EVE Search - Battle Barges

Joe Risalo wrote:

This is true on the dps and bs guns aspect, however, these ships would have enough tank to hold out against an alpha attack in high sec with their tank. In low sec they're designed more for fleets, in which case you would have several of them scattered around the belt, thus if a cruiser or frig is trying to take one down by getting in close range, the other ships will be at optimal. In null sec it's either designed for fleets, or for solo security against rats.

Another way you could fix these ships is by making them similar to bombers. They all fit heavy missiles because they're the most effective weapons, but they're limited by only having a bonus towards their racial missile type, the same way you see with bombers. So Gallente get therm, minmatar get exp, Caldari get kinetic, and Amarr get em.
While this will buff them by giving them better range limitations, it balances that by limiting their damage type.
If I were to design one of these ships, I'd probably fit heavy missiles on it.

Now, as far as having 300 dps...Well, while that might be easily tanked by a battlecruiser, could a battlecruiser tank 300 dps from 5 different ships?

So again, these ships are mostly designed for fleet situations, so that the fleet can have more security, but they are reasonably usable for solo mining.

My other thought though, would be to make some type of drone boat/tanked exhumers. Lower hold, lower yield, much more tank, and able to field a full fleet of heavy drones. A fleet of drones isn't that much dps, expecially if you're not in a domi with the bonuses, but if you have a full fleet of each drone type (light, med, heavy, sentry) then you'd be pretty set to defend yourself and wouldn't be too limited. So, less yield than a covetor, less hold (maybe 3k base?), 125 bw for drones, 400m3 drone bay, and bonuses for drones, yield, and tank...

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Joe Risalo State War Academy Caldari State 200	Posted - 2012.03.15 22:08:00 - [1] - Quote Perhaps the factions can come out with faction deep space mining vessels. Here me out here. So, due to the unrelenting agression faced in deep space, and the negative nature towards industrialists that are currently plaguing the Eve universe, one of the factions descided to begin construction and testing of a more secure mining vessel than what ORE was currently providing. However, through spying and other means, the other factions cought on to the idea, and a race began for each faction to create a deep space mining vessel. Due to the rights that ORE had on their designs and the immense amount of time creating an entirely new vessel would take, the factions decided to modify existing combat platforms of their own fleets. The outcome was an entirely new line of what used to be considered battleship class vessels. They were dubbed "Battle Barges". Unlike mining barges and exhumers, their cargoholds weren't as large, and they didn't yield as much precisious ores, but the factions had designed them to not only mine, but to tank and defend themselves against rats and pod pilots alike. new skill Racial Battle Barge (each faction has a skill) Requires Mining barges lvl 5, racial battleship lvl 3. They're an alternate t2 battleship, but since they're not specifically battleships, they don't require bs 5. They're also based off the tier 3 battleship hulls. Each ship has a reduction bonus allowing them to fit strip miners, ice harvesters, deep core miners, and gas harvesters. They have 3 slots available specifically for mining, to which standard turrets and launchers cannot be fitted. Each lvl of mining barges gives a bonus towards yield. Each lvl of racial specific bs gives a bonus towards damage and tracking of turrets/launchers. Each lvl of battle barge increases resistances. The ships will be using racial guns, but will also recieve a bonus towards "racial" drones. They don't have a lot of dps, but they can defend themselves and they are a good bit tanky. Each ship has a set amount of cargohold, which can only be increased with cargo rigs or expanded cargoholds. Someone else can figure the slot layouts for these things, but I was thinking 3 for mining, 4 for turrets/launchers. They're not bonused towards dps like a marauder or pirate bs, but sufficient enough dps to eliminate pesky rats. Now, these fit well because ORE doesn't design heavy ships, just simple industrial ships for more secure areas. So it would be up to the factions to design industrial ships for hostile envornments, and they wouldn't take the time to design a completely new ship. Now, how they fit in the balance world is that they're limited to racial specific defenses and weaponry. While they do fit 3 miners, they don't mine near as much as exhumers, and probably less yield than even a Covetor, but not by a whole lot. However, they make up for the lack of yield and cargohold with added defense and offense. They're not stacked in a way that they can go out pvp'ing, or even running complexes, but they are capable of taking care of themselves. Since they're t2 ships, and since they're battleships, they'll also be more costly than an exhumer( I would put them in the 300-400 mil range), but their risk vs reward factor would payoff, expecially since they have the versatility to be able to mine anything. Like I said, someone else can figure out their fits, holds, and whatever else, but I feel that these would be a very welcome site in eve, however, they wouldn't be as cost effective for a high sec miner, so exhumers would still be much more popular in high sec. These would be great for low sec mining fleets, null sec mining fleets and null sec solo mining, but would also preform quite well in wh space mining, solo and fleeted. Like I said though, due to their smaller holds, lower yield, over compensation in tank and dps, and their costs, they wouldn't be too popular for most high sec miners. They would be able to make much more money buying a hulk for less isk and better yield, So it balances things out.
Nikk Narrel Infinite Improbability Inc Mordus Angels 169	Posted - 2012.03.15 22:16:00 - [2] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Like I said though, due to their smaller holds, lower yield, over compensation in tank and dps, and their costs, they wouldn't be too popular for most high sec miners. They would be able to make much more money buying a hulk for less isk and better yield, So it balances things out. See... that's a funny thing, in a way. People might expect this to be bigger in low or null. I expect it to be just as big in high, if not more so. In null, if you go into someone's sov space uninvited, a welcoming committee with gift baskets can be surprisingly quick to greet you. They usually bring fireworks, even. Perverse as it sounds, high sec can be more risky for miners.... go figure.
Joe Risalo State War Academy Caldari State 200	Posted - 2012.03.15 22:23:00 - [3] - Quote Nikk Narrel wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: Like I said though, due to their smaller holds, lower yield, over compensation in tank and dps, and their costs, they wouldn't be too popular for most high sec miners. They would be able to make much more money buying a hulk for less isk and better yield, So it balances things out. See... that's a funny thing, in a way. People might expect this to be bigger in low or null. I expect it to be just as big in high, if not more so. In null, if you go into someone's sov space uninvited, a welcoming committee with gift baskets can be surprisingly quick to greet you. They usually bring fireworks, even. Perverse as it sounds, high sec can be more risky for miners.... go figure. This is true, however, you don't have to battle with rats flying bs's in high sec. It's pretty easy to dodge a hulk loss in high sec as long as you're aligned and jumping out any time something threatening shows up. However, in null sec, even though you might not have to worry as much about pirates, you have to worry much more about rats, and the occational cloaky pirate. Ultimately, these can still be usable in high sec, they just wouldn't be ask cost effective in high sec. Not to mention, if you want greater payout in high sec, you're gonna have to take a little more risk.
Fredfredbug4 Kings of Kill EVE Animal Control 100	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:24:00 - [4] - Quote ORE stands for "Outer Rim Excavations". Their ships are already designed to be used in the areas on the very edge of the galaxy, far from Hi-sec. There are a few problems with your suggestion. 1. This ship has guns, which means that it can mine AND rat at the same time. There is no ship in EVE that can do two active methods of making money at the same time and it should stay that way. 2. If you've ever been to low/null you would very well know that if you attempt to mine in a system that you and your corp don't have almost total control over, then you are going to get killed rather quickly. Especially if you are by yourself. In order to effectively mine in low and null you would need some form of outside protection, in that case this ship would be redundant, you would be better off in a hulk where you can mine more and have much more GTFO capability than a battleship. 3. Smaller cargo holds don't really matter as any decent low/null mining op will have at least one person dedicated to hauling the ore consistently which renders the smaller cargo holds a non issue. 4. A tech 2 battleship should require battleship 5 like any other tech 2 battleship. And all the tech 2 battleships are not battleships hence why they are tech 2. Mauraders are meant to be battleships on steroids and black ops ships are for super harrassment. They both require battleship 5. 5. Why would someone pay that much money for a ship when they can just join a nullsec corp that is strong enough to keep a system mostly secure (sov or no sov) while they use regular exhumers and not lose yield?
Tarn Kugisa Modern Mining Industries Space Mongolians 38	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:29:00 - [5] - Quote Fredfredbug4 wrote: 1. This ship has guns, which means that it can mine AND rat at the same time. There is no ship in EVE that can do two active methods of making money at the same time and it should stay that way. Rokh with 5 guns and 3 mining lasers I beg to differ Real Caldari Hull Tank (And Win doing so) Support https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16580
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 281	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:49:00 - [6] - Quote What advantage would this have over, say, a mining BS with a decent drone bay? The drones deal with the rats while the ship mines, and has plenty of tank.
Joe Risalo State War Academy Caldari State 200	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:51:00 - [7] - Quote Fredfredbug4 wrote: ORE stands for "Outer Rim Excavations". Their ships are already designed to be used in the areas on the very edge of the galaxy, far from Hi-sec. There are a few problems with your suggestion. 1. This ship has guns, which means that it can mine AND rat at the same time. There is no ship in EVE that can do two active methods of making money at the same time and it should stay that way. 2. If you've ever been to low/null you would very well know that if you attempt to mine in a system that you and your corp don't have almost total control over, then you are going to get killed rather quickly. Especially if you are by yourself. In order to effectively mine in low and null you would need some form of outside protection, in that case this ship would be redundant, you would be better off in a hulk where you can mine more and have much more GTFO capability than a battleship. 3. Smaller cargo holds don't really matter as any decent low/null mining op will have at least one person dedicated to hauling the ore consistently which renders the smaller cargo holds a non issue. 4. A tech 2 battleship should require battleship 5 like any other tech 2 battleship. And all the tech 2 battleships are not battleships hence why they are tech 2. Mauraders are meant to be battleships on steroids and black ops ships are for super harrassment. They both require battleship 5. 5. Why would someone pay that much money for a ship when they can just join a nullsec corp that is strong enough to keep a system mostly secure (sov or no sov) while they use regular exhumers and not lose yield? 1) low dps, like 3-400 dps, so not very effective at ratting, you could make much more ratting in something else, or mining in an exhumer. 2) It's not about being secure in someone else's system, it's about ensuring security in your own mining ops anywhere. 3) exactly, they don't matter when you're fleet mining, but this would make solo mining in low/null/wh space a possibility, but with a draw back. 4) It's not really a battleship, it's just a battleship class hull. It doesn't require battleships 5 because it's more of an exhumer with guns. The only reason it even requires bs 3 is because the hull that it's using, plus it gets damage bonuses from the battleships skill. 5) I've been in a null sec alliance and being able to solo mine at all was non-existant due to rats..Hell, even mining with 2 characters wasn't that effective cause one of them had to have a gun ship. So with this ship you'd be able to use the other account as an orca or hauler of sorts.
Joe Risalo State War Academy Caldari State 200	Posted - 2012.03.16 00:53:00 - [8] - Quote Danika Princip wrote: What advantage would this have over, say, a mining BS with a decent drone bay? The drones deal with the rats while the ship mines, and has plenty of tank. Well, it can use strip miners, deep core miners, ice harvesters, and gas harvesters for one. Not to mention the guns would be more of a deterant to pirates. Also, there are a lot of high sec miners that might venture out into low sec for mining ops if they had these because they would have much more security, because they typically wouldn't have enough people for mining and security.
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 283	Posted - 2012.03.16 12:47:00 - [9] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Danika Princip wrote: What advantage would this have over, say, a mining BS with a decent drone bay? The drones deal with the rats while the ship mines, and has plenty of tank. Well, it can use strip miners, deep core miners, ice harvesters, and gas harvesters for one. Not to mention the guns would be more of a deterant to pirates. Also, there are a lot of high sec miners that might venture out into low sec for mining ops if they had these because they would have much more security, because they typically wouldn't have enough people for mining and security. The guns won't deter anyone. 3-400 DPS can be tanked in a cheap battlecruiser easily. Since they're BS guns, you'll get lolmails of these dying to solo frigates and cruisers. Using a covetor as a base, you're looking at what, 12-1400 ore/minute? So not more than a hulk, but damn close. Hulk output, BS tank and guns? Don't you think that's a little bit over the top? Also, I thought it was relatively easy to fit a hulk that would tank 0.0 BS rats? That's what I've been told by members of my corp anyway.
Momoyo Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension 9	Posted - 2012.03.16 13:20:00 - [10] - Quote The 4 faction dont really bother with industrials that is what ORE. Any new indy should be made by them, beside there would be no point in 4 varieties of a mining ship. Im still holding out fir the ORE T3 barge. Give me that before any mining hull based on a BS. I mean really any mining hull designed to tank and defend itself would need to mine more than a retriever but less than a hulk or covetor.....which the current BS hulls can do with t2 mining lasers with crystals sooooo a "battle barge" is kind of pointless.

Velicitia Open Designs 799	Posted - 2012.03.16 13:31:00 - [11] - Quote Danika Princip wrote: Also, I thought it was relatively easy to fit a hulk that would tank 0.0 BS rats? That's what I've been told by members of my corp anyway. it's quite easy. Halada put one in the mining guide even. It's a bit pricey (Gistii modules...) but it gets the job done. Thing is, it's an active tank ... so while it's good for rats, with their low alpha/DPS; it is terrible against "good" players (though I have tanked younger toons who don't have good skills with the fit).
Momoyo Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension 9	Posted - 2012.03.16 13:44:00 - [12] - Quote Also to elaborate a bit on simply using the current BS for mining, atm you kinda need to dec out all your highs with mining lazors to beat out retriever yield (and you get close to covs really). If mining lazors were simply modified to have higher yield and made similar to gas harvesters (Mining V would allow you to use 5 mining lazors) that would free 3 turret slots for guns which should be plenty, anything over that would be over kill on a mining vessel. Also special cargo expanders for BS would help with the cargo hold. This would be way simpler and make more sense than coming out with new t2 BS hulls for mining.
Joe Risalo State War Academy Caldari State 200	Posted - 2012.03.16 18:05:00 - [13] - Quote Danika Princip wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: Danika Princip wrote: What advantage would this have over, say, a mining BS with a decent drone bay? The drones deal with the rats while the ship mines, and has plenty of tank. Well, it can use strip miners, deep core miners, ice harvesters, and gas harvesters for one. Not to mention the guns would be more of a deterant to pirates. Also, there are a lot of high sec miners that might venture out into low sec for mining ops if they had these because they would have much more security, because they typically wouldn't have enough people for mining and security. The guns won't deter anyone. 3-400 DPS can be tanked in a cheap battlecruiser easily. Since they're BS guns, you'll get lolmails of these dying to solo frigates and cruisers. Using a covetor as a base, you're looking at what, 12-1400 ore/minute? So not more than a hulk, but damn close. Hulk output, BS tank and guns? Don't you think that's a little bit over the top? Also, I thought it was relatively easy to fit a hulk that would tank 0.0 BS rats? That's what I've been told by members of my corp anyway. This is true on the dps and bs guns aspect, however, these ships would have enough tank to hold out against an alpha attack in high sec with their tank. In low sec they're designed more for fleets, in which case you would have several of them scattered around the belt, thus if a cruiser or frig is trying to take one down by getting in close range, the other ships will be at optimal. In null sec it's either designed for fleets, or for solo security against rats. Another way you could fix these ships is by making them similar to bombers. They all fit heavy missiles because they're the most effective weapons, but they're limited by only having a bonus towards their racial missile type, the same way you see with bombers. So Gallente get therm, minmatar get exp, Caldari get kinetic, and Amarr get em. While this will buff them by giving them better range limitations, it balances that by limiting their damage type. If I were to design one of these ships, I'd probably fit heavy missiles on it. Now, as far as having 300 dps...Well, while that might be easily tanked by a battlecruiser, could a battlecruiser tank 300 dps from 5 different ships? So again, these ships are mostly designed for fleet situations, so that the fleet can have more security, but they are reasonably usable for solo mining. My other thought though, would be to make some type of drone boat/tanked exhumers. Lower hold, lower yield, much more tank, and able to field a full fleet of heavy drones. A fleet of drones isn't that much dps, expecially if you're not in a domi with the bonuses, but if you have a full fleet of each drone type (light, med, heavy, sentry) then you'd be pretty set to defend yourself and wouldn't be too limited. So, less yield than a covetor, less hold (maybe 3k base?), 125 bw for drones, 400m3 drone bay, and bonuses for drones, yield, and tank...
Miss Whippy Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic 113	Posted - 2012.03.16 18:23:00 - [14] - Quote I don't think this is really necessary. We just need Exhumers to more resilient. Time to-aCOMPLETELY REDESIGN THE U.I. FROM SCRATCH: - End the click fest & Multiple Window fest - Streamline and Simplify it-a - Improve scalability-a
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 284	Posted - 2012.03.16 19:51:00 - [15] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: This is true on the dps and bs guns aspect, however, these ships would have enough tank to hold out against an alpha attack in high sec with their tank. In low sec they're designed more for fleets, in which case you would have several of them scattered around the belt, thus if a cruiser or frig is trying to take one down by getting in close range, the other ships will be at optimal. In null sec it's either designed for fleets, or for solo security against rats. Another way you could fix these ships is by making them similar to bombers. They all fit heavy missiles because they're the most effective weapons, but they're limited by only having a bonus towards their racial missile type, the same way you see with bombers. So Gallente get therm, minmatar get exp, Caldari get kinetic, and Amarr get em. While this will buff them by giving them better range limitations, it balances that by limiting their damage type. If I were to design one of these ships, I'd probably fit heavy missiles on it. Now, as far as having 300 dps...Well, while that might be easily tanked by a battlecruiser, could a battlecruiser tank 300 dps from 5 different ships? So again, these ships are mostly designed for fleet situations, so that the fleet can have more security, but they are reasonably usable for solo mining. My other thought though, would be to make some type of drone boat/tanked exhumers. Lower hold, lower yield, much more tank, and able to field a full fleet of heavy drones. A fleet of drones isn't that much dps, expecially if you're not in a domi with the bonuses, but if you have a full fleet of each drone type (light, med, heavy, sentry) then you'd be pretty set to defend yourself and wouldn't be too limited. So, less yield than a covetor, less hold (maybe 3k base?), 125 bw for drones, 400m3 drone bay, and bonuses for drones, yield, and tank... If it's designed for a fleet, just use hulks and get better yield, with a guy in a combat ship to deal with the rats. The ONLY thing these would ever be used for would be highsec mining bots. Hulks can already deal with 0.0 rats, anyone stupid enough to mine in null or low while they have hostiles in system is asking for what they get. Also, bombers don't fit heavy missiles. Those are cruiser sized weapons.
Momoyo Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension 11	Posted - 2012.03.16 20:15:00 - [16] - Quote Ok a Cov yield is 1250/minute max. A Mining Rohk yield is 950/minute which is 100 more than a retriever with 74k ehp(you can get it to 1050 if you sacrafice a bit of tank. If you drop three mining lazors and fit blasters you get about 300 dps with drones. So to make a "battle barge" All you need is to Change Mining lazors to be more like gas harvesters. 5 max with a higher yield each. Also a cargo expander designed for BS could be made to give them a bit extra cargo (rohk is 2500 with rigs and 4 cargo expanders) The other BS have a bit of a hard time doing a good mining fit since they have less cpu. Maybe change cpu requirements for mining lazors. Also this would give frigs and cruisers slightly better yield to help out new players.
tankus2 HeartVenom Inc. 38	Posted - 2012.03.16 22:50:00 - [17] - Quote not as well-received as I imagined, but at least its getting refined, polished, as well as getting stuffing all over it. My thoughts? yes give it strips, but give it either three extra highs with missiles only (minmatar/caldari) and bonuses for torpedos OR give it a heafty dronebay (gallente/amarr) and bonuses for sentry drones. Reason for torps is straightforward: they can't hit small stuff worth a damn which means unless they either bring a lot of small stuff or they (gankers) are guaranteed to lose a few ships before CONCORD does their thing, and losing a ship before they're done with their task is a bad thing. Sentries are along the same lines: they can't hit small stuff very well due to poor tracking, though have range and damage to deal with bigger targets. For both forms of defense, I'd suggest a 100% bonus to damage but a -25% to tracking (sentries) and -25%? explosion velocity (torps) to further encourage anti-big stuff yet vulnerability to small targets. Where the science gets done
Ardamalis Vanguard Corp Bounty Hunters 46	Posted - 2012.03.17 07:14:00 - [18] - Quote Imo, miners should have the ability to use mining lasers as low-dps makeshift weapons when activated on other ships. A good balance point would be to have about 8 to 10 various mining ships be enough to fend off a single lone battleship. Would make for some lulz killmails. Additionally, anyone who is killing ratts in a belt with his or her mining lasers can't technically mine at the same time. With the above in mind: A battle hulk ship hull is probably not necessary; however, I will say that if one were to be introduced, it should be a faction variant of the original with just simply bonuses to mining laser damage but with a small role penalty for mining laser yield.
Fronkfurter McSheebleton Squirrel Horde Habitat Against Humanity 75	Posted - 2012.03.17 08:43:00 - [19] - Quote If you're in a low/null mining fleet, you should have at least one Rorqual around. Those are a great deterrent to most smaller gangs, as it can effectively engage most any class of subcap by using different drone sizes. Two of those can relatively easily hold off a gang of roaming battlecruisers. Also: Quote: [Typhoon Fleet Issue, mrat] Mining Laser Upgrade II Mining Laser Upgrade II Mining Laser Upgrade II Expanded Cargohold II Expanded Cargohold II Damage Control II Co-Processor II Co-Processor II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Large Shield Extender II Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal I Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal I Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal I Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal I Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal I Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Cruise Missile rigs to taste Garde II x5 Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5

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