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Ratata K
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Posted - 2008.11.30 19:10:00 -
[1]
Since i have played eve (not that long) i have stuck with caldari missile boats. However i have come to realise that it was probably a bad decison. first i have never really enjoyed them and the recent nerf, although grossly exaggerated, has emphised the point. I feel a change should come sonner or later.
I feel that there are two paths that i could take, training for the gallente blaster boats. as opposed to the drone boats. Or take the road of the caldari rail boats. Reading through the forums im getting an idea about the gallente ships however the caldari ones are only briefly talked about.
i was wondering if people with exprience in thos ships could tell me a few thing about them. for example which ones to miss, which path to tkae and what tactics i should choose.
i sure many other caldari pilots are thinking the same so it would be good to hear from them as well _____________________________________
-cheers-
Ratata K |
Dasalt Istgut
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Posted - 2008.11.30 19:27:00 -
[2]
The thing about caldari gun ships is they do crappy DPS and can't fit a tank and tackle at the same time. So really, their only purpose is to hit things - from medium to long distance. As a result, the only one worth flying is the rokh.
That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.11.30 19:40:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut The thing about caldari gun ships is they do crappy DPS and can't fit a tank and tackle at the same time. So really, their only purpose is to hit things - from medium to long distance. As a result, the only one worth flying is the rokh.
That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
Blaster Moa does ok actually. I flew it once. But they mkae good sniping ships, but only the rokh really shines as a sniper, and it does so in a great way. Eagle I have no expereince in.
Blasterox should be ok, tho outperfromed by gallante equvivalents.
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Ratata K
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Posted - 2008.11.30 21:30:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Blaster Moa does ok actually. I flew it once. But they mkae good sniping ships, but only the rokh really shines as a sniper, and it does so in a great way. Eagle I have no expereince in.
Blasterox should be ok, tho outperfromed by gallante equvivalents.
is that the general consensus, that they are all okay, however the gallente conterparts just outperform them _____________________________________
-cheers-
Ratata K |
Terraform
Gallente Recreation Of The World
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Posted - 2008.11.30 21:33:00 -
[5]
basically yea, i fly a blaster ferox sometimes for kicks and giggles, but alas, my brutix outdps it and outtanks it if it has to fit tackling.
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Dasalt Istgut
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:15:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut The thing about caldari gun ships is they do crappy DPS and can't fit a tank and tackle at the same time. So really, their only purpose is to hit things - from medium to long distance. As a result, the only one worth flying is the rokh.
That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
Blaster Moa does ok actually. I flew it once. But they mkae good sniping ships, but only the rokh really shines as a sniper, and it does so in a great way. Eagle I have no expereince in.
Blasterox should be ok, tho outperfromed by gallante equvivalents.
The lack of a drone bay means its better to just spend the week it takes to fly a thorax.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:25:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut The thing about caldari gun ships is they do crappy DPS and can't fit a tank and tackle at the same time. So really, their only purpose is to hit things - from medium to long distance. As a result, the only one worth flying is the rokh.
That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
Blaster Moa does ok actually. I flew it once. But they mkae good sniping ships, but only the rokh really shines as a sniper, and it does so in a great way. Eagle I have no expereince in.
Blasterox should be ok, tho outperfromed by gallante equvivalents.
The lack of a drone bay means its better to just spend the week it takes to fly a thorax.
Usually yes, tho the Moa can get better range with rails. But thats more of a gang thing, and unfortunatly not useful in too many situations.
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Dasalt Istgut
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:37:00 -
[8]
Looking at above lets think about the Rokh:
[Rokh, Sniper] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Reactor Control Unit II Reactor Control Unit II
Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II Sensor Booster II Sensor Booster II 100MN MicroWarpdrive I
425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L 425mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
Hybrid Burst Aerator I Hybrid Locus Coordinator I Hybrid Metastasis Adjuster I
Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5
Probably not the definitive rokh sniper set up but you've got 5x warrior II for ceptors or 5x ECM if you wanna use that instead. Hits for 507 dps, an alpha that will insta-pop or almost insta-pop any frigate sized ship, decent tracking...Superior in pretty much every way to the others though obviously requires more training.
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Ratata K
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:52:00 -
[9]
just wondering how each of these ships would look like if you fitted blasters to them. would the increase in dps really count for much. or would it then just be crossing into gallente. I just dont want to see my caldari skills go to waste. _____________________________________
-cheers-
Ratata K |
Thenoran
Caldari Hegemony Enterprises E L I T E Alliance
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:58:00 -
[10]
You can get a decent buffer tank and DPS out of a Blasterox, with Null you can hit from quite a distance. Caldari gunboats aren't solo PvP ships, but in a gang they can be very nasty, so use them as such. ------------------------ Ship Yield Calc Low-sec is like sailing along the coast of Somalia...
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Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.11.30 22:59:00 -
[11]
Simple fact is damage bonuses are greater than range bonuses and armor tank ships have slot configurations that make gank, tank, and tackle much easier to accommodate (not to mention cap mods).
Go gallente blaster boats if its a choice of the two and you are looking to fly ships that are sub-BS --
Originally by: CCP Oveur Just donęt forget the reach-around.
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Kykio
Caldari The All-Seeing Eye G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.11.30 23:02:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Haradgrim Simple fact is damage bonuses are greater than range bonuses and armor tank ships have slot configurations that make gank, tank, and tackle much easier to accommodate (not to mention cap mods).
Go gallente blaster boats if its a choice of the two and you are looking to fly ships that are sub-BS
And armor tank is >>> shield tank especiall now that sign radius matter much more.
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Dasalt Istgut
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Posted - 2008.11.30 23:19:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Ratata K just wondering how each of these ships would look like if you fitted blasters to them. would the increase in dps really count for much. or would it then just be crossing into gallente. I just dont want to see my caldari skills go to waste.
Hmm. Not really. Rokh is good. You can set up a really sick bait ship though with the eagle.
[Eagle, Bait] Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Damage Control II
Photon Scattering Field II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M [empty high slot]
Core Defence Field Purger I Core Defence Field Purger I
Tanks like 1200 dps against hybrids while overloaded.
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Ratata K
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Posted - 2008.11.30 23:23:00 -
[14]
its a shame really that caldari are indirectly nerfed. It seems that i will have to train gallente then, i like the rokh, so i may see if i can get the best of both worlds and train thorax and brutix which means my armour skills will need a buffing. While keping in tune with the rokh.
cheers for the advice, more is always good tho
_____________________________________
-cheers-
Ratata K |
Dasalt Istgut
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Posted - 2008.11.30 23:27:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ratata K its a shame really that caldari are indirectly nerfed. It seems that i will have to train gallente then, i like the rokh, so i may see if i can get the best of both worlds and train thorax and brutix which means my armour skills will need a buffing. While keping in tune with the rokh.
cheers for the advice, more is always good tho
Technically the brutix hull tanks.
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Naomi Knight
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.12.01 02:18:00 -
[16]
Caldari railships lack pg , they need a stupid reactor contol just to fit up their guns.
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Xindi Kraid
Cerulean Sky Fire Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.01 02:41:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Naomi Knight Caldari railships lack pg , they need a stupid reactor contol just to fit up their guns.
If they fix that the Ferox and Moa might actually be good. A full load of 250s with mag field stabs would actually do good DPS -Xindi Kraid CSFI lead engineer and shipwright
Improve POS cargo access |
Precisionist
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Posted - 2008.12.01 06:02:00 -
[18]
Ya I kind of agree rokh good sniper and blaster(with gang) eagle good all hac snipers that move around a lot but you got to have like 5 eagles to do anything or 2 eagles and 2 huginns cloaked for a good alpha maybe. ferox can be a sniper but whats the point. Eagle blaster may be good bait since most ppl think EZ so just shield tank up the a$$ and put some dmg on it but better be tank for da bait hitting. if u like blasters/rails and want to do it with hacs try the deimos good for gank setup in gangs no tank tho if all gank. OR a dominix with all blasters and drones does wonders.
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BiggestT
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.12.01 06:05:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut The thing about caldari gun ships is they do crappy DPS and can't fit a tank and tackle at the same time. So really, their only purpose is to hit things - from medium to long distance. As a result, the only one worth flying is the rokh.
That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
This. But by all means do train for them, they are quite fun, being a different, possibly more involved experience than missile boats.
e.g. The eagle is fun, but the cerb is better than it in everyway (except for a little less rnage and lack of insta-hit). This is reflected partially by the price diff. between them.
It is sad that their not really serious enough to chose over other ships though (besides the rokh). EVE history
t2 precisions |
BiggestT
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.12.01 06:12:00 -
[20]
Edited by: BiggestT on 01/12/2008 06:12:38
Originally by: Kykio
Originally by: Haradgrim Simple fact is damage bonuses are greater than range bonuses and armor tank ships have slot configurations that make gank, tank, and tackle much easier to accommodate (not to mention cap mods).
Go gallente blaster boats if its a choice of the two and you are looking to fly ships that are sub-BS
And armor tank is >>> shield tank especiall now that sign radius matter much more.
This too, I think CCP need to take a look at that a bit. I.E. The old argument was.. armour: sacrifice dps for tank shield: sacrifice useful midslots for tank
Although this sounds balanced, it really is a bit unfair for shield tanking. Lower dps for tank isnt a huge fallback, as your still just as effective (combat utility wise) with only a little less dps.
However sacrificing mid slots for tank is quite a penalty, as its very hard to be viable with poor tank after everything (point if your not specialising, else youll need cap booster, sensor boosters, mwd/ab etc) else is fitted. And you often dont get to utilise the dps advantage, as rails and missiles arent that high dps weapons to start with, coupled with the fact that dps mods often need replacing with fitting mods.
These facts along with the sig radius affecting passive shield tanking much more now, makes me think that shield tanking cld use a boost.
EVE history
t2 precisions |
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BiggestT
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.12.01 06:28:00 -
[21]
Edited by: BiggestT on 01/12/2008 06:33:02 Edited by: BiggestT on 01/12/2008 06:29:06
Hmm, theres a new dev blog out about giving the eagle, moa and ferox an extra turret slot each (and the grid to compensate).
However, theyre forgetting the vulture, i mean, wtf, huge range bonus but terrible dps may sound ok, as fleet commands arent supposed to have good dps.
But the vulture has LOUSY dps, its pointless giving it those bonus's when it cant really do anything useful with them. The vulture is the single most skill intensive sub-bs ship caldari have to get into, let alone fly well. It should have an advantage over other ships, and i hate that CCP doom them to the "afk booster" position. This isnt just a problem with the vulture, but also fleet commands in general.
Nvm, was looking at an old blog LOL, still think this would be a deserved boost though... EVE history
t2 precisions |
PaddyPaddy Nihildarnik
Gallente aurorae pacificas
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Posted - 2008.12.01 08:55:00 -
[22]
It surprises me how many people can talk with such certainty about things they admit they know little about.
Im no eve pvp god (maybe demi-god) but I am experienced in both Caldari and Gallente specced ships across the board, from frig class to BS, including t2.
Particularly when facing multiple small gang targets, the benefits of the range bonused caldari gunboats really come into their own. While on paper a thorax outperforms/out damages the equiv moa for example, what isnt taken into account is the curvature of that damage. At 80km a moa will confidently put damage on even frigate class vessels, despite small sig radius/traversal. A thorax is useless. On the other hand @ 10km a moa is be toasted by a thorax.
The same goes for the t2 counterparts. A well trained eagle pilot is a great unknown force to have in a small skirmish, often being away from the main fight yet always within range of the action. I would like to see the eagle get a decent dronebay however, that really is the only thing holding this ship back.
Often the Caldari gunboats attacking at range really provide a problem to hostile FCs purely through their nagging invulnerability to hit yet be too far away to be countered well by cumbersome fleets. This has proved particularly true when facing lower skilled, non nanoed fleets such as was present in Factional Warfare when it was actually vibrant. 2-3 Eagles would massacre larger non-nanoed fleets purely though good/ supporting safe spots. As tacklers moved towards one Eagle they would be coming more and more into range of the other eagles. Cruiser class vessels were melted by the combined dps.
I suppose what im trying to say is dont discount the Caldari gunboats on their paper/eft stats. They require dedication to fly, not only through skillpoints but also in the style in which to fly them but once mastered really are viable skirmish ships where no other race really can compete with them.
Once you get up to the BS classes the other races have equivalents and tbh the Rohk really is outshone by the MegaT in fleet engagements. Its the smaller railboats like the eagle or the snarpy that dominate in a specific, often underused role.
I expect to see more and more slower ranged boats appearing on the battlefield now that missiles are less effective and also that nanoed ships are falling from being FOTM.
My advice would be to train them if you can stick to a longer term plan. If you want instant results train for thorax/brutix brawling type setups.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.01 09:12:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 01/12/2008 09:13:08
Originally by: Dasalt Istgut That's why you never see eagles or moa's or ferox's. Yeah they can hit far, but hitting for for less than 200 dps is pointless anyway.
Of course you never see any Eagles. It's not like it's the best anti-support ship in the game, after all. Why would anyone ever want to fly it?
As for Caldari, they will be fine as soon as missiles get a bit of a damage boost. The gunboats are fine exactly as they are, once you learn to ignore EFT dps and focus on real-world PvP where range and travel time are a major factor. The only changes that need to be made are to the ships that were overlooked in the recent fix to the split slot layout problem: 3x turrets for the Merlin, 4x for the CN Hookbill, and 7x for the Vulture/Ferox.
As for the mid slot "issue", no, you're wrong. You can easily fit a MWD, point, and good buffer tank (you don't try to active tank in PvP, do you?) on pretty much every Caldari ship. Cap booster is nice (and even fits on some ships), but isn't really needed as long as you don't plan on perma-running the MWD. Web is useless, as every single Caldari ship is designed to fight from outside web range. The end result is Caldari ships get all of the critical mid slot items, while also fitting 3x damage mods and a better tank than most armor tanking ships.
As for the Megathron being better than the Rokh: lol. I'm really having a hard time dignifying such a stupid claim with more than that. The Rokh out-damages the Megathron at all fleet ranges, while also having a much longer maximum range, and is the easiest ship to tank without giving up the ability to hit at the required ranges.
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PaddyPaddy Nihildarnik
Gallente aurorae pacificas
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Posted - 2008.12.01 10:12:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
As for the Megathron being better than the Rokh: lol. I'm really having a hard time dignifying such a stupid claim with more than that. The Rokh out-damages the Megathron at all fleet ranges, while also having a much longer maximum range, and is the easiest ship to tank without giving up the ability to hit at the required ranges.
"Outshone" was perhaps an overstatement. Regardless the mega does just as good as any Rohk will in most fleet encounters. The benefit of range really only applies to lower SP chars. If you have low SP in gunnery then the Rohk will probably be the first "fleet" bs that you can fly efficiently. On the other hand it is Tier 3 and therefore more expensive.
Overall Id prefer a MegaT to the Rohk, but you keep on fapping off thinking your the only one who has any real experience in Eve Merin.
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Naomi Knight
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.12.01 10:25:00 -
[25]
Merin you are wrong. As Eagle didnt get powergrid when they changed its turret slots to 5,so if you want to fit 5 250mm turrets + LSE or MWD you need 1 reactor control and if you want to fit both a LSE + MWD you need to fit 2 reactor controls, as it is the minimal tank and a mandatory module in fleets where you wanna use your Eagle anyway. It realy criples this ship. While a zealot only needs a power diag to be able to fit 5 Heavy beams an LSE + MWD. Same for the muninn with 720mm guns. So the eagle has to give up one of its already few low slots. And now dps wise without dmg and range mods: Eagle 114dps 146km opt with spike has 2 low and 2 med free slots zealot 176dps 81km opt with aurora has 6 low and 1 med free slots
And it is much harder to use out your optimal bonus,as you wont help your gang much by being farther out from enemy , while better dmg applied always ,when you shoot.
And the usual unbonused utility high slots are completly useless for a pvp ship,and still every caldari ships have one.But for what no caldari ships can fit those slots ,without sacrificing a low slot for another fitting module ,due to all high slot items are pg hungry.
So ccp eighter remowe those high slots and mowe them to med or low slot , or give a pg boost so i can fit something there, no i dont need salvager on my sniper pvp ship. And give pg for eagle pls it lack it much.
And the usuall being caldari syndrome : -bigger signiture which means bigger incoming dmg -slow locking speed -slow moving speed -no or small drone bay -complet dependance on gang mates , no solo capable
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.01 11:02:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 01/12/2008 11:02:52
Originally by: PaddyPaddy Nihildarnik "Outshone" was perhaps an overstatement. Regardless the mega does just as good as any Rohk will in most fleet encounters. The benefit of range really only applies to lower SP chars. If you have low SP in gunnery then the Rohk will probably be the first "fleet" bs that you can fly efficiently. On the other hand it is Tier 3 and therefore more expensive.
Hint: 50% range bonus = use ammo with higher base damage = more damage than the Megathron at a given range. There is more than just Spike L, you know.
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Originally by: Naomi Knight Merin you are wrong. As Eagle didnt get powergrid when they changed its turret slots to 5,so if you want to fit 5 250mm turrets + LSE or MWD you need 1 reactor control and if you want to fit both a LSE + MWD you need to fit 2 reactor controls, as it is the minimal tank and a mandatory module in fleets where you wanna use your Eagle anyway. It realy criples this ship.
Hm. I don't fly the ship (I use a Vulture instead when I want a rail sniper), but you have a point there. It could probably use a bit of a grid boost, but otherwise the ship is just fine. Hint: that extra 55% range is critical to doing the Eagle's job, so the Zealot can't even compete.
Quote: -armor tank is more cap efficient
Both are essentially capless, as the cap use from active hardeners is low enough for any ship to perma-run easily. You aren't trying to use an active tank in PvP, are you?
Quote: -basic armor resists are better than shield resist
Only slightly. The end result is what matters though, and shield EHP is just fine in the end.
Quote: -armor resist modules needs much less cpu and cap and eamn is a passive module
Armor tanking ships generally have much less CPU in the first place, so this is not an advantage.
Quote: -damage control gives more armor resist than shield resist
A damage control also uses the same slots as an armor tank, while it's a free bonus on shield tanks.
Now let's not forget the advantages of shield tanking:
- Uses mid slots, allowing a full 3x damage mods and grid mods (= bigger guns = more damage) in the remaining lows.
- Passive regen means you don't have to waste a slot on an active rep if you are unable/unwilling to dock and repair between fights.
- No speed penalty on extenders/rigs gives a significant mobility advantage.
- Invulnerability fields not only give higher resists than even a max-skill EANM, but can be overloaded to increase your tank even more. -----------
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Kirtan Loor
Divine Retribution Sons of Tangra
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Posted - 2008.12.01 11:03:00 -
[27]
[Moa, Blasphemy!] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Damage Control II
10MN Afterburner I Invulnerability Field II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I
Warrior II x3
Most small gang action goes at 20km or lower. This setup helps Moa doing what you cannot do with maller or omen: Have a good tank along with those pulse lasers. No pvp utility though...let other ships handle it.
Those rigs are cheap by the way I wouldn't mind putting them on Moa.
If you wish to have some blaster action with Moa:
[Moa, Blaster Moa] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Warp Scrambler II
Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Electron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M [empty high slot]
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I
Use last high slot for whatever fits. Performs better than thorax if you don't have skills for drones.
Bottom line is: Caldari and gunnery actually goes well along. But rails are only useful at high ranges. |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.12.01 11:14:00 -
[28]
Wow. That has got to be the single worst Moa setup I've ever seen. How about trying a non-comedy setup?
[Moa, New Setup 1] Nanofiber Internal Structure II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II
Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Uranium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Uranium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Uranium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Uranium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Uranium Charge M Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Thunderbolt Heavy Missile
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I
Warrior II x3
A bit less tank and tracking, but more damage, much better maximum range, and a MWD so you don't end up becoming a comedy killmail after you fail utterly at keeping out of range of anything smaller than a sieged dread. |
fkingfurious
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Posted - 2008.12.01 11:51:00 -
[29]
I am seriously baffled by Naomis assertion that Zealot's need to be fitting an LSE when sniping. Same with the Eagle.
What exactly is it going to achieve, other than nerfing the rest of your setup into the ground?
Anyways, the Eagle is actually a pretty tasty sniper since the Locus nerf bashed the potential optimal ranges of Zealots down quite a bit. With AWU V, 3% PG and Hybrid rigging 3 it cn fit an MWD, 5 250 II and a locus rig with an RCU II. Coupled with 3 MFS and 2 range scripted tracking comps an Eagle actually outdamages the Zealot at ranges past 50km.
Unfortunatly it's tracking can't compare (roughly half that of a Zealot) but it can keep pushing it's range all the way out to 200KM.
And as for fitting an LSE on a Muninn?!?!? 5x 720 II and an MWD I cannot be fitted without a PG mod, regardless of skills or implants. So you're now down a mid and a low and you've completely crippled the ship.
And the Rokh is frigging awesome, tuffest fleet sniper in game.
And Harpys are pretty sweet too.
So thats like 3 Caldari railboats that are awesome. I suppose the Vulture too. Thats 4.
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Kirtan Loor
Divine Retribution Sons of Tangra
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Posted - 2008.12.01 11:55:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin ....A bit less tank and tracking, but more damage, much better maximum range, and a MWD so you don't end up becoming a comedy killmail after you fail utterly at keeping out of range of anything smaller than a sieged dread.
Merin that was the most clueless post you've ever made in these forums.
More damage??? A "bit" less tank by removing a damage control??? A bit less tracking??When did you forget math? The only thing I can give you credit with that post is the MWD...and there is an even better way to fit mwd to that setup.
Just to give you numbers:
Blasphemy! vs New Setup 1 (All lvl 5 char is used for comparing purposes)
DPS: 303 vs 270 (3x warrior II's included) EHP: 41758 vs 34203 Defense: 91 vs 80 Tracking: 0.084 vs 0.052
Caldari rail bonus for range is only useful when you are fighting at higher ranges where you can substitue for lower range ammo. At lower ranges range / damage ratio of hybrid ammo gets worse. Surely Moa with rails excels when fighting at 50-60+km ranges. But most of the time the encounter range for small gang skirmishes is around 20k where warp disruptors operate. I think the OP wants the do the minimal amount of training and still be competent without missiles. I just wanted to point out the role of rails in the game. |
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