Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Morgan Brykein
Gallente Aliastra
|
Posted - 2008.09.19 05:46:00 -
[1]
We all know about the Amarrian religion, but the other possible religions in EVE are unknown, no doubt there are religions. The Minmatar likely have a multitude of people who follow the Amarrian religion. What about the other two though?
Something makes me doubt the Jove have any religion.
|
A Soporific
Caldari Venom Pointe Industries
|
Posted - 2008.09.19 06:09:00 -
[2]
I frankly know much less about them than I should but I know that the Achura and the Intanki both have a strong religious bent to them.
The Achuran faith-tradition is discussed in depth in the http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=862890On the Achura . The Intanki have a tradition based heavily around patterns of rebirth, sadly I do not have a quick link for them although it is covered in the character creation choices for them.
There are occasional references to other traditions among bloodlines that aren't as heavily defined by a given faith, but these are rarely fleshed out.
|
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.19 07:37:00 -
[3]
The Minmatar have some various tribal beliefs, from what I understand. I'm not sure how many Minmatar follow Amarr beliefs -- probably some, but I doubt lots do. Probably most that do wouldn't feel very welcome in the Republic and would leave (likely for the Ammatar Mandate, who obviously do follow Amarrian beliefs).
I'll go into more detail on other religions when I have a bit more time. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
Che Biko
Polytechnique Gallenteenne
|
Posted - 2008.09.19 09:52:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Che Biko on 19/09/2008 09:52:35 I think the Intaki practice a form of Buddhism.
|
Morgan Brykein
Gallente Aliastra
|
Posted - 2008.09.19 15:55:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Che Biko Edited by: Che Biko on 19/09/2008 09:52:35 I think the Intaki practice a form of Buddhism.
Or...since it's 23000-something, a religion that may have it's groundings in Buddhism.
|
Stitcher
Caldari Duty.
|
Posted - 2008.09.20 01:26:00 -
[6]
I personally have always considered it a nice idea if the ethnic Caldari - the Deteis and Civire - had an ancient reverence for natural spirits and their ancestors. It'd be a quiet, understated sort of religion, offering spiritual comfort without pretensions to ethical guidance. Imagine an especially shy and unassuming derivation of Shinto that lives on in little rituals and mannerisms across the State, but isn't necessarily formally practiced all that much.
There's not a lot of PF support for this idea, sadly. The strongest reference to any kind of Caldari religion is the chronicle "Cold Wind", which suggests that the early Caldari at least tended to personify natural forces. There's no reason why those spiritual roots wouldn't endure. -
Captain Verin "Stitcher" Tarn-Hakatain. |
Veron Daerth
Amarr Blood Meridian
|
Posted - 2008.09.20 06:32:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Veron Daerth on 20/09/2008 06:33:04 I always envisioned the Caldari as having a form of ancestor worship mixed with a polytheistic religion, much like the Japanese.
The Amarrian faith is based on (yes, its in the timeline) Catholicism, though there have been some... changes... in the 23odd thousand years or so since .. well, since now.
The Intaki belief of rebirth and reincarnation reminds me of Hinduism, especially in the way that (cant remember if I read it as PF, EVE Chron, forum discussion or what) it seems that they have different aspects for a single unified universal "power"/god. Call it karma if you wish, Hinduism isnt my speciality and I know just enough to get into trouble, so to speak.
The Matari... I would imagine they have a shamanistic form of religion, with various aspects and gods, possibly with some form of ancestor worship as well. (Think the Aesir mixed with native american tribal shamanism.)
All of this is of course, wildly speculative, and wholly unsupported, with the exception of the Amarr thing, which I actually remembered from way back when. Amarr timeline is here.
|
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.20 18:16:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Veron Daerth The Amarrian faith is based on (yes, its in the timeline) Catholicism
But not Roman Catholicism. The timeline mentions the 'Unified Catholic Church,' a rather redundent term, since catholic means universal. All Christian churches that use the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicene_Creed"Nicene Creed[/url] identify themselves as catholic (small 'c'). Roman Catholic, often simply Catholic (uppercase 'c'), refers to all churches in full communion with the Bishop of Rome (aka the Pope). This includes both the Latin Rite (what most people think of when they think of 'Catholic') and a number of Eastern Rite churches.
Also note that the term 'catholic' was used by Christians long before the Roman Catholic Church existed (Rome did not split from the other churches [who are now known as the Orthodox churches] until 1054 -- before that, I believe it was simply the Catholic Church [not Roman Catholic]).
So exactly what 'Unified Catholic Church' means is uncertain, but it's fairly clear that it doesn't mean the Roman Catholic Church in anything like its current form. Possibilities: Some sort of new movement encompasing more than one of the Abrahamic Religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam). Some sort of pan-Christian movement, possibly including elements from the Roman Catholic Church. A reunion between the Orthodox Churches and the Roman Catholic Churches, possibly including other churches that are in appostolic succession. Some movement from the Orthodox Churches that does not include the Roman Catholic Church, or at least not the Pope. Other ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
Vabjekf
|
Posted - 2008.09.20 22:44:00 -
[9]
"amarrian"?
I thought it was always just "amarr"? "this cup is amarr in origin, it was crafted in a third period amarr style and was probably used by amarr nobility, on amarr" etc.
|
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.20 23:25:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Vabjekf "amarrian"?
I thought it was always just "amarr"? "this cup is amarr in origin, it was crafted in a third period amarr style and was probably used by amarr nobility, on amarr" etc.
No. Amarr can perhaps be used as an adjective in some cases, but generally it is 'Amarrian.' Except for the language -- there are two times PF specifies the name of the Amarrian language, and it uses different names each time. In one case it calls it Amarrish, in the other, Amarrian. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
|
Morgan Brykein
Gallente Aliastra
|
Posted - 2008.09.21 02:58:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Morgan Brykein on 21/09/2008 02:59:05 The "United Catholic Church" exists in 3000-something, so it's entirely possible that some new change happens in the next thousand years. It's hard to tell, because nothing in the Amarrian religion resembles catholicism, almost nothing, actually.
There seems to be some things that suggest that the original colonists who became the Amarr were primarily middle-eastern, their language sounds like perhaps some highly warped form of Arabic, I dunno. Maybe in the next thousand years some highly warped up form of Islam shows up.
|
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.21 03:49:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Morgan Brykein Edited by: Morgan Brykein on 21/09/2008 02:59:05 The "United Catholic Church" exists in 3000-something, so it's entirely possible that some new change happens in the next thousand years. It's hard to tell, because nothing in the Amarrian religion resembles catholicism, almost nothing, actually.
I'd more say that nearly nothing resembles Catholicism (as we know it) specifically. We do have some things that resemble it, but only because they resemble all Abrahamic religions -- there are enough things that seem to refer to the Old Testament that make me relatively certain that the Amarrian religion is Abrahamic in origin. I'll go into detail later.
It's interesting to note that certain ideas that seem much more distinctly Christian or Islamic than Old Testament to me have been labled as heracy. See the description of the Sahtogas system, then the description of the Apocryphon.
Originally by: Morgan Brykein There seems to be some things that suggest that the original colonists who became the Amarr were primarily middle-eastern, their language sounds like perhaps some highly warped form of Arabic, I dunno. Maybe in the next thousand years some highly warped up form of Islam shows up.
I'm told by people more knowledgable in such things than myself that what we know of the Amarrian language seems very Persian. Also, what we know of their scripture tends to be somewhat poetic, and there is some other evidence to suggest the poetry is an important part of Amarr culture. It is my understanding (possibly incorrect) that this would support Arabic links. I have also been told that the Qu'ran is rather poetic.
It is clear, however, that whatever the original religion of the Amarrians, it is quite different from that now. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
Vabjekf
|
Posted - 2008.09.21 04:33:00 -
[13]
The idea could well be that in the future the ROMAN catholic church collapses, but the eastern catholic church remains, and forms the united catholic church. If this is the case its 'center' would be a bit more east (not rome but turky) and be in great position to mix in with all these other influences that are being felt looking at amarr.
|
Veron Daerth
Amarr Blood Meridian
|
Posted - 2008.09.23 13:46:00 -
[14]
Lol, really didnt mean to spark that off there. What I meant was that the religion of the Amarr Empire more closely resembles a pseudo-Christian faith rather than...say, Shintoism, or Buddhism.
Considering that EVE takes place what...23000 years in the future, and considering the differences that have occurred in the few thousand since Christianity has been founded, I would expect that there is quite a bit that changes.
|
Gaven Lok'ri
Amarr PIE Inc.
|
Posted - 2008.09.23 23:29:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Gaven Lok''ri on 23/09/2008 23:30:44
Quote:
I'm told by people more knowledgable in such things than myself that what we know of the Amarrian language seems very Persian. Also, what we know of their scripture tends to be somewhat poetic, and there is some other evidence to suggest the poetry is an important part of Amarr culture. It is my understanding (possibly incorrect) that this would support Arabic links. I have also been told that the Qu'ran is rather poetic.
Arab doesn't equal Persian. I know of few to no Arab elements in the Amarrian culture, as opposed to a vast number of Persian/Mesopotamian elements.
Only some Amarrian scripture is poetic. This is in keeping with most religious texts. Not really much to get from it.
The best proposed history I have seen is that they represent a near eastern branch of a much larger christian church. This fits the timeline and the eastern character of the Amarrian race.
The Christian roots are pretty much unarguable, (look at the front of the classic bestower) though I would say that anyone playing that up in their roleplay needs to seriously think what having 20,000 years of development would do to a religion. Just for an example: their scriptures are weird by modern standards as they consist of hundreds of thousands of square meters of volume for a single full copy. (we had to move one once, this was before freighters, it was annoying.) There is much more than just a "bible" in that. More like the entire Vatican library.
Of course, what Amarr really is is something more like:
CCP took an ancient Persian/Mesopotamian model of government and culture. They then added a monotheistic overlay. The result is something to which the closest real life comparison is the middle stages (I would say early to mid 11th century) of the Byzantine Empire.
Its history incorporates both of these traditions. The whole city of God episode is a thinly disguised transfer of an episode in Egyptian history. The slave culture is also very ancient near eastern in nature.
The single biggest thing to remember in Amarrian religion is that there is no concept of separation of church and state. The dichotomy does not exist.
This has an effect that seems alien to modern religious conceptions. Professions of faith are not really something I would consider "amarrian." Everyone is Amarrian if they are a non-Foriegn member of society, no need to make a point of saying you believe. Tradition is vital. If you don't follow tradition, you become a deviant. If you become a deviant people wonder what is going on with the religion.
I have a RL example of how this sort of dominance of a religion can work: In the 12th century (IIRC) a son of a french duke went off on crusade. While he was there, he converted to Islam. When he returned, there was no problem with this until he insisted that he would not share the friday fast.
I think Amarr is very much like this example. You are assumed to be Amarrian in faith until you start doing things that seem unamarran.
There is also a great deal of evidence that Amarr is a shame culture and not a guilt culture. It is not the thought that counts in Amarr. It is what you do. And even then, its not just what you do, its what you do in public (which would be any place your peers can see.)
Anyhow, that's probably enough rambling from me on Amarrian stuff.
Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.24 00:04:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Edited by: Gaven Lok''ri on 23/09/2008 23:30:44
Quote:
I'm told by people more knowledgable in such things than myself that what we know of the Amarrian language seems very Persian. Also, what we know of their scripture tends to be somewhat poetic, and there is some other evidence to suggest the poetry is an important part of Amarr culture. It is my understanding (possibly incorrect) that this would support Arabic links. I have also been told that the Qu'ran is rather poetic.
Arab doesn't equal Persian. I know of few to no Arab elements in the Amarrian culture, as opposed to a vast number of Persian/Mesopotamian elements.
Oops, that's me getting confused between different cultures and terms, everyone listen to Gaven, not me (nor Western media).
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Only some Amarrian scripture is poetic. This is in keeping with most religious texts. Not really much to get from it.
Well, certainly not all of it is particularly poetic (and I hear you have some more of it that I've not seen yet), but a fair amount of it seems rather poetic to me . . . perhaps not really something to link them to a specific culture unless you're looking to see connections, true, but I do think, combined with some other things we've seen (especially the Aura chron) that we have evidence for poetry being important in Amarr religion. Not indisputable evidence, but enough to make a good claim.
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri The Christian roots are pretty much unarguable, (look at the front of the classic bestower)
Though it could be debated if it has other influences, as well. And what type of Christianity, as they can be very different from each other.
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Anyhow, that's probably enough rambling from me on Amarrian stuff.
No! You ramble more, please. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
Veron Daerth
Amarr Blood Meridian
|
Posted - 2008.09.24 03:12:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Garion Avarr No! You ramble more, please.
Seconded, please. All the info and insight into my chosen people is all the better. Hehe, got a bit into character there, but you get the idea.
|
Gaven Lok'ri
Amarr PIE Inc.
|
Posted - 2008.09.24 07:21:00 -
[18]
This isn't really the thread for it. I just opened a thread with an older essay of mine on the scriptures that I don't think I have posted to this forum.
Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Garion Avarr
Amarr Zero Zero Traders YTMND.
|
Posted - 2008.09.24 14:55:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri This isn't really the thread for it.
I have some intentions of making one devoted to discussing general thoughts on the Amarr, both what is firmly supported by PF, and stuff that is more speculation. Of course, you're welcome to start it as well. ________________________________ This is not a signature. |
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |