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| Author |
Topic |
Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
    |
Posted - 2008.07.18 15:56:00 -
[91]
*laughs*
Keep the entertainment coming, everyone.
Click me! You know you want to... |
Andreus Ixiris
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 17:37:00 -
[92]
 Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien
Three whole paragraphs. My word.
You should be flattered, in a twisted kind of way - I only bother writing that much invective for people I really loathe, and Your Highness the unintentionally-self-proclaimed Queen of Really, Really Crazy is at least worthy of knowing exactly how much I dislike you. It can be summed up, however, in just six words: Blood cultist freaks need to die.
Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien
Like the stuff people find in the darkest recesses of the Federation, your mouth spews forth a vile and bitter mess, that slithers out onto the Summit and offends even the Gallente you try to stand proud for.
Karanth isn't really a Gallente I stand proud for. She's kind of like a more irritating and less directly dangerous version of you.
Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien
In the end, Mr Ixiris, you've proved my point. While your deviant mind twists around the difficulties you have with women, your endless claptrap continues regardless, for a whole THREE paragraphs.
I don't have difficulties with women in general. Just the crazy ones. See, I can keep up a nice conversation with Aria Jenneth without spouting invective, for the simple reason that she doesn't talk about exsanguinating people and using them as toys on a regular basis. I have a woman, Feyona, in my corporation and I'm able to deal with her amicably on both a professional and personal level. The only time I've ever really used gender as an insult was back during my Heretic Army days, but I was hazed to buggery on boosters anyway.
But this isn't about the fact that you're a woman. In fact, you being a woman means I actually withold certain insults that I would hurl were you male. My distaste for you and your conduct is not due to gender, or race. It's due to you and your conduct. The sad truth is, Ju'wien, that I'd still despise you were you a man, or an Amarrian, or a Caldari, or an Intaki. You're a criminally insane psychopath with tendencies edging disturbingly close to necrophilia. Were you my twin brother I'd still hate you (although I'd feel a darn sight more embarassed, all the time - I have the utmost pity for your sister, incidentally).
Basically, you laying my dislike of you on your gender is lying to yourself in a fairly blatant way. It's not because you're a woman - it's because you're crazier than two fried Fedo eggs in a blender full of Drop. With sprinkles.
Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien
She's asleep. She's been playing all day with her dolls.
That's far more information than I require - then again, I still prefer talking to her. I like it when our dialogue is simply terrifying, rather than terrifying and also irritating.
-----
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Dance Commander
Asuka Smith > not even goons can make 30m ISK this interesting. |
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 17:57:00 -
[93]
Mr Tarn-Hakatain, you practically make my own point for me. Many people go through traumatic events, and that will naturally shape who they are as a person. It will shape the kind of decisions they make. It may even influence them to make a different decision than they would have before tragedy in their lives.
That doesn't give other people the right to make decisions for them unless they are actually mentally incompetent - and most people who go through a traumatic event aren't. It might change them, but they are still human beings, and still capable of making well informed decisions on their own.
The cool down period isn't supposed to be long enough for people to totally forget, since as you say many - or most even - will likely never forget such terrible events. It is simply so they can get over the initial shock. This is at its basis a debate about whether people should be free to make decisions on their own - and have their free will - or not. I'm happy with the side I'm on. Are you, Mr Tarn-Hakatain?
Mr Ixiris. I was wondering what a suitable disposition for your corpse would be should we acquire it. I'm glad it is no longer a problem.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
Mebrithiel Ju'wien
Veto.
Veto Corp
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 18:15:00 -
[94]
You still don't get it.
I'm playing with you. Gender isn't an issue. Race isn't an issue. You being Andreus isn't an issue, although when she finds out, she might go in a mood with me.
You're just another walking or flying target. Sometimes you're a talkative walking target, but it's fun to do something other than shoot at you.
Anyway, now that your "wardec announcement" has become a four page laughing stock festival, I'll let ya hang.
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
I have the utmost pity for your sister, incidentally
I'm sure she appreciates it.
Good luck Izzy and co, but if you get his corpse before me, give me a bell.
Personal Library |
Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 18:33:00 -
[95]
Edited by: Stitcher on 18/07/2008 18:33:40
Originally by: Silver Night
This is at its basis a debate about whether people should be free to make decisions on their own - and have their free will - or not.
People have accused me in the past of being almost Gallente in my belief that people are entitled to have their opinion. What nobody has ever yet caught onto is the fact that I also believe that the people in charge are entitled to ignore said opinion if it is without merit.
Notice I said "people" and not "person". The person in charge is answerable only to people on his own rung of the ladder and above, not to those below. The whole concept of the CEP is founded upon that selfsame assumption. Of course, the term "ladder" implies a linear progression of rank, whereas the model actually works laterally as well, relying on the opinions of qualified consultants to assist in the decision-making process where the ranking individual lacks the appropriate knowledge to make an informed choice.
If I am the doctor, then I know:
- What the patient has.
- What the patient needs.
- When the patient is doing something stupid.
I don't believe for a second that people should be free to make a decision if somebody who knows better than they do says that it is a bad decision. In my considered medical opinion and that of several of my peers [references attached], applying for the implantation of a so-called "Happy Chip" is a bad idea. They cause mental addictive responses, behaviorally condition their users, permanently activate areas of the brain that are not designed to see constant activity, and artificially bypass psychological distress that is not then properly addressed and resolved, potentially leading to unidentified neuroses and psychoses further down the line.
-
Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 18:56:00 -
[96]
Edited by: Silver Night on 18/07/2008 18:58:31
Originally by: Stitcher
I don't believe for a second that people should be free to make a decision if somebody who knows better than they do says that it is a bad decision. In my considered medical opinion and that of several of my peers [references attached], applying for the implantation of a so-called "Happy Chip" is a bad idea. They cause mental addictive responses, behaviorally condition their users, permanently activate areas of the brain that are not designed to see constant activity, and artificially bypass psychological distress that is not then properly addressed and resolved, potentially leading to unidentified neuroses and psychoses further down the line.
We are not talking about someone with a broken leg deciding a jog is a good idea, nor someone with liver failure going out for a couple of rounds. This is a much more complex and personal issue than you would like it to be. As it happens, Mr Tarn-Hakatain, I used to work with Zainou and am something of an expert in the field, and I have my own team of experts and you and I and our respective experts can argue about who's right all day.
The difference is that you and your team have not even payed attention to the publicly available documentation on how the Happy Chip works, much less studied it as you claim.
For example, the Happy chip doesn't bypass emotional distress. As I'm sure you know - being an expert - human beings can experience more than one emotion at a time. These mixed emotional states are, in fact, far more common than feeling one 'pure' emotion. So if, for example, we take a victim of the Malkalen tragedy who has opted for the chip. They would no doubt still feel grief about the deaths of their loved ones. However they would also feel more optimistic about the future, and be prevented from sinking into a self destructive depressive apathy.
Many people self-medicate to catastrophic effect using drugs, boosters, or other forms of escape (such as gambling or war deccing Naqam) when they find they are unable to cope with events in their lives. The Chip helps people that would otherwise turn to such extremes by giving them a gentle boost in the right direction, allowing them to cope without becoming emotionally crippled.
Your behavioral conditioning tripe I'll just laugh at. The chip does nothing to directly modify behavior, nor does it, for example, use positive reinforcement to encourage some specific behavior. Your ignorance on the subject is really beginning to cast your supposed professional opinion in a rather negative light.
Finally, your concerns about overactive brain centers would certainly be true if the chip induced intense euphoria or the like. Luckily, it doesn't. A constant low level sense of happiness or contentment is actually achievable by some people naturally. The Chip is also not constantly active, there are times it doesn't have to be, including several hours a day when the user is asleep and low or no chip activity is needed. Additionally, we tested the chip extensively of course before starting sales.
Your conjecture that this could be harmful therefore, I'm happy to assure you, is purest fantasy.
Now, you can continue to try and twist the facts to represent your own prejudices, or you can just accept that you don't like Naqam because you don't like the Nation because your parents or supervisors told you we were the 'bad guys.' I mean, that I can certainly understand, I was in the same boat not too long ago before I learned that thinking for myself is more rewarding.
On a seperate issue, Ms Ju'wien, be assured that you will be the very first person we contact.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
IzzyChan
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 19:32:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Stitcher
I don't believe for a second that people should be free to make a decision if somebody who knows better than they do says that it is a bad decision.
Wow.
--------------------
Naqam
|
Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 19:46:00 -
[98]
Originally by: Silver Night
Your conjecture that this could be harmful therefore, I'm happy to assure you, is purest fantasy.
And I'm quite happy to disbelieve every word you're saying.
I have studied these thing, remember, and I claim, based on the observations of several of my respected peers, many of whom are far more expert in the field of neuroimplantation than I am, that the effects of your Happy Chips are massively more profound and invasive than you are making out.
You, of course, have the ulterior motive of wanting to sell the damn things, so it's only to be expected that you would exaggerate their (few) positive properties and wave away their negative consequences. I invite you to wonder for a second what my ulterior motive could be. I'm not a market competitor of yours, nor do I stand to lose anything from the presence of Happy Chips on the market, nor gain anything from their absence.
My motive is pure concern to curb what I view as being a form of "pretty" drug-running. I've heard junkies addicted to all sorts of mind-altering vices - some chemical, some technological -and the one thing they all have in common is that they were lured in by the assurance that their vice of choice was harmless, or even beneficial. Yours is a classic marketing strategy to sell people something that is bad, employed by drug dealers, back-alley implant engineers and even cult recruiters for generations.
ANY mechanism that artificially induces a state of mind that would not otherwise exist is morally questionable at best, intensity be damned. Your fedo gas about the chips not causing behavioural conditioning is insulting as well - your chips induce an artificial sensation of well-being and contentment. Stimulation of a pleasure response - be it through material reward, or through direct activation of the relative brain centers - is the classic reward for positive encouragement-based enticement-reward behavioural conditioning, and it works just as well on humans as it does on lab rats.
The stimulation does not have to be intense - all it has to do is convince people that following a certain course of action was the correct decision, and their future responses will follow that learned reflex. In this case, they are rewarded through direct neural stimulation for the action of listening to your propoganda about the chips. This prompts the creation of a Ledoir Reflex ((OOC: Pavlovian Response)), encouraging them to trust your judgment in future. Stimulus X correlates with positive result Y, therefore X will ALWAYS result in good things happening, therefore X is to be responded to in a certain way every time.
In this case, listening to your opinion made the Happy Chip come along, therefore any opinion you give in the future will (in their eyes) result in more good things happening. Their respect for your opinion is reinforced with time and repetition, until they unconditionally obey your every command - classic mind control or "brainwashing" technique. A little more subtle than old Sansha's direct neural overrides, but just as effective in controlling people, over time.
My certainty that the implantation of Happy Chips is just the first step in gaining control over people is further reinforced by the fact that you feel it necessary to ship your "safe harbour" refugees out to the Nation. That strikes me as an unnecessary step if you genuinely are out for their well-being.
-
Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Andreus Ixiris
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 20:10:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Silver Night
On a seperate issue, Ms Ju'wien, be assured that you will be the very first person we contact.
Does that mean you're actually going to fight us, rather than flee to Delve? 
-----
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Dance Commander
Asuka Smith > not even goons can make 30m ISK this interesting. |
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 20:27:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
Originally by: Silver Night
On a seperate issue, Ms Ju'wien, be assured that you will be the very first person we contact.
Does that mean you're actually going to fight us, rather than flee to Delve?
You mean are you important enough for us to bother leaving Delve to come to you and fight? Probably not. However if one of us should happen upon you and so acquire a corpse.
I would like, incidentally, to refer everyone to my comments earlier in this thread, specifically:
Originally by: Silver Night
Where to begin. Well, Naqam podder operations are minimal to non existent in the Federation.
So... If we leave Delve in the first place, you can look forward to a fight.
Or is this the first step in you declaring victory after no one shows up to your petty little war? You certainly aren't having an impact on our non-podder operations.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
|
Andreus Ixiris
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 20:34:00 -
[101]
Well if there's no capsuleers around to defend them, your operations in the Federation will be stamped out fairly effortlessly.
-----
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Dance Commander
Asuka Smith > not even goons can make 30m ISK this interesting. |
Heartstone
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 22:06:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
Well if there's no capsuleers around to defend them, your operations in the Federation will be stamped out fairly effortlessly.
Ah my dear Andreus you think too much of us I feel. Just because there are no capsuleers around to defend them the "puny mortals" are far from defenseless. Indeed whilst on planet leave I feel quite safe under the protection of the Star Fraction's personal bodyguards assigned to me. I entrust my wife's well being to the security forces of the Star Fraction on a daily basis as well with little fear for her.
Your presumption seems to indicate the belief that we transhumanist capusleers have grasped godhood and all who stand before us must tremble at our power. I think you may have forgotten exactly how the universe works my poor booster-fried federation sycophant. After all your own proud Gallente Federation Navy is almost entirely maned by non-capsuleer pilots much like the navies of the other core empires and the pilots of the fringe powers.
I suggest climbing down from your throne of wishes before you take a tumble you don't survive.
---
 |
Andreus Ixiris
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
|
Posted - 2008.07.18 23:30:00 -
[103]
And from whence, my dear anarchist, come the supply of NHB products, if the capsuleers do not bring them? It doesn't exactly seem like they're making them on-site. If the shipments are manned by conventional fleets, who's to stop me from shooting them down? You're right, I can't track down every single Naqam surface-based member and kill them - but neither can Naqam have their cake and eat it.
Someone has to transport the civilians for Safe Harbour and someone has to move the Happy Chips. And unless they plan to set up Safe Habour in Luminaire, they're going to have to move in space, and in space, without capsuleer support, they are mine. As for the planet-based ones... you do know what Orun does for a living, right?
-----
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Dance Commander
Asuka Smith > not even goons can make 30m ISK this interesting. |
Vikarion
Caldari
Onyx Syndicate
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 03:06:00 -
[104]
As I understand, NHB chips are moved through normal merchant channels, rather than through capsuleer trade corporations. Therefore, NHB chips may be aboard any non-capsuleer ship, from a Federation Navy Megathron providing "postal services" (yes, the Navy does often ship things as a way to generate side income - if the ship is heading that direction anyway, why not?) to civilian freighters.
Furthermore, the retail sale of the NHB has been abnormally high in the Federation, which means that most stores carrying implants also carry the NHB chip. The number of outfits selling NHB chips is innumerable.
From my analysis, the supply and provision of NHB happy chips is so diverse that the only hope of cutting off the flow of "happy chips" is by direct distruction of the Naqam factories in their home systems.
Good luck with that. 
--------
Burn The Heretic, Kill The Mutant, Purge The Unbeliever
Innocence Proves Nothing |
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 05:36:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Stitcher
The stimulation does not have to be intense - all it has to do is convince people that following a certain course of action was the correct decision, and their future responses will follow that learned reflex. In this case, they are rewarded through direct neural stimulation for the action of listening to your propoganda about the chips. This prompts the creation of a Ledoir Reflex ((OOC: Pavlovian Response)), encouraging them to trust your judgment in future. Stimulus X correlates with positive result Y, therefore X will ALWAYS result in good things happening, therefore X is to be responded to in a certain way every time.
In this case, listening to your opinion made the Happy Chip come along, therefore any opinion you give in the future will (in their eyes) result in more good things happening. Their respect for your opinion is reinforced with time and repetition, until they unconditionally obey your every command - classic mind control or "brainwashing" technique. A little more subtle than old Sansha's direct neural overrides, but just as effective in controlling people, over time.
My certainty that the implantation of Happy Chips is just the first step in gaining control over people is further reinforced by the fact that you feel it necessary to ship your "safe harbour" refugees out to the Nation. That strikes me as an unnecessary step if you genuinely are out for their well-being.
Well, I'm sure all of that would certainly be true, except you have once again failed to do proper research Mr Tarn-Hakatain.
A) The Chips are only very tenuously linked to Naqam in the advertising. The company that manufactures them is Naqam Heavy Bioindustries, which is most often represented with the acronym NHB. Additionally, the announcements emphasize the chip, rather than the company, and finally no mention of the Sansha way of life is made, even peripherally. Nor are any Naqam pilots or directors seen in the advertisements (the ones relayed here on Galnet being the exception since I posted them, but as I'll explain in a moment, this is irrelevant as well.)
B) The Chips are most utilized by low and middle class people. This is a demographic we were intentionally aiming for. However, even should demand be that high, there is no way a corporation the size of Naqam could produce enough chips for even .1% of the population. So, what would be the point? Well helping people to the degree we can. Of course, you see evil Sansha boogie men in every corner. The truth is, if we wanted the chips to have some sort of evil ulterior motive, we would either have to target influential people (who don't need them and have access to the much more potent and customizable TCMCs if they wish) or we would have to be able to produce them for a reasonable percentage of the population. Neither of these are true. The only remaining motivation - helping people who are unhappy - is the truth, regardless of how difficult it is for you to accept it.
C)The entire point of the Safe Harbor program is that it gives people a place to live outside the Empires. Where do you want them to go? Syndicate? Curse? Fountain? Don't be absurd.
Actually the vast majority go to Esoteria. There are still a lot of planets with partial infrastructure, already terraformed to the needed degree, and devoid of people. It is perfect. I also admit to the ulterior motive, openly discussed nearly constantly, of wanting to help build the Nation into something better. This isn't something we hide, from the rest of the podder community or from new prospective residents. They are, in essence, re-colonizing these places with a head start granted them by Naqam and all the people, civilians in Esoteria, who gave their lives to Sansha's great mistake and the politics of the Empires.
So you caught us! We are guilty of wanting to help people, and also wanting to - in helping them - right one of histories great wrongs.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
Karanth
Gallente
Federal Defence Union
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 06:10:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Karanth on 19/07/2008 06:12:40
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
Originally by: Mebrithiel Ju'wien
Like the stuff people find in the darkest recesses of the Federation, your mouth spews forth a vile and bitter mess, that slithers out onto the Summit and offends even the Gallente you try to stand proud for.
Karanth isn't really a Gallente I stand proud for. She's kind of like a more irritating and less directly dangerous version of you.
...
How the hell did I end up being discussed here? And you, Mr. Ixiris. Why the hell are you wasting time playing with the spawn of Sanshas when, oh, I don't know, the CALDARI are trying to invade? I understand needing time off, but you have gone and blown this whole little thing out of proportion. Congratulations.
Also, if I've merely become irritating, I should sit down for an hour and slam out something vile. Hate to lose my "Minister of Death" title just because I didn't rail hard enough.
EDIT: Typo
|
Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 11:10:00 -
[107]
Edited by: Stitcher on 19/07/2008 11:10:17
Originally by: Silver Night
So you caught us! We are guilty of wanting to help people, and also wanting to - in helping them - right one of histories great wrongs.
Lies. You are guilty of wanting to control people in order to get them to rebuild a crumbled old pyramid on your behalf, with you and your corporation at its apex. Just as Sansha did, except your methods are more subtle and veiled by the illusion of benignity.
And you have the gall to accuse ME of denying people their right to a free will.
-
Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Ooyama
Caldari
Rastana CMP
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 11:23:00 -
[108]
As i'm quite certain that there will be a risk of loads of the below named "merchandise" available soon,, i'll not set price above 10000 Isk,, but all corpses brought to me, by Naqam-pilots, from a Ixiris-clone, will be bought instantly,,, i have some amusing experiments i wish to conduct,, regarding revival and methods (which might kill the subject) of controlling slaves,, and can see no higher amusement than to perform said tests on Mr Ixiris's clones.
In anticipation of contracts rolling in, regarding corpses,
Ooyama.
 |
Andreus Ixiris
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 11:35:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Karanth
How the hell did I end up being discussed here? And you, Mr. Ixiris. Why the hell are you wasting time playing with the spawn of Sanshas when, oh, I don't know, the CALDARI are trying to invade?
See, Karanth, this is your problem. You're utterly obsessed with the Caldari. I don't know if you've noticed, but the Caldari aren't making any progress in their invasion. They took one system before we got organised, but now they're getting mercilessly slapped down every time they try to contest a system. At the very worst we've stalemated them. And for the Gods sake, woman, not every Caldari is an evil monster, and not every Caldari civilian needs to die!
And just because the Caldari State is becoming more of a threat to us, doesn't mean we should ignore other, more insidious and less obvious threats. That would let s****like the Serpentis, the Guristas or the agents of Sansha's Nation to run wild around our beloved homeland.
Originally by: Karanth
I understand needing time off, but you have gone and blown this whole little thing out of proportion. Congratulations.
Also, if I've merely become irritating, I should sit down for an hour and slam out something vile. Hate to lose my "Minister of Death" title just because I didn't rail hard enough.
Yeah, you're like a Thorradin for the Gallente people - both utterly irredeamable idiots who twist the practices of your home countries into warped extremism. Congratulations.
-----
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Dance Commander
Asuka Smith > not even goons can make 30m ISK this interesting. |
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 12:54:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Stitcher
Edited by: Stitcher on 19/07/2008 11:10:17
Originally by: Silver Night
So you caught us! We are guilty of wanting to help people, and also wanting to - in helping them - right one of histories great wrongs.
Lies. You are guilty of wanting to control people in order to get them to rebuild a crumbled old pyramid on your behalf, with you and your corporation at its apex. Just as Sansha did, except your methods are more subtle and veiled by the illusion of benignity.
And you have the gall to accuse ME of denying people their right to a free will.
If you won't be convinced, you won't be convinced. You will always blind yourself to the truth so that it fits your vision of what the world is and stay in your comfortable, anger filled bubble reveling in self deception. I wish you joy of it. I think anyone who has read the preceding can make their judgment about the truth. Should my clone fail today I'm happy with the legacy of ideas I'd leave, I hope you can say the same Mr Tarn-Hakatain. I've said my piece on the subject and I leave it to others to decide for themselves.
Just maybe what they figure out for themselves is what's best for them. Comes of free will, you see.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
|
Heartstone
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 13:06:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Silver Night
To be clear (since it seems to have become a matter of interest), aside from the disposition of any initial Andreus Ixiris corpse, all MXD corpses acquired should we persecute this war to any extent (we probably won't) will be sold, most likely in auction format. Proceeds to go to the The NHB Ultra Happy ChipÖ Scholarship Fund and the Safe Harbor program. Apparently these sorts of things have value in the podder community, and we can always use additional charitable funds.
Hmmm interesting. Do let me know if you happen to acquire a spare Andreus corpse would you? I would be interested in dissecting that brain.
---
|
Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 14:30:00 -
[112]
Originally by: Silver Night
I think anyone who has read the preceding can make their judgment about the truth.
Yes, and they can make their judgment with far greater accuracy, now that I have presented the counter argument. If so much as one person shies away from signing up to your little scheme because of my words, then I've done my job.
Of course, I'm hoping that the figure more closely resembles 100% of your potential recruits, but that's probably an unrealistic dream.
-
Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Thorradin
State Protectorate
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 15:57:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
Originally by: Thorradin
It would appear Mixed Metaphor is so unimportant that even their own announcements are taken from them by others..
Says the man who's so violently patriotic, other Caldari won't listen to him. That's like being thrown out of the Order of St. Tetrimon for being too zealous. Nice work there.
I'd ask what you base your assumption off of, but the lunacy and disillusioned world you live in really doesn't interest me.
And I don't care if some liberal Ishukone drones don't like me.
|
Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 16:26:00 -
[114]
Edited by: Stitcher on 19/07/2008 16:27:03
Originally by: Thorradin
I don't care if some liberal Ishukone drones don't like me.
Great, well that's MY opinion thrown firmly out the airlock then. Anyone from LDIS care to chip in and shut this idiot up?
-
Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Remy Valios
Gallente
Strix Armaments and Defence
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 16:40:00 -
[115]
I feel I need chime in here, and apologize profusely to Silver and Naqam for being unable to earlier, due to certain conditions, and speak as to something of the Safe Harbour program.
Before I joined Strix, and before the war kicked off in earnest, I was conducting an effort to form a corporation to offer humanitarian aid to those stricken by the war, on both sides of the Gallente-Caldari border, seeking out aid from corporations on both sides of the conflict.
This, invariably, corresponded with the timing and launch of the Safe Harbour project, which brought me into contact with Silver and Naqam.
Being the reckless idealist I was at the time, I took a miniaturized camera drone which I'm fond of using, and proceeded to head to one of the Safe Harbour Naqam hangars, to see just what was what.
I can tell you, that in my time there, I saw nothing inappropriate or improper being carried out- and further, I was in the company of an Amarrian as well, who could testify to this as surely. I also have both the unedited, timestamped holoreel footage, and the edited footage I was working with for what I hoped would be a widely spread holoreel documentary. Sadly the war and other circumstances made this impossible to tend to at the time.
The only questionable thing that happened at the Safe Harbour hangar was my being involved in a beating by one of the more spirited, angry Caldari who was there, and who would have beaten me, possibly to death, if it hadn't been for the intervention of Naqam personnel to get the man away from me. That, as well, is on the footage.
Should any of you care for the footage, I'd be glad to send you a copy, until such time as I can release a fairer copy with narration.
Remy Valios, Strix
_______________________________________________
What a terrible, necessary, dissapointing pursuit, peace is. |
Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
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Posted - 2008.07.19 17:05:00 -
[116]
Has conflict even started yet? All this barking is getting boring.
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Once I was fallen, now I have wings
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Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 20:26:00 -
[117]
Edited by: Silver Night on 19/07/2008 20:26:08
Mr Valios, I thank you for coming forward with the truth, unpopular though it may be.
Originally by: Leon 026
Has conflict even started yet? All this barking is getting boring.
As I've mentioned, this is most likely just an effort to get attention on the part of Mr Ixiris, and he will likely just declare victory when nothing has changed and Naqam podders still aren't in the Federation. It simply isn't where we operate. At the moment. Who knows, of course, what the future holds?
So likely talk will be a large part of what you see.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
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Karanth
Gallente
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.07.19 20:31:00 -
[118]
Edited by: Karanth on 19/07/2008 20:36:19
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris
Originally by: Karanth
How the hell did I end up being discussed here? And you, Mr. Ixiris. Why the hell are you wasting time playing with the spawn of Sanshas when, oh, I don't know, the CALDARI are trying to invade?
See, Karanth, this is your problem. You're utterly obsessed with the Caldari. I don't know if you've noticed, but the Caldari aren't making any progress in their invasion. They took one system before we got organised, but now they're getting mercilessly slapped down every time they try to contest a system. At the very worst we've stalemated them. And for the Gods sake, woman, not every Caldari is an evil monster, and not every Caldari civilian needs to die!
And just because the Caldari State is becoming more of a threat to us, doesn't mean we should ignore other, more insidious and less obvious threats. That would let s****like the Serpentis, the Guristas or the agents of Sansha's Nation to run wild around our beloved homeland.
Originally by: Karanth
I understand needing time off, but you have gone and blown this whole little thing out of proportion. Congratulations.
Also, if I've merely become irritating, I should sit down for an hour and slam out something vile. Hate to lose my "Minister of Death" title just because I didn't rail hard enough.
Yeah, you're like a Thorradin for the Gallente people - both utterly irredeamable idiots who twist the practices of your home countries into warped extremism. Congratulations.
Where to start... Ok, first off, if I or most other people were asked to list, from most to least dangerous to the Federation, I'm fairly sure that Sanshas minions would fall somewhere between Protein Delicacies and the EVE Gate. Why not hunt the Serpentis if they are a threat? Oh yes, because in your farce of a crusade, targets that might shoot back are too much to handle.
The reason the Caldari are not winning is because of the vigilance of militia pilots. And I can count the number of times I've seen Guristas in Federation space on one hand. Face it: your war was not only driven by your obsession (a position I can respect), but poorly planned, and your PR makes Revan Neferis and her ramblings look good.
I'm embarrassed by this whole debacle, but it's nice that I remain close to your thoughts. 
EDIT: Forgot to say, not all Caldari are monsters, and I never said they were. If they surrender to, or work for, any entity other than the State, they are fine by me.
|
Silver Night
Caldari
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 21:11:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Karanth
EDIT: Forgot to say, not all Caldari are monsters, and I never said they were. If they surrender to, or work for, any entity other than the State, they are fine by me.
The Nation, for example?
Silver Night smiles
To be entirely honest though, I personally (insert standard not speaking for my corporation disclaimer here) work for the good of the Caldari people. Unusual though my methods might be, they will always have my first allegiance. Of course, the Caldari people are not the same as the Caldari State.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
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Stitcher
Caldari
Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.07.19 23:42:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Remy Valios
Being the reckless idealist I was at the time, I took a miniaturized camera drone which I'm fond of using, and proceeded to head to one of the Safe Harbour Naqam hangars, to see just what was what.
I can tell you, that in my time there, I saw nothing inappropriate or improper being carried out- and further, I was in the company of an Amarrian as well, who could testify to this as surely.
No disrespect intended, Pilot Valios, but that is hardly compelling proof. Even Naqam lack the gall to carry out any "inappropriate" activities within empire space, where anybody with a camera and an inquisitive mind could find out about it.
This is all a public relations battle. They'd be on their best behaviour, presenting the image of a friendly, concerned organisation working for the public good. All above-board, compassionate and welcoming. I have no doubt that the illusion of benignity continues even once the applicants have been shipped out to the Nation - all the better to lull them into believing that they are surrounded by angels of mercy.
What were expecting to go in there and find? Screaming, sobbing men and women strapped to a table while faceless bloody-to-the-elbow doctors jammed cruel spiky things into their grey matter? Slaver hounds and razor wire-topped fences keeping a line of distraught victims in check as they slowly filed into a room marked "processing"? Maybe a nice big screen with someone's face reciting borderline-horrific propoganda at the huddled, terrified masses?
If you were expecting to find anything "inappropriate" when you checked out that Safe Harbour hangar, then I'm afraid you were being incredibly naive.
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Lt. Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
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