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Yorlock
Caldari Farmer Killers United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.10.26 17:32:00 -
[1]
The stealth bomber used to be an antifrigate vessel Just tested a manticore (Lost several) on test, its damage is 108 per cruise vs a stationary target, 54-60 on a moving target, (zero if they use a microwarp)
The stealth bomber can no longer take down a t1 a frigate from 80k before they close and pop you Their role as a supression ship for suprise attacks on Ewar (Kitsune, Griffin) frigates has been removed
Please devs, get in a few and test them for yourselves 50 ish damage from a ship with sig rad reduction and cruise damage bonuses(not to mention one that had a damage potential up to a 600units for optimized ammo) is just plain wrong.... Perhaps ship needs another bonus to explosion velocity, and a decrease in velocity penalty so they have a role again,(other then suicide bomb deployment) if not the blueprint owners are going to be very unhappy as they will no longer sell any of this ship class |
Spartan dax
eXceed Inc. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.10.26 21:17:00 -
[2]
Don't worry about the stealthbomber m8. Let the devs play with missiles until they're happy with them and then they can tune the stealthbombers bonuses afterwards. Easier that way.
Looks like they gave the Nighthawk an ex velocity bonus instead of the precision bonus, they'll probably do something similar to SB's eventually. |
Iog Krugar
The Rising Stars Cosmic Anomalies
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Posted - 2008.10.26 21:43:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Yorlock The stealth bomber used to be an antifrigate vessel Just tested a manticore (Lost several) on test, its damage is 108 per cruise vs a stationary target, 54-60 on a moving target, (zero if they use a microwarp)
The stealth bomber can no longer take down a t1 a frigate from 80k before they close and pop you Their role as a supression ship for suprise attacks on Ewar (Kitsune, Griffin) frigates has been removed
Please devs, get in a few and test them for yourselves 50 ish damage from a ship with sig rad reduction and cruise damage bonuses(not to mention one that had a damage potential up to a 600units for optimized ammo) is just plain wrong.... Perhaps ship needs another bonus to explosion velocity, and a decrease in velocity penalty so they have a role again,(other then suicide bomb deployment) if not the blueprint owners are going to be very unhappy as they will no longer sell any of this ship class
in the meantime, you can have some laughs vs closerange ceptor pilots. i killed like 3 claws with the following nemesis setup: 3x cruise launcher, 1x blaster, cloak, 1x scrambler, 2x web, 1x ecm burst damage control, cpu 2x flare catalyst rig
fights usually end with ceptor dead and you in half armor. needless to say, a crow or other warp-disruptor ceptor will kill you w/o breaking sweat. |
Vim
Spook Division
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Posted - 2008.10.26 22:37:00 -
[4]
Matador SB's are so sexy. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.26 23:10:00 -
[5]
You mean stealth bombers were ever useful?
Actually, this is a good thing, if you think about it. CCP will finally have to concede that stealth bombers are not working, and do something about it. I suggest:
1) covops cloak. 2) 3x bomb launchers. 3) bomb costs reduced to approximately interdictor bubble levels 4) grid/CPU to fit proper setups (MWD included)
Problem solved. |
Kyoko Sakoda
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.10.26 23:31:00 -
[6]
I don't know why bombers were ever used as anti-frigate, other than the cheap laughs I got on Singularity instagibbing frigates stupid enough to get webbed. The very word bomber implies it should be used against larger targets.
No, not a bad change at all.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.26 23:39:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda I don't know why bombers were ever used as anti-frigate, other than the cheap laughs I got on Singularity instagibbing frigates stupid enough to get webbed. The very word bomber implies it should be used against larger targets.
No, not a bad change at all.
It's because frigates were the only thing bombers could kill. The problem has just been around for so long that bomber fanboys have turned it from a bug into a feature. ----------- Blaster sig removed for now, pending those "changes we've been working on all day". CCP, don't screw this up.
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Nikolae Varius
Amarr Exiled. Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.10.27 13:32:00 -
[8]
What if we let bombers equip torpedoes? Or we can increase the explosion radius but increase velocity too so you can hit still targets with good damage but moving targets for massively reduced damage. Also another 5% bonus to damage to compensate. After all as mentioned previously, its a frigging bomber. Not space superiority fighter. Anti-Frigs should be either other frigs or destroyers. Do the role dance! HOOAH ====================================
Looking for a 0.0 PvP corp? Check me out. |
Jason Edwards
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Posted - 2008.10.27 16:40:00 -
[9]
I agree. I've been making a big huff and puff about it also. Basically all I can effectively do is shoot at battleships from outside their targeting ranges.
Then again I've been able to get more kills in the orca then I have with stealth bomber.
Quote: Don't worry about the stealthbomber m8. Let the devs play with missiles until they're happy with them and then they can tune the stealthbombers bonuses afterwards. Easier that way.
Afaik they are done changing the missiles.
Quote: You mean stealth bombers were ever useful?
Believe it or not they were pretty good. It was just a nasty travel time problem.
Quote: Actually, this is a good thing, if you think about it. CCP will finally have to concede that stealth bombers are not working, and do something about it. I suggest:
All ccp from zulupark to the nubs associated with CSM have admitted this.
Quote: 1) covops cloak.
Never happening.
Quote: 2) 3x bomb launchers.
30million after bomb changes? 60million if you want to be able to reload and kill anything. Assuming you dont kill yourself.
Quote: 4) grid/CPU to fit proper setups (MWD included)
I have a feeling this would make them op. I can generally keep myself alive in ffa1... infact havent lost a stealth bomber in ffa1 for awhile.
Quote: I don't know why bombers were ever used as anti-frigate, other than the cheap laughs I got on Singularity instagibbing frigates stupid enough to get webbed. The very word bomber implies it should be used against larger targets. No, not a bad change at all.
You sir, know nothing. Stealth bombers were all about alpha dmg. They cant deal out any reasonable dps. The idea is to deal up to 2500dmg and instant pop in 1 volley. But nanos made it impossible to get hit most of the time. Stealth bombers are generally unable to deal any reasonable damage to larger targets; meaning you die.
What did happen was stealth bombers would fit ewar like remote sensor damps... but that got nerfed. So its much harder.
Quote: What if we let bombers equip torpedoes?
This is what zulupark said... but it isnt a reasonable option.
Torps would be heavily ranged... 15-20km max pretty much. My god if the stealth bomber has to be that close... Not to mention there's no real increase in dps. Extra 50-100dps?
It just doesnt play.
Now Citadel torps is where it's at. Now given... epic training to use such a low skilled ship.
The dps is basically identical to cruise or torps. Except 30 second rof. Meaning BIG alpha. It also has good range vs speed considerations. You could fire the citadel from 100km away... but it'll take 1.5 minutes to reach the target.
You then have to adjust your distance according to situation.
But this is all beside the point. Citadels will never be put on. To heavy skill requirements. 3 citadel launchers would cost 150million.
Literally not feasible.
All they have to do is design a new launcher for the stealth bombers. Make it so the stealth bombers are the only ones capable of fitting. similar to strip miners or whatever. Remove the skill requirement off the citadel torp ammo. As the citadel launcher itself is what has the skill required.
You then use citadel torp ammo in the new launcher.
Reapply the missile bonuses to citadels.
The stealth bomber then takes the role of anti-bs anti-capital; in a stealth bomberskirmish way.
You could sit 100km and fire at will at sieged dreads. Or be around 30km from the enemy blob and fire your citadels into the blob. Recloak for cooldown. Pretty high risk doing that. ------------------------ "There was this bright flash of light - and now this egg shaped thing is on my screen - did I level up?" |
Tac Ginaz
The Righteous Few
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Posted - 2008.10.27 18:19:00 -
[10]
Simple solution is to have the stealth bombers be specifically vs- big signature target attackers. Anti-frigate work is not a bomber's work , thats an interceptor, AF and destroyer's work.
This is done by two things:
Changing the BOMB launcher into a LARGE WARHEAD launcher.
Essentially, this is a launcher that can launch BOMBS and CITADEL torpedoes. This launcher has by default, no auto-repeat fire nor an option to turn this on. it must be clicked manually.
Bonuses on the bomber:
Change the PG and CPU bonus for CRUISE to be SIEGE launchers. The explosion and other reduction bonuses change them so that the bomber applies full damage with torpedoes to a battleship-size ship (equivalent to the bomber having 1 target painter active on target).
+ citadel and siege torpedo speed. Make them twice as fast as their non-SB fired counterparts.
+ siege torpedo flight time. Enough so it can be fired from 80km.
Code change: Whatever code in the game makes missiles not work past 40km if you recloak needs to be changed to 80km range.
Cloaked speed: Increase bonus on this for the bombers. As the PG/CPU does not allow for an MWD or AB nor can it be used when cloaked.. AND since this ship cannot warp when cloaked, then the bomber should be highly mobile when unseen.
Change the cloaking speed bonus to be tied to CLOAKING skill (not covops.. the damage bonus and missile speed/flight time bonus will be based on covert ops). At level 5 cloaking, a stealth bomber should be flying at the same speed as if it was using an afterburner II.. about 900-1200ms.
With all the above, the bomber becomes a true large-ship hunter and practically ineffective vs smaller craft (which are the bomber's main killers). The high stealthed speed coupled with the slower fly-to-target (but much higher damage) torpedo/bombs can make a 2 or 3 man bomber team capable of first-strike killing a battleship sized vessel. |
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Max Hardcase
Art of War Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.10.27 21:12:00 -
[11]
I once, vainly, (when the devs were happily devving up bomb launchers), made a post about getting Stealth Bombers some kind of tactical missile between a citadel torp and a cruise missile in specs. Low rof, high alpha ofcourse. I also advocated some special EW warheads for these. Unique, usefull etc etc.
We all know how that ended.....bombs
My other pet peeve with BO and SB's is that they're essentially un-stealthy during travel and that any target that knows his basics therefore has good options to avoid you. While I wouldnt advocate a full covops cloak for them I do think that a 2 au/s for the SB and an 1 au/s BO wouldnt be overpowering. That leaves fast cloaked warping to the more dedicated stealthy ships ( EAF, Covops and recons).
The extra cloaked tactical speed for BO's and SB's is nice but not more than that.
BO's need the most love though...half a billion iskies worth of love
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Eka Lawrencia
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.10.27 21:24:00 -
[12]
As long as the cruise bonus remains the same, all is well.
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Hi Lo
Faulty Solutions
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Posted - 2008.10.28 02:36:00 -
[13]
Nerfing missiles would be a very bad thing in general. Karl Kopalnia > omg Hi Lo is the name I use for all my gaming characters for 15 years--you're the one that took it :*( |
Hi Lo
Faulty Solutions
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Posted - 2008.10.28 02:40:00 -
[14]
Nerfing missiles would be a very bad thing in general. Karl Kopalnia > omg Hi Lo is the name I use for all my gaming characters for 15 years--you're the one that took it :*( |
Xercers
Minmatar Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2008.10.28 04:32:00 -
[15]
I love my bomber, please don't make it useless |
Nikolae Varius
Amarr Exiled. Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.10.28 05:13:00 -
[16]
I dunno about that, I we give them torps and have like a 50% increase in missile velocity per level, it might work out fine. Cant hit small stuff for jack but can put the hurt on a BC and definitely a BS. More daydreams. ====================================
Looking for a 0.0 PvP corp? Check me out. |
Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2008.10.28 10:09:00 -
[17]
give them citadel torps and you have the new empire suicide gankers dream ... --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
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