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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 21:25:00 -
[1]
I have just had an interesting discussion with my friends and would like to put this question to the eve forum.. I expect flaming
What movies would being genre defining Sci-Fi ?
By this I mean films that are you use as comparison as standards by which other movie are compared. We came up with the following list in no particular order;
- When Worlds Collide
It Came from Outer Space
War of the Worlds û first version
The Last Starfighter
Enemy Mine
Plan 9 From Outer Space û Worse?
The Day the Earth Stood Still
2001 Space Odyssey
Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Alien
Star Wars Original untampered with
Invasion of the Body Snatchers
Day of the Triffids
Andromeda Strain
Silent Running
Dark Star
Metropolis
Demon Seed
Titan AE
Stargate
Terminator
Superman û Christopher Reeve Version
Matrix
Fortress
West World
Black Hole
Forbidden Planet (The Tempest)
Fifth Element
20000 Leagues under the Sea
King Kong (Fay Wray)
Frankenstein (The Monster)
Invisible Man
Soylent Green
Fantastic Voyage
Logans Run
Zardoz
Back to the Future
Special mention has to go for the Definition of a bad Movies. The Three New Star Wars Films, especially the fight with Yoda and Christopher Lee, Sulking Darth Vader, Jar Jar Binks û do I have to say more.
All these comment are the collective responsiblity of no one.. please dont hurt me too much.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 21:26:00 -
[2]
Held for suggestion
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Wendat Huron
Stellar Solutions
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Posted - 2008.07.19 21:53:00 -
[3]
Capricorn One?
These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade! |
Xen Gin
Universal Mining Inc
Forged Dominion
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Posted - 2008.07.19 21:59:00 -
[4]
Blade Runner should be on the list!
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:09:00 -
[5]
I would agrue that Capricorn One isn't Science Fiction, it is more a political Drama. It uses a Sci Fi as a starting point but then does run with that aspect.
Blade Runner... True that is missing from the list. I think that one should be included but need to be convince that it is genre beating.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:15:00 -
[6]
Planet of The Apes.
Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav!
Also Known As |
Joseph 9
Digital Fury Corporation
Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:18:00 -
[7]
What exactly do you mean by "genre-beating". Without some sort of defintions and reasoning behind your selections it's difficult to see why they are in your list.
Blade Runner for example is Cyberpunk, and in order to be genre-beating I would say it needs to be a better film than any other cyber punk film out there. Other options for genre-beating are most profitable (measureable but boring - no debate involved) or most influential.
So what films outdo Blade Runner then? The Matrix? Metropolis? Any other cyber punk films I've seen have mostly sucked, although a few are good, but not great. Examples of the good are (imho) Strange Days, Running Man and Virtuosity.
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Joseph 9
Digital Fury Corporation
Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:28:00 -
[8]
And moving on to critique your list I think the following shouldn't be on there on the grounds that they are not very good films
Titan AE
Fortress
Black Hole
Invisible Man (although which one?)
Fantastic Voyage
Logans Run
Zardoz
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:33:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Brigitte Helm on 19/07/2008 22:34:16
 Originally by: Joseph 9
What exactly do you mean by "genre-beating". Without some sort of defintions and reasoning behind your selections it's difficult to see why they are in your list.
First I don't mean genre beating in the sense of the best ever of a movie. I mean a film that when ever you are watch a movie you are compare the movie to it. So it doesnt have to be a perfect film, or even a good film.
It simply has to be a film that is a high point in the history that makes a perminant mark on the records of film.
Originally by: Joseph 9
And moving on to critique your list I think the following shouldn't be on there on the grounds that they are not very good films
As I just said, does have to be good. Just has to be the movie that you can't imagine history without
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.07.19 22:47:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 19/07/2008 22:49:17
Originally by: Joseph 9
First I don't mean genre beating in the sense of the best ever of a movie. I mean a film that when ever you are watch a movie you are compare the movie to it. So it doesnt have to be a perfect film, or even a good film.
It simply has to be a film that is a high point in the history that makes a perminant mark on the records of film.
I think Black Hole and Logan's Run fit here. Most people here are just probably too young to appreciate it. Certainly they remain in the pop consciousness and influence films even today. Although how you get Dark Star on there and miss these I have no idea.
And by all means Blade Runner is on the list. That one is a no brainer.
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"Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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War Keynvor
Flashbang Innovations
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:08:00 -
[11]
I definitely agree Blade Runner needs to make the list.
What about Twelve Monkeys? or Stargate?
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:08:00 -
[12]
Thxs I think you get it. I will be honest Dark Star was raised in our discussion but I think I would be hard to justify it if pressed. That one I would be willing to drop I think.
I am ashamed that we didnt pick up Blade Runner. However we only picked up Frankenstein late on in the discussion.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Meklon
Caldari
Gradient
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:09:00 -
[13]
The mind boggles how Babylon 5 can be left out.
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: War Keynvor
I definitely agree Blade Runner needs to make the list.
What about Twelve Monkeys? or Stargate?
He types as the discussion rages on TS
Stargate we talked about and thought that there are better example of the type.
Twelve Monkey - I need convincing about that. As a technical film it is different but as a subject matter I dont think it is.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:13:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Meklon
The mind boggles how Babylon 5 can be left out.
Because it isnt a movie at the cinema
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Meklon
Caldari
Gradient
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:24:00 -
[16]
Quote:
Because it isnt a movie at the cinema
Technically, you never stated that it had to be a cinematic release, iirc there were a couple of B5 movies, so in mere technicalities it fits into the discussion - at least in my eyes.
((Not intending to flame, so please don't take it that way)).
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.19 23:28:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Meklon
Quote:
Because it isnt a movie at the cinema
Technically, you never stated that it had to be a cinematic release, iirc there were a couple of B5 movies, so in mere technicalities it fits into the discussion - at least in my eyes.
((Not intending to flame, so please don't take it that way)).
No prob.. my fault for not including it... editing the original post now.. Interesting that no one picked up that Star Trek isnt included. We are having that discussion now. We have limited to IV or Generations if any.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Drax Darksun
Infortunatus Eventus
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Posted - 2008.07.20 04:51:00 -
[18]
Star Trek : First Contact is the only TNG movie as far as I'm concerned 
Wish I could say Battlestar Galactica, but I don't feel Razor has enough umph to be considered for a recommendation.
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Mary Makepeace
Caldari
Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2008.07.20 05:14:00 -
[19]
Pitch Black - If only for the good low budget hot landing on a planet. Works out well as a redemption film as well.
Akira - the first widely distributed cinema release of a Japanese animation. rocking sound track and incomprehensible plot.
Clockwork Orange - 'nuf said.
The Fly - very strong release for horror/scifi, sadly i havn't seen the original.
Mad Max (road warrior?)-post apocalyptic \o/
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Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.07.20 05:33:00 -
[20]
Terminator 2: Judgment Day
its scifi action! but it truely defined special effects in the field for years to come.
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F'nog
Amarr
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Celestial Industrial Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.20 07:28:00 -
[21]
Day of the Trifids was just on "The Really Bad Movie" around here. And it really lives up to its billing. That's a bad movie. The book may be different, but the movie...
And When Worlds Collide? I can paint a better backdrop in my sleep, thank you very much.
Otherwise it's a good list.
Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari
F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
Originally by: Chribba
Go F'nog! You're a hero! Not a Zero!  /me bows
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.07.20 08:04:00 -
[22]
Ok... maybe not all genre-defining, but notable titles nevertheless... take your pick on some you missed... think "older" 
* Godzilla ("Gojira")
* The Blob
* Barbarella
* Mad Max
* Flash Gordon
* The Thing
* Scanners
Closer to today, in animation
* Ghost in the Shell
* The Iron Giant (one year earlier than Titan AE)
* Heavy Metal 2000 ("F.A.K.K.2")
* Final Fantasy : The Spirits Within
* Treasure Planet
Back to our (relatively recent) days in motion pictures :
* E.T.
* Tron
* Robocop
* Predator
* Total Recall
And even more recent, but not all that genre-defining at all :
* Contact
* Armageddon//Deep Impact (I prefered the second one, really)
* Jurassic Park
* Independence Day
* Idiocracy
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THE APPRENTICE || mineral balance || nanofix
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Kyanzes
Amarr
Utopian Research I.E.L.
The ENTITY.
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Posted - 2008.07.20 08:43:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Kyanzes on 20/07/2008 08:43:51
Fantastic Voyage seems to be missing from the list.
Also what about The Time Machine (1960)? Or perhaps Back to the Future? Another definitive movies: 1984 and Equilibrium.
What about Johnny Mnemonic?
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GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese. |
knifee
Caldari
Euphoria Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.20 09:41:00 -
[24]
Dark City
Alian
Gattaca
Stalker
The Abyss
eve-dev - making a good thing better
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Akiba Penrose
The Movement
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Posted - 2008.07.20 09:59:00 -
[25]
Classic should be on the list.
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.20 11:07:00 -
[26]
Ok first of all thxs for all the replies. Some interesting suggestion and missed films. I'll try to cover as many as I can.
When the list was put together, we didn't look at the special effect. Although key to a Sci Fi film, its the stories we are interested in. Anyway on to the suggestions
Clockwork Orange - We did discuss this one, but it didnt make the final list, because although a great film, it doesnt feel like it adds anything to the history of SciFi. Same goes for Mad Max
Barbarella / Flash Gordon is an interesting one and I am not sure about them. They represent the Saturday morning serials. So important to Sci Fi. When my friends get on we will talk about these I am sure. Maybe maybe... tell me why they should / shouldnt be in the list
The Time Machine - We did talk about this one, but the story it actually tells is done better in other movies, the folly of man. The world taken back. We even miss "Things to come".
Fantasic Voyager - We thought about that one but discussed and rejected
Tron - Was brought up but mad computer - 2001, cyberpunk - The Matrix.. Need convincing I guess
THE BLOCKBUSTER - ok in this I am talking about Independance day, Jurassic Park, Deep Impact etc... I have a problem including these as most of them are retelling of stories already done, but with flashier special effects. Again convince me
So in summary, rather then just lists, give me reasons... if you challenge one on the list I will try to justify it to you.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Mark Lucius
Kinetic Vector
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Posted - 2008.07.20 11:58:00 -
[27]
Maybe you should define sub-genres first. It will be easier to distinguish which movies are genre-defining that way. Although classifying movies by sub-genre might be hard again. 
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Brigitte Helm
Minmatar
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.20 12:31:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Mark Lucius
Maybe you should define sub-genres first. It will be easier to distinguish which movies are genre-defining that way. Although classifying movies by sub-genre might be hard again.
This is the thing I have been trying to avoid. Once you label a movie as a type of movie it become fitting in boxes. What I am trying to do, and not saying very well. Which movies actual were so ground breaking that they are the point of reference for everything else both in the future and also in the past.
Hug a Carebear, Kill a pirate, squish a Rat, and tickle a dev.
Make Eve fun.... |
Mark Lucius
Kinetic Vector
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Posted - 2008.07.20 12:37:00 -
[29]
Well yeah, but some of these movies are only ground breaking when compared to others in their subgenre, while being less so to the sci-fi genre as a whole.
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Jorana Rowan
Gallente
Flying Fox Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.20 18:33:00 -
[30]
I think Dark Star should go back in - I think it is genre defining and at least one other person agrees with me :
http://blog.wired.com:80/underwire/2008/07/dan-obannon-exc.html
In case anyone can't be bothered to go to wired, here's the relevant bit:
It's been a while since anything new written by sci-fi and horror master Dan O'Bannon hit the screen.
Either working alone or in tandem, O'Bannon piled up monumental, genre-defining films in the 70s and 80s. From Return of the Living Dead and Dark Star to Alien and Total Recall, O'Bannon penned some seminal scary moments (article carries on)
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