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Marketmaking is dysfunctional

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:37:00 - [1] Example: There are 2 salesorders available. Quantity: Price: 5 100 10 200 I want to buy the 10 and I am willing to pay 200 in order to keep the 5 at 100 in the market. They may even be my own! I select the 10/200 order with a right-click and tip 10 and press buy. What happens? I takes the 5 at 100 and pays the seller 200 (1000 in all) for them, and takes another 5 from the 10/200 order, leaving this picture: Quantity: Price: 5 200 which was not intentional. As a buyer I choose what to buy and at what price. In the real stockmarkets I would never have paid 200 but 100 for the first 5. CCP you should choose what you want. Either I get the 10/200 order at 2000 isk, og I get the 5/100 and 5/200 at 1500 isk. Anything else is dysfunctional marketmaking. H E - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:37:00 - [2] Example: There are 2 salesorders available. Quantity: Price: 5 100 10 200 I want to buy the 10 and I am willing to pay 200 in order to keep the 5 at 100 in the market. They may even be my own! I select the 10/200 order with a right-click and tip 10 and press buy. What happens? I takes the 5 at 100 and pays the seller 200 (1000 in all) for them, and takes another 5 from the 10/200 order, leaving this picture: Quantity: Price: 5 200 which was not intentional. As a buyer I choose what to buy and at what price. In the real stockmarkets I would never have paid 200 but 100 for the first 5. CCP you should choose what you want. Either I get the 10/200 order at 2000 isk, og I get the 5/100 and 5/200 at 1500 isk. Anything else is dysfunctional marketmaking. H E - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:38:00 - [3] Implied buy order is implied. - DesuSigs
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:38:00 - [4] Implied buy order is implied. - DesuSigs
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:47:00 - [5] Edited by: Harper Ei on 25/09/2008 08:49:46 Originally by: Crumplecorn Implied buy order is implied. Implied price functionality is not applicable on the EVE markets, since there are a multitude of marketplaces (stations). It is applied locally, not globally. Also, implied price functionality is used when you are dealing with timefram shifts like for instance in dealing monthly contracts (synthetic orders). For normal trading it is not optimal, since it does not in itself generate more market liquidity. - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:47:00 - [6] Edited by: Harper Ei on 25/09/2008 08:49:46 Originally by: Crumplecorn Implied buy order is implied. Implied price functionality is not applicable on the EVE markets, since there are a multitude of marketplaces (stations). It is applied locally, not globally. Also, implied price functionality is used when you are dealing with timefram shifts like for instance in dealing monthly contracts (synthetic orders). For normal trading it is not optimal, since it does not in itself generate more market liquidity. - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:55:00 - [7] The idea is to suppress ISK transfer via the market. Monkey want item, monkey get item. Monkey wants to move ISK off a trial account. Try a little harder. While I agree that the system is a little awkward, I don't see why it is such a big deal. Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:55:00 - [8] The idea is to suppress ISK transfer via the market. Monkey want item, monkey get item. Monkey wants to move ISK off a trial account. Try a little harder. While I agree that the system is a little awkward, I don't see why it is such a big deal. Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:56:00 - [9] Originally by: Harper Ei Implied price I said implied order. I'm talking game mechanics, not econonomicanal stuff. - DesuSigs
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.09.25 08:56:00 - [10] Originally by: Harper Ei Implied price I said implied order. I'm talking game mechanics, not econonomicanal stuff. - DesuSigs


CCP Lingorm C C P	Posted - 2008.09.25 09:09:00 - [11] The EVE market is modelled after a Commodities market, in which you legally have to sell the lowest priced item to the buyer,even if they have offered more. Look at share markets and similar, this is how it works. CCP Lingorm CCP Quality Assurance QA Engineering Team Leader Originally by: Lord Fitz Eve is to WoW as Wow is to an 8 player game of Unreal Tournament.

Dashhammer II Amarr O RLY corp YTMND.	Posted - 2008.09.25 09:14:00 - [12] You all have too much time on your hands. - Dashhammer II
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.09.25 09:18:00 - [13] Originally by: Dashhammer II You all have too much time on your hands. I know I do. Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2008.09.25 09:27:00 - [14] Originally by: CCP Lingorm The EVE market is modelled after a Commodities market, in which you legally have to sell the lowest priced item to the buyer,even if they have offered more. Look at share markets and similar, this is how it works. Well, seems this model does not work hence the world wide crisis Sorry I pressed the 'report' button btw
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 14:46:00 - [15] Originally by: CCP Lingorm The EVE market is modelled after a Commodities market, in which you legally have to sell the lowest priced item to the buyer,even if they have offered more. Look at share markets and similar, this is how it works. But that is not how it works! Read my example. - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Veldya Guristari Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2008.09.25 15:09:00 - [16] Originally by: CCP Lingorm The EVE market is modelled after a Commodities market, in which you legally have to sell the lowest priced item to the buyer,even if they have offered more. Look at share markets and similar, this is how it works. That is not how it works. If it is based on a commodoties market he would have been sold the 5 at 100 and 5 at 200. He paid 200 for the 100 items.
Faife Minmatar Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.09.25 15:13:00 - [17] Edited by: Faife on 25/09/2008 15:14:34 NM, misread OP. i guess the game considers it not an auto sale, but you creating an open buy order that's then filled by a 3rd party from the open sell orders your buy order price applies, not the sell order price. shrug - - - i am a humble and inefficent ammo to dps converter
mistakes happen	Posted - 2008.09.25 15:53:00 - [18] Originally by: CCP Lingorm The EVE market is modelled after a Commodities market, in which you legally have to sell the lowest priced item to the buyer,even if they have offered more. Look at share markets and similar, this is how it works. In that case why are they still charged the higher price? Legally that should not happen, an offer is in no way and actual transaction.

CCP Gangleri Tanis. Corp Tanis. Alliance	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:00:00 - [19] This is working as intended. If you select a sell order and choose to buy from it then the system will charge you the price of said order but deliver goods from the cheapest one. This only happens if the two orders are in the same station. ------------------ Originally by: CCP PrismX Obviously this reply does not constitute a promise to do anything but I'd like to see the discussion take off and see opinions from both sides.

mistakes happen	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:02:00 - [20] Originally by: CCP Gangleri This is working as intended. If you select a sell order and choose to buy from it then the system will charge you the price of said order but deliver goods from the cheapest one. This only happens if the two orders are in the same station. My question is this then. Why in a game where scamming is okay and people need to think before they act would you not let someone rip someone off in the market? The way i see it is Working as intended to most MMORPG makers = Deal with it we dont care if it makes no sense


CCP Gangleri Tanis. Corp Tanis. Alliance	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:06:00 - [21] Originally by: Julius Rigel The idea is to suppress ISK transfer via the market. Monkey want item, monkey get item. Monkey wants to move ISK off a trial account. Try a little harder. While I agree that the system is a little awkward, I don't see why it is such a big deal. This person pretty much has it nailed down. ------------------ Originally by: CCP PrismX Obviously this reply does not constitute a promise to do anything but I'd like to see the discussion take off and see opinions from both sides.

mistakes happen	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:07:00 - [22] Originally by: CCP Gangleri Originally by: Julius Rigel The idea is to suppress ISK transfer via the market. Monkey want item, monkey get item. Monkey wants to move ISK off a trial account. Try a little harder. While I agree that the system is a little awkward, I don't see why it is such a big deal. This person pretty much has it nailed down. Now this makes a lot more sense.
Marchocias Silent Ninja's	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:10:00 - [23] Indeed, I have an example of just HOW it stops isk transfers: http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=873418 Worked out alright for me tho (so far). ---- Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaacoughcoughaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrr!!
Davich MacGregor Minmatar Stellar Products and Quality Resources	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:12:00 - [24] Originally by: Dashhammer II You all have too much time on your hands. LMAO. Truer words were never spoken.
mistakes happen	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:15:00 - [25] Originally by: Davich MacGregor Originally by: Dashhammer II You all have too much time on your hands. LMAO. Truer words were never spoken. Well, they are rebooting the server =)

CCP Chronotis	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:18:00 - [26] Just to point out, whilst the current behaviour is 'as designed', we do want to change bracket ordering to be more sensible than 'keep the change' method you have currently. It is correct to buy from the lowest seller, however it should be more intelligent in bracketing the order. Ideally we should bracket fill properly by quantity. Such that if you want to buy 100 units of something, and there are three orders of 50 @ 10, 30 @ 15 and and 40 @ 20 then it should fill the order (5010)+(3015)+(20*20) rather than taking 100 at 20 as now. So in short, I agree the current behaviour could be improved and should be.

Demitria Fernir Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:18:00 - [27] Originally by: Harper Ei In the real stockmarkets DON'T 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101001 I will Conquer My Signature Somewhere in the future 10100110010100101010011010100101001100101110101001
Shad0wsFury Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.09.25 16:18:00 - [28] Simple solution: post a buy order for what you want at the price you want to pay, and set it for instant. Using your example, if you put up a buy order under instant for 10 units at 200isk, you would buy the 5 at 100 for 200, and you'd get the other 5 for 200, but you'd get all 10 at once. Very simple.
Harper Ei	Posted - 2008.09.25 18:16:00 - [29] Originally by: CCP Chronotis Just to point out, whilst the current behaviour is 'as designed', we do want to change bracket ordering to be more sensible than 'keep the change' method you have currently. It is correct to buy from the lowest seller, however it should be more intelligent in bracketing the order. Ideally we should bracket fill properly by quantity. Such that if you want to buy 100 units of something, and there are three orders of 50 @ 10, 30 @ 15 and and 40 @ 20 then it should fill the order (5010)+(3015)+(20*20) rather than taking 100 at 20 as now. So in short, I agree the current behaviour could be improved and should be. That is great news! Hurry up! - This is not my main. I have no alts. I therefore have no main. This is me. Mains are for whiners only!
Vyktor Abyss IONSTAR Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.09.25 18:53:00 - [30] Gosh just look at all the Blue bars here... Does that mean the information blackout is oveur? :P



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