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Aiifa
Clann Fian Narwhals Ate My Duck
36
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Posted - 2012.03.30 12:41:00 -
[121] - Quote
Rico Minali wrote:Kaivar Lancer wrote:"Antisemitism rife in Eve Online"
"NAACP targets CCP in anti-racist campaign"
"Eve Online player commits suicide after racist cyber-bullying"
"Germany bans Eve Online after antisemitic scandal"
Some of the headlines that CCP can look forward to if it doesn't act. CCP is trying to attract subscribers from other countries like Japan who may not understand or appreciate dark, satirical humour. And obviously there are those knobheads who take things too far and start hurling racial and sexist insults. I remember listening to a pre-recorded vent where some corp members teased a female player and accused her of enjoying being raped by her now-deceased father. Obviously she logged in tears. Very ****** up.
Watch your back CCP. So your implying that people in Japan are somehow lacking in satirical senses of humour or are somehow unable to interact with the rest of the world without being offended? Are you serious?
Those slant-eyed orientals simply don't have the mental capacity to understand our gritty comedy amirite
NB: in the "real" world, racism, sexism and so forth continue to be disgusting, depressing and terrible problems that all thoughtful beings should be working against. The frontier to fight them is not within a webspaceships distraction where enraging people is a component of success. This final paragraph is for the benefit of the gaming press, you sloppy hacks you <3 because everyone on these forums is merely affecting righteous anger |
Helicity Boson
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
227
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:12:00 -
[122] - Quote
There are no jews in new eden, nor are the christians or muslims or hindus or buddhists.
Sure, there's some reeeeaaal crazy nutjobs up in Amarr who think God in on their side, but the more rational capsuleers wisely know there is but one breed of Gods in New Eden.
And they speak in voices that cracks hulls and scorch the earth. |
Staten Island
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:22:00 -
[123] - Quote
Aranakas wrote:I live in Germany, and if we're even accused of Anti-Semitism here, the government will send us to a concentration camp.
Good. |
Staten Island
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:26:00 -
[124] - Quote
Caliph Muhammed wrote:Kaivar Lancer wrote:"Antisemitism rife in Eve Online"
"NAACP targets CCP in anti-racist campaign"
"Eve Online player commits suicide after racist cyber-bullying"
"Germany bans Eve Online after antisemitic scandal"
Some of the headlines that CCP can look forward to if it doesn't act. CCP is trying to attract subscribers from other countries like Japan who may not understand or appreciate dark, satirical humour. And obviously there are those knobheads who take things too far and start hurling racial and sexist insults. I remember listening to a pre-recorded vent where some corp members teased a female player and accused her of enjoying being raped by her now-deceased father. Obviously she logged in tears. Very ****** up.
Watch your back CCP. On behalf of the viking people go to hell and a big laugh at your threats. This thread shows exactly how the silencing of speech begins. The problem is created out of thin air, in this case the Jewes have decided anti semitism is an issue in game. Next comes the reaction. All of said persuasion come out of the wood work with manufactured disgust. Then will come a solution. Here's where it gets deep. The initial solution will be to prevent anyone from saying anything directly about the mindset creating the dichotomy. The Jewes. Once this happens its impossible to ever stop the never ending crusade of divide and conquer originating from one direction. To object leads to being labeled a racist and when necessary antisemite. Its the first assault to place the special ones into a position of authority and power over anyone else. It work's out of game it can just as easily work in game. We need no special or protected classes in EVE. The bottom line is unless you reveal your ethnicity no one knows or cares but you.
Hey dumbass what's with the extra "e" in Jews?
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Staten Island
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:29:00 -
[125] - Quote
Staten Island wrote:Caliph Muhammed wrote:Kaivar Lancer wrote:"Antisemitism rife in Eve Online"
"NAACP targets CCP in anti-racist campaign"
"Eve Online player commits suicide after racist cyber-bullying"
"Germany bans Eve Online after antisemitic scandal"
Some of the headlines that CCP can look forward to if it doesn't act. CCP is trying to attract subscribers from other countries like Japan who may not understand or appreciate dark, satirical humour. And obviously there are those knobheads who take things too far and start hurling racial and sexist insults. I remember listening to a pre-recorded vent where some corp members teased a female player and accused her of enjoying being raped by her now-deceased father. Obviously she logged in tears. Very ****** up.
Watch your back CCP. On behalf of the viking people go to hell and a big laugh at your threats. This thread shows exactly how the silencing of speech begins. The problem is created out of thin air, in this case the Jewes have decided anti semitism is an issue in game. Next comes the reaction. All of said persuasion come out of the wood work with manufactured disgust. Then will come a solution. Here's where it gets deep. The initial solution will be to prevent anyone from saying anything directly about the mindset creating the dichotomy. The Jewes. Once this happens its impossible to ever stop the never ending crusade of divide and conquer originating from one direction. To object leads to being labeled a racist and when necessary antisemite. Its the first assault to place the special ones into a position of authority and power over anyone else. It work's out of game it can just as easily work in game. We need no special or protected classes in EVE. The bottom line is unless you reveal your ethnicity no one knows or cares but you. Hey dumbass what's with the extra "e" in Jews? Oh and stopping ******* Penguins, its screwing with your brain.
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Quaaid
EVE Pilot Help Center
14
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:32:00 -
[126] - Quote
Great, now I have to go listen to NOFX - The Brews.
OI OI
Anyone have a good recorded version of that anyway? |
Nu Tra
All Seeing Eye
0
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:35:00 -
[127] - Quote
Watch from 3:21
Political Correctness
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Basileus Volkan
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
107
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:47:00 -
[128] - Quote
There is such a thing as assent through inaction and political correctness, even if it is often misused, tries to remedy this problem a bit. That being said, the issue of who-called-whom-by-what-slur is really a minor one in a game such as EvE. If you really wanted to, you could easily dig up tons of "offensive" bits. "Why, for example, are there only ever high-heeled boots available to female characters? That's sexist!" "The only black people are found among the Minmatar, that's racist!"
The nomenclature used in the game is so far removed from the actual religion it becomes meaningless. |
Moon Kitten
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
19
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:49:00 -
[129] - Quote
Callduron wrote: I believe it originally came to Eve via Goons from the Something Awful boards where there's a tolerance for many things that people wouldn't want in Eve. The N-word is dropped as often as the word jew over there. But that's there and just because it's permitted there doesn't mean it should be permitted here.
I laughed at this because if you tried to use the N-word and jew on somethingawful you'd find yourself banned fast enough to spin your head around.
I went to check and on the first page of bans listed two of them are for racism with reasons such as "I couldn't finish reading this post, so I'm going to assume that all of it was stupid racist bullshit and that you shouldn't be posting on this forum." This is not counting "probations" which are warnings whereby you can't post again for a certain amount of time. Racism and other ethnic slurs are absolutely not tolerated and will get you instantly banned. |
Aiifa
Clann Fian Narwhals Ate My Duck
36
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:51:00 -
[130] - Quote
better than the alternative |
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Kiandoshia
Gnampf Inc.
25
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Posted - 2012.03.30 13:58:00 -
[131] - Quote
Jesus ******* Christ.. Could you just play the game instead of posting **** like this? >_>
I think I may have pwned myself there actually... /me goes back to playing with spaceships. |
JackStraw56
Run Like an Antelope Knights of Tomorrow
45
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:01:00 -
[132] - Quote
I find the use of the word Jew to be offensive in the way it is used in the game as well.
There are a couple other words that are thrown around casually that also bother me - fa**ot and ni***er. I wish it was just a result of the younger naive players using these words, but I've seen them used too widely for that to be the case.
If you read some of the forum dumps for various alliances that spies have released, the use of these words is even worse than in game in many cases.
I find the situation pretty sad. |
Ni Cho
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
40
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:12:00 -
[133] - Quote
In the popular smartphone game, Words with Friends, you can not use the word Jew. That was a shame, because I totally had at least 666 times I could have used Jew for a triple line.
When exactly did the word Jew become so bad that you can't even say the word Jew anymore. What do we start calling Jewish people? |
Kiandoshia
Gnampf Inc.
25
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:16:00 -
[134] - Quote
Ni Cho wrote:In the popular smartphone game, Words with Friends, you can not use the word Jew. That was a shame, because I totally had at least 666 times I could have used Jew for a triple line.
When exactly did the word Jew become so bad that you can't even say the word Jew anymore. What do we start calling Jewish people?
It's all a gigantic plot to do away with them. Didn't you hear? |
Amity Lane
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
173
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:28:00 -
[135] - Quote
Ooh, responses. Sorry for not checking up; I really expected nothing more than a cursory "shut up, Jew".
Also I failed to mention it before, but as this thread has progresses I feel it's probably fair for me to admit that while I am an ethnic Jew (Israeli) I'm not a practitioner of Judaism (though I keep the kashrut and observe Jewish holidays, not the Christian/American/Pagan ones). Some people make those kinds of distinctions.
Jhoria Englside wrote:Amity Lane wrote:Is it in poor taste? Sure.
Am I offended? Not really, no.
I can't speak for all Jews, but many of us have learned to just shrug off this kind of thing. If you got upset over every tiny stereotype and slur, you'd never be happy.
No matter what your ethnicity, there are always people seeking to dehumanize and disparage you. It's best just to ignore it.
Obviously, if there's ever any real malicious intent behind it you should probably report it. But am I gonna petition every single person who stereotypes Jews as profiteering and greedy? Nah. I've got better things to do. Too bad people can't do this with the word ******. I'm assuming that's the dreaded "n-word". Couldn't comment there, I'm not of African descent.
Shawnm339 wrote: like making isk?
Actually, yeah. High-sec speculative hauling has been making me some tidy sums the last few nights. :)
Ni Cho wrote:When exactly did the word Jew become so bad that you can't even say the word Jew anymore. What do we start calling Jewish people? It's a question of context. Saying "Jesus was a Jew" is one thing. Saying "Stop being such a Jew" is another. One carries a negative connotation (implying that being a Jew is "bad") and the other is simply descriptive. It's total and complete grey area that varies from person to person, and it's almost impossible for people on the outside of the group being discussed to really understand...especially if you're of a social group that isn't often the target of bigotry. And even though I have been the target (both directly and indirectly) of true, sincere, even deadly bigotry (as any Jew in Israel can tell you)...I can't help but think that in the context of this game, people need to just ignore the people that are bothering them. That's why block features exist in the game.
Or better yet, pod 'em. Jews have been fighting off our aggressors for millennia...no reason to stop here. |
Isengrimus
Rave Technologies Inc. C0VEN
0
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:33:00 -
[136] - Quote
CCP allowed a certain "racial realist" who has never hidden his feelings towards the real life Jews (or at least people he thinks to be Jews) to run for the CSM, so now going after the Mittani for using the word "jew" in a figurative, game-content related way would be just reaching the peak of Mount Hypocrisy.
Oh, also I'm of partially jewish heritage IRL, I've been fighting real anti-semitism for years (as it's still quite sound in a place where I live) and TBH, I couldn't care less about the way goons use the word "jew" in the EvE-related content. It's not even mildly racist or offensive towards the ACTUAL people of ACTUAL jewish heritage.
After all, the Amarrians are one big parody of every monotheist religion, aren't they? |
Josef Stylin
University of Caille Gallente Federation
14
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Posted - 2012.03.30 14:34:00 -
[137] - Quote
Are you serious? You realise this is just an engrained term? Next you'll be telling everyone they can't use the term 'carebear' because it's offensive to hairy gay men or something. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
1369
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 15:06:00 -
[138] - Quote
I have also noticed the use of the word "jew" in the same references as the OP brings up.
In the Northeast USA, there is a term called "to jew them/him/her down". This comes from "haggling" down the price on something. We would commonly hear "they wanted 4 grand for the car but you might be able to jew them down to 3500" or something like that.
This stems from, in the northeast USA in particular, a reputation that the Jewish community has over the mastery of money, and while the root of the slang might have had it's origin in anti-semitic ideas, I have heard everybody, even Jews, actually use this term. The Jews of New York are not shy about their mastery of money and involvement in banking.
(Side note: I am not Jewish)
Still, like everything, it's not necessary and bound to be taken the wrong way. I have been on the other end of what would be considered a slander in one part of the US being used as a harmless word in another. In each case I was aware of how the context of a slang or nickname differs from one place to another.
But while I can handle it, most people cannot, and we have in the USA a business model based on being offended. There are people who make a living on being offended by words.
For this reason we should be careful about what words and terms are used so that CCP does not have additional headaches in addition to the present nerd-rage and Mittani/Goon Soap Opera.
While I believe in Free Speech to a point where I would die for it, these forums and the game are private property and the owners have a right to handle this any way they please. We should hope that they handle this in a manner that is not going to cause such trouble as to detract from the further development and advancement of this game, and a defamation or hate crime lawsuit, no matter how friviolous, will do just that.
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My Neutral Toon
Knights Who Til Recently Said Ni
60
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:08:00 -
[139] - Quote
Callduron wrote:One thing that's been bothering me for some time is the casual use of the word jew in Eve to mean trader/industrialist. It's very widespread and it's derogatory. I've often seen it used in the context of people being angry about exploitative prices. "100 isk for AM small???" and someone replies "Shrug, Jews." It's now so normal for many players and alliances that people are starting to forget it's potentially offensive.People used it constantly when I was in the old Northern Coalition. And it's become so widespread now. For example The Mittani wrote:Everyone uses Jita GÇô alliances, humble traders, mega-jews, legions of market bots, you name it. http://www.evenews24.com/2012/03/28/leak-gsf-ceo-update-clutching-pearls-and-finger-waggingI don't think he was trying to be offensive, he just uses the word because to him and everyone he plays Eve with, it's just the word for trader It's possibly because I'm older. I was born in the 60s and influenced as a child by many people who had fought in the Second World War. Their view was that the war was completely just because of the Jewish issue and that antisemitism is profoundly wrong It's a very out-of-date stereotype. In the Middle Ages there were prohibitions in the Christian and Muslim religions against usury. This meant that most bankers had to be of a different religion and in Europe they were generally jews But now there's very little connection between jews and usury in the modern world. It's not Israel that caused the crash of 2008 I believe it originally came to Eve via Goons from the Something Awful boards where there's a tolerance for many things that people wouldn't want in Eve. The N-word is dropped as often as the word jew over there. But that's there and just because it's permitted there doesn't mean it should be permitted here. Now you could try to defend it by claiming that it's meant light-heartedly, that it's a joke, that it's ironic. But it's well established in law (and simple common sense) that harassment is determined by how the recipient feels, not the person makiing the comments It's not appropriate here and it worries me that it's gaining traction. So much so that when a player is trying to behave it slips out - he's forgotten it's an emotionally-charged word. In fact to some extent I had too, it was only when someone commented on my blog about Mittens using it that I thought this really has gone too far I would like CCP to crack down, to issue temp bans for the use of the word jew in a derogatory way. And I don't just mean if someone complains I mean one day a player laughs about "jewing it up" and the next day they can't log in. Recent events have shown that Eve's developed a locker room culture that's out of control and in some countries there are even legal implications to antisemitism.
LOLOLOLOL OP
You don't understand.....
Its not anti-semitism.... the "Jews" are a certain breed of tight-wad people in game that will count every penny and salvage every wreck.
When fleet battles go down, the Jews come out, and boy do they Jew hard....
...Can't. Tell. If ...Troll? Or Serious.... |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
423
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:13:00 -
[140] - Quote
Germany banning EVE would be pretty funny. You know how many people would sub over that headline? |
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TkAlligator38
Kotodama Corp
1
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:24:00 -
[141] - Quote
I like jews. |
Naga Elohim
Golden Shellbacks Surely You're Joking
15
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:27:00 -
[142] - Quote
At first I wasnt aware of such references.
but now that you have enlightened me, I think I will refer to any trader or market baron as a "Jew"
thank you for this OP! 10/10!!! |
Spy 21
Lonetrek Exploration and Salvage
9
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:38:00 -
[143] - Quote
Anti semitism and racism in all it's forms sucks.
Having said that (required) just wondering about some aspects of the whole racial stereotype thing... some of the stereotypes aren't all that bad ... ie almost all groups have their own super power.
Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural trader and businessman Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural athlete Why is it offensive to be thought of as smart
You can easily guess which groups the above statements are aimed at...
just curious... as a member of the only minority that it's politically acceptable and ENCOURAGED to discriminate against (white-male-christian-smoker) I always thought it would be nice to have a super power like the other minorities do.
Where's my super power!!!! |
Amity Lane
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
177
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:47:00 -
[144] - Quote
Spy 21 wrote:Anti semitism and racism in all it's forms sucks.
Having said that (required) just wondering about some aspects of the whole racial stereotype thing... some of the stereotypes aren't all that bad ... ie almost all groups have their own super power.
Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural trader and businessman Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural athlete Why is it offensive to be thought of as smart
You can easily guess which groups the above statements are aimed at...
just curious... as a member of the only minority that it's politically acceptable and ENCOURAGED to discriminate against (white-male-christian-smoker) I always thought it would be nice to have a super power like the other minorities do.
Where's my super power!!!! Well, those are the more positive spins on what were originally very negative stereotypes:
Being considered "greedy". Being considered "savages". Being considered "weak".
I don't know...positive stereotyping is still stereotyping, and isn't really a "good thing". I don't personally care, but I could see how some people would. |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released 0ccupational Hazzard
566
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:48:00 -
[145] - Quote
Spy 21 wrote: just curious... as a member of the only minority that it's politically acceptable and ENCOURAGED to discriminate against (white-male-christian-smoker) I always thought it would be nice to have a super power like the other minorities do.
Where's my super power!!!!
Try the divine... trololol! I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
1397
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 15:49:00 -
[146] - Quote
Spy 21 wrote:Anti semitism and racism in all it's forms sucks.
Having said that (required) just wondering about some aspects of the whole racial stereotype thing... some of the stereotypes aren't all that bad ... ie almost all groups have their own super power.
Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural trader and businessman Why is it offensive to be thought of as a natural athlete Why is it offensive to be thought of as smart
You can easily guess which groups the above statements are aimed at...
just curious... as a member of the only minority that it's politically acceptable and ENCOURAGED to discriminate against (white-male-christian-smoker) I always thought it would be nice to have a super power like the other minorities do.
Where's my super power!!!!
Well, to be honest most of those folks would rather the "super power" be attributed to their individual accomplishments, not their racial heritage.
Again though, lest I be quoted out of context, I'm not in favor of bans for something like this.
If the intent to use the term as a racial slur is not present, or if used among friends, it would be silly to do such a thing. Eventually they'll figure out that to the general public it makes them look like inbred, uneducated gutter trash, and if they are fine with that then so am I.
(And yes, it sucks to be a smoker right now.) When I check troll in the dictionary, it has a photo shopped picture of you standing somewhere in the vicinity of a point.
Also, I can kill you with my brain. |
Abon
Pandorum Research Incorporated
29
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Posted - 2012.03.30 15:58:00 -
[147] - Quote
Science flies you to the moon.
Religion flies you into buildings.
That is all! |
Richter Enderas
Kaesong Kosmonauts Test Friends Please Ignore
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:01:00 -
[148] - Quote
ban thread gas OP |
Spy 21
Lonetrek Exploration and Salvage
9
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Posted - 2012.03.30 16:07:00 -
[149] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Spy 21 wrote:Anti semitism and racism in all it's forms sucks.
Where's my super power!!!! Well, to be honest most of those folks would rather the "super power" be attributed to their individual accomplishments, not their racial heritage.
Cheers for dead solid perfect answer. |
CEO Rockhound
The Treehugger Corp
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:13:00 -
[150] - Quote
OP: I to like jews. If you can't stand them, get out.
Besides, I can go to Amarr and buy slaves. I can take these Minmatar slaves and I can eject them in a can and I can shoot them.
So, please, go look at the color of these worthless matar slaves. Are you now going to call me a racist?
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