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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Jas Dor
Republic University Minmatar Republic
82
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Posted - 2012.03.28 05:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
So CCP is going to change to dec system so that you can no longer scrape a dec with a dec shield. Also, there is going to be a price break for deccing small corps (they're going to a base price + target member count system). We will also be getting extreme rigs and drone damage mods.
From what I can see, this pretty much spells the end of any high sec POSes smaller than larges, and even those might be in trouble. Sentry drone pretty much make ECM mods useless. If Sentries start doing descent damage all you've really got as a deterrent is a large enough amount of EHP.
This change really needs to happen with a POS overhaul. You think inflations bad now, wait until we start loosing a bunch of industrial capacity. |
Maria Yumeno
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.03.28 07:31:00 -
[2] - Quote
Source? |
Aubrey Addams
University of Caille Gallente Federation
9
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Posted - 2012.03.28 08:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
why? if i know correctly, now its 2mill to wardec some1, but it will be 20+mill in the future. |
Aurel Svenson
Cyclone Solutions
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 09:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
20M/week against a POS owner isn't all that significant. It's a billion ISK+ venture costing ~15M/day in fuel and can be ransomed for far, far more than a wardec.
Defensive alliances are where it's at. All the POS operators in an area (everyone within 2 jumps, say) should band together and all join any wars, sending a few mercs each; then it would take a very powerful aggressor to get anything done. |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
It will become very easy to hire mercs. Simple. http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif
How about fixing image-linking on the forums, CCP? I want to see signatures! |
Rengerel en Distel
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
20
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Posted - 2012.03.28 11:10:00 -
[6] - Quote
As much as i'd like to worry about the changes coming in the winter expansion, i'd rather worry about the summer one first. Actually, i'll wait until they actually post something beyond a roundtable.
Don't assume bad intent, when stupidity is the much more likely cause. |
Raven Ether
Republic University Minmatar Republic
115
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Posted - 2012.03.28 11:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Rigs and Drone damage mods?
For non sentry drones too? About time. |
Jurinak
Roboticslaboratorium
2
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Posted - 2012.03.28 13:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
Posshoting is boring as hell (next to icemining) nobody cares about your f... Highsec Pos if you are not 2j away from Jita. So cool down
And if someone shoot it...dont have any friends?? Ok you dont have. no prob at all. But a Tower doesn t cost more then a HAC so... who cares? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder Thundering Herd
461
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jurinak wrote:Posshoting is boring as hell (next to icemining) nobody cares about your f... Highsec Pos if you are not 2j away from Jita. So cool down
And if someone shoot it...dont have any friends?? Ok you dont have. no prob at all. But a Tower doesn t cost more then a HAC so... who cares?
It's not the cost. It's the hassle of re-anchoring, etc. OMG He Spent His Free-áAURUM ! God is simply-áthe very extraordinary power of the Universe to organize Itself as percieved. -á-á- Lee Smolin "Three Roads to Quantum Gravity" |
Aurel Svenson
Cyclone Solutions
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 13:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jurinak wrote:Posshoting is boring as hell (next to icemining) nobody cares about your f... Highsec Pos if you are not 2j away from Jita. So cool down
And if someone shoot it...dont have any friends?? Ok you dont have. no prob at all. But a Tower doesn t cost more then a HAC so... who cares?
And a tower's the only thing to lose?.. What about multiple 100M labs? A month's worth of fuel (450M for a large)? Things in construction (in 60M facilities)... It's an expensive proposition. |
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Jurinak
Roboticslaboratorium
2
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Posted - 2012.03.28 14:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
Aurel Svenson wrote:Jurinak wrote:Posshoting is boring as hell (next to icemining) nobody cares about your f... Highsec Pos if you are not 2j away from Jita. So cool down
And if someone shoot it...dont have any friends?? Ok you dont have. no prob at all. But a Tower doesn t cost more then a HAC so... who cares? And a tower's the only thing to lose?.. What about multiple 100M labs? A month's worth of fuel (450M for a large)? Things in construction (in 60M facilities)... It's an expensive proposition.
Yes the Tower is the only thing you loose, you can unanchor the labs when wardec is incomming or you can gamble if the attack the tower or not, its your joice. The only thing what happens is that you feel a little bit annoyed by anchor and unanchor and maybe you loose a longrun copy job
If you thing all this is to bad to do it then feel free to use NPC Station, then you have to wait a little bit or buy copy and research from someone else
And again there are no juggernauts with "YARRRRR we destroy all your Highsectower!!!!11111"
It is boring, it happens from time to time but not on a regular basis. And if it happens and you have no friends then hire merc or unanchor your labs whatever, its not 100% save anymore and that is fine |
Aurel Svenson
Cyclone Solutions
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 14:15:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jurinak wrote:Aurel Svenson wrote:Jurinak wrote:Posshoting is boring as hell (next to icemining) nobody cares about your f... Highsec Pos if you are not 2j away from Jita. So cool down
And if someone shoot it...dont have any friends?? Ok you dont have. no prob at all. But a Tower doesn t cost more then a HAC so... who cares? And a tower's the only thing to lose?.. What about multiple 100M labs? A month's worth of fuel (450M for a large)? Things in construction (in 60M facilities)... It's an expensive proposition. Yes the Tower is the only thing you loose, you can unanchor the labs when wardec is incomming or you can gamble if the attack the tower or not, its your joice. The only thing what happens is that you feel a little bit annoyed by anchor and unanchor and maybe you loose a longrun copy job If you thing all this is to bad to do it then feel free to use NPC Station, then you have to wait a little bit or buy copy and research from someone else And again there are no juggernauts with "YARRRRR we destroy all your Highsectower!!!!11111" It is boring, it happens from time to time but not on a regular basis. And if it happens and you have no friends then hire merc or unanchor your labs whatever, its not 100% save anymore and that is fine
Heh, hadn't considered the period between the wardec and the siege. I'll quietly bow out now... You could remove the tower too, couldn't you, and just lose the spot?
|
bornaa
GRiD.
138
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
This all ****** new war dec system is putting a barrier so that you cant war dec goons or test because it will cost you 5 BILLION isk per week.
You see, CCP want to secure large alliances from decs and screw smaller corps/alliances so that large one can easily attack them directly or with alt corps. And as i can see, they are really struggling to kill industry in EVE - no fixes or upgrades for indy players for years while making better ganking ships and now they want make so that everybody war decs them.
Nice one CCP.
And one more thing, when you are attacked you can't do anything about it. Attacker can easily get out of it - even if CCP is advertising this will make war more of commitment - yea, commitment for indy and smal corps to be screwed. |
Kirith Vespira
Border Zone Excursions
14
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Posted - 2012.03.28 16:08:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:So CCP is going to change to dec system so that you can no longer scrape a dec with a dec shield. Also, there is going to be a price break for deccing small corps (they're going to a base price + target member count system). We will also be getting extreme rigs and drone damage mods.
From what I can see, this pretty much spells the end of any high sec POSes smaller than larges, and even those might be in trouble. Sentry drone pretty much make ECM mods useless. If Sentries start doing descent damage all you've really got as a deterrent is a large enough amount of EHP.
This change really needs to happen with a POS overhaul. You think inflations bad now, wait until we start loosing a bunch of industrial capacity.
Please cite a Dev Blog for your announcement.
Thanks. |
Aurel Svenson
Cyclone Solutions
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:28:00 -
[15] - Quote
Since you're allowed to bring in allies, defensive alliances could offer a great deal of protection. It would be great if they could formalize that. If some bullies are working over POS owners, it's in the interest of local POS owners to contribute mercs to the conflict and make sure the aggressors never enter the system(s) again. And POS owners don't tend to be poor, so it should be manageable...
Just need to overcome the bystander effect.
Maybe a system could even hire a merc corp to set up shop full time, running their missions nearby and joining any wars that threaten the system. |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
238
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:58:00 -
[16] - Quote
I am all against this ****** "lets **** small and indy corps" changes.
source, FanFest: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4u0H3WA_UYA
And, listen to questions that people asked on the end. They all was worried about changes, and CCP gave the same lame answer. |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
173
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:37:00 -
[17] - Quote
Personally, I would like to know how CCP would like to address the very real possibility of someone just making over 9000 trial account characters to inflate corp membership. If trial accounts are to be excluded from some "internal" member count, then it's not that difficult to convert these accounts into subscribing accounts with the PLEX deal for a month and then ditch them, it still won't cost you anything other than time taken to do so.
Determining "inactive" member count and basing stuff off of that seems like it might not work so well. I mean, someone really dedicated and bored could just keep cranking out trial account alts and removing those who are past their "free" play time from the corp, thus keeping high numbers of fake active members by logging them in every once in a while.
Anyway, still seems exploitable |
Jas Dor
Republic University Minmatar Republic
82
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:00:00 -
[18] - Quote
Aurel Svenson wrote:20M/week against a POS owner isn't all that significant. It's a billion ISK+ venture costing ~15M/day in fuel and can be ransomed for far, far more than a wardec.
Defensive alliances are where it's at. All the POS operators in an area (everyone within 2 jumps, say) should band together and all join any wars, sending a few mercs each; then it would take a very powerful aggressor to get anything done.
So by deccing one group you can get a target rich environment? Same reason people dec goons now even though it costs billions, you're assured to get some kills.
|
Aurel Svenson
Cyclone Solutions
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 18:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
Jas Dor wrote:Aurel Svenson wrote:20M/week against a POS owner isn't all that significant. It's a billion ISK+ venture costing ~15M/day in fuel and can be ransomed for far, far more than a wardec.
Defensive alliances are where it's at. All the POS operators in an area (everyone within 2 jumps, say) should band together and all join any wars, sending a few mercs each; then it would take a very powerful aggressor to get anything done. So by deccing one group you can get a target rich environment? Same reason people dec goons now even though it costs billions, you're assured to get some kills.
Hmm, good point. I guess the group could submit money for a single large merc hire so that only one target is vulnerable but there's still collective defense. |
Tekota
The Freighter Factory
218
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:50:00 -
[20] - Quote
Whilst I certainly have some concerns about the proposed changes, many of which are noted above, it's worth keeping some context.
Dec shields were only quite recently moved to non-exploit status.
So a year or so ago, with dec shield an exploit, what did it take to dec a small research pos corp? If memory serves, 2 million isk dec fee and a 48 hour wait.
With the propsed changes what will it take to dec a small research pos corp? If I've read things right, it'll take c.20 million isk dec fee and a 24 hour wait.
Given that small and medium POS owning baby research corps existed a year ago quite happily - that is they got stomped on if unlucky/stupid/wrong place, wrong time but otherwise were overlooked - I can't really see this situation changing much under the proposed system. Ie. it's cheap and easy to stomp on small corps and their space assets, just as it (mostly) always has been. |
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Josie Alland
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2012.03.28 18:57:00 -
[21] - Quote
Tobiaz wrote:It will become very easy to hire mercs. Simple. You mean the same mercs who initiated the wardec using an alt corp? Or the ones who will take your money and do nothing? |
Katarina Reid
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
148
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:38:00 -
[22] - Quote
Josie Alland wrote:Tobiaz wrote:It will become very easy to hire mercs. Simple. You mean the same mercs who initiated the wardec using an alt corp? Or the ones who will take your money and do nothing?
what about the merc who work for free? they will be some cuz they dont have to pay for the war that way get more targets. To kill a large tower with ecm mods hardener and stuff going to be a bunch of targets. Also you are not limited by the amount of corps you can hire/invite to the war the attacker cant invite anyone. The attacker is stuck in the wardec for 1 week. I think wardec will backfire on alot of people. |
Zarific
Frekmacinations
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:39:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tekota wrote:Whilst I certainly have some concerns about the proposed changes, many of which are noted above, it's worth keeping some context.
Dec shields were only quite recently moved to non-exploit status.
So a year or so ago, with dec shield an exploit, what did it take to dec a small research pos corp? If memory serves, 2 million isk dec fee and a 48 hour wait.
With the propsed changes what will it take to dec a small research pos corp? If I've read things right, it'll take c.20 million isk dec fee and a 24 hour wait.
Given that small and medium POS owning baby research corps existed a year ago quite happily - that is they got stomped on if unlucky/stupid/wrong place, wrong time but otherwise were overlooked - I can't really see this situation changing much under the proposed system. Ie. it's cheap and easy to stomp on small corps and their space assets, just as it (mostly) always has been.
I beleive incentives have changed. From what I understood they are revamping the entire system, to the point that you can "pay off" for a system enforced 7 day dec free period. IE: Get wardecced, pay 75m to surrender, accepted by deccing corp as "payment" and they cannot redec for 7 days.
This gives an incentive to war dec and force payments that, from what I understand, is not currently available. Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Zar |
Severian Carnifex
119
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:32:00 -
[24] - Quote
The worst change CCP made. So again you want to screw little ppl and make love with big guys? Again you want to make ppl that don't want to PVP make the best/only war target??? You want that large alliances even don't need neutral alts for hi-sec hauling????? I see that you want to make large alliances safe everywhere and **** small so that they must disband. Thnx a lot... NOT!
make little guy pay 5B and large alliance 40 mill? Yea, thats the best. Screw the little guy, make so that everybody screw him, and he cant do anything about it, and make him leave the game. |
Cyniac
Twilight Star Rangers Black Thorne Alliance
179
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Severian Carnifex wrote:The worst change CCP made. So again you want to screw little ppl and make love with big guys? Again you want to make ppl that don't want to PVP make the best/only war target??? You want that large alliances even don't need neutral alts for hi-sec hauling????? I see that you want to make large alliances safe everywhere and **** small so that they must disband. Thnx a lot... NOT!
make little guy pay 5B and large alliance 40 mill? Yea, thats the best. Screw the little guy, make so that everybody screw him, and he cant do anything about it, and make him leave the game.
I think you missed the point.
And I agree with Tekota this change will at worst bring things back to how they were a year ago when war dec shields were an exploit and not an option. Chill - unless you really make someone angry at you, or have a loot pi+¦ata of a POS, for the most part you will be ignored.
And incidentally this provides an interesting incentive for small corps to become bigger corps... now if only they fixed POS's and the corp interface so that you could actually run a decent sized industrial corp without having to give everyone massive access rights to damage your work and your assets... |
Maria Yumeno
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.03.29 03:58:00 -
[26] - Quote
7 days after surrender seems a little short. If i were a merc, i would wait out the 7 day timer and re-dec as i knew i would get paid again for no effort :) It would bring in a good weekly income |
Sidrat Flush
Eve Industrial Corp
8
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Posted - 2012.03.29 04:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
Maria Yumeno wrote:7 days after surrender seems a little short. If i were a merc, i would wait out the 7 day timer and re-dec as i knew i would get paid again for no effort :) It would bring in a good weekly income
Or it could be a month in which case you only need to find about 8 small but rich corps and cycle between them. That's more regular than moon mining!
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LifeHatesMe
SKULLDOGS RED.OverLord
2
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Posted - 2012.03.29 05:14:00 -
[28] - Quote
Katarina Reid wrote:what about the merc who work for free? they will be some cuz they dont have to pay for the war that way get more targets. To kill a large tower with ecm mods hardener and stuff going to be a bunch of targets. Also you are not limited by the amount of corps you can hire/invite to the war the attacker cant invite anyone. The attacker is stuck in the wardec for 1 week. I think wardec will backfire on alot of people. What game are you playing? There are no mercs like that. Not in the 6+ years I've been playing.
Maria Yumeno wrote:7 days after surrender seems a little short. If i were a merc, i would wait out the 7 day timer and re-dec as i knew i would get paid again for no effort :) It would bring in a good weekly income lol god, bring the popcorn.
Apparently they will make it so after you surrender with the moola in hand, they can't war dec you back for a whole week. I already see the issue. Lets make a rolling corp of war dec corps; Privateer Alliance 1 Privateer Alliance 2 Privateer Alliance 3 Privateer Alliance 4 Privateer Alliance 5 Privateer Alliance 6
etc. Do they really think things through at all before they post fixes for these war dec things? |
Katarina Reid
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:38:00 -
[29] - Quote
LifeHatesMe wrote:Katarina Reid wrote:what about the merc who work for free? they will be some cuz they dont have to pay for the war that way get more targets. To kill a large tower with ecm mods hardener and stuff going to be a bunch of targets. Also you are not limited by the amount of corps you can hire/invite to the war the attacker cant invite anyone. The attacker is stuck in the wardec for 1 week. I think wardec will backfire on alot of people. What game are you playing? There are no mercs like that. Not in the 6+ years I've been playing.
Well wardecs after the change will cost alot. To dec goons u need 4b /week eve uni 800m /week. On my pvp alt i will join a big dec ally where they pay the dec's or just get add to dec's for free as a defender. More targets free is a good thing. |
Nevryn Takis
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:36:00 -
[30] - Quote
Well CCP wanted to nerf industry completely and they've just succeeded. If you're not part of a large alliance (read one of the 3 power block alliances) or in a npc corp, you can be griefed (sorry leggally wardeced) out of the game. This means NO POS's at all unless you part of a massive alliance block, so all the small industrials are now dead. Long live Goons. If this goes through then I'll be un-subbing - I doubt you'll miss me and I won't be shedding any tears. |
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