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Passive Tank Drake vs. Raven (standard) for solo level 4s

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Author	Topic
0rch1d	Posted - 2008.08.30 12:12:00 - [1] I've recently become a passive tank addict. Love the Drake, and really not to jazzed about getting a Raven for level 4s, though I'm worried that my Drake will just take too long with level 4s and my ISK per hour ratio will suffer. Just how good can a Drake get? How possible is it to solo level 4s and not be sloppy about it? What is the absolute best passive set up there is for this beast? Can Heavy Missiles do the job, etc? I know the Darke can solo level 4s, but I don't want to be sitting there for hours. Then again, I love the whoel concept of the passive tank and how it works so beautifully. So should I just get totally lit with a passive Drake, or is rehab the answer? ;) Would appreciate any insight.
ZephyrLexx Caldari Earth Federation Space Forces	Posted - 2008.08.30 13:13:00 - [2] I wasn't too happy about 'upgrading' to an active tank raven either, but if you make sure that your fit is capacitor stable (able to run the shields and hardeners etc without capacitor running dry, ever) it's essentially like a passive tank!
Gul Rashen Perkone	Posted - 2008.08.30 15:24:00 - [3] Edited by: Gul Rashen on 30/08/2008 15:26:31 Or go for a Rattlesnake. Its the only Missile-BS that can fit a decent passive tank. Here are 2 Examplefittings: T2 Faction
BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:36:00 - [4] Originally by: 0rch1d I've recently become a passive tank addict. Love the Drake, and really not to jazzed about getting a Raven for level 4s, though I'm worried that my Drake will just take too long with level 4s and my ISK per hour ratio will suffer. Just how good can a Drake get? How possible is it to solo level 4s and not be sloppy about it? What is the absolute best passive set up there is for this beast? Can Heavy Missiles do the job, etc? I know the Darke can solo level 4s, but I don't want to be sitting there for hours. Then again, I love the whoel concept of the passive tank and how it works so beautifully. So should I just get totally lit with a passive Drake, or is rehab the answer? ;) Would appreciate any insight. You cna solo lev4's quite ezily but slowly in a drake. You may be enjoying the tank for now but when ur on npc bs no. 321 for misison x ur just going to want raven dps.. Proudly annoying FC's since 2007
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:42:00 - [5] Simple. Drake = Big tank, very very slow at level 4s. Raven = Enough tank. Fast for level 4s. You don't need a permatank. Fit at least 3 BCUs or consider unsubscribing and giving me your stuffs.
0rch1d	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:43:00 - [6] Originally by: Gul Rashen Edited by: Gul Rashen on 30/08/2008 15:26:31 Or go for a Rattlesnake. Its the only Missile-BS that can fit a decent passive tank. Here are 2 Examplefittings: T2 Faction Been hearing about the rattler quite a bit but never really looked into it. looks like an interesting, albeit expensive option. How much do these go for?
0rch1d	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:45:00 - [7] Originally by: AstroPhobic Simple. Drake = Big tank, very very slow at level 4s. Raven = Enough tank. Fast for level 4s. You don't need a permatank. Fit at least 3 BCUs or consider unsubscribing and giving me your stuffs. Seems to make sense, actually . . . except for the unsubscribing part. ;)
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:48:00 - [8] Edited by: AstroPhobic on 30/08/2008 16:48:15 Originally by: 0rch1d Seems to make sense, actually . . . except for the unsubscribing part. ;) The raven doesn't need a big tank because it's got enough DPS to not need one. Fitting a giant tank on a raven is counterproductive. Not fitting 3 damage mods, especially on a shield tank, is downright stupid (with the exception of those of you who have serious connection issues) More damage done = shorter mission times = less damage taken = less tank needed. Bigger tank = less damage done = longer mission times = more damage taken.
BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.08.30 16:51:00 - [9] Originally by: AstroPhobic Edited by: AstroPhobic on 30/08/2008 16:48:15 Originally by: 0rch1d Seems to make sense, actually . . . except for the unsubscribing part. ;) (with the exception of those of you who have serious connection issues) guilty Proudly annoying FC's since 2007
Bokabeus	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:04:00 - [10] Originally by: Gul Rashen Edited by: Gul Rashen on 30/08/2008 15:26:31 T2 Faction I am wondering... why would that setup idea not work on a good-old Raven? You would have to lose one of the shield power relays (or a BCS if you are not afraid of Mr. Astro's wrath), but other than that, it should work... well enough. Once you change your hardeners to something mission-specific, that is. Not that I have ever even flown a Raven.

Annowyn Domini Umbrus Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:06:00 - [11] Because a raven has FAR less base shield HP than a rattler.
Enden Assulu Caldari JinTech Industries Utterly Harmless	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:13:00 - [12] If you like passive ships i suggest you get a nighthawk since they are pretty damn good at lvl 4s * * * M3h Skillz
Bokabeus	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:15:00 - [13] Originally by: Annowyn Because a raven has FAR less base shield HP than a rattler. Meh. Using that same all-level-5 skill profile as was used to make those Rattlesnake setups, assuming a 70%kin/30%therm damage spread and replacing the hardeners with 2x kinetic hardeners and 1x thermal hardener, I end up with 409dps tanked after removing one of the SPRs. Which is plenty. Had I removed a BCS instead, I would have ended up with 538 dps tanked (and of course somewhat lower DPS), which I would consider overkill. It is definitely worse, but I would guess it is a more feasible option than spending a gadjillion ISK on a Rattlesnake if a passive-tanking missile BS is what is desired. =/
Bokabeus	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:20:00 - [14] Edited by: Bokabeus on 30/08/2008 17:21:47 Oh! And I just tried the 3x BCS Raven setup from earlier on a Navy Raven. With the 70%/30% damage spread and the same hardeners (2 kin 1 therm), I ended up with 529 dps tanked, and MORE outbound dps than the Rattlesnake. And the CNR is definitely more affordable, right? =)
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:24:00 - [15] This is why passive tanking a raven is dumb: [Raven, PermaXL] Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II X-Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier II Ballistic Deflection Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Wrath Cruise Missile Drone Link Augmentor I [empty high slot] Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Hammerhead II x5 Easy permatank, 3 BCUs, 509 tank vs guristas. IE the same as your passive tank, but more damage.
Bokabeus	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:38:00 - [16] Of course it is better to active tank it. But we are having this discussion because the man wanted to know whether a passive tank is at all plausible. =/
Kadoes Khan	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:54:00 - [17] Originally by: 0rch1d I've recently become a passive tank addict. Love the Drake, and really not to jazzed about getting a Raven for level 4s, though I'm worried that my Drake will just take too long with level 4s and my ISK per hour ratio will suffer. Just how good can a Drake get? How possible is it to solo level 4s and not be sloppy about it? What is the absolute best passive set up there is for this beast? Can Heavy Missiles do the job, etc? I know the Darke can solo level 4s, but I don't want to be sitting there for hours. Then again, I love the whoel concept of the passive tank and how it works so beautifully. So should I just get totally lit with a passive Drake, or is rehab the answer? ;) Would appreciate any insight. It will be slow in a drake the difference between heavies(which you only get a boost to kinetic) and cruises(which you can use any type) is huge. Not sure why you dislike an active tank, the Raven can easily tank anything the lvl4s can toss out, the main point is you just need to realise it's an active tank. There is no need to be cap stable(in fact making yourself cap stable hurts more than it helps). With the Raven's DPS you rarely have to run the booster for longer than about 1-2 minutes. -=^=- "Someday the world will recognize the genius in my insanity."
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 17:55:00 - [18] Originally by: Bokabeus Of course it is better to active tank it. But we are having this discussion because the man wanted to know whether a passive tank is at all plausible. =/ That's not really what I got from the OP. Especially when running a perma-XL is pretty much the same thing as a passive tank.
Ziena Amani	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:09:00 - [19] Originally by: AstroPhobic That's not really what I got from the OP. Especially when running a perma-XL is pretty much the same thing as a passive tank. Except if you get disconnected, all your mods get shut down
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:11:00 - [20] Originally by: Ziena Amani Except if you get disconnected, all your mods get shut down Except they don't.

Ziena Amani	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:23:00 - [21] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Ziena Amani Except if you get disconnected, all your mods get shut down Except they don't. Next time I'll lose perma-tank ship due to d/c, I'll tell myself "It's fine, I'm just daydreaming" Oh, except I don't fly perma-tank ships due to the first and the last time I managed to "test" it
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:25:00 - [22] Originally by: Ziena Amani Next time I'll lose perma-tank ship due to d/c, I'll tell myself "It's fine, I'm just daydreaming" Not my fault if your ship can't tank the whole pocket, perma shield booster ships aren't meant to tank entire pockets. Mods DONT turn off when you DC, that I'm absolutely positive.
Ziena Amani	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:28:00 - [23] Originally by: AstroPhobic Not my fault if your ship can't tank the whole pocket, perma shield booster ships aren't meant to tank entire pockets. Mods DONT turn off when you DC, that I'm absolutely positive. Yeah, ok. Everyone has the right to enjoy his own personal fantasies anyhow.
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:30:00 - [24] Originally by: Ziena Amani Yeah, ok. Everyone has the right to enjoy his own personal fantasies anyhow. How many times have you probed out an interceptor that logged off in your space? How about a perma MWD ishtar? 0. Its because their mods dont turn off when logged. Don't argue about things that you have no clue about.
Disco Flint The Flaming Sideburn's	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:41:00 - [25] I had a disconnect about 1h ago. My mods did not turn off and I don't remember my mods EVER turning off when I disconnected.
Ziena Amani	Posted - 2008.08.30 18:45:00 - [26] Hm, then I'm mistaken, simple as that :P My case was in a duo of death mission, could've tanked them forever. Electricity went down for around an hour, then I found myself in a pod Could be other reasons ofc, first of them would be non-capstable setup.. but was not the case. About perma-MWD ishtars.. er, well, it's not this. What happens when it logs off? Right, in case he's not tackled he initiates emergency warp out, MWD does turn off.
Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.31 00:32:00 - [27] Originally by: Ziena Amani Hm, then I'm mistaken, simple as that :P Except you made a big stink about how you were right and that was funny and we are laughing at you. If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.31 03:36:00 - [28] Originally by: Ziena Amani About perma-MWD ishtars.. er, well, it's not this. What happens when it logs off? Right, in case he's not tackled he initiates emergency warp out, MWD does turn off. If he's flagged (more than likely), he stays for the remainder before he warps off into nowhere. D'oh.
BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.08.31 05:14:00 - [29] Originally by: Ghoest Originally by: Ziena Amani Hm, then I'm mistaken, simple as that :P Except you made a big stink about how you were right and that was funny and we are laughing at you. lololololololol oh and the reason u died is i expect u were desynching before power went out or something and u may have thought ur mods were on and they werent. Or u were just too stoned and frogot to turn them on at all x) Proudly annoying FC's since 2007
Shardrael Caldari Titan Industries Technology Team Shadow of xXDEATHXx	Posted - 2008.08.31 05:35:00 - [30] just permarun a large tank, same laziness as passive but allows you to kick ass with a raven

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