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Ekrid
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:16:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Ekrid on 10/07/2008 04:19:01 they have less DPS than intys, and get hit much more. I suggest this to make them better at least doing DPS.
add a ship special bonus of 90% PG use reduction for heavy assault launchers.
Also, all assault ships should get 2 more hardpoints of the launcher variety.
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:18:00 -
[2]
they have less dps than intys?
Are you SUUUURE about this? You don't want to look dumb now, do you? --
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Ekrid
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:22:00 -
[3]
yeah, look at retribution and crusader, same amount of bonus to damage and turret points, but the crusader has better tracking.
better tracking = better hits = better damage.
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Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:28:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Ekrid yeah, look at retribution and crusader, same amount of bonus to damage and turret points, but the crusader has better tracking.
better tracking = better hits = better damage.
Yes, but generally they're going pretty fast, and that kind of throws things off there.
If you fit them for gank, you might have a point here, but generally combat inties are built for speed - if they weren't, they'd have practically no defenses.
Now, that being said, do the AFs need a buff? Yes. What about a real role? Yes. Fourth bonus? Damn straight.
Click me! You know you want to... |
TK 732
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:46:00 -
[5]
Enyo and Ishkur can get around 250, while the Taranis can get 235.
I'll take the taranis please.
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DubanFP
Caldari Four Rings Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.07.10 04:50:00 -
[6]
Edited by: DubanFP on 10/07/2008 04:52:36 EFT whoring for the win!! There are a lot more to EVE then pure DPS you know. Webifiers for example. Show me a ceptor that fights at close range without heavy fire support and i'll show you a ship that's headed for certain disaster. Actually fly a ship, well, before you judge it. _______________
CCP Atropos > I pod people because there's money to be made in selling tears. |
Dantes Revenge
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Posted - 2008.07.10 05:38:00 -
[7]
Originally by: DubanFP Edited by: DubanFP on 10/07/2008 04:52:36 EFT whoring for the win!! There are a lot more to EVE then pure DPS you know. Webifiers for example. Show me a ceptor that fights at close range without heavy fire support and i'll show you a ship that's headed for certain disaster. Actually fly a ship, well, before you judge it.
True.
IMO, a web/scram range bonus to all ceptors would be more useful than the DPS/tracking bonus some have. It would allow them to be tacklers as a primary job becausse they could then stay out of range of the target ships webbers. Honestly, what point is there in having a tracking bonus on a ship that's dead once it gets webbed?
( I notice you used the quote in your sig then). -- There's a simple difference between kinky and perverted. Kinky is using a feather to get her in the mood. Perverted is using the whole chicken. |
Kano Sekor
Amarr Viziam
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Posted - 2008.07.10 07:19:00 -
[8]
ive said it before and i say it again boost their damage and boost their resistances so that they are slightly better than cruisers dps-wise or tank-wise (in EHP).
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr Naval Protection Corp Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.07.10 07:19:00 -
[9]
Yes, let's put this thread in general discussion instead of game development / features and ideas!
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MenanceWhite
Amarr Red Light Navy
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Posted - 2008.07.10 08:01:00 -
[10]
Edited by: MenanceWhite on 10/07/2008 08:02:56
Originally by: DubanFP Edited by: DubanFP on 10/07/2008 04:52:36 EFT whoring for the win!! There are a lot more to EVE then pure DPS you know. Webifiers for example. Show me a ceptor that fights at close range without heavy fire support and i'll show you a ship that's headed for certain disaster. Actually fly a ship, well, before you judge it.
Well fighting and fighting- depending on modules, I can tell that if the enemy is cruiser or larger it won't be an problem even if they fit web.
Just manually fly closer to make yourself harder to track. Besides, perma mwd ceptors can still move around at speeds faster than 1km/s when webbed depending on web and fit. It's been done, I've seen rifters pop cruisers even after getting webbed by manually flying even closer.
Assault ships are still broken as always - more expensive, uninsureable, equal speed, lower DPS, worse tank compared to cruisers. This is not exactly the first time its mentioned. ---
Originally by: Torfi There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses
Originally by: Oveur
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Ch Tang
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Posted - 2008.07.10 08:12:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Ch Tang on 10/07/2008 08:13:17 With just kicking around an idea, how about just doubling the structure on AFs?
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Gimpb
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Posted - 2008.07.10 11:09:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Gimpb on 10/07/2008 11:11:26
Originally by: TK 732 Enyo and Ishkur can get around 250, while the Taranis can get 235.
I'll take the taranis please.
The enyo and ishkur can get considerably higher than that without fancy gear, but the ranis is still probably the best "assault ship" *cough* out there because it's actually fast enough to pick fights, it has a decent buffer, and its dps is plenty.
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baltec1
Antares Shipyards
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Posted - 2008.07.10 11:15:00 -
[13]
I have been able to tank ishtars a few times in my retribution. On Singularity I even managed to tank a carrier, how I have no idea but I held out for 10 min before I got webbed.
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Tamia Clant
New Dawn Corp New Eden Research
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Posted - 2008.07.10 11:15:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ch Tang Edited by: Ch Tang on 10/07/2008 08:13:17 With just kicking around an idea, how about just doubling the structure on AFs?
When a ship gets to structure, its fate is pretty much sealed.
Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
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Snow Banshee
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Posted - 2008.07.10 11:28:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ekrid yeah, look at retribution and crusader, same amount of bonus to damage and turret points, but the crusader has better tracking.
better tracking = better hits = better damage.
While i agree that AF sucks, i have to tell you that you have no idea how to judge a ship.
Ok,both have 4 turret slots and 1 damage bonus, but you ever considered that you need CPU/Powercore to activate them? :) Give me a valid crusader setup with medium pulses II ( or even worse: medium beams II ), and then i will say that you are right.
Ah, forgot, "Of course the crusader have also 5 low slots ( for damage mods)"
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Prometheus Exenthal
Dirty Deeds Corp.
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Posted - 2008.07.10 11:32:00 -
[16]
Don't even start with the whole "Taranis does more dps therefore better" thing. Enyo can do just as much dps, difference being that it can actually LIVE if someone looks at it funny.
I don't know about you, but I've never seen a Taranis tank very much. Especially not a battleship.
With that over with, AFs make really good anti-support platforms. They can tank numerous interceptors and kill them while doing so. In fact, afaik the only AF that really really blows for this purpose would be the vengeance since it has zero range and javs are slow as hell. Even a Hawk with missile explosion/velocity rigs can hit polycarb'd interceptors (only just).
Yes, AFs need their fix. No, your suggestion is not it.
FRIGANK |
Des Garcons
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Posted - 2008.07.10 12:05:00 -
[17]
instead of buffing AF they should just nerf all other ships in the game till AF are comparable!
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Tristel
Gallente Hematite Rose Bionic Dawn
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Posted - 2008.07.10 12:14:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Tamia Clant
Originally by: Ch Tang Edited by: Ch Tang on 10/07/2008 08:13:17 With just kicking around an idea, how about just doubling the structure on AFs?
When a ship gets to structure, its fate is pretty much sealed.
I see you don't fly a Taranis with a DCU.
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Kano Sekor
Amarr Viziam
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Posted - 2008.07.10 12:21:00 -
[19]
Best frigsized ratter for me is the ishkur 3 x Railguns with a RR to remote rep my drones so ill never lose a single one... my cute little drones <3 <3...
but seriously i like to be able to rep my drones keeps me from going to station to take drones from my cargo to my dronebay and god forbid having to buy new drones... cause my current drones have sentimental values.
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Dheorl
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.10 12:39:00 -
[20]
If AF's could permarun a MWD and a 20km point I would fly them every day and nothing but them. I don't see this as taking away the inty's role in any way because intys are great for first points, AF's can then act as heavy tacklers and bash it out if the intys have to bail.
As it is though, it's very hard to permarun a MWD and point on most of the AF's whilst still maintaining a reasonable setup.
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Ch Tang
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Posted - 2008.07.10 12:45:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Tamia Clant
Originally by: Ch Tang Edited by: Ch Tang on 10/07/2008 08:13:17 With just kicking around an idea, how about just doubling the structure on AFs?
When a ship gets to structure, its fate is pretty much sealed.
True. However, with a DC2 and say CCP created some structure rigs to increase base resistance.
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Crellion
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.07.10 15:02:00 -
[22]
Ummm call me stupid but I think if you were to give them a 4th bonus of 20% per level to tracking of their weapons and a special AF ability of 200% to range you would make them the anti ceptor anti nano anti anything that speed tanks that they were always supposed to be.
Those that allready have one of those bonuses could have that changed to 5% dmg or rof.
Essentially we would still be talking about 100-200dps boats (well 50 for Hawk lol) but with the accuracy and range to apply that DPS on everything. Their speed becomes (fairly) irrelevant, they have a role they are very good at and you will see once again swarms of inties and AFs pairing together to roam :)
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
DubanFP
Caldari Four Rings Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.07.10 15:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: MenanceWhite [Just manually fly closer to make yourself harder to track. Besides, perma mwd ceptors can still move around at speeds faster than 1km/s when webbed depending on web and fit. It's been done, I've seen rifters pop cruisers even after getting webbed by manually flying even closer.
Again with the EFTage. There is no such thing as 1 v 1 in EVE. You completely ignored the fact that going 1km/s webbed cost you a small fortune for a ship that's so vulnerable to ganks. Hell going 1km/s, which is generous if anything, will mean you're screwed the second 2-3 of his friends come by. It's not like you'll be able to run without killing your transversal and even then it'll take a good 10 seconds to escape web range. Look any ceptor that fights at close range is begging for disaster. _______________
CCP Atropos > I pod people because there's money to be made in selling tears. |
Cybele Lanier
Amarr The Graduates
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Posted - 2008.07.10 15:47:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ekrid Edited by: Ekrid on 10/07/2008 04:19:01 they have less DPS than intys, and get hit much more. I suggest this to make them better at least doing DPS.
add a ship special bonus of 90% PG use reduction for heavy assault launchers.
Also, all assault ships should get 2 more hardpoints of the launcher variety.
Sucks to be a Harpy pilot, huh?
AF's don't need a single "role", they just need improving in general at what they do now. All of their big brothers, the HAC's, work in very different ways but they're popular because whatever they do, they're usually pretty good at it. --------------- ""Minimum collateral damage" and "Entire star system" do not belong in the same sentence." |
Arvald
Caldari Aurora Acclivitous Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2008.07.10 15:54:00 -
[25]
hehe yes less dps than an inty , i push nearly 300 dps with my enyo and have easily taken on battlecruisers with it
Originally by: Xanos Blackpaw Stealthbomber combat (or as i like to call it: Just because you are paranoid don't mean there isnt a invisible demon about to eat your face) |
Dysthyme
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Posted - 2008.07.10 16:29:00 -
[26]
how do you reach 300 ? - pelase tell me about that fitting.
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.10 16:38:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Dysthyme how do you reach 300 ? - pelase tell me about that fitting.
my guess: all damage relevant skills at 5, hybrid damage implants and 2, maybe 3 damage mods with T2 neutrons with faction AM. ---
Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
Arvald
Caldari Aurora Acclivitous Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2008.07.10 16:48:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Arvald on 10/07/2008 16:48:26
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: Dysthyme how do you reach 300 ? - pelase tell me about that fitting.
my guess: all damage relevant skills at 5, hybrid damage implants and 2, maybe 3 damage mods with T2 neutrons with faction AM.
t2 mag stabs and neutrons good skills +5% hardwirings
Originally by: Xanos Blackpaw Stealthbomber combat (or as i like to call it: Just because you are paranoid don't mean there isnt a invisible demon about to eat your face) |
d3vo
The Space BorderLine Diabolic Paradox
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Posted - 2008.07.10 18:28:00 -
[29]
Edited by: d3vo on 10/07/2008 18:31:02
Originally by: Ekrid yeah, look at retribution and crusader, same amount of bonus to damage and turret points, but the crusader has better tracking.
better tracking = better hits = better damage.
who flys a crusader with medium pulses? then again, who flys a retribution with dual light pulses?
get outta here...
you cannot compare intys with af's because af's tank much better __________ -_- |
Prometheus Exenthal
Dirty Deeds Corp.
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Posted - 2008.07.10 18:31:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Dheorl If AF's could permarun a MWD and a 20km point I would fly them every day and nothing but them.
Then you would die very very fast.
As for 300dps Enyo: 2 mfs, 4 neutrons, rocket 2, collision rig, hob2.
FRIGANK |
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