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Target painters, usefull?

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Author	Topic
Leinad tir	Posted - 2008.08.21 08:38:00 - [1] Hi, Im thinking about fit a target painter in my thrasher but i really dont know for what is good, it increases the signature radius, what does it means exactly? is good for fast ships orbiting near or is usefull at long range because im shooting at 30+ km, any ideas?
Wil Smithx Minmatar Suns Of Korhal	Posted - 2008.08.21 08:52:00 - [2] It increases the size of the ships you're shooting and thus makes them easier to hit. Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm but not sure how effective it would be for a sniper like you...
Gneeznow Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.08.21 08:55:00 - [3] Originally by: Wil Smithx Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm explain this wizardry please
Leinad tir	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:06:00 - [4] Originally by: Wil Smithx It increases the size of the ships you're shooting and thus makes them easier to hit. Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm but not sure how effective it would be for a sniper like you... So signature radius is the size of the ship? im a bit confused then the painter is usefull at any distance isnt? Another question, those bonuses are just for me or for all the ppl shooting that target?
Wil Smithx Minmatar Suns Of Korhal	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:06:00 - [5] Edited by: Wil Smithx on 21/08/2008 09:08:04 Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Wil Smithx Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm explain this wizardry please Gimme a minute I'll find the formula... Edit: http://wiki.eve-id.net/Tracking I believe if you put the numbers into this the sig radius increase increases your hits more than a tracking computer.
Galan Undris	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:07:00 - [6] Edited by: Galan Undris on 21/08/2008 09:07:33 Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Wil Smithx Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm explain this wizardry please A t2 tracking comp gives 30% tracking. A t2 target painer gives +36% sig radius with lvl4 in the effectivness skill. The tracking formula treats sig radius vs sig resolution and tracking vs traversal on the same scale, so the skilled target painter increases hit chance by 6% more than a tracking computer.
Burn Mac Minmatar Burning Steel Inc.	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:07:00 - [7] Originally by: Leinad tir Originally by: Wil Smithx It increases the size of the ships you're shooting and thus makes them easier to hit. Its better than a tracking computer for close range guns atm but not sure how effective it would be for a sniper like you... So signature radius is the size of the ship? im a bit confused then the painter is usefull at any distance isnt? Another question, those bonuses are just for me or for all the ppl shooting that target? Its for all the ppl shooting that target.
Sandra Tyrell	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:12:00 - [8] Edited by: Sandra Tyrell on 21/08/2008 09:12:57 It's good for large guns/missiles hitting smaller targets. Each ship has a signature, BS in the 320-500 range, cruisers maybe 125-200, frigs 25-50. Each gun has a signature resolution, large guns usually 400. When the target is below this size, you'll miss more, and get crappier hits. Likewise each missile has an explosion radius, 450 for normal torps for example. When that explosion radius is bigger then the ship signature, they take reduced damage. Painter increases the signature of the target ship, for everyone shooting at it. It's also faster to lock a larger target, so a quick locking frig with a couple painters can help BS lock smaller targets faster. Though that's a pretty minor benefit.
Galan Undris	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:19:00 - [9] Originally by: Sandra Tyrell Each gun has a signature resolution, large guns usually 400. When the target is below this size, you'll miss more, and get crappier hits This is a myth actually. It makes sense from a "realistic" standpoint, missiles work this way and the turret guide leads to this conclusion for turrets, but it's not accurate. The tracking formula does not "cap" the sig resolution calculation at any point, it's just (sig size / sig res), and this ratio can be > 1. Painted = easier to hit, no matter how big it is in regards to your guns before application.
Sandra Tyrell	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:23:00 - [10] Edited by: Sandra Tyrell on 21/08/2008 09:24:44 Galan answered my question already. Thanks. If that is really correct, well, looks almost like a design flaw to me.

Furb Killer Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:32:00 - [11] It is correct, and why would it be a design flaw? If you paint a cruiser to the size of a capital ship, wouldnt it also be easier to hit for small guns?
Leinad tir	Posted - 2008.08.21 09:56:00 - [12] Edited by: Leinad tir on 21/08/2008 10:00:10 well, thanks for all the answers, so what do u think about this fitting? is going to give good bonuses for sniping or there are ohter things to use better? Thrasher: 7x 250mm light arty I sensor booster I, target painter I, MWD I 2x traking enhacer I with this setting i can shot at 35km with 26 DPS All is T1 because im new :P but i want to know if the idea of the fitting its ok, tx in advice.
Gimpb	Posted - 2008.08.21 10:04:00 - [13] Originally by: Sandra Tyrell Edited by: Sandra Tyrell on 21/08/2008 09:24:44 Galan answered my question already. Thanks. If that is really correct, well, looks almost like a design flaw to me. If the sig factor and the radial velocity factor were maxed at 1, it would be a big boost for the survivability of smaller ships... a BIG boost. But it would also make MWDs much more powerful than they already are and nerfing MWDs is the current mindset, for better or worse. It would also make missiles much more powerful.
Sandra Tyrell	Posted - 2008.08.21 10:09:00 - [14] Edited by: Sandra Tyrell on 21/08/2008 10:10:11 Originally by: Furb Killer It is correct, and why would it be a design flaw? If you paint a cruiser to the size of a capital ship, wouldnt it also be easier to hit for small guns? Well, if the idea of signature resolution is that a gun can put it's shots on target within a certain area, like 125m for medium guns, what would it matter if the target area is 126 or 125 000m? But then again, tracking has it's own very strange "logic", like when orbiting a stationary target, so maybe it's not supposed to make sense. Anywho, thanks for raising my awareness to this >1 radius calc, shall test it out asap.
Tamoko Damage Unlimited Inc INTERDICTION	Posted - 2008.08.21 10:13:00 - [15] I think the concept is that, if the target is considerably larger than the guns sig resolution, the extra size compensates for lack of tracking. An artillery cannon struggling to track will have an easier time hitting something the size of Manhattan than something the size of a baseball diamond.
Wil Smithx Minmatar Suns Of Korhal	Posted - 2008.08.21 10:16:00 - [16] Originally by: Sandra Tyrell Edited by: Sandra Tyrell on 21/08/2008 10:10:11 Originally by: Furb Killer It is correct, and why would it be a design flaw? If you paint a cruiser to the size of a capital ship, wouldnt it also be easier to hit for small guns? Well, if the idea of signature resolution is that a gun can put it's shots on target within a certain area, like 125m for medium guns, what would it matter if the target area is 126 or 125 000m? But then again, tracking has it's own very strange "logic", like when orbiting a stationary target, so maybe it's not supposed to make sense. Anywho, thanks for raising my awareness to this >1 radius calc, shall test it out asap. It makes perfect sense... When the sig radius of a target is massivly increased the window of time that the gun has to time and fire the shot to hit the ship is increased. like if your sig res is o and your trying to hit a ship with a sig radius of o then lets say you have a 1 second window in which to time the shot to hit that target as it passes (and your tracking speed will help damp this effect) if you have a sig res of o and your target has a sig radius of ooo then you would have 3 times as long to time the shot to hit that ship before it passed out of the tracking of that gun. Thats a fairly bad explanation but I hope you can understand it.
Anddeh McNab Minmatar Boundless Horizons	Posted - 2008.08.21 10:25:00 - [17] http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g61_5.asp This guide might help to explain it better for you

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