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Connner
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.03 16:49:00 -
[1]
I had this idea from another thread. In the tabletop strategy game Starfleet Battles there is a ship class called Q ships. They have a freighter hull and when scanned give off all signs as being a freightor, untill the prey (Orion Pirates) gets close. Then up go the shields and weapons charged, Suprise its not a frieghtor but a fairly well armed cruiser.
I think this could be cool in Eve. Get a ship class w/ the same hull as say, a Hulk; then make a module that acts similar to a cloak, when active if the ship is scanned it will return results exactly as if it were a real Hulk (even right click--> show info). But once the mod is deactivated (as cloak) after maybe a delay like a cloak the ship shows up as an actual fighting ship (still with a Hulk hull to save on grapics). The mod should only be able to be fitted by this ship and for each level for the skill reduces the fireing delay time.
I think this would really make low/null sec a lot more exciting. What do think?
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Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.09.03 16:51:00 -
[2]
I think I'd engage with overwhelming firepower... just like I do now.
-Liang -- I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent. -- Mahatma Gandhi |
Connner
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.03 16:53:00 -
[3]
lol, of course it wouldn't be immune to a gang or whatever, but maybe a soloer might think twice about attacking a lone miner. Or the ship could be used to setup rat traps. It would definately be a niche ship, but it might be interesting?
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.09.03 16:54:00 -
[4]
The only reason it worked in SFB was because pirates were considerably inferior to navy ships, so Q-ships could be balanced to be effective against pirates, but not good enough to go up against navy ships and survive (making navy ships obsolete). In EVE, on the other hand, there's no difference between the two, pirates are using the best ships and equipment. So that gives you a pretty major problem, any Q-ship that can kill a pirate (especially one that can do it in the usual "surprise, you're dead" Q-ship way) will be too effective in normal combat.
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Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.09.03 16:58:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin The only reason it worked in SFB was because pirates were considerably inferior to navy ships, so Q-ships could be balanced to be effective against pirates, but not good enough to go up against navy ships and survive (making navy ships obsolete). In EVE, on the other hand, there's no difference between the two, pirates are using the best ships and equipment. So that gives you a pretty major problem, any Q-ship that can kill a pirate (especially one that can do it in the usual "surprise, you're dead" Q-ship way) will be too effective in normal combat.
All things considered, it's not too disimilar from what recons do now. It'd make for an amusing alternative mod to the covops cloak. ;-)
-Liang -- I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent. -- Mahatma Gandhi |
Connner
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.03 17:04:00 -
[6]
Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
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Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.09.03 17:12:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Connner Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
Just imagine if my Sin could do this... ;-)
-Liang -- I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent. -- Mahatma Gandhi |
Wil Smithx
Minmatar Suns Of Korhal
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Posted - 2008.09.03 17:25:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Wil Smithx on 03/09/2008 17:25:38 It would be awesome if you could come up on scanner as a different ship...
Mimic other ships in enemy gangs and screw their intel.
Edit: Not any old ship doing this lol, but like black ops or something
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Connner
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.03 17:33:00 -
[9]
It would certinally give Cov/black ops type craft a bigger role.
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Webster Carr
Gallente Magellan Exploration and Survey
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Posted - 2008.09.03 20:07:00 -
[10]
It'd also be fun to go the other way and make my Sin look like a Moros...
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Johann Callasan
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Posted - 2008.09.03 20:46:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Connner I had this idea from another thread. In the tabletop strategy game Starfleet Battles there is a ship class called Q ships. They have a freighter hull and when scanned give off all signs as being a freightor, untill the prey (Orion Pirates) gets close. Then up go the shields and weapons charged, Suprise its not a frieghtor but a fairly well armed cruiser.
I think this could be cool in Eve. Get a ship class w/ the same hull as say, a Hulk; then make a module that acts similar to a cloak, when active if the ship is scanned it will return results exactly as if it were a real Hulk (even right click--> show info). But once the mod is deactivated (as cloak) after maybe a delay like a cloak the ship shows up as an actual fighting ship (still with a Hulk hull to save on grapics). The mod should only be able to be fitted by this ship and for each level for the skill reduces the fireing delay time.
I think this would really make low/null sec a lot more exciting. What do think?
They existed in RL as well, not just in Starfleet Battles - a Q-ship is a Real Life concept. They became less and less effective as weapons became more and more though...by thier nature a Q-ship is not as effective as a actual warship, being built on a non-purpose-designed hull.
TBH, I never visualized any kind of Q-ship in EvE as being a miner - I always envisioned them (as in RL) them being based either on a indy or freighter hull. Imagine, back before the suicide ganker nerf,..
Said ganker sees a nice fat Iteron approaching the gate. he targets and scans, sees what he thinks is a nice fat cargo. He oipens up - only to find that the iteron has 80% resistances. Panels fly open along the sides, revealing blasters - and a swarm of drones flies out. He tries to warp - and is scrambled. Further, that ominous warning of imminent CONNCORDdokkening sounds...
Lulz would ensue :)
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Syringe
Morphine Inc
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Posted - 2008.09.03 20:51:00 -
[12]
BATTLEMAMMOTH!!!!!! --------- War isn't the answer. However, the objective isn't to provide answers rather than eliminate the question. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.09.03 21:23:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Connner Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
And this is why it isn't going to happen. If you have a ship that can fight as a BB or BC AND hide its real identity, why would you fly a BB or BC?
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Tamoko
Damage Unlimited Inc INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.09.03 21:32:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Connner Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
The Team Fortress Spy comes to mind...
Originally by: "Bellum Eternus" Is 'speed tank' code for 'completely invulnerable'?
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Tamoko
Damage Unlimited Inc INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.09.03 21:59:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Originally by: Connner Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
And this is why it isn't going to happen. If you have a ship that can fight as a BB or BC AND hide its real identity, why would you fly a BB or BC?
Not necessarily agreeing with the OP (:P) but we have a line of battleships which can jump through cyno fields and cloak... why in the world would anyone want to fly a BS now?
Originally by: "Bellum Eternus" Is 'speed tank' code for 'completely invulnerable'?
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Cpt Branko
Surge.
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Posted - 2008.09.03 23:39:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 03/09/2008 23:39:29
Originally by: Tamoko
Not necessarily agreeing with the OP (:P) but we have a line of battleships which can jump through cyno fields and cloak... why in the world would anyone want to fly a BS now?
Uhhh.... have you seen the Black OPS combat efficency?
Not mentioning the price, just look at combat efficency ;)
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
AstroPhobic
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.09.03 23:47:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin And this is why it isn't going to happen. If you have a ship that can fight as a BB or BC AND hide its real identity, why would you fly a BB or BC?
Cost, targeting delay. Cost. Cossssst.
Why would I fly a harbinger now instead of an absolution? Cost.
Not all of us have dysprosium moons at our disposal.
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Tamoko
Damage Unlimited Inc INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.09.03 23:58:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 03/09/2008 23:39:29
Originally by: Tamoko
Not necessarily agreeing with the OP (:P) but we have a line of battleships which can jump through cyno fields and cloak... why in the world would anyone want to fly a BS now?
Uhhh.... have you seen the Black OPS combat efficency?
Not mentioning the price, just look at combat efficency ;)
Congrats genius. My point, exactly.
Originally by: "Bellum Eternus" Is 'speed tank' code for 'completely invulnerable'?
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Rogerano
Minmatar Einherjar Rising Cry Havoc.
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Posted - 2008.09.04 06:32:00 -
[19]
Hmmm, this mimic concept is pretty hot actually. The actual implementation would need work, but something like it would certainly spice things up a bit - esp in a game which is lacking certain spices at the moment. |
Jacob Holland
Gallente Weyland-Vulcan Industries
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Posted - 2008.09.04 07:14:00 -
[20]
If you think a Q-Ship is a miner then look on the videos forum - there's at least one video of a Hulk baiting and soloing all sorts. As most Q-Ships were merchantmen however you should probably look for the BattleMammoth, haulers take down a Vagabond and similar videos. The concept of the "Battle Badger" is one which keeps being revisited for precisely the reasons Q-Ships were viable in the first place. --
Originally by: cordy
Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
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BiggestT
Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana
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Posted - 2008.09.04 08:20:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Connner Thats a good point. Its still effective though. Imagine a "Hulk" out 0.0 mining alone or in a group. A pirate comes accross and opens up. The "Hulk" de-cloakes (or whatever you want to call it) and tackles or opens up a can of whoop a$$ fighting as a BS or BC, tanking until backup or a waiting gang warps in to assist.
Just imagine if my Sin could do this... ;-)
-Liang
/signed, give black ops this module :D Proudly annoying FC's since 2007
Originally by: Sherrif Jones
*ding ding!*
Wrangler: Hello and w-
*ding ding!*
Wrangler: Damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*
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Connner
JUDGE DREAD Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.04 11:02:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
And this is why it isn't going to happen. If you have a ship that can fight as a BB or BC AND hide its real identity, why would you fly a BB or BC?
That was just an example. The balance would have to be worked out for the actual stats of the ship by people who are more attuned to that sort of thing than I am. I'm just bringing up the concept. After making this post, I did get curious about why they were called Q-Ships and read up on the real world aspect. The RL Q-ships didn't work out so well, but then again they didn't have the tech that the Eve-verse has. I still think it would work.
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Cpt Branko
Surge.
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Posted - 2008.09.04 11:04:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 04/09/2008 11:05:03
Originally by: Tamoko
Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 03/09/2008 23:39:29
Originally by: Tamoko
Not necessarily agreeing with the OP (:P) but we have a line of battleships which can jump through cyno fields and cloak... why in the world would anyone want to fly a BS now?
Uhhh.... have you seen the Black OPS combat efficency?
Not mentioning the price, just look at combat efficency ;)
Congrats genius. My point, exactly.
The OP was suggesting ships which can actually fight worth a damn, unlike Black OPS.
Besides, what's the problem with using battle-badgers/battle-mammoths/battle-iteronVs (and battle Hulks, etc)? It is the Q ship people are looking for actually, a combat-refit hauler ;P
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Crellion
Art of War Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.04 11:13:00 -
[24]
If they fight it will be bad but what if the mod requires 3x weapon hardpoints and can only fit in frig class vessels?
You attack a ratting Raven and then you realise it is in fact an Ares tackling you and local is rising... OOPS! Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
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