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Sivonya
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Posted - 2008.08.07 21:16:00 -
[61]
i agree totaly with whats said up
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MJ Maverick
IronPig
Sev3rance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 22:23:00 -
[62]
Based on the whole topic... I've said it again and I'll say it again...
CCP need to put down their nerf hammer and pick up their nerf screwdriver. You can't just go WHACK! -50% to everything in speed and WHACK +100% to scram strength and WHACK -300% to DDD strength.
You need to tweak and tune finely so you don't over do it. Just a small tweak to the offending ships bonuses/attributes that are doing stupid speeds would do the trick. The hammer approach just causes uproar and then you have to spend twice the amount of time you did to start with, fixing all the overkill.
I'm Gallente, not a role player and I hate all things nano. So you can't say I'm bias. But everything has it's place, the Vaga's being in the speed tank genre.
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Taya Tal
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Posted - 2008.08.07 22:34:00 -
[63]
Armor tank your vagabond.
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Uncle Smokey
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Posted - 2008.08.07 23:04:00 -
[64]
 Originally by: Taya Tal
Armor tank your vagabond.
Yea. Just what it was meant to do, right? ******* get real.
.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.
\o/ EVERYBODY SAY HELL YEAH! \o/ |
Havoc G
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.08.08 00:10:00 -
[65]
JUST NERF EVERYTHING TOTAL NOOBS MOAN ABOUT..
its total fail sauce enough said 
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Ihrda Siharkhail
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.08.08 08:52:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Taya Tal
Armor tank your vagabond.
have you had a look at the base resists?
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Number 17
Caldari
COLD-Wing
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Posted - 2008.08.08 09:50:00 -
[67]
Every day i come in here to read nano.whinning, it makes me feel like christmas.
Before this patch everyone who would say "im training for the cerberus" would be answered: "drop it mate, fly a drake". Similar situations could be heard about other races hacs, a super specialized ship, that is not cost effective and does not deliver better than a BC which is 1/3 of its price.
Except for one ship.
There are 2 hacs that where actually good. Great for solo because you did not need scouts as you could mwd away from small gatecamp (popping away ceptors that chase you in straight line in 2 volleys), or run back to gate in big gatecamp.
Comparing it to other hacs where being bubbled means 98% death, as it should be.
God mode? not quite, but really close to it. We fought TRI a lot the past year, and we managed to snag a lot of nano hac kills, but it was thru hard work and specific counter measures. And it involved a lot of battleships and RR, and ecm and whatnot ALL of that to fight.... cruisers...
Vaga with post nerf speed can still go over 3km/second. that can outrun precision heavy missiles. Interceptors will be slower as well, and if a vaga can track my crow now, it will shred it apart post nerf.
Get it into your heads, you cannot speed tank while in orbit, you should not be able to, ever. if you want to speed tank go in a straight line to get top speed.
the bright side is, that the vaga is still fast enough to disengage, mwd to 100km and smack in local. So you basically have not been nerfed at all!!!!
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Ihrda Siharkhail
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.08.08 10:05:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Ihrda Siharkhail on 08/08/2008 10:05:53
Originally by: Number 17
Every day i come in here to read nano.whinning, it makes me feel like christmas.
Before this patch everyone who would say "im training for the cerberus" would be answered: "drop it mate, fly a drake". Similar situations could be heard about other races hacs, a super specialized ship, that is not cost effective and does not deliver better than a BC which is 1/3 of its price.
Except for one ship.
There are 2 hacs that where actually good. Great for solo because you did not need scouts as you could mwd away from small gatecamp (popping away ceptors that chase you in straight line in 2 volleys), or run back to gate in big gatecamp.
Comparing it to other hacs where being bubbled means 98% death, as it should be.
God mode? not quite, but really close to it. We fought TRI a lot the past year, and we managed to snag a lot of nano hac kills, but it was thru hard work and specific counter measures. And it involved a lot of battleships and RR, and ecm and whatnot ALL of that to fight.... cruisers...
Vaga with post nerf speed can still go over 3km/second. that can outrun precision heavy missiles. Interceptors will be slower as well, and if a vaga can track my crow now, it will shred it apart post nerf.
Get it into your heads, you cannot speed tank while in orbit, you should not be able to, ever. if you want to speed tank go in a straight line to get top speed.
the bright side is, that the vaga is still fast enough to disengage, mwd to 100km and smack in local. So you basically have not been nerfed at all!!!!
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
also, you and most caldari players suck in pvp, get use to it, youll still die in numbers after the nerf.
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Kepakh
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Posted - 2008.08.08 10:14:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Number 17
Comparing it to other hacs where being bubbled means 98% death, as it should be.
Vaga with post nerf speed can still go over 3km/second. that can outrun precision heavy missiles. Interceptors will be slower as well, and if a vaga can track my crow now, it will shred it apart post nerf.
if you want to speed tank go in a straight line to get top speed.
Those ones are funny.
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Number 17
Caldari
COLD-Wing
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Posted - 2008.08.08 10:32:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
also, you and most caldari players suck in pvp, get used to it, youll still die in numbers after the nerf.
1- You are not supposed to tank, even so the vaga is still a very good hac pre nerf and post nerf.
2- Sure, i suck big time, caldari also sucks big time that is why a caldari alliance like mine got between the top 5 in last tourney, but it seems everyone else sucks harder because i/we have a very good kill/loss ratio and an efficiency over 80%. You can check it out yourself in any KB of your preference. And if you all think caldari sucks and we still die in numbers after nerf, why is you whining all the time?
3- LOL at your nano tears, lol at your anger, lol at your failure to understand this game, it makes me feel like christmas.
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Gordon Red
SteelVipers
Ev0ke
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Posted - 2008.08.08 11:26:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Sivonya
so how can vaga be king of guerilla warfare when any ceptors can kill it easily (or asault or electronic frigs)
You Sir have no clue.
btw: Munnin is the future. Adapt or die.
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Titan Pilot
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.08.08 11:52:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Number 17
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
also, you and most caldari players suck in pvp, get used to it, youll still die in numbers after the nerf.
1- You are not supposed to tank, even so the vaga is still a very good hac pre nerf and post nerf.
2- Sure, i suck big time, caldari also sucks big time that is why a caldari alliance like mine got between the top 5 in last tourney, but it seems everyone else sucks harder because i/we have a very good kill/loss ratio and an efficiency over 80%. You can check it out yourself in any KB of your preference. And if you all think caldari sucks and we still die in numbers after nerf, why is you whining all the time?
3- LOL at your nano tears, lol at your anger, lol at your failure to understand this game, it makes me feel like christmas.
Have you ever flown the Vaga on test server? If you have not I kindly suggest you never post again about Vagas. Unless you have some kills on test server with said ship with setup, you are just typing words on a screen...
I will say it again, unless MWD reactivation penalty is removed, Vaga is effectively dead.
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Gordon Red
SteelVipers
Ev0ke
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Posted - 2008.08.08 12:20:00 -
[73]
Do you really think that everyone will carry a 7,5/9km around?
Ceptor vs Vaga is a quickly dead ceptor, the interceptors are dead meat anyway with this change.
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Miss Rumpelstilzchen
Minmatar
Black Horizon Ltd
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Posted - 2008.08.08 12:45:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Gordon Red
Do you really think that everyone will carry a 7,5/9km around?
Ceptor vs Vaga is a quickly dead ceptor, the interceptors are dead meat anyway with this change.
on TQ , yes .. but not on SISI ... try it out
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Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.08 12:47:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Relliassa
Edited by: Relliassa on 03/08/2008 23:30:14
So you're not totally immune to missiles, uncatchable and close to unkillable if you're a competant pilot.
Cry more.
And I thought the funniest bit was "its the same as if caldari got all shield resses cut in half" - when it's actually Caldari who've been screwed over already by precisely those ships you're BAWWWing over.
How about doing what nano*** pilots have been telling everyone else to do: adapt and survive. Yeah those words sound a whole lot nastier when it's other people saying it to you eh?
Yeah vagabond perma mwds and has cap for more than 90 seconds of mwd'ing while it can't do much dps while mwd'ing except when making passes where it can take turret dps too.
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Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.08 12:58:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Euriti on 08/08/2008 13:00:57
Edited by: Euriti on 08/08/2008 12:59:15
Originally by: Stab Wounds
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Originally by: Malachon Draco
Be careful what you wish for. This is what happens when nanopilots adapt:
http://triumvirate-alliance.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=141675
But Triumvirate guys know their stuff and don't whine on the forums so much?
the thing is they really don't know their stuff and all they do is whine on the forums. they will fail when nanos are nerfed and i await the nanotears.
Look how ignorant you are. Your posting is really pathetic and everything you do is supporting anything that nerfs speed. I presume you are just a silly alt of some caldari drake pilot who once upon a time ventured in to low sec and got killed by a vagabond and after that decided to lead a crusade towards anything going faster than 600m/s. Hell you even want interceptor speeds nerfed even though they are broken on sisi. Pathetic and disgusting.
Also I laugh at your perception that PL and Tri only do nano gangs. It's so laughable. Maybe you should go look at various killmails and see that we already have a new style and are miles ahead of you.
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Osher
Caldari
Eve University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.08.08 13:27:00 -
[77]
Save the VAGA pfft...
When every war your corp fights involves you having to design your entire navy around countering one ship something is wrong...
When you do so and your enemy continues to spam Vagas knowing that even the best Vaga specific countermeasures mean they'll usually escape unscathed, something is wrong...
You know speed is overpowered.
CCP knows speed is overpowered.
This patch is a good change that will add diversity to pvp instead of what it is now; speed freaks and specific countermeasures. See that bold word, I know its a big one, look it up.
I cannot believe you all continue to dillute yourselves. Take some of your own "adapt or die" medicine for god sake.
I cannot believe I just bumped this thread! Arg! Well played OP...well played |
Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.08 13:35:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Osher
Save the VAGA pfft...
When every war your corp fights involves you having to design your entire navy around countering one ship something is wrong...
When you do so and your enemy continues to spam Vagas knowing that even the best Vaga specific countermeasures mean they'll usually escape unscathed, something is wrong...
You know speed is overpowered.
CCP knows speed is overpowered.
This patch is a good change that will add diversity to pvp instead of what it is now; speed freaks and specific countermeasures. See that bold word, I know its a big one, look it up.
I cannot believe you all continue to dillute yourselves. Take some of your own "adapt or die" medicine for god sake.
I cannot believe I just bumped this thread! Arg! Well played OP...well played
Yes, diversity.
We will now go from
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Nano gangs
to
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Look, we increased diversi... actually we didn't.
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Taram Caldar
Noir.
Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.08 14:12:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Sivonya
Vagabonds are in great peril
I did test vagabond with various fitting on singularity and didnt like what i saw.
Regular vaga fit with 2 overdive, nanofiber and 2 gyro does not make vagabond go even 3km/s (orbit aroun 2.4km/s)
Full nano low slot (without gyrostabilizers), with speed hardwirings and polycarbons goes 3.6km/s (orbit around 2.9km/s)
Even when full nano fit (no gyrostabilizers - it has no dps to kill a npc in belt) in orbit of 2.9km/s it gets hammered by missiles
Now Vagabond
cant even tackle anything longer than 30 secs,
cant avoid missiles,
cant reach the falcon jamming at 200km away in reasonable time
cant runaway when situation gets hot
so how can vaga be king of guerilla warfare when any ceptors can kill it easily (or asault or electronic frigs)
minmatars got their main advantage nerfed, its the same as if caldari got all shield resses cut in half or galente dronebays reduced to by 50%
Ok first of all... that's a TERRIBLE fit for a vaga on SISI... might want to take another look at what mods do before making a post like this. You can get Vagas to go much faster than 2.5k/s if you fit them right on SISI.
1) Nano's no longer affect Mass... they only affect Agility (barely) and a little tiny smidge of speed (5% IIRC).....
2) ISTABS still only affect Agility
3) Overdrives only affect speed.... (12.5% IIRC)
So:
It's better to fit 4 OD II and 1 ISTAB II than to fit the mish-mash of lowslots you listed now. If you do that you can get the vaga into the 3k/s realm... think it was 3.5 or 3.6k/sec without rigs with rigs you can get it just south of 4k or right at it.... (I think... I need to re-test to be sure)... which really still isn't fast... but it's not awful... the REAL problem with the Vaga isn't it's top speed on sisi (as compared to other ships of it's class) it's it's acceleration combined with the MWD Re-activation delay.
With the increased mass of ALL minmatar ships, combined with the MWD reactivation delay the vagabond is not a very good ship anymore. It takes too long to reach max speed and unless you really gimp your fit so that you can run the MWD non-stop it can't maintain speed at all due to the MWD re-activation delay (which is breaking more than just the vaga btw).
.
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Orange Faeces
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.08.08 14:46:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
Superlolz. With 2x LSE II, and base resists the Vagabond has a better buffer than almost any other HAC, except maybe 2xLSE II on an ishtar + plate. That mid slot choice costs you no speed. Idea: Put a kinetic shield rig in also costing you no speed (Ryysa was a smart guy), use your lows for speed and damage, and you are the big winner!!
How about a thread called "SAVE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FLY THE VAGA" 
I don't think YOU get it.
---
The Other Orange |
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Orange Faeces
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.08.08 14:52:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Euriti
Yes, diversity.
We will now go from
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Nano gangs
to
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Look, we increased diversi... actually we didn't.
Also hillarious.
I'd really like to see Pandemic in one of these new gangs. Really I would. When is the last time you saw PL roll anyone in a "sniper gang". Or even funnier ... "RR gang". Can you see a PL pilot helping another PL pilot? Only people over the age of, say, 16 do that. Too funny, PL.
---
The Other Orange |
Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 15:23:00 -
[82]
Edited by: Euriti on 08/08/2008 15:23:44
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Euriti
Yes, diversity.
We will now go from
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Nano gangs
to
Sniper Fleets
RR Gangs
HAC sniper gangs
Look, we increased diversi... actually we didn't.
Also hillarious.
I'd really like to see Pandemic in one of these new gangs. Really I would. When is the last time you saw PL roll anyone in a "sniper gang". Or even funnier ... "RR gang". Can you see a PL pilot helping another PL pilot? Only people over the age of, say, 16 do that. Too funny, PL.
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-03%2021:17:00&end_time=2008-08-03%2022:43:00&system=YVBE-E 59 kills 33 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2017:53:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2018:27:00&system=PNQY-Y 15 kills 4 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2020:43:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2021:19:00&system=YVBE-E 46 kills 3 losses
Don't come tell me these are nano BS.
Also don't come tell me that it's not correct "because we dont post losses". Afaik the board is API updated.
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Orange Faeces
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.08.08 15:46:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Euriti
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-03%2021:17:00&end_time=2008-08-03%2022:43:00&system=YVBE-E 59 kills 33 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2017:53:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2018:27:00&system=PNQY-Y 15 kills 4 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2020:43:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2021:19:00&system=YVBE-E 46 kills 3 losses
Don't come tell me these are nano BS.
Also don't come tell me that it's not correct "because we dont post losses". Afaik the board is API updated.
Okay... Thanks for the links. Fine, but...
A. These are sniper slug-fests, not small-gang action. Thus, they don't add much to the comment that, for small-gang and freeform pvp, you guys are all nano.
B. Most of the BS losses for PL do not indicate the use of remote repair. Some of them in the last link do. Kuddos.
Anyway, the data on the DPS, falloff and agility is clear -- the vaga could do with some balancing, and I agree with some but not all of the nano-nerf changes. But you already knew that...
OF
---
The Other Orange |
Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 15:51:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Euriti
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-03%2021:17:00&end_time=2008-08-03%2022:43:00&system=YVBE-E 59 kills 33 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2017:53:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2018:27:00&system=PNQY-Y 15 kills 4 losses
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-08-02%2020:43:00&end_time=2008-08-02%2021:19:00&system=YVBE-E 46 kills 3 losses
Don't come tell me these are nano BS.
Also don't come tell me that it's not correct "because we dont post losses". Afaik the board is API updated.
Okay... Thanks for the links. Fine, but...
A. These are sniper slug-fests, not small-gang action. Thus, they don't add much to the comment that, for small-gang and freeform pvp, you guys are all nano.
B. Most of the BS losses for PL do not indicate the use of remote repair. Some of them in the last link do. Kuddos.
Anyway, the data on the DPS, falloff and agility is clear -- the vaga could do with some balancing, and I agree with some but not all of the nano-nerf changes. But you already knew that...
OF
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-07-27%2001:18:00&end_time=2008-07-27%2002:18:00&system=D-IZT9 Small hac gang with long range dps + heavy vaga tacklers.
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-07-24%2021:25:00&end_time=2008-07-24%2021:50:00&system=D-IZT9 Another of above
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_battle.php?start_time=2008-07-19%2020:32:00&end_time=2008-07-19%2020:45:00&system=F-G7BO and another one
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Titan Pilot
Amarr
Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 18:33:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
Superlolz. With 2x LSE II, and base resists the Vagabond has a better buffer than almost any other HAC, except maybe 2xLSE II on an ishtar + plate. That mid slot choice costs you no speed. Idea: Put a kinetic shield rig in also costing you no speed (Ryysa was a smart guy), use your lows for speed and damage, and you are the big winner!!
How about a thread called "SAVE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FLY THE VAGA"
I don't think YOU get it.
Actually, you don't get it.
Scenario: You are in your trusty Vaga, doing 3.2k, staying around 18-21k range, shooting victim in your falloff. As soon as you turn off your guns so they can actually track, you have 10 SECONDS before your can MWD. Now, unless your shooting a Drake or Raven, which I seriously doubt you are, cause you can't speed tank anymore, your prolly shooting a Sac or Ishtar or maybe Thorax or Brutix. With that in mind, as soon as the other pilot sees you turn off your MWD, guess what he will do?
BINGO! He hits MWD, approach, WEB, Scram (Neut if he is Ishtar) and your 2x LSE II buffer is going BYE BYE real fast while you madly hit warp, MWD and try to get the frack out of dodge. Remember, the other pilot only needs to get within 9k of you to turn off your MWD. Approximately 10K distance to cover in 10 seconds. And Vagas dont fit WEBS so once he has you within 9K, your a wreck waiting to be salvaged...
The scenario has been played out a million times on test server, Vaga in its current bonus form is now at a real disadvantage. Now perhaps its time the Vaga dies for a while, but at least post something intelligent so everyone can really understand why its at a disadvantage. The CCP Dev has the Vaga wrong and until they wake up, its pretty much dead unless you fly it with some crazy setup that does not take advantage of its bonuses....as some on test server have bragged about but I have yet to really see happen.
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Sivonya
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Posted - 2008.08.08 20:05:00 -
[86]
LETs sum this up with info from SISI
-No,it cant tank armor
-No it cant break 3km/s in orbit and thus speed tank no matter the fittings
-with reduction in speed it gets even more voulnerable to various attacks
THUS making Vagabond obsolite and hence the topic "Save the Vaga"
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Ihrda Siharkhail
Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 21:03:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
Superlolz. With 2x LSE II, and base resists the Vagabond has a better buffer than almost any other HAC, except maybe 2xLSE II on an ishtar + plate. That mid slot choice costs you no speed. Idea: Put a kinetic shield rig in also costing you no speed (Ryysa was a smart guy), use your lows for speed and damage, and you are the big winner!!
How about a thread called "SAVE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FLY THE VAGA"
I don't think YOU get it.
your an idiot, l2p
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Trojanman190
D00M.
Triumvirate.
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 21:56:00 -
[88]
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
Superlolz. With 2x LSE II, and base resists the Vagabond has a better buffer than almost any other HAC, except maybe 2xLSE II on an ishtar + plate. That mid slot choice costs you no speed. Idea: Put a kinetic shield rig in also costing you no speed (Ryysa was a smart guy), use your lows for speed and damage, and you are the big winner!!
How about a thread called "SAVE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FLY THE VAGA"
I don't think YOU get it.
your an idiot, l2p
QFT
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Pesadel0
Minmatar
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
|
Posted - 2008.08.08 22:33:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Trojanman190
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
Originally by: Orange Faeces
Originally by: Ihrda Siharkhail
I dont think you get it, the vaga has shit base resists on armour, hence we are stuck with putting 2 large extenders on it, so if you cant speed tank, how are you suppose to tank with 2 extenders?
Superlolz. With 2x LSE II, and base resists the Vagabond has a better buffer than almost any other HAC, except maybe 2xLSE II on an ishtar + plate. That mid slot choice costs you no speed. Idea: Put a kinetic shield rig in also costing you no speed (Ryysa was a smart guy), use your lows for speed and damage, and you are the big winner!!
How about a thread called "SAVE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FLY THE VAGA"
I don't think YOU get it.
your an idiot, l2p
QFT
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Orange Faeces
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.08.09 00:20:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Titan Pilot
Actually, you don't get it.
Scenario: You are in your trusty Vaga, doing 3.2k, staying around 18-21k range, shooting victim in your falloff. As soon as you turn off your guns so they can actually track, you have 10 SECONDS before your can MWD. Now, unless your shooting a Drake or Raven, which I seriously doubt you are, cause you can't speed tank anymore, your prolly shooting a Sac or Ishtar or maybe Thorax or Brutix. With that in mind, as soon as the other pilot sees you turn off your MWD, guess what he will do?
BINGO! He hits MWD, approach, WEB, Scram (Neut if he is Ishtar) and your 2x LSE II buffer is going BYE BYE real fast while you madly hit warp, MWD and try to get the frack out of dodge. Remember, the other pilot only needs to get within 9k of you to turn off your MWD. Approximately 10K distance to cover in 10 seconds. And Vagas dont fit WEBS so once he has you within 9K, your a wreck waiting to be salvaged...
The scenario has been played out a million times on test server, Vaga in its current bonus form is now at a real disadvantage. Now perhaps its time the Vaga dies for a while, but at least post something intelligent so everyone can really understand why its at a disadvantage. The CCP Dev has the Vaga wrong and until they wake up, its pretty much dead unless you fly it with some crazy setup that does not take advantage of its bonuses....as some on test server have bragged about but I have yet to really see happen.
That sounds about right. In fact, four midslots is generous for a turret-HAC. Think about how hard it would be for any turret HAC in that situation. Hitting from within heavy Neut range puts you at risk as well.
So, what does "Guerilla warfare" mean? Maybe the devs want it to mean that special cruiser class ships can get past gate camps? On sisi, can you scoot get back to the gate in your beloved vagaz? I know my deimos can't anymore.
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The Other Orange |
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