Originally by: Tatsujin Koufu

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Originally by: Ki An

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Originally by: Tatsujin Koufu

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When did they make high sec 100% safe?

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I said AFTER. When the war dec changes goes through and the 'griefing' is gone, PvP will only happen to you if you want it to. That's 100% safe.

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Since your clearly an Oracle or something, riddle me this

Tell me, exactly, how will the changes to wardecs be made. I need a full list of conditions that are usable, penalty mechanics and costs please

Oh thats right, you dont actually know for sure do you?

Change can be a terrible thing, but resistance to it is just futile, pointless and in the end a waste of time

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Originally by: Shady's Lady

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Originally by: Kin Dahl

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Ive already posted that I have never suicide ganked or been involved with suicide ganks, I have sat at gates and scanned afk haulers in my frigate, amazed at what people will haul while they are off doing whatever.
My main concern is High sec will become a no pvp zone, whether its suiciding, war decs, or scamming. I dont like the road that CCP is taking in regards to High Sec.
Im worried what the future is for high sec. There will always be low sec and 0.0, but the whole reason I started playing this game is because of the risk, the whole you are not safe anywhere, including high sec.

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Sorry, but that doesn't make sense. You say you joined this game because of the risk but you seem to be telling us that you spend your time in hi-sec which is hardly what you'd call risky.

Those of us in 0.0 dont give a rats toss what happens in hi-sec. ie. to all intents and purposes it might as well not exist.

Your statements here have done nothing to change why I think you're posting and have instead strengthened my suspicion you are a hi-sec griefer upset that he can't grief people so easily anymore.

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Originally by: Gildoom

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I love people that ASSUME everyone wants to play their way, I have zero desire to invest months of doing level 4 missions to lose a battleship to some suicide gankers. I think it is idiotic and I applaud their fixing of this. Bet you were one of the same people that laughed at me when I was upset about the Torpedo nerf, get over it.

Reality is, companies expand or die, CCP made a good decision to protect it's "bread and butter", you don't like WoW is that way ---->

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Originally by: Tatsujin Koufu

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Originally by: Ki An

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Originally by: Tatsujin Koufu

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When did they make high sec 100% safe?

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I said AFTER. When the war dec changes goes through and the 'griefing' is gone, PvP will only happen to you if you want it to. That's 100% safe.

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Since your clearly an Oracle or something, riddle me this

Tell me, exactly, how will the changes to wardecs be made. I need a full list of conditions that are usable, penalty mechanics and costs please

Oh thats right, you dont actually know for sure do you?

Change can be a terrible thing, but resistance to it is just futile, pointless and in the end a waste of time

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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Edited by: Somealt Ofmine on 02/09/2008 20:25:28
Use the whine, Luke!

For crissakes, will this ever end? The sec in high-sec is, errr, high, m'kay?

If you're lookin' to gank folks there's a whole big universe waiting for you beyond those jumps into .4 where the sec is, well, not so high.

High sec is predictable, steady, not so exciting. It's the place you go when you can't afford to go backwards, or just don't want to, and prefer a slow, steady grind to making a quick name or pile of isk for yourself.

You can't conquer or lose any space there. There are no officer spawns that will make you an instant billionaire. No plexes that are worth a damn. It's civilization, rather than the wild-wooly frontier.

Its there for a reason. Its always been there. It'll always be there.

If the devs get the idea that something about it is getting out of hand, you can expect the nerf bat to come out, just like it did with dual MWD Ravens, and Nanos, and Nos, and WCS, and just about every other FOTM that has come down the pike. Suicide ganks were becoming the FOTM. They got whacked. If that comes as a suprise to you, you either haven't been playing long, or you haven't been paying attention.

I do love the "Eve is becoming WoW!!!" hysterics. I think references to WoW are kind of like ****** references. When somebody starts comparing whatever game you're playing to WoW, they've run out of something to say, and the thread is over. When you die and you end up back in your hanger with your ship intact, talk to me about WoW. Until then, get a grip, huh?

Wow, you can't say Hittler? Nevermind. Is it time for our milk and our nap yet?

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Originally by: Julietta

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Originally by: Malcanis

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That's like asking a football team to accommodate players who only like non-contact sport.

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Which is incredibly easy. You have a game on one field where rough tackling's allowed, and a game on another field where it isn't.

We have 0.0 and lowsec space where anything goes, and highsec space where it doesn't. Why the problem?

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Originally by: NocturnalDeath

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No idea why they are encouraging the large majority of their player base to find other PvP mmorpg's to play

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Originally by: Slim Goodbody

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Originally by: NocturnalDeath

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No idea why they are encouraging the large majority of their player base to find other PvP mmorpg's to play

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How about you enumerate these other PvP mmorpg's for us....


There aren't many out there and none even close to the quality of EVE.

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Originally by: BobbyCarter

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I think this nerf shows a great deal of care and thought by CCP to keep both parties happy, and both playstyles relevant. Heres the thing nobody seems to get... Suicide ganking, even under the new system, is pretty much a zero risk activity. The risk-reward ratio everyone keeps touting is seemingly still HEAVILY in the suicide gankers favor.

I see it this way, the afk-hauler is taking a risk by autopiloting, there could be someone at the gate he's warping to, ready to pop him. His reward is reaching his destination without the need of constantly interacting with the piloting interface and whatever profit awaits him for MOVING his cargo to the destination. The afk hauler is in a high risk, moderate reward scenario due to his choices.

The suicide ganker risks his fully insured crap fit ship, which is really next to nothing in terms of isk loss, and until now a miniscule hit to standings. They also risk failing to gank their target, but under the current system unless the pilot is balls, success is nearly gauranteed. His/her reward for successfully suicide ganking a target is the value OF the cargo, not just the profit had through moving it to a new area.

I fail to see the problem here, a very low risk, very high reward game mechanic has been nudged into line. The risk has been increased by a quicker response time (no assurance of success) and higher penalties (you can't do it as often). Suicide gankers still lose very little money, but the chances of success and large rewards are not as great.

I think this is a great balance to strike, as the suiciders need to be picky about their targets. They are still free to try as many times as possible without isk loss, the only penalty being the need to eventually return to 0.0 and grind up some concorde standing.

In conclusion, suicide ganking will now require more skill as it needs to be done quicker, but the underlying mechanic of punishing idiot afk haulers is still alive and kicking.

P.S. I am all for an equivilant adjustment to highsec rewards, I think that the amount of ore spawned in highsec roids could do with a reduction, as well as the isk rewards for mission running. I would also like to advocate that mission rats drop less salvage in general, belt/complex rats should be the primary source of salvage.

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Originally by: Malcanis

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that's fine.

I wonder if the devs are getting the idea that hi-sec level 4 mission-grinding is getting out of hand.

I trust you will maintain your lofty objective tone if they do.

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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Originally by: Malcanis

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that's fine.

I wonder if the devs are getting the idea that hi-sec level 4 mission-grinding is getting out of hand.

I trust you will maintain your lofty objective tone if they do.

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Well, as someone who runs maybe two of them a week, I probably won't have much trouble.

I don't see how they could, though, frankly. Economically, they are fairly well self-balancing. They are both an isk and materials faucet. It's pretty easy for CCP to adjust the amount of loot they generate to offset the addition to the money supply that they represent.

Other than a potential enconomic effect that really doesn't exist, they don't hold out much potential to effect anyone else's game play. They do cause lag in the mission hub systems, but if you aren't running missions, you aren't likely to be there anyway.

They aren't really analogous to suicide ganking, or nanos, or even war-decs, which, by definition, do effect other people's game play.

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Originally by: Ki An

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Wrong. Once again you show how clueless you are. Please post with your main so I can laugh at you.

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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You'll have to excuse me if I don't accept that I'm wrong just 'cause Ki An says so. Exactly how am I wrong?

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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It's alright, you can go ahead and laugh at my alt. I'll care just about as much either way.

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Originally by: Ki An

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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You'll have to excuse me if I don't accept that I'm wrong just 'cause Ki An says so. Exactly how am I wrong?

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You continue to try to spread the lie/misconception that mission runners don't affect anyone else. Either you don't know better, despite being told multiple times (i.e. you're an idiot) or you are deliberately trying to spread misinformation (i.e. you're a liar). Personally I'm leaning towards the first option, but it's still open for debate.

Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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It's alright, you can go ahead and laugh at my alt. I'll care just about as much either way.

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I'll be honest with you. I had hoped you would post with your main so that I could war dec you, you could jump corp, I could dec your next corp, you could jump again... etcetera ad infintium just to make an even bigger mockery over CCPs catering to carebears by allowing corp jumping to avoid fights but not corp jumping to initiate them.

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Originally by: Ki An

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You're joking, right? Have you read the patch notes? Suicide ganking is more or less dead. Freighters have nothing to worry about in high sec anymore. Peace and love reigns supreme. Now they just have to nerf war decs too (not that they have to, as you can just corp hop) and it will be perfect for the high sec bear.

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Originally by: Ki An

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You continue to try to spread the lie/misconception that mission runners don't affect anyone else. Either you don't know better, despite being told multiple times (i.e. you're an idiot) or you are deliberately trying to spread misinformation (i.e. you're a liar). Personally I'm leaning towards the first option, but it's still open for debate.

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Quote:

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I'll be honest with you. I had hoped you would post with your main so that I could war dec you, you could jump corp, I could dec your next corp, you could jump again... etcetera ad infintium just to make an even bigger mockery over CCPs catering to carebears by allowing corp jumping to avoid fights but not corp jumping to initiate them.

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Originally by: Ki An

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I'll be honest with you. I had hoped you would post with your main so that I could war dec you, you could jump corp, I could dec your next corp, you could jump again... etcetera ad infintium just to make an even bigger mockery over CCPs catering to carebears by allowing corp jumping to avoid fights but not corp jumping to initiate them.

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Originally by: Malcanis

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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Edited by: Somealt Ofmine on 02/09/2008 20:25:28
Use the whine, Luke!

For crissakes, will this ever end? The sec in high-sec is, errr, high, m'kay?

If you're lookin' to gank folks there's a whole big universe waiting for you beyond those jumps into .4 where the sec is, well, not so high.

High sec is predictable, steady, not so exciting. It's the place you go when you can't afford to go backwards, or just don't want to, and prefer a slow, steady grind to making a quick name or pile of isk for yourself.

You can't conquer or lose any space there. There are no officer spawns that will make you an instant billionaire. No plexes that are worth a damn. It's civilization, rather than the wild-wooly frontier.

Its there for a reason. Its always been there. It'll always be there.

If the devs get the idea that something about it is getting out of hand, you can expect the nerf bat to come out, just like it did with dual MWD Ravens, and Nanos, and Nos, and WCS, and just about every other FOTM that has come down the pike. Suicide ganks were becoming the FOTM. They got whacked. If that comes as a suprise to you, you either haven't been playing long, or you haven't been paying attention.

I do love the "Eve is becoming WoW!!!" hysterics. I think references to WoW are kind of like ****** references. When somebody starts comparing whatever game you're playing to WoW, they've run out of something to say, and the thread is over. When you die and you end up back in your hanger with your ship intact, talk to me about WoW. Until then, get a grip, huh?

Wow, you can't say Hittler? Nevermind. Is it time for our milk and our nap yet?

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that's fine.

I wonder if the devs are getting the idea that hi-sec level 4 mission-grinding is getting out of hand.

I trust you will maintain your lofty objective tone if they do.

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