s and a signature of 100m.
So what do you guys think? I know the dps is low, just 166DPS but consider it at minimum in pairs, so your getting 332DPS.
This is all theoretical as its hard to get people to try such a thing and who have the relevant
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Dheorl
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:23:00 -
[2]
For starters I would have said swap the LSE for a invun and then upgrade the missile launchers.
Beyond that I really wouldn't know but it has that problem that although yes, it could be fun (and a bit of a surprise), 2 huginns would probably do a better job.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:42:00 -
[3]
Nano Rapier and Nano Ishtar. Rapier to hold them down, Ishtar to shred them. Far more effective combo.
Bellum Eternus
[Vid] L E G E N D A R Y COLLECTION
Inveniam viam aut faciam. |
Treasal
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:49:00 -
[4]
you could make it do it's role better and join a nano gang, you would be loved i think :)
as far as making it a gank duo or trio of logistics ships no idea, but sounds fun!
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The Djego
Minmatar merovinger inc
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Posted - 2008.07.08 21:58:00 -
[5]
Nearly every Nano Gang with a logistic becomes very powerfull. Simpy because this ships add Tank to the Nano Ships.
Combined with the Damage reduction because of the speed, the ships take now next to zero Damage, even Webbed its hard to kill a Vage with 1-2 Logistics working on it.
If you got a Curse to cap Nuke Webbers and Tacklers it even becomes more funny.
Bottom line, donŠt use logistics as Damage dealers, use them to protect the damage dealers. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.08 22:07:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Grimpak on 08/07/2008 22:07:29 scrap the guns and put more transporters. also scrap the tackling equipment (or at least the web), and slap more tanking in it.
this ship is no damage dealer. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Gneeznow
Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.08 22:24:00 -
[7]
scimmy has 4 highs, but its almost identical to my setup, I use the 2x dual 180 II's and a heavy launcher and a large xfer but you should prolly drop the guns and put another xfer on there to keep the vaga's and rapiers alive. This is an awesome ship.
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Nian Banks
Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.07.09 07:50:00 -
[8]
Yes yes, its for repping other ships, I think thats an obvious and near pointless point you guys are trying to make, I am NOT making a "Help me make a good logistics cruiser" thread, this is, "help me make a logistics cruiser actually do some damage and survive" thread. Its for fun and the WTF factor. What I want to know is if you could make a for example, faction warfare combat duo that would survive basically everything in its class and whittle away at their opponent.
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DeathsEmbrace
Minmatar The Renegades Asylum DEFI4NT
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Posted - 2008.07.09 10:44:00 -
[9]
I love the idea as I've been reluctant to get in one due to the gardian and caldari equivelent being better for remote rep fleet setups. Would suggest droping the web for another lse II, like all nano boats if your in web range your dead, so its a waste of a slot.
As a dual combo, i'd be tempted to use shield rep drones aswell as the transfer, just to give the extra bit of buffer. but in all honesty I think it would work best in a nano formation as with all the will in the world 180 dps sucks, ask any rapier pilot thats tried to solo larget targets. To live is to die, and to die is to give life. Thus pain is a form of euphoria.
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Nian Banks
Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.07.09 11:30:00 -
[10]
Originally by: DeathsEmbrace I love the idea as I've been reluctant to get in one due to the gardian and caldari equivelent being better for remote rep fleet setups. Would suggest droping the web for another lse II, like all nano boats if your in web range your dead, so its a waste of a slot.
As a dual combo, i'd be tempted to use shield rep drones aswell as the transfer, just to give the extra bit of buffer. but in all honesty I think it would work best in a nano formation as with all the will in the world 180 dps sucks, ask any rapier pilot thats tried to solo larget targets.
In faction warfare, this low dps is fine when your only combating ships of your size or smaller.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.09 11:48:00 -
[11]
3x large s95a transporters 1x salvager
1x mwd 1x lse 1x warp disruptor 1x invul 2x cap recharger
2x overdrive 2x cpr
no rigs, cheap, expendable and very effective at rr
I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them. |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.09 12:03:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sokratesz 3x large s95a transporters 1x salvager
1x mwd 1x lse 1x warp disruptor 1x invul 2x cap recharger
2x overdrive 2x cpr
no rigs, cheap, expendable and very effective at rr
Close, but too many transporters, not enough cap regeneration and not enough speed. . .the rest is a sekrit because its Zerv's special setup. . . ----
GO BLUE!! |
Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.07.09 12:08:00 -
[13]
It does have a crazy small sig radius, certainly quite a boon.
I would think it could be plenty dangerous simply with shield transporters. With its speed, agility, shield boost range, and sig radius it'd be a royal pain in the butt to kill--like a vaga that hangs out at 60 km and has a tiny sig radius. You could also fit a cloak on it and still be able to target a MWDing cruiser for repping in a reasonable amount of time.
If you had it setup for heavy shield boosting it could allow your nano gang to take on some things that would otherwise be very dangrous.
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar Celestial Apocalypse The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.09 13:00:00 -
[14]
I was engaging a Brutix and Hurricane just fine with a Rapier when a Scimitar that must have been fit similar to yours showed up. I ignored it at first and ending up losing my Rapier.
Unexpected to say the least. Lesson learned. Nice out-of-box thinking.
"Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.09 13:32:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Close, but too many transporters, not enough cap regeneration and not enough speed. . .the rest is a sekrit because its Zerv's special setup. . .
With logistics 5 (which any pilot serious at flying logistics should have) it can permarun two of the transporters and burst the third.
I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them. |
Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2008.07.09 14:12:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Sokratesz With logistics 5 (which any pilot serious at flying logistics should have) it can permarun two of the transporters and burst the third.
I think he's referring to the lack of pg on a Scimitar. To fit 3x large shield transporters + t2 mwd usually means a RCU or something in the lows. Or it means removing the LSE.
The invuln field means the 2x cpr + 2x cap recharge setup won't perma run the mwd + 2x shield transporters. If the mod isn't activated until needed then the setup will autorun.
Adding ccc rigs isn't a bad deal to free up mid slots.
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Matrixcvd
Caldari Rionnag Alba The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.09 14:32:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Crackzilla
The invuln field means the 2x cpr + 2x cap recharge setup won't perma run the mwd + 2x shield transporters. If the mod isn't activated until needed then the setup will autorun.
Adding ccc rigs isn't a bad deal to free up mid slots.
uhm you missed sok's point, who needs to perma run the MWD and Shield transporters? r u gonna be repping people chasing you and if so fraps please cause that would be hilarious
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2008.07.09 14:51:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Matrixcvd who needs to perma run the MWD and Shield transporters?
If the fight lasts a while being able to perma run the mwd simplifies flying the ship. The scimitar can perma run without much difficulty.
If folks get distracted (too far from the fc) it can also be required to run the mwd to close distance so the shield transporters can be used. The shield transporters have a 71km(?) range.
I ended up using the mwd quite a bit and a perma run setup was useful (except for the optional burst 3rd shield transporter).
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P'uck
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Posted - 2008.07.09 16:02:00 -
[19]
I only skimmed the thread, but i think nobody mentioned that you can only use tracking links on other ships, and that you need to boost each other for it to be worthwile. if you wanted to boost your drones, you'd be better off with an omnidirectional tracking link.
and if you have two guys with minnie cruiser V and whatnot, there are probably better combos than two scimitars ;)
but basically, orbitting somebody really fast and remote repping your drones while doing so sounds fun to me. out of the box-ish.
basically id try to get a large cap bat or something on there, i think it heard it can permarun mwd and a repper or two.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.09 16:08:00 -
[20]
My setup included an RCU instead of the second CPR, forgot that. Three RR really is life saving, you should burn out to about 50 - 60k of the fight then rep people or when they dont have much tacklers stay closer and add some damage in the form of drones.
There is *no* need to permarun mwd + reps, and with logistics 5, 2 cap rechargers and a cpr are all you need. Cap batteries werent an option anyway due to the horrible grid of the scim.
I refuse to respect religious beliefs, and i refuse to respect people who hold them. |
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XFreedomX
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Posted - 2008.07.09 16:14:00 -
[21]
Anyone mention the obvious combination of Scimitar and Muninn?
Also for small gang roaming, a refreshing change from standard nano gang would be 2 Scimatar, 2 x Muninn, 1 Rapier. Fits under the Alliance turney point total also
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Crackzilla
The Shadow Order
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Posted - 2008.07.09 16:40:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Sokratesz There is *no* need to permarun mwd + reps,
Need? No. Nice? Yes.
The watch list has improved things. However even in a medium gang not everything can fit in a watch list.
So you're flying a nano ship, trying to maintain distance with hostiles, maintain traversal against hostile snipers, lock those requesting assistance, watch for those that aren't broadcasting, trying to stay reasonably close to the fc, attempting to run down any nano that has decided to get into trouble outside of rep range, managing the rep cycles because theres some ceptor/dictor that needs a rep *now* and you can't wait for the mod cooldown, etc. Mostly personal preference but it is nice not having to worry about cap issues.
Originally by: XFreedomX Anyone mention the obvious combination of Scimitar and Muninn?
So the dps ship cannot manuever while the logistics ship can?
The best defense a Muninn has is to warp off to a another sling when hostiles get too close. Maybe if the logistics was used to create those slings.
I'd rather a bunch of ceptors & 2x scimitars, or the average nano gang + 2x scimitars. If we're talking 2 ships, then scimitar + vaga.
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Nian Banks
Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2008.07.09 16:40:00 -
[23]
Originally by: XFreedomX Anyone mention the obvious combination of Scimitar and Muninn?
Also for small gang roaming, a refreshing change from standard nano gang would be 2 Scimatar, 2 x Muninn, 1 Rapier. Fits under the Alliance turney point total also
I am glad you see my point, with small gangs, be it for Faction warfare or an Alliance tournament. A nano scimitar is exceedingly powerful. True I am trying to get it to perform a combat role as much as a logistics one, but thats only for 2-3 ship gangs, the smallest you can go. Naturally if it can supply dps to the gang then you may as well do it. Regardless of the gangs size.
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Janis Kallisti
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Posted - 2008.07.10 21:31:00 -
[24]
I was actually looking into training for this ship with similar semi-combat sentiment. However, won't repping at distance negate ACs? Harder to fit Art makes more sense, but is it just TOO difficult to fit?
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Rixsta
0utbreak
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Posted - 2008.07.10 22:19:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Rixsta on 10/07/2008 22:20:37 Think i use something along the lines of:
3x Large S95A 1x Small unstable neut
1x 10mn Mwd II 1x LSE II 3x Cap Recharger II
3x PDU II 1x Nanofiber II
2x Aux rigs
Can perma run 1 large transporter and MWD iirc, and all 3 (without mwd) for a fair amount of time with logistics IV, tops out at 3.5km/s and keeps up with nano gangs no problem at all with no speed implants, if you added them and polycarbs i can imagine you can get it over 4km/s easy. -------------------------------
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